God as much of a woman as a man

Miles · May 13, 2020

I think it's symbolism, meant to communicate something. I doubt that God is male or female as we typically use the terms. It's not like the Word, the Alpha and Omega, needs to sexually reproduce.

ewq1938 · May 13, 2020

Paidiske said:
Not quite accurate. At the very least, in Hebrew, Holy Spirit is feminine, not masculine.

That's the gender of words which doesn't determine the gender of what the word represents. There are plenty examples of things having a feminine Hebrew word or name but aren't actually male or female in the sense we are talking about.

The Hebrew word for wind is rûach. It's a feminine noun but that doesn't mean wind is a female. Same goes for the Holy Spirit and also remember the Holy Spirit impregnated Mary. If the HS is a female that would be a sin.

Dkh587 · May 13, 2020

ewq1938 said:
I'm certain that the way God created a woman is found in Gen 2. The fact that God created females/femininity in creation is not evidence that any part of God is female. There is no female in the Trinity.

The detailed account of the creation of humans, both male & female, is in Genesis 2.

just because *you* say it isn’t evidence doesn’t mean that it’s not evidence.

Philip_B · May 13, 2020

Here is the thing: before there were men and women, there was God. So God is before masculine and feminine came to be the thing. Gender serves a biological purpose where death is an ever present reality, otherwise a species would simply cease to be. As God is eternal, and death is not a reality beyond this mortal coil, God has no need and no purpose in being masculine or feminine, it is simply pointless, and God is beyond pointless, and beyond gender.

Genesis 1 and two allow you to realise that if we are to carry this image and the likeness, we can not do it in one gender, for it is in diversity and complexity, in our complimentarity and relationship that we present a pale image and reflection of the likeness of God.

For now we see in a glass darkly, but then, face to face.

Sam81 · May 13, 2020

Here's the thing: you all can believe what you want. I'm going to church.

Dkh587 · May 13, 2020

Sam81 said:
Here's the thing: you all can believe what you want. I'm going to church.

you can believe whatever you want, too. Have fun.

Paidiske · May 13, 2020

ewq1938 said:
That's the gender of words which doesn't determine the gender of what the word represents.

We could then say the same of a term like "Father" when used of God.

ewq1938 said:
It's a feminine noun but that doesn't mean wind is a female. Same goes for the Holy Spirit and also remember the Holy Spirit impregnated Mary. If the HS is a female that would be a sin.

Okay, I don't mean to be crude, but.... it's not as if the Holy Spirit "impregnated" Mary the way a man would. The Holy Spirit created life within Mary's womb, but that's not analogous to sexual reproduction!

Philip_B · May 13, 2020

Matthew 23:37-39
‘Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often have I desired to gather your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing! See, your house is left to you, desolate. For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, “Blessed is the one who comes in the name of the Lord.” ’

Not every image of God in Scripture is simply masculine.

ewq1938 · May 13, 2020

Paidiske said:
We could then say the same of a term like "Father" when used of God.

Not really. Mother, Son, daughter, Father have word genders that actually match what the word represents. It's words like spirit and wind etc etc that have word genders but do not represent things that have a gender.

Okay, I don't mean to be crude, but.... it's not as if the Holy Spirit "impregnated" Mary the way a man would.

This is correct but the impregnation did come from the Holy Spirit and that eliminates the possibility of the Holy Spirit being a female since that would be a homosexual act between two females resulting in a conception.

The Holy Spirit created life within Mary's womb, but that's not analogous to sexual reproduction!

Naturally Mary's conception was non-sexual.

ewq1938 · May 13, 2020

Philip_B said:
Matthew 23:37-39
‘Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often have I desired to gather your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing! See, your house is left to you, desolate. For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, “Blessed is the one who comes in the name of the Lord.” ’

Not every image of God in Scripture is simply masculine.

That is a metaphor not a direct description. God the Father is not a female hen, does not have feathers and does not lay eggs. The only meaning that passage has is that God cares for children like a hen cares for her brood.

Hermit76 · May 13, 2020

archer75 said:
So do you think I said that just to mesa with someone?

The assigned roles for each gender are not universal. Even within Orthodoxy. Now it's some kind of blubbering nonsense if a man cries. But in a different culture, such as that of St. Boris and Gleb, crying was a sign of masculinity.

And you're talking about gender, which is not the same as sex. Maleness refers to sex.

The male priesthood (in the OC) has nothing at all to do with whether maleness is a biological trait.

I have no idea what you are trying to say

Paidiske · May 13, 2020

ewq1938 said:
This is correct but the impregnation did come from the Holy Spirit and that eliminates the possibility of the Holy Spirit being a female since that would be a homosexual act between two females resulting in a conception.

Naturally Mary's conception was non-sexual.

Ah... yes. It was non-sexual. Which means that your first point there is completely invalid.

ewq1938 said:
That is a metaphor not a direct description.

As with all terms for God!

ewq1938 · May 13, 2020

Paidiske said:
Ah... yes. It was non-sexual. Which means that your first point there is completely invalid.

It would still be sinful if the Holy Spirit was female:

Mat 1:18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.

Yes it was non-sexual but it was a conception of a child between the Holy Spirit and a human woman. The Spirit cannot be a female for moral and divine reasons.

So back to the OP, No part of God/Trinity is female. The Father isn't female. The Son isn't female. The Holy Spirit isn't female.

Philip_B · May 13, 2020

ewq1938 said:
That is a metaphor not a direct description.

