Which baptism is the "one baptism" of Christianity?

Sam81

Jesus is everything
Sep 12, 2016
393
288
42
Texas
✟27,676.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
Ephesians 4:4-6 reads

There is one body and one Spirit---just as you were called to one hope when you were called---one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

And in Luke 3:16 John the baptizer says,
"I baptize you with water. But one more powerful than I will come, the thongs of whose sandals I am not worthy to untie. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire."

I think most non-Catholics would agree that water baptism doesn't save a person and that it is the baptism of the Holy Spirit that saves one, which spiritual baptism every believer receives when he or she is born again (having been buried with Him in baptism and raised with Him through your faith in the power of God, who raised Him from the dead. Colossians 2:12) .

What then is the purpose of water baptism? For Jews it was a symbolic ritual representing a desire for a good conscience toward God and repentance from sins. Jesus' disciples and the early Christians practiced the same ritual. Yet we have no instructions in the NT for how to water baptize or any command to perform or partake in the ritual.

Some believe that Christ sent the apostles to baptize people with water as a part of their evangelistic commission. But if there is only one baptism that saves, why would He? The two are obviously not one and the same.

The apostle Paul water baptized a few people, but he said that Christ did not send him to baptize but rather to preach the gospel (1 Corinthians 1:13-17), through which those who hear and believe are baptized by the Spirit.

Why would the man who was arguably the greatest apostle not have been sent by Christ to water baptize if water baptism was an important or necessary part of Christianity, and if Jesus had indeed sent His other apostles to water baptize?

I am one Christian who believes that water baptism is an obsolete Jewish ritual that was carried over into Christianity for a time in the early days of the faith for its symbolic spiritual significance but which God didn't intend for Christians to continue and which is not necessary or important to administer or to partake in.
I agree that water baptism doesn't save you the same way that communion doesn't save or sanctify. But it is still something we are commanded to do, for inasmuch as obedience to the gospel is necessary for salvation, water baptism and communion are both necessary for salvation.
 
Upvote 0

TLSITD

Conservative Christian
Apr 26, 2020
315
296
40
Tennessee
✟15,274.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
I agree that water baptism doesn't save you the same way that communion doesn't save or sanctify. But it is still something we are commanded to do, for inasmuch as obedience to the gospel is necessary for salvation, water baptism and communion are both necessary for salvation.
Neither water baptism nor "communion" are requirements for salvation. That is not a part of the gospel.
 
Upvote 0

ralliann

christian
Jun 27, 2007
6,112
1,696
✟201,659.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
Well, the New Testament clearly differentiates John's Baptism from Christian Baptism. John's Baptism was obsoleted by Christian Baptism, even though we're talking about two things that look similar.




We see that point illustrated here.
And?? what point.? it was obsoleted?
 
Upvote 0

Albion

Facilitator
Dec 8, 2004
111,138
33,258
✟583,842.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
Neither water baptism nor "communion" are requirements for salvation. That is not a part of the gospel.
We are, however, called upon to observe/practice/receive them. While it is true that they are not requirements for salvation, strictly speaking, that applies to extraordinary circumstances, not to a routine refusal or disinterest.
 
Upvote 0

DerSchweik

Spend time in His Word - every day
Aug 31, 2007
70,184
161,375
Right of center
✟1,879,104.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Recall what John the baptizer said to the Pharisees who came to him to be water baptized. If water baptism saves everyone, why were they rejected?
First off, your premise that "baptism saves everyone" has no scriptural support and is therefore wrong - so any conclusion made from that premise cannot logically follow (a non-sequitur).
Second, their rejection was simply a matter of their unrepentant hearts and trusting solely in their genealogical relationship to Abraham - repentance being a pre-requisite to anyone's salvation. (c.f. Acts 2:38)
Jesus didn't command the apostles to baptize people with water in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit;
Jesus' actual words: “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I commanded you..." Matthew 28:18ff
He sent them out to baptize people into God with the saving baptism of Christ, which is the baptism of the Holy Spirit (which those who hear and believe the gospel receive from God, not man), not the symbolic baptism of John the baptizer which was water baptism.
Again, absolutely zero scriptural support for this statement.
 
