Trump says American needs faith to be a great nation

Semper-Fi

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(“We have people coming into the country or trying to come in, we're stopping a lot of them, but we're taking people out of the country. You wouldn't believe how bad these people are," Trump said.
"These aren't people. These are animals.") etc.
Trump on immigrants: 'These aren't people. These are animals.'

Those comments where for people
like the MS-13 gang members.

"California's law provides safe harbor to some of the most vicious and violent offenders on Earth, like MS-13 gang members putting innocent men, women, and children at the mercy of these sadistic criminals," he said.
 
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Halbhh

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First, congratulations on the admirable point you made at the start of this post. Second, how disappointing it was to see you then go out of your way to pair with it a clear falsehood like that one which followed in the same paragraph. :(
This is the 'clear falsehood'>? --

“We have people coming into the country or trying to come in, we're stopping a lot of them, but we're taking people out of the country. You wouldn't believe how bad these people are," Trump said.
"These aren't people. These are animals."

Trump on immigrants: 'These aren't people. These are animals.'

Under cover of legitimately talking about catching actual criminals, Trump has repeatedly suggested basically that allowing any immigration from south of the border tends to let bad people in.

It's not a one-time thing.

I wish it were only a one bad day, one time thing.
 
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Albion

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Here in the U.S., we've had bad incidents when a synagogue or a church was attacked, for being a religious place.

But generally most all Americans are always free to practice their religion, and we are all protected from having some other religion imposed by force on us.
I'm sorry to have you say that, because it suggests that you do not understand the issue. It's not that the Gestapo will show up and arrest all the worshippers. It's about the gradual but steady erosion of Constitutional liberties, as has happened with one after another of our rights. That is happening on many fronts, but since no one of them seems, to the average person, to be simply unbearable, they continue to mount.
 
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Albion

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This is the 'clear falsehood'>? --

“We have people coming into the country or trying to come in, we're stopping a lot of them....."

No, it was to this:

We can certainly hope that all the Christians that judge 'bad people' (a word Trump used for immigrants from the south)

 
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Halbhh

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I'm sorry to have you say that, because it suggests that you do not understand the issue. It's not that the Gestapo will show up and arrest all the worshippers. It's about the gradual but steady erosion of Constitutional liberties, as has happened with one after another of our rights. That is happening on many fronts, but since no one of them seems, to the average person, to be simply unbearable, they continue to mount.

Do you mean only suffering for Christ the way He Himself told His sheep that they would suffer for Him?

No political leader can somehow make Christ's words on that untrue.

It's really helpful to read again, though many haven't read this in the last decade, or many never:

John 15 NIV
 
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Halbhh

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No, it was to this:

Ok, look and see for yourself --

DONALD TRUMP: When do we beat Mexico at the border? They’re laughing at us, at our stupidity. And now they are beating us economically. They are not our friend, believe me. But they’re killing us economically.

The U.S. has become a dumping ground for everybody else’s problems.

Thank you. It’s true, and these are the best and the finest. When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.

Trump: Mexico Not Sending Us Their Best; Criminals, Drug Dealers And Rapists Are Crossing Border
 
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Albion

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Ok, look and see for yourself --

DONALD TRUMP: When do we beat Mexico at the border? They’re laughing at us, at our stupidity. And now they are beating us economically. They are not our friend, believe me. But they’re killing us economically.

The U.S. has become a dumping ground for everybody else’s problems.

Thank you. It’s true, and these are the best and the finest. When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.
Trump: Mexico Not Sending Us Their Best; Criminals, Drug Dealers And Rapists Are Crossing Border

All that proves to me is that you were intentionally misrepresenting the facts to me. I know that you are smarter than to either misread it or else simply take the standard claim made by Pelosi and Company as true.

I will confess that when people who nit-pick every syllable that Trump utters, dissecting the supposed meaning to the most excruciation degree, then turn around and think that their own "close enough" approximations are honest amazes me.

No, Trump did not say X about "immigrants." He did not say immigrants are rapists. He said X about those particular immigrants WHO ARE rapists.
 
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Bobber

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If only Trump really believed those words in a real way (or with understanding of what Christ said), and that believe then evident just as Christ said in John chapters 14 and 15: in actual fruit of being on the Vine, that would be really a good thing.

And what if he's a man who's merely struggling. He's come to believe these things are true and it's something he wants but is just trying to figure out how to rightly walk in them. It seems to me Nicodemuous Jn3 was one such individual. He knew there was something more and had a tremendous respect of the Lord....but there were things that just weren't easy for him....and yet we see it was him that defended Jesus at his trial and after his death it was he and another who prepared him for burial. John 19 We can't know it for sure he could very well have received the Lord as Acts 6:7 (many Priests became obedient to the faith) Maybe he was among them? So with President Trump. Can't any of you consider that he has a heart really trying to maybe reach out for God? Is he not worthy of your genuine prayers?

But we learn in Matthew chapter 6, we are never to practice our righteousness just as a political or social show -- Matthew 6 NIV .

But then again neiter are we to set ourselves up as judge and jury at just where a person's heart is. That verse you quoted above is an instruction to crowds of people. We can't always claim to KNOW what's in a persons heart. Only God knows that.
 
