NOT A PLASTIC GOSPEL

Dorothy Mae · May 3, 2020

Skidder said:
Written with tears of joy on what my Savior did for me. Grace and peace to you and your family.

The tears of joy one has when one when knows He is pleased with one’s obedience to Him are much deeper. It’s more blessed to give than receive.

crossnote · May 3, 2020

Skidder said:
The simple and pure Grace of God has always been a threat to our enemy. He is always striving to water down or change the simple gospel message that brings salvation; a salvation not only from the penalty of sin, but also the everyday power of sin. If he can introduce a little yeast into the batch he knows he can contaminate the simple and spontaneous power of “no longer I who live, but Christ”.

Yes the way some Christians speak, it is 'no longer Christ who lives in me, but my own planning and ingenuity'.

Skidder said:
For the last several years I have been noticing a “reprogramming” going on in the western church. An ecumenical spirit that is slowly contaminating the cistern of God’s living water. A subtle deception that lures believers away from the cross. Slowly but surely poisoning the watering hole with a false gospel that is centered around the desires of the flesh.

The tares definitely have the upper hand in the administration of things (unity over truth) but nothing that real persecution won't sort out.

Skidder said:
A gospel that no longer proclaims that sin is the problem and Christ is the ONLY cure. A gospel that promises a sleigh full of goodies when you put your faith in the latest “perfect plan” riding on the coattails of religion. A gospel that promises prosperity to an old man who has long since been crucified. A gospel that fixes “everything” broken in your life, and will fill your lap with a plethora of earthly pleasures.

Yes, in short, a Gospel that has lost sight of eternity and judgment.

Skidder said:
Galatians 6:14
But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.

How did we stray so far from the hope that left us crucified to this world? How did we become so engulfed in the cares of this world that we left the CONTENTMENT of a perfect forgiveness? How did we let Satan deceive us into turning away from the RICHES of an EMPTY TOMB? When did we make this wrong turn into the the desert where our souls became parched? When we turned from streams of living water to embrace the dry, barren, wilderness of the flesh?

The old man has a natural proclivity to law keeping and is easily seduced away from the sufficiency of the cross, so looks elsewhere for righteousness but finds only mirages of promises that appeals to the pride of man.

Skidder said:
We turned away when the world sold us a list of promises; plastic promises that soon revealed a list of lies. We left when we were deceived into thinking that the sufferings of Christ could in no way produce a JOY that cometh in the morning!! That somehow God would give us relief from being sanctified into the image of His Son. That sufferings no longer produce perseverance but are rather the result of a weakness in our faith. We turned away when we abandoned that quiet place of shelter at the cross in the arms of our Savior! That sacred place that reveals our sins are no longer scarlet but white as snow!!

Yes, no one to blame but us...not even the world, satan, others etc...
James 1:14 (KJV) But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
...away from God's good gifts.
James 1:17 (KJV) Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
As a matter of fact, I think some Christians have forgotten that eternal life is a GIFT purchased at Calvary, but insist they somehow have to pay back some of the price (idiocy).

Skidder said:
May we never leave the simplicity and POWER of a PERFECT FORGIVENESS!! The simplicity of the TRUE GOSPEL that reveals a joy unspeakable and full of glory! A forgiveness that has washed us white as snow in the eyes of our Father. An EVERYDAY mercy that is ALIVE and FILLED with the POWER of the GLORY OF HIS SON!!

Nor may we leave the fact of a FREE (to us) forgiveness and righteousness.
Romans 5:16-17 (NASB) The gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned; for on the one hand the judgment arose from one transgression resulting in condemnation, but on the other hand the free gift arose from many transgressions resulting in justification. For if by the transgression of the one, death reigned through the one, much more those who receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.

Skidder said:
I pray we seek a deeper understanding of the GRACE that frees us from ourselves. I've strayed on paths of "spirituality" in the past only to find myself crawling back to the cross. There's a power in the finished work of our Lord Jesus Christ that never runs dry or becomes stagnant. A power that is not human, and gives a peace and joy that passes understanding! The more we believe in the work of His cross the more we will cling to it. Our walk began here, and when it ends, I hope we are still clinging to that old cross!!
1 Corinthians 15:3-5
For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures

Acts 16:31
Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you shall be saved

Grace and Peace...