Upvote 0

Albion

Facilitator
Dec 8, 2004
111,138
33,258
✟583,842.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
And?? what point.? it was obsoleted?
When Christ commissioned his Apostles to convert all nations and baptize them.

This is a reference to Christian baptism, with all that that implies, not to the washing gesture that was common among repentant Jews and which John had administered before the beginning of Christ's public ministry.
 
Upvote 0

DerSchweik

Spend time in His Word - every day
Aug 31, 2007
70,184
161,375
Right of center
✟1,879,104.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Neither water baptism nor "communion" are requirements for salvation. That is not a part of the gospel.
Communion, I agree is not part of the salvation process. But baptism? I'd like to see some scriptural support for excluding it from the salvation process.
(Hint: there is none)
I mean, if you think about it:

We receive forgiveness of sins after… repenting and being baptized (Acts 2:38)
We receive the gift of the Holy Spirit… after being baptized (Acts 2:38)
We’re “added” after being baptized (Acts 2:41)
We’re “judged faithful” after being baptized (Acts 16:15)
We’re “in Christ Jesus” having been baptized (Rom 6:3)
We’re thus baptized into His Death, having been crucified with Him (Rom 6:3, Gal 2:20)
We’ve been buried with Him in baptism (Rom 6:4)
We’ll be raised from the dead, as Christ was, because of our baptism (Rom 6:4)
We have “clothed ourselves with Christ” in baptism (Gal 3:27)
We’ve been buried with him in baptism (Col 2:12)

Crucified with Christ, buried with Him, to be one day raised with Him, having been judged faithful, having clothed ourselves with Him… all in Christian baptism... would it therefore not be proper to say of Christian baptism that it IS the gospel?

...and as Albion and others rightfully noted - Christ DID command us to submit to it - pretty much His last words to us in fact. (Matthew 28:18-20, Mark 16:16)
Verses like Acts 22:16 - "Now why do you delay? Get up and be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on His name.’" (Paul's conversion) Isn't the "wahing away of sins" synonymous with salvation?
Or Acts 2:40b, 41 - “Be saved from this perverse generation!” So then, those who had received his word were baptized; and that day there were added about three thousand souls. (Peter's appeal to the crowds) Peter just appealed to them to "Be saved...!" Why then were they baptized?
Or Mark 16:15f - “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned." I don't know - this seems pretty clear on two levels: 1) as a command by our Lord, and 2) as necessary to the salvation process, doesn't it?

I could go on - citing actual examples of people becoming Christians in the NT - incapable of finding ANY scriptures that explicitly refute or disallow Christian baptism.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

ViaCrucis

Confessional Lutheran
Oct 2, 2011
37,341
26,785
Pacific Northwest
✟728,115.00
Country
United States
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
I explained that already. I don't believe he's saying what he seems to be saying, in light of what the rest of the Scriptures say on the subject.

What the rest of the Scriptures say on the subject are that we receive the gift of the Holy Spirit and forgiveness of sins through baptism (Acts 2:38), we are united to Christ's death, burial, and resurrection (Romans 6:3-4, Colossians 2:12), are clothed with Christ (Galatians 3:27), and are born again (John 3:5, Titus 3:5).

In light of what the rest of Scripture says about baptism, it would appear that St. Peter meant exactly what he said. There's no reason to engage in mental gymnastics to make it say something other than what it says.

With verses that seem to suggest something other than what other Scriptures say about the same subject, look to what the rest of the Scriptures say about it. If what Peter said in that verse meant that water baptism saves people, the rest of the New Testament's teachings about how a person is saved make no sense. There is only one baptism that saves, and everyone who gets saved is not water baptized.

This seems to demonstrate the problems of certain theologies about salvation, rather than a problem with the biblical witness about Baptism and the historic Christian understanding of it.