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Bobber

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No, Trump did not say X about "immigrants." He did not say immigrants are rapists. He said X about those particular immigrants WHO ARE rapists.

True but it doesn't serve some of his critics agenda to show balance and perspective about anything. If they can keep a delusion clamped down on people's minds that he said A, B or C and there's no way to consider his words except the way THEY SAY that's what they'll do. One's which are honest and sincere however will acknowledge other things have a right to be considered as being possible of what he really meant.
 
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pescador

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Matthew 5:37 says, "Let your word be ‘Yes, yes’ or ‘No, no.’ More than this is from the evil one." Trump is a consistent liar; he has lied thousands of times about many, many things. (It has been reported that he has made 18,000 false or misleading claims in 1,170 days, an average of more than 15 per day!) Believing him is like believing Satan.
 
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Halbhh

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And what if he's a man who's merely struggling. He's come to believe these things are true and it's something he wants but is just trying to figure out how to rightly walk in them. It seems to me Nicodemuous Jn3 was one such individual. He knew there was something more and had a tremendous respect of the Lord....but there were things that just weren't easy for him....and yet we see it was him that defended Jesus at his trial and after his death it was he and another who prepared him for burial. John 19 We can't know it for sure he could very well have received the Lord as Acts 6:7 (many Priests became obedient to the faith) Maybe he was among them? So with President Trump. Can't any of you consider that he has a heart really trying to maybe reach out for God? Is he not worthy of your genuine prayers?



But then again neiter are we to set ourselves up as judge and jury at just where a person's heart is. That verse you quoted above is an instruction to crowds of people. We can't always claim to KNOW what's in a persons heart. Only God knows that.
That would be really great if we saw any individual change over time for the better, with a real repentance and change.

Showing humility.

That would be a very good sign, and if they began to love others not only a select circle of friends or allies, but actually loving other Christians from other nations -- such as from Guatemala or El Salvador, not just our own American native Christians.
 
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Halbhh

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True but it doesn't serve some of his critics agenda to show balance and perspective about anything. If they can keep a delusion clamped down on people's minds that he said A, B or C and there's no way to consider his words except the way THEY SAY that's what they'll do. One's which are honest and sincere however will acknowledge other things have a right to be considered as being possible of what he really meant.
Trump overall, on the whole, repeatedly refuses to recognize that as Christians, and as a nation with a largely Christian ethic, we are to bring in and welcome the refugees suffering and trying to come here for a better life.

Show "perspective and balance" yourself, and see that actual real factual situation and actions.
 
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Halbhh

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All that proves to me is that you were intentionally misrepresenting the facts to me. I know that you are smarter than to either misread it or else simply take the standard claim made by Pelosi and Company as true.

I will confess that when people who nit-pick every syllable that Trump utters, dissecting the supposed meaning to the most excruciation degree, then turn around and think that their own "close enough" approximations are honest amazes me.

No, Trump did not say X about "immigrants." He did not say immigrants are rapists. He said X about those particular immigrants WHO ARE rapists.

So, you are going to just intentionally misrepresent what I posted above?

If you slander me, it won't stop me from pointing out real facts and truth from scripture.
 
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Halbhh

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Or, it could be the prayer breakfast is done in all earnestness, and the cameras are there because the media follows everything the president does like a lost puppy, because it informs the American public of what our nations leaders are doing.

It's all in your perspective. If you only desire to see evil it's all you will see, whereas if you desire to see the good in all things that is what you will see.

I always try to give everyone the benefit of the doubt, lest I be found sitting in judgment unjustly.
Have you seen some of the video from the national prayer breakfasts in the last couple of years?

Here're our instructions, as actual believers:

1 “Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven.

2 “So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 3 But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, 4 so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

5“And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. "

As you see, we are not to make a show of righteousness to impress society.
 
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Halbhh

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What are you talking about?
When you claimed after me showing simply full direct quotes of Trump that I was 'intentionally misrepresenting' him then you made slander against me.
 
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Hazelelponi

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Have you seen some of the video from the national prayer breakfasts in the last couple of years?

Here're our instructions, as actual believers:

1 “Be careful not to practice your righteousness in front of others to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven.

2 “So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 3 But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, 4 so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

5“And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. 6But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. "

As you see, we are not to make a show of righteousness to impress society.


That's not an admonition against all public prayer though... again, when two or more are gathered together in My Name there I am in the midst of you.

A hypocrite does in public what they refuse to do in private. They are neither genuine nor authentic. When was the last time you admonished your Pastor for leading the church in prayer before service?

Have you admonished him for continuing to lead the prayer in the Facebook service now that service is streamed instead of in person due to the coronavirus?

If you go out to eat do you skip praying before the meal just because people are around?

Best not to be an extremist, just don't be steeped in hypocrisy.
 
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Albion

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When you claimed after me showing simply full direct quotes of Trump that I was 'intentionally misrepresenting' him then you made slander against me.
Baloney. You misrepresented the meaning of his statement. You did not simply repost the quote, if that's what you want me to believe.

You paraphrased it in the post where this first came up and reinterpreted it.
 
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