Amen.

crossnote · May 3, 2020

Dorothy Mae said:
The tears of joy one has when one when knows He is pleased with one’s obedience to Him are much deeper. It’s more blessed to give than receive.

Even deeper is the realization that even in our obedience (as imperfect as it is), the glory and praise and thanks must go to Him, as He is the Author and Finisher of our faith.

Dorothy Mae · May 3, 2020

crossnote said:
Even deeper is the realization that even in our obedience (as imperfect as it is), the glory and praise and thanks must go to Him, as He is the Author and Finisher of our faith.

Nah! This is merely an assumed theology to prevent pride from growing which is better than pride to be sure or to comfort those who don’t try to please him. But no one who has tasted “well done” from God would be fooled by this statement above. There is nothing more deeply pleasing than experiencing him being pleased and making that clear. He is actually easy to please but hard to satisfy.

Jesus spoke of those who will hear from God “well done” regarding their lives. It will always be referring to what we did in faith, trust and love ...that which He wanted us to do.

crossnote · May 3, 2020

Dorothy Mae said:
Nah! This is merely an assumed theology to prevent pride from growing which is better than pride to be sure or to comfort those who don’t try to please him. But no one who has tasted “well done” from God would be fooled by this statement above. There is nothing more deeply pleasing than experiencing him being pleased and making that clear. He is actually easy to please but hard to satisfy.

Jesus spoke of those who will hear from God “well done” regarding their lives. It will always be referring to what we did in faith, trust and love ...that which He wanted us to do.

Me thinks you need to study up a bit. This is the exact attitude I was conveying...

Luke 17:7-10 (KJV) But which of you, having a servant plowing or feeding cattle, will say unto him by and by, when he is come from the field, Go and sit down to meat? And will not rather say unto him, Make ready wherewith I may sup, and gird thyself, and serve me, till I have eaten and drunken; and afterward thou shalt eat and drink? Doth he thank that servant because he did the things that were commanded him? I trow not. So likewise ye, when ye shall have done all those things which are commanded you, say, We are unprofitable servants: we have done that which was our duty to do.

To tell you the truth, I don't know why you feel compelled to jump in on every post you don't agree with, especially the ones not addressing you.

Skidder · May 3, 2020

Galations 2:20-21
I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 21 I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!”

Take up your cross...
Is our cross separate from His? Were we crucified apart from our Savior? So often we struggle to see what Jesus was saying when He told us to "take up our cross". Our human nature wants to fight and please the Lord. We have so many ups and downs, good days and bad days, suffering and joy, glad hearts and broken hearts. Some days the battle seems so large that taking up our cross seems like a distant victory.

Romans 7:18-25
18 For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh. For I have the desire to do what is right, but not the ability to carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want, but the evil I do not want is what I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells within me. 22 For I delight in the law of God, in my inner being, 23 but I see in my members another law waging war against the law of my mind and making me captive to the law of sin that dwells in my members. 24 Wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? 25 Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself serve the law of God with my mind, but with my flesh I serve the law of sin.

We are free my friends!! We will never conquer our flesh with our flesh. It serves its own law. Instead we take up a victory that won the battle nearly 2000 years ago! The law of the Spirit of life serves the living God... "Christ in us our hope of glory"!! Take up our cross is to reckon His Cross as our victory. We were crucified with CHRIST!! Not separate from Him, but with Christ, our King and Master!!

Romans 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death.

As we reckon the death of Jesus we reckon our death. No longer I but Christ is spontaneous in a grace that is sufficient. "I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!” -Galatians 2:21

2 Corinthians 4:10
10 always carrying in the body the death of Jesus, so that the life of Jesus may also be manifested in our bodies.

This verse says we carry something with us, that causes something else to happen spontaneously. This is the FREEDOM of HIS CROSS!! No longer I BUT CHRIST!!

FAITH has a LOVE STORY to lay hold of and HE IS VERY POWERFUL!!

Dorothy Mae · May 3, 2020

crossnote said:
Me thinks you need to study up a bit. This is the exact attitude I was conveying...

Me thinks you need to read more than your favorite passages. Do you know these are in the bible?

16The first came before him, saying, ‘Lord, your mina has made ten minas more.’ 17And he said to him, ‘Well done, good servant!c Because you have been faithful in a very little, you shall have authority over ten cities.’

“Therefore also we are ambitious, whether being at home or being away, to be well-pleasing to Him

To tell you the truth, I don't know why you feel compelled to jump in on every post you don't agree with, especially the ones not addressing you.