Correct, as with the Genesis 1 image of the Spirit of God brooding over the waters.

The images do in fact carry a feminine undertone. There is the risk that a Patriarchal tradition has tended to neutralise the feminine and emasculate the neutral, so throwing a bias into our understanding that tends to support a Patriarchal position.

Culture and religious traditions can be difficult to discern, and we should be careful that we understand this less we end up defending flawed positions. If you want to defend the proposition that God is Masculine, do you really understand why you think that, and what benefit it is to you or the Kingdom of God to proclaim it.

When Dave Hughes Argued that God was Masculine because God is a boys name, I suddenly realised that much of what was being defended was not God, nor Kingdom, nor Scripture, but rather a patriarchal tradition.

God is bigger than we can think.

Philip_B · May 13, 2020

ewq1938 said:
No part of God/Trinity is female. The Father isn't female. The Son isn't female. The Holy Spirit isn't female.

Apart from the danger of dividing substance and confounding persons, your statement may carry the same level of truth if it was inverted to the masculine.

PloverWing · May 13, 2020

chevyontheriver said:
The one thing you have not accounted for is that the Father is ... male. God as Trinity does not have gender but the Father does, as does the Son. That God is not male or female is good theology ... as long as the Father is not morphed into something other than the Father.

Hermit76 said:
You know as well as I do that maleness goes beyond a biological function.

Those of you who have said that God is male (or that God the Father is male): What do you mean when you say that God is male? What does "male" mean to you, when you are speaking of a being who does not have a body?

ewq1938 said:
Angels are always male and often are confused for being human males because angels look human even though they aren't.

Similarly: What do you mean when you say that an angel is male?

Citizen of the Kingdom · May 13, 2020

Paidiske said:
We could then say the same of a term like "Father" when used of God..
Okay, I don't mean to be crude, but.... it's not as if the Holy Spirit "impregnated" Mary the way a man would. The Holy Spirit created life within Mary's womb, but that's not analogous to sexual reproduction!

The same pattern again of the Holy Spirit brooding over the waters and of Jesus’ exclamation that He was as the mother hen.

Mark Quayle · May 13, 2020

GaveMeJoy said:
Disclaimer to male readers: I am a straight and manly 6 foot 200 pound man, who is red blooded and I am not a progressive or “feminist” or liberal. It’s ok to keep reading and not just dismiss it because you think I’m a woman.

God is a spirit being. God had no gender or physical representation. While Jesus manifested as a male human, he existed as a member of the triune God for eternity before creation.
While it can be argued Jesus is entirely male, there is no scriptural defense for the position that God is male in any way.

The scriptures use the male pronoun to refer to God by default, through translation, and because the scriptures were written in patriarchal societies where the male pronoun would be used for a deity.

As Goddess is a spirit and gender free, she does not have a gender.

The previous sentence sounds weird and is inaccurate. It also doesn’t use common scriptural male terms for God so it feels uncomfortable. However, it is equally as inaccurate as the following sentence:

As God is a spirit and gender free he does not have a gender.

God is not male. It’s OK to admit it, it won’t make you turn blue.

but seriously, where am I wrong, any scripture to demonstrate God is male? Do you have a problem with my perspective here shared (other than my Lame jokes) or is it acceptable theologically.

thanks! I’m mostly trying this out because I want to talk to my pastor about it but I don’t want to miss anything important. Thanks!

We see everything backwards. Male and female are hardly the point. Masculine and feminine are more to the point, but even that we don't understand.

While it can be argued that God, like everything else in most languages, is referred to by the generic masculine, I don't think that is all there is to it. God, to my thinking, is decidedly masculine --and by that I don't mean lacking feminine qualities. He just comes across to me that way. But no he is not male. We males are masculine, though not nearly so much as he is.

Further, there are many references to the interaction of God with Humanity --first with Israel, to whom he was "husband", and such things as Song of Solomon; also, Christ and his Bride. There is no end to the ways the work of God for himself and for us is masculine, to my mind at least.

Paidiske · May 13, 2020

ewq1938 said:
It would still be sinful if the Holy Spirit was female:

Mat 1:18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.

Yes it was non-sexual but it was a conception of a child between the Holy Spirit and a human woman. The Spirit cannot be a female for moral and divine reasons.

It would only be sinful if you imagine that there was something sexual going on. For the Holy Spirit to create life, according to God's purposes, without sex, cannot be sinful, no matter whether we see the Holy Spirit as male or female.

ewq1938 said:
So back to the OP, No part of God/Trinity is female. The Father isn't female. The Son isn't female. The Holy Spirit isn't female.

I actually agree. Except I'd say they aren't male either (except for Christ's humanity). God transcends these human attributes.

Sam81 · May 13, 2020

God is not biologically male. But God is most certainly masculine.

God as much of a woman as a man

Student of Life

I love you three.

Well-Known Member

Bread is Blessed & Broken Wine is Blessed & Poured

Jesus is everything

Well-Known Member

Clara bonam audax

Bread is Blessed & Broken Wine is Blessed & Poured

I love you three.

I love you three.

You can call me Paisios

Clara bonam audax

I love you three.

Bread is Blessed & Broken Wine is Blessed & Poured

Bread is Blessed & Broken Wine is Blessed & Poured

Episcopalian

Well-Known Member

Monergist; and by reputation, Reformed Calvinist

Clara bonam audax

Jesus is everything

Similar threads