That baptism is salvific is not at odds with the biblical teaching that we are saved by grace through faith. Because what Scripture teaches is that our salvation is a working of God that comes to us through those means which God has established, and that God Himself gives us faith (Ephesians 2:8) and it is through faith that we are justified. If we truly believe that what Christ did is sufficient, the question then is how do I, the individual sinner, receive what Christ has done so that I might enjoy its benefit? Well, the biblical answer to that question is that Christ commanded His Church to go out and preach the Gospel and to baptize, that's the Great Commission.

Read Romans 10, what does St. Paul say? Yes, it says whoever calls on the name of the Lord will be saved, but read everything here, he says how can they call on One they have never heard? And how can they hear unless one is sent? And therefore "how beautiful are the feet of those who bring good news", therefore it is the preaching of the Gospel that does this, even as the Apostle plainly says, "Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ" It is Christ's institution of the sending out of the Church to preach the Gospel, and it is the preaching of this Gospel through which faith comes, and it is only with faith that one can call on the name of the Lord.

That is why St. Paul can, in Ephesians 1, say the Ephesians had been sealed with the Holy Spirit when they believed in the Gospel.

This is why we should be able to say that wherever the word of Christ is, God works faith, and thus salvation is at work.

Unsurprising then, St. Paul in Ephesians 5:26 speaks of Christ having cleansed His Church "by the washing of water by the word". Catch that? Water and word. Not some kind of figurative not-water "water", but water. The washing of water by the word. Water and word. Even as Jesus our Lord Himself says that the new birth is being born of "water and the Spirit". What water? Actual water.

Baptism.

Baptism contains God's word. It is the word of Christ connected to and comprehended in water, so that, whoever is baptized has been crucified, buried, and raised with Christ, they have been clothed with Christ. This is not just flowery prose with no meaning, it actually means what it says.

God isn't playing with words, He means what He says. "“For as the rain and the snow come down from heaven and do not return there but water the earth, making it bring forth and sprout, giving seed to the sower and bread to the eater, so shall my word be that goes out from my mouth; it shall not return to me empty, but it shall accomplish that which I purpose, and shall succeed in the thing for which I sent it." (Isaiah 55:10-11)

So instead of trying to get the Bible to work with your theology, instead get your theology from the Bible.

If the Bible says that baptism saves, and if the Bible says that salvation is by grace through faith, then both are true.

-CryptoLutheran
 
Upvote 0

ViaCrucis

Confessional Lutheran
Oct 2, 2011
37,341
26,785
Pacific Northwest
✟728,115.00
Country
United States
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
Well, I think some aspects of what you say are true, but it is not the whole of it IMO.
I think maybe (not settled on any of this) taking into consideration the situation. Jew's were for the most part already baptized in water by John, and the disciples were continuing John's baptism as Christ's disciples. Jesus baptized none but John's baptism was being done by them.

Knowing only the baptism of John.

Instructed in the way, the things of the Lord

24 And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, and mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus.
25 This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.

The way of God more perfectly....
26 And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly.
27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:
28 For he mightily convinced the Jews, and that publickly, shewing by the scriptures that Jesus was Christ. {Christ: or, is the Christ }
1 And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,
2 He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.
3 And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John’s baptism.
4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
These disciples seems were John's, since they did not seem to know that Jesus was the one that John said to follow (as did the disciples of John which followed Jesus).

John 7:37 In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

So, this seems to be a distinction. His glorification caused their ministry to gain power that was not before.

John's baptism was of repentance in preparation for the coming of the Messiah.

The early Church did not practice John's baptism, but Christian baptism, which had been commanded and instituted by Jesus Christ after His resurrection, as testified to in Matthew 28 in the Great Commission.

John's baptism was a ritual bath to demonstrate repentance in preparation for the coming of the Messiah.

Christian baptism is union to Jesus Christ and life, death, and resurrection.

In Acts 19 St. Paul encounters a group of "disciples" who were only familiar with John's ministry, they say so, which led to Paul preaching the Gospel, giving them Christian baptism, and then laying hands on them (Chrismation).