I have never yet seen a post inviting only a particular poster. I did read there is a place for private discussions. And you are wrong in any case.

crossnote · May 3, 2020

Dorothy Mae said:
16The first came before him, saying, ‘Lord, your mina has made ten minas more.’ 17And he said to him, ‘Well done, good servant!c Because you have been faithful in a very little, you shall have authority over ten cities.’

Yes those are speaking of servants not sons. Besides even our stewardship does not affect our sonship, only rewards. Reread the prodigal son.

Dorothy Mae said:
“Therefore also we are ambitious, whether being at home or being away, to be well-pleasing to Him

Yes, that should be our ambition.

Dorothy Mae said:
I have never yet seen a post inviting only a particular poster. I did read there is a place for private discussions. And you are wrong in any case.

Perhaps, but that is between you and God.

Dorothy Mae · May 4, 2020

Skidder said:
Galations 2:20-21
I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 21 I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!”

Take up your cross...
Is our cross separate from His? Were we crucified apart from our Savior? So often we struggle to see what Jesus was saying when He told us to "take up our cross". Our human nature wants to fight and please the Lord. We have so many ups and downs, good days and bad days, suffering and joy, glad hearts and broken hearts. Some days the battle seems so large that taking up our cross seems like a distant victory.

Romans 7:18-25
18 For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh. For I have the desire to do what is right, but not the ability to carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want, but the evil I do not want is what I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells within me. 22 For I delight in the law of God, in my inner being, 23 but I see in my members another law waging war against the law of my mind and making me captive to the law of sin that dwells in my members. 24 Wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? 25 Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself serve the law of God with my mind, but with my flesh I serve the law of sin.

We are free my friends!! We will never conquer our flesh with our flesh. It serves its own law. Instead we take up a victory that won the battle nearly 2000 years ago! The law of the Spirit of life serves the living God... "Christ in us our hope of glory"!! Take up our cross is to reckon His Cross as our victory. We were crucified with CHRIST!! Not separate from Him, but with Christ, our King and Master!!

Romans 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death.

As we reckon the death of Jesus we reckon our death. No longer I but Christ is spontaneous in a grace that is sufficient. "I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!” -Galatians 2:21

2 Corinthians 4:10
10 always carrying in the body the death of Jesus, so that the life of Jesus may also be manifested in our bodies.

This verse says we carry something with us, that causes something else to happen spontaneously. This is the FREEDOM of HIS CROSS!! No longer I BUT CHRIST!!

FAITH has a LOVE STORY to lay hold of and HE IS VERY POWERFUL!!

“Our human nature wants to fight and please the Lord.” You wrote this above. The Bible says our human nature is at enmity with God, doesn’t want to please Him at all. You’ve got it backwards. Maybe that’s why you struggle. Surrender and it’s a lot easier. When you surrender the whole and bit by bit in daily choices, you’ll find life a lot easier after a time. I surrendered a long time ago and as a result cannot st all relate to your description of yourself above.

Skidder · May 4, 2020

Dorothy Mae said:
“Our human nature wants to fight and please the Lord.” You wrote this above. The Bible says our human nature is at enmity with God, doesn’t want to please Him at all. You’ve got it backwards. Maybe that’s why you struggle. Surrender and it’s a lot easier. When you surrender the whole and bit by bit in daily choices, you’ll find life a lot easier after a time. I surrendered a long time ago and as a result cannot st all relate to your description of yourself above.

The Holy Spirit has been poured out on all flesh convicting everyone of "sin, righteousness, and judgment," of sin because they do not believe in Christ...

John 16:8
And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me;

It's the Gospel (grace of God) that offends you. And the knowledge of His grace only comes by revelation, after another revelation... "Oh wretched man that I am!" If you have not come to the latter, you will never see the former, and what Paul was saying when He said concerning good works "Not I , but the grace of God that was with me". And apparently the book of Romans is still a mystery to you (even though I posted it)... There are two laws at work in our members. The law of sin and death, and the law of the Spirit of life. These laws are spontaneous in both directions: Just like we don't have to try to sin, the same goes when we enter His rest, "No longer I who live, but Christ.

Romans 7:18-25
18 For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh. For I have the desire to do what is right, but not the ability to carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want, but the evil I do not want is what I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells within me. 22 For I delight in the law of God, in my inner being, 23 but I see in my members another law waging war against the law of my mind and making me captive to the law of sin that dwells in my members. 24 Wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? 25 Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself serve the law of God with my mind, but with my flesh I serve the law of sin.

Romans 2:14-16
for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

Romans 3:20
Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Skidder · May 4, 2020

Dorothy, Jesus loves you beyond human measure, and knowledge of this love is what frees us from ourselves. I fear you are still trying to please him through works of the law (human effort).

1 John 3:5
And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and IN HIM THERE IS NO SIN.

Hebrews 13:12
Therefore Jesus also, that He might sanctify the people with His own blood, suffered outside the gate.

Romans 4:15
because THE LAW brings about WRATH; for where there is NO LAW there is NO TRANSGRESSION.

Romans 5:13
Until the law sin was in the world: but SIN IS NOT IMPUTED when there is NO LAW.

Romans 10:4
For Christ is the end of the law for RIGHTEOUSNESS to everyone who believes.

A person is either under the law (letter) or under grace. There is no in-between. When a person believes in the Lord Jesus Christ they die to the law through the body of Christ and are married to another. They have been reconciled in the body of His flesh through death. This is the ONLY WAY to die to the old and be born of the Spirit. The letter is of the old covenant and the Spirit is of the NEW. The law (letter) brings wrath because no one can fulfill its righteous requirements. But we have a blessed hope in all this hopelessness! We have the Lamb of God who is the end of the law for righteousness for everyone who believes. He was the only one who could fulfill these requirements; and those requirements were met when this righteous lamb of God suffered a brutal death for our sins on a hill called Calvary. So those who reject Christ are under God’s wrath because they are still under the law; therefore still under the condemnation of sin. Their sins are still counted against them because they have rejected the end of the law, who is CHRIST JESUS, the PAYMENT for ALL SINS!!

A transaction that shook the foundations of the world is not a transaction that we take lightly! If we take our eyes off of His sacrifice we take our eyes off the wisdom of Christ. Because only in CHRIST CRUCIFIED do we find the POWER and WISDOM of God, the same power that raised Christ from the dead!!

Grace and Peace...

Dorothy Mae · May 4, 2020

crossnote said:
Yes those are speaking of servants not sons. Besides even our stewardship does not affect our sonship, only rewards. Reread the prodigal son.

The rewards are those of relationship, not materialistic. And I’m honored to be His servant. Jesus, himself, came as a servant.

Yes, that should be our ambition.

There are theologies that make that an optional extra.

Perhaps, but that is between you and God.

Uh, that was referring to the site.

Dorothy Mae · May 4, 2020

Skidder said:
Dorothy, Jesus loves you beyond human measure, and knowledge of this love is what frees us from ourselves. I fear you are still trying to please him through works of the law (human effort).

Then fear not. Accept that this description is outside of your experience and what you imagine is not how it is. But I appreciate your kindness.

1 John 3:5
And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and IN HIM THERE IS NO SIN.

Hebrews 13:12
Therefore Jesus also, that He might sanctify the people with His own blood, suffered outside the gate.

Romans 4:15
because THE LAW brings about WRATH; for where there is NO LAW there is NO TRANSGRESSION.

Romans 5:13
Until the law sin was in the world: but SIN IS NOT IMPUTED when there is NO LAW.

Romans 10:4
For Christ is the end of the law for RIGHTEOUSNESS to everyone who believes.

There is life beyond forgiveness.

A person is either under the law (letter) or under grace. There is no in-between. When a person believes in the Lord Jesus Christ they die to the law through the body of Christ and are married to another. They have been reconciled in the body of His flesh through death. This is the ONLY WAY to die to the old and be born of the Spirit. The letter is of the old covenant and the Spirit is of the NEW. The law (letter) brings wrath because no one can fulfill its righteous requirements. But we have a blessed hope in all this hopelessness! We have the Lamb of God who is the end of the law for righteousness for everyone who believes. He was the only one who could fulfill these requirements; and those requirements were met when this righteous lamb of God suffered a brutal death for our sins on a hill called Calvary. So those who reject Christ are under God’s wrath because they are still under the law; therefore still under the condemnation of sin. Their sins are still counted against them because they have rejected the end of the law, who is CHRIST JESUS, the PAYMENT for ALL SINS!!

You forget the law of love.

