Scared of being left behind

lismore

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but how does he KNOW rapture is coming soon. He has the same Bible we do? the Bible is the only book that can tell us. the Bible is where the prophecies are about end times

In 2 Peter chapter 3 one of the main signs given for the Lord's soon return is the rise of scoffers, seemingly even among professing believers.

They will say, "Where is this 'coming' he promised? (2 Peter 3:4)

You have only to look at the number of scoffers on this thread to see that the Apostle Peter gave a true prophecy here. God Bless :)
 
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Jamdoc

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In general "The Rapture" is associated with what you call the Pre-Trib view. What is called the Post-Trib view is certainly less problematic, since it agrees with Scripture and the general confession of the Christian faith; but it is arguably better in my opinion to dispense with the use of the term "Rapture", and instead simply confess the faith once and for all delivered: That on the Last Day Christ will return, and the dead will rise, glory be to God.

-CryptoLutheran

To be totally post trib is a bit confusing for me, it confuses me as to what exactly is happening at the 6th seal in Revelation 6 and 7 if not the rapture. That's why I lean towards pre wrath, because it lines up with Revelation without having to Tarantino things and tell events out of order.
 
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Citizen of the Kingdom

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Sorry, I don't get what your meaning.

My point was.. Telling people "it's OK" when they have concerns.. never helps and is often times wrong advice.
There was a post about the lifeboats leaving the Titanic half empty.
On the Titanic the captain said, “Women and children first.” Some lifeboats left the ship half full as they thought they were not supposed to take men aboard. Lives were lost due to this error.
Misquote I think
That’s what happens when the men don’t follow the women and children into the lifeboats.
bad humour, m'bad
 
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lismore

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And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds, not giving up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but encouraging one another--and all the more as you see the Day approaching (Hebrews 10:24-25)
 
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ViaCrucis

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prophecy illuminated and expands on what has been written. it does not add to it. unless what this guy means is that we can tell if we ar ein the end times or close to them? i do believe that. there are signs all around us? that sys it is close. but there are no dates predicting. no day month nor year. becsue to say otherwise would contradict Jesus

I think there is a benefit of being familiar with world history here.

What is it that people think are "signs" today? Diseases? Natural disasters? Troubling times in various nations? War? Rumors of war?

Is there really any more of that today than there was in the past?

Disease:

In the 2nd century a horrible plague swept through the Roman Empire, the Antonine Plague, possibly a smallpox outbreak, the death toll in the Roman Empire was 5 million.

In the 3rd century another terrible plague broke out in Rome, the Plague of Cyprian, probably smallpox again, which lasted for over 20 years and at its height was killing five thousand people daily.

In the 6th century the Plague of Justinian, an outbreak of bubonic plague, killed 25 million people.

The Black Death of the 14th century killed as many as 200 million people, as much as half the entire population of Europe.

European contact with the Americas brought diseases with which the Native Americans had no immunity, and estimates are as high as 90% of the indigenous population of the Americas were wiped--when Europeans started colonizing and described America as a place of pristine and untamed wilderness, it's only because most of the people living there had already died and where people once lived had already been forested over.

In 1918 the Spanish Flu swept the world and resulted in a death toll of 50 million.

Natural disasters:

In 115 AD an earthquake in Antioch killed 260,000

In May of 526 AD another earthquake in Antioch killed as many as 300,000

In 856 AD an earthquake in the Persian city of Damghan killed 200,000

In 1138 AD an earthquake in Aleppo killed 230,000

In 1303 AD an earthquake in Hongdong, in what was then part of the Mongolian Empire, resulted in a death toll of 200,000

In 1556 an earthquake in Shaanxi killed 830,000

In 1923 an earthquake in the Kanto region of Japan resulted in the death of over 142,000

The 1976 earthquake in Tangshan killed anywhere between 242,000 and 655,000

The Great European Famine from 1315 to 1317 resulted in 7.5 million deaths

The Russian famine of 1601-1603, 2 million

The Bengal famine of 1770, 10 million

The Great Irish famine between 1 and 1.5 million

The Northern Chinese famin of 1876-1879, as many as 13 million

The Great Chinese famine of 1958-1961, between 15 and 43 million

A seismic event caused by the Minoan Eruption some 4,000 years ago destroyed the Minoan civilization, caused a tsunami that killed as many as 100,000, and is likely the source of the story of Atlantis which Plato mentions in The Republic.

The Krakatoa eruption of 1883 caused a tsunami that may have killed as many as 120,000, with the eruption itself resulting in the death of another 36,000

But then, Jesus tells us that these things aren't signs of the end, He says that wars, rumors of wars, earthquakes, famines, etc are not signs of the end, but are only the beginnings of birth pangs. This is the world crying out in pain on account of sin and death. But it's not the end.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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lismore

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But it's not the end.
-CryptoLutheran

hello. In the link above (Hebrews 10:24-25) it talks about us seeing the day approaching. In Matthew 24:33 Jesus said we would know when his return was near, 'even at the door'. That expression is incredible, we would know by the signs when his return was at the door, nigh upon us. If you have a guest who's at the door, there is nothing else to be done but open it. Your guest's arrival is so close! Jesus said we would know when his return was that close.

So with respect to you and to others who are mystified, I think there's something you're missing.

There have been people down through the ages who set dates and got it wrong, Catholics and Orthodox thought 1000 was significant, based on a misguided interpretation.

But there was something they were missing.

God Bless You :)
 
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Blade

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Boxman144 there is no fear in God. Rapture..we all know it means "caught up". We all know there is no DATE TIME when that will happen. So I look at Gods word and Gods word did not promise me tomorrow. So WHY put my faith in a day I was never promised? I don't. To prepare for tomorrow is wise.

So I live each moment that He gave me as THIS is that moment Christ is coming. Oh man to ALWAYS be thinking about Him.. always ready. I will never miss Him. So live in the moment you have. Live for Him.. share Him with others. Know that He went to make you a home and WILL come back and get you. Be ready NOW!

No man on this earth has some INSIDE INFO on this lol. But when fear worry doubt things like this are the first thing that pops up.. its not of God. I Know this man in that video. I do not listen to him. He is looking for Christs return praise GOD!

Now the bible says IF YOU DOUBT let not that man think he will get anything from God. So what do YOU think happens if we are not watching.. do not believe? You won't go. There is no verse in the bible that says PRE TRIB or MID TRIB or POST TRIB. There is none. People use verses to say "what that means.. what that is saying.

I like what this man of God (home now) said. "I am post tribulation. BUT if Christ comes pre trib I am ready right now!" <---that is wise. I am sure we all heard of this man. He knew the word of God. There is no PRE MID POST verse. And were you promised tomorrow? Paul said "we that remain". Yeah.. he put HIMSELF in that WATCHING for CAUGHT UP. And this was preached about the word RAPTURE in 1700..did you know that? And going farther back.. a hymn writer in 300-400 ad wrote about caught up before the great tribulation.

This means proves what? Nothing. Some say.. they didn't watch nor were looking and never talked about it till 1830. Yet.. I being no one.. found them.. others have. So since I can not find a PRE MID POST trib verse.. I and always ready NOW!
 
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Citizen of the Kingdom

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Boxman144 there is no fear in God. Rapture..we all know it means "caught up". We all know there is no DATE TIME when that will happen. So I look at Gods word and Gods word did not promise me tomorrow. So WHY put my faith in a day I was never promised? I don't. To prepare for tomorrow is wise.

So I live each moment that He gave me as THIS is that moment Christ is coming. Oh man to ALWAYS be thinking about Him.. always ready. I will never miss Him. So live in the moment you have. Live for Him.. share Him with others. Know that He went to make you a home and WILL come back and get you. Be ready NOW!

No man on this earth has some INSIDE INFO on this lol. But when fear worry doubt things like this are the first thing that pops up.. its not of God. I Know this man in that video. I do not listen to him. He is looking for Christs return praise GOD!
What was the day you were not promised? Today? or Eternity? Yesterday ? How are you putting your faith in a day that was never promised you???
 
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ViaCrucis

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hello. In the link above (Hebrews 10:24-25) it talks about us seeing the day approaching. In Matthew 24:33 Jesus said we would know when his return was near, 'even at the door'. That expression is incredible, we would know by the signs when his return was at the door, nigh upon us.