"And it happened that while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul passed through the inland country and came to Ephesus. There he found some disciples. And he said to them, 'Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?' And they said, 'No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit.' And he said, 'Into what then were you baptized?' They said, 'Into John's baptism.' And Paul said, 'John baptized with the baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in the One who was to come after him, that is, Jesus.' On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And when Paul had laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they began speaking in tongues and prophesying." - Acts of the Apostles 19:1-6

John's baptism =/= Christian baptism.

-CryptoLutheran
 
Upvote 0

TLSITD

Conservative Christian
Apr 26, 2020
315
296
40
Tennessee
✟15,274.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
And?? what point.? it was obsoleted?
It was never a part of Christian doctrine. It was a part of Jewish practice that Christians continued doing but it was never given as a command to anyone but John the baptizer, and that to the Jews for a symbolic purpose. Some of the apostles continued to water baptize for its spiritual symbolism, but it was never a requirement for salvation or a part of their commission and still isn't for the church.

I maintain that the "one baptism" of the faith that Christ sent the apostles out to baptize the world with was the baptism of His Spirit, which doesn't depend upon, neither is it the same as, water baptism.

Many people get saved without ever being water baptized, and many people who get water baptized are not saved and never do get saved. Water baptism is not the baptism of Christ.

Again, Christ didn't send Paul to water baptize. Why would He omit this important commandment if it was a part of the gospel? It was obviously not essential but optional.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Sam81

Jesus is everything
Sep 12, 2016
393
288
42
Texas
✟27,676.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
Baptism and communion both accompany saving faith. If you die before you're able to get baptized or take communion, you still go to heaven, as we're saved by grace through faith (but I don't believe God would let that happen). But if you determine to not be baptised and/or refuse communion, then you obviously are not genuinely saved, as baptism and partaking in communion accompany salvation. No one born of God would refuse either.
 
Upvote 0

Tigger45

Romans 12:2…be transformed…
Supporter
Aug 24, 2012
20,713
13,149
E. Eden
✟1,264,086.00
Country
United States
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Constitution
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Tigger45

Romans 12:2…be transformed…
Supporter
Aug 24, 2012
20,713
13,149
E. Eden
✟1,264,086.00
Country
United States
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Constitution
B2F589B0-EED0-466F-AB2F-6C117ABC5BA6.gif
 
Upvote 0

charsan

Charismatic Episcopal Church
Jul 12, 2019
2,297
2,115
52
South California
✟62,421.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Neither water baptism nor "communion" are requirements for salvation. That is not a part of the gospel.

Baptism is very much a requirement as Christ said one must be baptized to have Salvation, there is no wiggle room. I also might add that Baptism is something God does, it is not a work of men
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

DerSchweik

Spend time in His Word - every day
Aug 31, 2007
70,184
161,375
Right of center
✟1,879,104.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
It was never a part of Christian doctrine. It was a part of Jewish practice that Christians continued doing but it was never given as a command to anyone but John the baptizer, and that to the Jews for a symbolic purpose. Some of the apostles continued to water baptize for its spiritual symbolism, but it was never a requirement for salvation or a part of their commission and still isn't for the church.
You might want to go back and look at early church history and its doctrines.

For instance, just a couple examples (What Early Christians believed about BAPTISM):
110-165 AD Martyr "there is no other way [to obtain God's promises] than this-to become acquainted with Christ, to be washed in the fountain spoken of by Isaiah for the remission of sins, and for the remainder, to live sinless lives." (Justin Martyr, Trypho chap. 44)
140-230 AD Tertullian "Baptism itself is a corporal act by which we are plunged into the water, while its effect is spiritual, in that we are freed from our sins" (Baptism 7:2).
150-200 AD CLEMENT "Being baptized, we are illuminated; illuminated, we become sons; being made sons, we are made perfect; being made perfect, we are made immortal... This work is variously called grace, and illumination, and perfection, and washing. Washing, by which we cleanse away our sins; grace, by which the penalties accruing to transgressions are remitted; and illumination, by which that holy light of salvation is beheld, that is, by which we see God clearly." (Clement of Alexandria, "The Instructor," Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. 2, pg. 215)
200 AD HERMAS "And I said, 'I heard, sir, some teachers maintain that there is no other repentance than that which takes place, when we descended into the water and received remission of our former sin.' He said to me, 'That was sound doctrine which you heard; for that is really the case.'" (Hermas, "The Shepherd," Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. 2, pg. 22)


I maintain that the "one baptism" of the faith that Christ sent the apostles out to baptize the world with was the baptism of His Spirit, which doesn't depend upon, neither is it the same as, water baptism.