A transaction that shook the foundations of the world is not a transaction that we take lightly! If we take our eyes off of His sacrifice we take our eyes off the wisdom of Christ. Because only in CHRIST CRUCIFIED do we find the POWER and WISDOM of God, the same power that raised Christ from the dead!!

Grace and Peace...

I walk in grace and peace daily and my struggles are more in the area of obeying that which I naturally do not want to do.

But I thank you and wish you equal grace and peace. I especially thank you for your very kind post. The life and love of Jesus is evident in your words.

Dorothy Mae · May 4, 2020

Skidder said:
The Holy Spirit has been poured out on all flesh convicting everyone of "sin, righteousness, and judgment," of sin because they do not believe in Christ...

John 16:8
And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me;

Is this what you see in real life??

It's the Gospel (grace of God) that offends you.

Untrue

And the knowledge of His grace only comes by revelation, after another revelation...

How do you know that this hasn’t been my experience?

"Oh wretched man that I am!" If you have not come to the latter, you will never see the former, and what Paul was saying when He said concerning good works "Not I , but the grace of God that was with me". And apparently the book of Romans is still a mystery to you (even though I posted it)... There are two laws at work in our members. The law of sin and death, and the law of the Spirit of life. These laws are spontaneous in both directions: Just like we don't have to try to sin, the same goes when we enter His rest, "No longer I who live, but Christ.

Is this your experience or your theory?

Romans 7:18-25
18 For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh. For I have the desire to do what is right, but not the ability to carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want, but the evil I do not want is what I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells within me. 22 For I delight in the law of God, in my inner being, 23 but I see in my members another law waging war against the law of my mind and making me captive to the law of sin that dwells in my members. 24 Wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? 25 Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself serve the law of God with my mind, but with my flesh I serve the law of sin.

Yet at the end of his life he boldly claimed he had finished the course set for him. He had accomplished ALL of God’s will for him. Can you boast this?

Romans 2:14-16
for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

Romans 3:20
Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Have you never heard of the LAW of loving God with all your being????

crossnote · May 4, 2020

Dorothy Mae said:
There are theologies that make that an optional extra.

Those theologies are most likely written by unregenerate men, because when a person is born again they receive a heart that pants after God. (Rom 5:5). The problem is we can't whip up that desire in ourselves; it is implanted in us through the new birth.

Dorothy Mae · May 5, 2020

crossnote said:
Those theologies are most likely written by unregenerate men, because when a person is born again they receive a heart that pants after God. (Rom 5:5). The problem is we can't whip up that desire in ourselves; it is implanted in us through the new birth.

First read Romans 5:5 again. It promises no such thing. It says “the love of God has been poured out into us.” No promise we then pant after Him. I can give you evidence after evidence that most believers, even ones here, do not love God Himself much at all. They deeply love his salvation, that is they’re not going to hell and are grateful but that’s it. I know because of what they blithely say about Him attributing almost evil to Him. No one loves someone and falsely accuses them of cruelty.

Now I wished false theology came only from unregenerate people. It is not even close to the truth. Christians can be and are deceived drawn away by wrong in them. I can trace wrong theologies to sin within. We need to take care it doesn’t happen to us.

crossnote · May 5, 2020

Dorothy Mae said:
First read Romans 5:5 again. It promises no such thing. It says “the love of God has been poured out into us.” No promise we then pant after Him. I can give you evidence after evidence that most believers, even ones here, do not love God Himself much at all. They deeply love his salvation, that is they’re not going to hell and are grateful but that’s it. I know because of what they blithely say about Him attributing almost evil to Him. No one loves someone and falsely accuses them of cruelty.

Now I wished false theology came only from unregenerate people. It is not even close to the truth. Christians can be and are deceived drawn away by wrong in them. I can trace wrong theologies to sin within. We need to take care it doesn’t happen to us.

If you read on from Rom 5.1...
Romans 5:2-5 KJV
[2] By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God. [3] And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience; [4] And patience, experience; and experience, hope: [5] And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.

doesn’t sound like attributing evil to God, to me.

Dorothy Mae · May 5, 2020

crossnote said:
If you read on from Rom 5.1...
Romans 5:2-5 KJV
[2] By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God. [3] And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience; [4] And patience, experience; and experience, hope: [5] And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.

doesn’t sound like attributing evil to God, to me.

It doesn’t say a love FOR God is poured into us. You can throw in the whole Bible and you don’t find that anywhere. We must choose to love God and our neighbor. It won’t come into us bypassing our will. Of course if a man sees he lacks this and greatly desires it, he can ask God to give or grow love in his heart. This help is always possible. We don’t do this on own own but neither are we passive.

And of course the BIBLE doesn’t attribute evil to God! People writing here do. You wouldn’t believe what evil they lightly say God does.

Skidder · May 5, 2020

Dorothy Mae said:
Is this what you see in real life??

It doesn't matter what I "feel" or what I think I "see" in real life, it's what the bible proclaims...

Acts 2:17
‘And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, That I will pour out of My Spirit on ALL flesh;

Before I came to Jesus, He did convict me of sin, righteousness, and judgement. Just like Jesus said it would happen. I was part of this world and HIS Spirit brought me to repentance (Metanoia). Even repentance is by Him. Sorry to disappoint you Dorothy but you get no glory, and that is why you are offended by His grace... His grace gives you no glory. Repentance is by His Spirit, just like salvation through the Gospel is also by His Spirit.

Repentance is by His Spirit not your self righteousness Dorothy...

Luke 5:32
I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Luke 13:3
I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.

Repentance is a requirement before salvation, but the word "met·a·noi·a" in the Greek is often misrepresented. I believe "turn their hearts" or "change of mind" is a good explanation of the work of the Holy Spirit through the Gospel message that brings salvation (Jesus Christ).

It is by no accident that John's ministry of repentance came 6 months prior to the ministry of Jesus Christ (salvation). "Repentance" is always represented before salvation, and this is verified throughout scripture.

And concerning John the baptists' ministry of repentance….

Luke 1:15-16
He will also be FILLED WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT, even from his mother’s womb. 16 And he will TURN many of the children of Israel to the Lord their God. 17 He will also go before Him in the spirit and power of Elijah, ‘to TURN THE HEARTS of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just, to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.”

We must know that repentance is NOT A WORK. Repentance is a response to the WORKING of the Holy Spirit through the Gospel message (the power of God). The bible clearly reveals in John 16:8,9 that the Holy Spirit convicts the world of sin unto faith in Christ.

John 16:8,9
And when He has come, He will CONVICT THE WORLD OF SIN, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 OF SIN, BECAUSE THEY DO NOT BELIEVE IN ME.

If repentance was a work of the individual than it would be a direct contradiction to scripture… “For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that NOT OF YOURSELVES; it is the gift of God, NOT OF WORKS, lest anyone should boast. ”.

Some of the simplest definitions of “repentance” are often overlooked. Definitions that describe a turning through conviction from an opposing way, towards God....

Acts 20:21 Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.

Acts 26:17-18
I will deliver you from the Jewish people, as well as from the Gentiles, to whom I now send you, to open their eyes, in order to TURN THEM from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.’

And here is an example of Paul preaching the Gospel, turning many people to faith in Christ.

Acts 17:2-4
Then Paul, as his custom was, went in to them, and for three Sabbaths reasoned with them from the Scriptures, 3 explaining and demonstrating that the Christ had to suffer and rise again from the dead, and saying, “This Jesus whom I preach to you is the Christ.” 4 And some of them were persuaded; and a great multitude of the devout Greeks, and not a few of the leading women, joined Paul and Silas.

This repentance (turning the hearts) towards God is a work of the Holy Spirit. The Grace of God is not separate from the preaching of the Cross. And this Gospel (good news) that we preach is the power unto salvation. A Grace that is sufficient from the beginning is sufficient everyday, and shall be till the very end!!

BBAS 64 · May 5, 2020

crossnote said:
If you read on from Rom 5.1...
Romans 5:2-5 KJV
[2] By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God. [3] And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience; [4] And patience, experience; and experience, hope: [5] And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.

doesn’t sound like attributing evil to God, to me.

Good Day, Crossnote

You have to read verse one for sure as it sets the tone... love this context

Rom 5:1 Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Shalom for all of eternity...

John Wesley notes:

Being justified by faith - This is the sum of the preceding chapters. We have peace with God - Being enemies to God no longer, Rom 5:10; neither fearing his wrath, Rom 5:9. We have peace, hope, love, and power over sin, the sum of the fifth, sixth, seventh, and eighth chapters. These are the fruits of justifying faith: where these are not, that faith is not.

In Him,

Bill

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