So with respect to you, I think there's something you're missing.

There have been people down through the ages who set dates and got it wrong, Catholics and Orthodox thought 1000 was significant, based on a misguided interpretation.

But there was something they were missing.

God Bless You :)

Except that Matthew 24:33 isn't about when He returns, but rather the destruction that falls upon Jerusalem.

He says "Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place." in verse 34. I know some want to try and play weird textual gymnastics to suggest "this generation" means some future generation, but He really is talking about the generation living at the time. Within their lifetime they would see these things take place--and they did, when the Temple in Jerusalem was destroyed.

I suspect confusion might arise here because in some translations we have "he is at the doors/gates". In Greek we have

οὕτως καὶ ὑμεῖς ὅταν ἴδητε πάντα ταῦτα γινώσκετε ὅτι ἐγγύς ἐστιν ἐπὶ θύραις

"likewise and when you perceive all this, know that it's at hand, even at the gates."

"(403)So the Romans being now become masters of the wars, they both placed their ensigns upon the towers, and made joyful acclamations for the victory they had gained, as having found the end of this war much lighter than its beginning; for when they had gotten upon the last was, without any bloodshed, they could hardly believe what they found to be true; but seeing nobody to oppose them, they stood in doubt what such an unusual solitude could mean. (404) But when they went in numbers into the lanes of the city, with their swords drawn, they slew those whom they overtook, without mercy, and set fire to the houses wither the Jews were fled, and burnt every soul in them, and laid waste a great many of the rest; (405) and when they were come to the houses to plunder them, they found in them entire families of dead men, and the upper rooms full of dead corpses, that is of such as died by the famine; they then stood in a horror at this sight, and went out without touching anything. (406) But although they had this commiseration for such as were destroyed in that manner, yet had they not the same for those that were still alive, but they ran every one through whom they met with, and obstructed the very lanes with their dead bodies, and made the whole city run down with blood, to such a degree indeed that the fire of many of the houses was quenched with these men's blood. (407) And truly so it happened, that though the slayers left off at the evening, yet did the fire greatly prevail in the night, and as all was burning, came that eighth day of the month Gorpieus [Elul] upon Jerusalem; (408) a city that had been liable to so many miseries during the siege, that, had it always enjoyed as much happiness from its first foundation, it would certainly have been the envy of the world. Nor did it on any other account so much deserve these sore misfortunes, as by producing such a generation of men as were the occasions of this its overthrow." - Flavius Josephus, The Wars of the Jews, Book VI, Sections 403-408

-CryptoLutheran
 
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lismore

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Except that Matthew 24:33 isn't about when He returns, but rather the destruction that falls upon Jerusalem.

The question the disciples asked was;

And as he sat on the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what [shall be] the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world? (Matthew 24:3)

So, they're seeking the sign of his coming and the end of the world.

29 But immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 and then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send forth his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

32 Now from the fig tree learn her parable: when her branch is now become tender, and putteth forth its leaves, ye know that the summer is nigh; 33 even so ye also, when ye see all these things, know ye that he is nigh, [even] at the doors.

So, when in 70AD did the stars fall from the sky? (verse 29)
When did they see in 70AD the Son of Man coming on the clouds of Heaven? (verse 30)
How can the destruction of Jerusalem be referred to as 'summer'? (Verse 32) Summer for Rome maybe, winter for the Jews.

God Bless :)
 
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Citizen of the Kingdom

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Matthew 24:15-16
So when you see the desolating sacrilege standing in the holy place, as was spoken of by the prophet Daniel (let the reader understand), 16 then those in Judea must flee to the mountains; ..... that was hindsight?
 
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ViaCrucis

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Matthew 24:15-16
So when you see the desolating sacrilege standing in the holy place, as was spoken of by the prophet Daniel (let the reader understand), 16 then those in Judea must flee to the mountains; ..... that was hindsight?

Jesus references what occurred under Antiochus to point toward what to look for, in this case the occupation of Jerusalem by the murderous zealots who slew the priests, melted down the sacred ornaments of the Temple, and committed egregious abomination.

"But as for John, when he could no longer plunder the people, he betook himself to sacrilege, and melted down many of the sacred utensils, which had been given to the temple; as also many of those vessels which were necessary for such as ministered about holy things, the caldrons, the dishes, and the tables; nay, he did not abstain from those pouring vessels that were sent them by Augustus and his wife; for the Roman emperors did ever both honor and adorn this temple; whereas this man, who was a Jew, seized upon what were the donations of foreigners, and said to those that were with him, that it was proper for them to use Divine things, while they were fighting for the Divinity, without fear, and that such whose warfare is for the temple should live of the temple; on which account he emptied the vessels of that sacred wine and oil, which the priests kept to be poured on the burnt-offerings, and which lay in the inner court of the temple, and distributed it among the multitude, who, in their anointing themselves and drinking, used [each of them] above an hin of them. And here I cannot but speak my mind, and what the concern I am under dictates to me, and it is this: I suppose, that had the Romans made any longer delay in coming against these villains, that the city would either have been swallowed up by the ground opening upon them, or been overflowed by water, or else been destroyed by such thunder as the country of Sodom perished by, for it had brought forth a generation of men much more atheistical than were those that suffered such punishments; for by their madness it was that all the people came to be destroyed." - Flavius Josephus, The Wars of the Jews, Book V, Section 562

-CryptoLutheran
 
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Citizen of the Kingdom

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Jesus references what occurred under Antiochus to point toward what to look for, in this case the occupation of Jerusalem by the murderous zealots who slew the priests, melted down the sacred ornaments of the Temple, and committed egregious abomination.

"But as for John, when he could no longer plunder the people, he betook himself to sacrilege, and melted down many of the sacred utensils, which had been given to the temple; as also many of those vessels which were necessary for such as ministered about holy things, the caldrons, the dishes, and the tables; nay, he did not abstain from those pouring vessels that were sent them by Augustus and his wife; for the Roman emperors did ever both honor and adorn this temple; whereas this man, who was a Jew, seized upon what were the donations of foreigners, and said to those that were with him, that it was proper for them to use Divine things, while they were fighting for the Divinity, without fear, and that such whose warfare is for the temple should live of the temple; on which account he emptied the vessels of that sacred wine and oil, which the priests kept to be poured on the burnt-offerings, and which lay in the inner court of the temple, and distributed it among the multitude, who, in their anointing themselves and drinking, used [each of them] above an hin of them. And here I cannot but speak my mind, and what the concern I am under dictates to me, and it is this: I suppose, that had the Romans made any longer delay in coming against these villains, that the city would either have been swallowed up by the ground opening upon them, or been overflowed by water, or else been destroyed by such thunder as the country of Sodom perished by, for it had brought forth a generation of men much more atheistical than were those that suffered such punishments; for by their madness it was that all the people came to be destroyed." - Flavius Josephus, The Wars of the Jews, Book V, Section 562

-CryptoLutheran
There’s this huge link to commentaries about those verses, I’m not convinced that standing in the temple is yet fulfilled after Christ. Matthew 24:15 Commentary | Precept Austin
 
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ViaCrucis

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I have no doubt that in their mind the destruction of the Temple could mean nothing other than the very end of the world. Jesus, however, demarcates between the destruction of the Temple marked by signs to look out for, and His own coming, which is without warning, but like a thief in the night.


When did the sun turn dark and the moon to blood on Pentecost?

"But Peter, standing with the eleven, lifted up his voice and addressed them: 'Men of Judea and all who dwell in Jerusalem, let this be known to you, and give ear to my words. For these people are not drunk, as you suppose, since it is only the third hour of the day. But this is what was uttered through the prophet Joel:

"And in the last days it shall be, God declares, that I will pour out My spirit on all flesh, and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams; even on My male servants and female servants in those days I will pour out My Spirit, and they shall prophesy. And I will show wonders in the heavens above and signs on the earth below, blood, and fire, and vapor of smoke; the sun shall be turned to darkness and the moon to blood, before the day of the Lord comes, the great and magnificent day. And it shall come to pass that everyone who calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved."'" - Acts of the Apostles 2:14-21

Consider for a moment that apocalyptic language is not the same thing as literal language. The point of apocalyptic language is to say, "Pay attention, this is important".

We have two choices here: Either Peter lied, and in which case the entire episode of the outpouring of the Spirit on Pentecost is somehow false, and not just Peter, but also John the Baptist and the Lord Jesus Himself are all wrong. Or, and this is the position I take, Peter was absolutely correct, what was happening on that day WAS in fact fulfillment of what Joel had prophesied.

The sun turning dark and moon turning to blood aren't literal celestial events, but instead a way to say, "Pay attention! This is important"

For on that day God poured out the Holy Spirit in fulfillment of a promise made long ago through the Prophet Joel, and also through St. John the Baptist who said that the One coming after him would baptize with the Holy Spirit and with fire--precisely what occurred on Pentecost, where Christ baptized the whole Church once and forever with the Holy Spirit.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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ViaCrucis

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There’s this huge link to commentaries about those verses, I’m not convinced that standing in the temple is yet fulfilled after Christ. Matthew 24:15 Commentary | Precept Austin

It would make no sense for the Evangelist to say "Let the reader understand" unless this was the point. Why is the Evangelist so concerned that the reader pay really close attention here? Unless this was something the reader should pick up on.

"Luke, in order to shew that the abomination of desolation foretold by Daniel had reference to the time of the siege of Jerusalem, repeats these words of our Lord, When ye shall see Jerusalem encompassed by armies, then know ye that its desolation draweth nigh." - Augustine

"Or it may be understood of the statue of Cæsar, which Pilate set up in the temple; or of the equestrian statue of Adrian, which stood to the present time in the very Holy of Holies. For, according to the Old Scripture, an idol is called ‘abomination;’ of desolation is added, because the idol was set up in the desolated and deserted temple." - Jerome

"And this we know was so done when the fall of Jerusalem drew near; for on the approach of the Roman army, all the Christians in the province, warned, as ecclesiastical history tells us (Euseb. H.E. iii. 5.), miraculously from heaven, withdrew, and passing the Jordan, took refuge in the city of Pella; and under the protection of that King Agrippa, of whom we read in the Acts of the Apostles, they continued some time; but Agrippa himself, with the Jews whom he governed, was subjected to the dominion of the Romans." - Remigius

"Note how this speech is directed against the Jews; for when these things were done by Vespasian, the Apostles could neither observe the Sabbath nor fly, seeing most of them were already dead, and those who survived were living in distant countries. And why they should pray for this He adds a reason, For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor shall be." - Chrysostom

Quotes all taken from Thomas Aquinas' Catena Aurea, Matthew 24:15-22
https://www.ecatholic2000.com/catena/untitled-31.shtml#_Toc384506931

-CryptoLutheran
 
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Berean Tim

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By asking the question as to whether the very concept of a rapture is even Biblical. I don't believe that it is, and would point out that the very concept of the rapture has only been around for the last 200 years (out of a church history that spans 2000+ years).
The word rapture is a Latin translation of the greek word "hapazo" translated "caught up" in English.
1st Thessalonians 4 16For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and o we will always be with the Lord. 18Therefore encourage one another with these words.
The concept of the rapture or catching away the saints who are alive and remain is biblical as it comes from Paul's writing to the Thessalonians.
 
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JacksBratt

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Has anyone here addressed the OP's fear of being left behind?

I mean really... all you are doing is arguing over when it will come, if it will come... is it real...

Totally neglecting the fact that this was supposed to be about their fear of being left behind..

Anyone really got any other advice other than arguments about the event itself?

Fact is... if you could die tomorrow and have complete confidence that you are saved.. then... if and when the rapture comes... you will be taken.
 
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RDKirk

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Has anyone here addressed the OP's fear of being left behind?

I mean really... all you are doing is arguing over when it will come, if it will come... is it real...

Totally neglecting the fact that this was supposed to be about their fear of being left behind..

Anyone really got any other advice other than arguments about the event itself?

Fact is... if you could die tomorrow and have complete confidence that you are saved.. then... if and when the rapture comes... you will be taken.

I did.
 
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