Many people get saved without ever being water baptized, and many people who get water baptized are not saved and never do get saved. Water baptism is not the baptism of Christ.
With all due respect, I get that you believe certain things, but you have yet to provide any scriptural backup for any of your assertions.

Again, Christ didn't send Paul to water baptize. Why would He omit this important commandment if it was a part of the gospel? It was obviously not essential but optional.
This objection to Christian baptism has already been debunked as a logical fallacy as well as an argument completely removed from the context in which Paul stated it. See post #23.

Interestingly, this objection to Christian baptism is perhaps the oldest one out there. Tertullian even addressed it in the 2nd century:
140-230 AD TERTULLIAN "But they roll back an objection from that apostle himself, in that he said, 'For Christ sent me not to baptize;' as if by this argument baptism were done away! For if so, why did he baptize Gaius, and Crispus, and the house of Stephanas? However, even if Christ had not sent him to baptize, yet He had given other apostles the precept to baptize. But these words were written to the Corinthians in regard of the circumstances of that particular time; seeing that schisms and dissensions were agitated among them, while one attributes everything to Paul, another to Apollos. For which reason the 'peacemaking' apostle, for fear he should seem to claim all gifts for himself, says that he had been sent 'not to baptize, but to preach.' For preaching is the prior thing, baptizing the posterior. Therefore the preaching came first: but I think baptizing withal was lawful to him to whom preaching was." (Tertullian, "On Baptism," Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. 3, pg. 676)
 
Upvote 0

DerSchweik

Spend time in His Word - every day
Aug 31, 2007
70,184
161,375
Right of center
✟1,879,104.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Obedience of Faith
Paul used this phrase (c.f. Rom 1:5, 16:26).
Peter used something similar - "Since you have in obedience to the truth purified your souls for a sincere love of the brethren..." (I Peter 1:22)
Are they talking about Christian baptism? Up to the reader, probably - but, in the wake of such strident opposition to baptism - and considering our Lord commanded baptism... I wonder.

Many like to assert "faith only" or "belief only" as the sole requirements for salvation - but most think belief and faith synonymous (they're not), that both merely refer to the mental assent of the truth of the gospel - they don't.
Belief, for example, has its exceptions - e.g. the demons in James 2:19 believed, and the religious rulers in John 12:42f also believed.

But, it's passages like Hebrews 3:16ff that should give the "belief only" crowd certain pause - and us as well lest we become proud - "... And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who were disobedient? So we see that they were not able to enter because of unbelief."
Here the Hebrews writer rightfully equates UNBELIEF with DISOBEDIENCE.

Indeed, everywhere in the bible, OT and new, faith's context is ALWAYS obedience. Always.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ralliann
Upvote 0

DerSchweik

Spend time in His Word - every day
Aug 31, 2007
70,184
161,375
Right of center
✟1,879,104.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Humility and Obedience
...and did we know that HUMILITY is a function of obedience? Jesus taught us this - "Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross." - Philippians 2:8

Pride, on the other hand is almost always equated with a refusal to obey. Naaman is the likely example here (2 Kings 5) - after being told to “Go and wash in the Jordan seven times, and your flesh will be restored to you and you will be clean" this was his response:
"..Naaman was furious and went away and said, “Behold, I thought, ‘He will surely come out to me and stand and call on the name of the Lord his God, and wave his hand over the place and cure the leper.’ Are not Abanah and Pharpar, the rivers of Damascus, better than all the waters of Israel? Could I not wash in them and be clean?” So he turned and went away in a rage." ...

The refusal to obey is a function of pride, not an act of humility.

See what Naaman did after he calmed down and his servants spoke some reason into him.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums