WHY SOLA SCRIPTURA MAKES SENSE - UPDATED.

Hi all wanted to update this one to show that faith in God's Word alone is the sole source of eternal life.

Those who seek to tear it down do so at their own peril. In it is the light of life and without it there is only darnkess. Those who do not come to the light (the Word) do not come lest their evil deeds are exposed. This is the reason many seek to put out the light. It is a lamp and a light to our path and without it we cannot find our way to JESUS.

Let's share the scriptures...

PSLAMS 27:1 The LORD is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? the LORD is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?

PSLAMS 36:9 For with you is the fountain of life: in your light shall we see light.

PSLAMS 43:3 O send out your light and your truth: let them lead me; let them bring me to your holy hill, and to your tabernacles.

PSLAMS 119:105 YOUR WORD IS A LAMP UNTO MY FEET AND A LIGHT UNTO MY PATH.

PSALMS 119:130 THE ENTRANCE OF YOUR WORDS GIVES LIGHT; IT GIVES UNDERSTANDING TO THE SIMPLE

PROVERBS 6:23 FOR THE COMMANDMENT IS A LAMP AND THE LAW IS LIGHT; and reproofs of instruction are the way of life:

ISAIAH 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is NO LIGHT IN THEM

JOHN 1:1-4; 14 [1], In the beginning was the WORD, and the WORD was with God, and THE WORD WAS GOD. [2], The same was in the beginning with God. [3], All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. [4], In him was life; and the life was the light of men. [5], And THE LIGHT (Word) SHINES IN DARKNESS; and the darkness comprehended it not.

[14] AND THE WORD BECAME FLESH AND DWELT AMOUNG US and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

JOHN 3:19-21 And this is the condemnation, that LIGHT (the Word) IS COME INTO THE WORLD, and men loved darkness rather than LIGHT (the Word), because their deeds were evil. FOR EVERYONE THAT DOES EVIL HATES THE LIGHT (the Word), neither comes to the LIGHT (the Word), lest his deeds should be reproved. BUT HE THAT DOES TRUTH COMES TO THE LIGHT (the Word), that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are worked in God.

JOHN 8:12 Then spoke Jesus again to them, saying, I AM THE LIGHT OF THE WORLD (The Word see JOHN 1:1-4; 14): he that follows me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

2 TIMOTHY 3:16-17 [16], ALL SCRIPTURE IS GIVEN BY INSPIRATION OF GOD (God breathed) and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. [17], That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished to all good works.

2 TIMOTHY 2:15 STUDY TO SHOW YOURSELF APPROVED TO GOD, a workman that needs not to be ashamed, RIGHTLY DIVIDING THE WORD OF TRUTH.

JOHN 14:26 [26], But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, HE SHALL TEACH YOU ALL THINGS, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatever I HAVE SAID TO YOU.

JOHN 16:13 [13], However, WHEN HE THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH IS COME HE WILL GUIDE YOU INTO ALL TRUTH: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.

JOHN 17:17 SANCTIFY THEM THROUGH THE TRUTH THY WORD IS TRUTH

JOHN 8:31-32 [31], Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, IF YOU CONTINUE IN MY WORD THEN YOU ARE MY DISCIPLES INDEED AND YOU SHALL KNOW THE TRUTH AND THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

EPHESIANS 2:8 [8], FOR BY GRAECE ARE YOU SAVED THROUGH FAITH; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God (links to)

ROMANS 10:17 FAITH COMES BY HEARING AND HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD

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According to the scriptures God's salvation only comes by faith in God's WORD. If there is no Word there is no faith and if there is no faith there is no salvation to those who reject God's Words. There is no righteousness without faith as there is no faith without Gods' Word. BEWARE of those who seek to teach you contrary to the scriptures.

What are your thoughts?

ACTS 17:11 [11], These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

FRIENDLY DISCUSSION PLEASE (no flamming and goading)

God bless.

YouAreAwesome said:

I don't think you believe that.

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Hmm where is [the bible] added into what I wrote? Yes I do believe that both the spoken and written Word are Gods' Word. The spoken Word (revealed by God to his messengers/prophets) was before the written Word, but now we have the written Word and the spoken Word of God. For the spoken Word of God we are told to test the Spirits to see if they are of God or not. As long as the spoken Word of God agrees with the written Word are God's Word it is the Word of God if it does not agree with the written Word then it is not of God..

1 JOHN 4:4 [4] Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3 and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you heard was coming and now is in the world already. 4 Little children, you are from God and have overcome them, for he who is in you is greater than he who is in the world. 5 They are from the world; therefore they speak from the world, and the world listens to them. 6 We are from God. Whoever knows God listens to us; whoever is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the Spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

ISAIAH 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

1 JOHN 2:3-4 [3], And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. [4], He that said, I know him, and keeps not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

etc etc...

GodsGrace101 said:

Hi @LoveGodsWord

I have a question for you.
You say that the Word of God is our eternal salvation.
What would you say about someone that loves God and worships Him but has never read the bible?

I know persons like this.
I believe they are saved and in God's grace.

But sometimes it sounds on these forums that some love their bible more than their Savior.

I feel that as long as the Word of God is HEARD,,,and the person accepts it,,,that's all that is necessary.

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Aww hi stranger nice to see you again (Im so happy!) Great question BTW fran! I would say they are worshipping God out of ignorance and in times of ignorance God winks at until he gives us a knowledge of His truth at which time calls us to believe and follow his Word (see ACTS 17:30-31 and JAMES 4:17).

Yep faith comes by either hearing God's Word of reading it *ROMANS 10:17. But either way salvation only comes through believing God's Word.

God bless and nice to see an old friend.

dzheremi said:

If Sola Scriptura is to be taken as some kind of key to the practice of our religion, then how did people practice Christianity historically before the canonization of the Holy Bible, i.e., pre-367 AD? (The earliest extant list of the now-standard 27-book NT comes from the 39th festal letter of HH St. Athanasius of Alexandria written in that year, though it spread/was accepted throughout the Church at different times and places subsequently.)

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The bible is both the old testament Torah and writings of the prophets and the new testament scriptures from the spoken words of JESUS and the Apostles. Much of the new testament was written in the lifetime of the Apostles who had both the torah, the writings of the prophets and the words of JESUS and their own that were written down and sent to the church's. Canonization is simply a collective compilation of all scripture ordained by God to be given to the world.

16 POINT REBUTTAL OF THE MAIN ARGUMENT IN Sola Scriptura Doesn't Make Sense

JAL said: ↑ This post will serve as a summary list of the seemingly insurmountable objections facing Sola Scriptura.

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Let's see about your claims and bring everything to the light of God's Word. As it is written only God's Word is true and we should believe and follow it over the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God *ROMANS 3:4 and again in JOHN 3:20-21 [20], For every one that does evil hates the light, neither comes to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. [21], But he that does truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are worked in God. Please if you disagree with any of the scriptures provided here that prove why your claims are in error, please prove why you disagree.

JAL said: ↑ (1) There are no conceivable exceptions to the following maxim. (I prefer to call it the rule of conscience, but the exact naming of it isn’t a vital issue). “If I feel certain that action-A is evil, and B is good, I should opt for B”.
This maxim is a final authority in the sense that it both can and does properly dictate all our behavior, thereby contradicting the view of Scripture as the ONLY final authority. The maxim is tautological because it defines justice. God would be unjust to dishonor this maxim because perfect justice evaluates men on whether they did what is right to the best of their knowledge, which is precisely what the maxim means. Interestingly Rom chap. 14 seems to be a verbose articulation of the maxim. It implies that the final court of appeals on moral issues is whether the individual either "has doubts" (vs 23), on the one hand, or feels "fully convinced" (vs. 5), on the other. Parallel to Romans 14 is 1Cor 8:1-13 which actually mentions the word conscience several times.

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There are only no conceivable exception if you do not believe the scriptures. Where point one falls down and can be dismissed right away is that there is only one standard for GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS and that is the Word of God given through God's 10 commandments *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172. If we break anyone of them we stand guilty before God of sin *JAMES 2:10-11. Sin which is defined in Gods' Word is not believing God's Word *ROMANS 14:23 and breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments *JAMES 2:10-11; 1 JOHN 3:4. Breaking God's commandments from the heart is also defined in the scriptures or the Word of God as "Evil" in MATTHEW 15:19 see also GENESIS 6:5. So the point here? It is the Word of God alone (Sola scriptura) that gives us the knowledge of what good and evil; Sin and righteousness is. Outside of God's Word we do not know what sin is or have no knowledge of what sin is. This is why it is written in the scriptures in JAMES 4:17 [17], Therefore to him that knows to do good, and does it not, to him it is sin and again in Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31 [30] And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commands all men every where to repent:[31], Because he has appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he has ordained; whereof he has given assurance to all men, in that he has raised him from the dead which links to ROMANS 7:7 [7], What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. No, I had not known sin, but by the law (Word of God): for I had not known lust, except the law had said, You shall not covet (refering to EXODUS 20:17). The scriptures teach "FAITH comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God *ROMANS 10:17. If we are saved by God's GRACE THROUGH FAITH *EPHESIANS 2:8-9 how then can you have FAITH which is needed for God's salvation *JOHN 3:16-21; EPHESIANS 2:8-9 when you have no Word?
- Point 1 falls over....

JAL said: ↑ (2) The biblical incidents of God speaking to men presuppose the maxim. Righteous men obeyed the Voice (even when it commanded them to slaughter entire nations) because it caused them to feel certain that it was the morally right thing to do. In fact Heb 3 and 4 thrice rebuked Israel for initially abstaining from the slaughter, chastising it as disobedience to the Voice. See 1 Sam 15 for a similar example. And when Paul heard the Voice on the road to Damascus, he rightly abandoned 20 years of exegesis-based conclusions, because the Voice caused him to feel certain of the gospel. To summarize, the only viable definition of Direct Revelation is God-given feelings of certainty, because God’s voice is of no use to me if it doesn’t help me feel certain about the authenticity of the message. In fact, such dynamics form the only cogent explanation as to how biblical inspiration enabled the prophets to author the Scriptures.

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God's Word teaches that before the written word of God given to ISRAEL at Mt Sinai, there was the Spoken Word of God (GENESIS 3:1-3; 9; 11-19 8:15; 9:8; 24:7; 31:11 etc). After the written Word of God, sometimes God provides direct revelation of His Word to those who he sends as prophets and messengers to His people. This is biblical where your argument here in point 2 falls down we are also told in the scriptures that there will be many false prophets and teachers that God has not sent even showing great signs and wonders that if it were possible could deceive Gods' very elect *MATTHEW 24:24; JEREMIAH 14:4; MATTHEW 24:11; LUKE 6:26; 2 PETER 2:1. We are told in 1 JOHN 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. How then do we try the Spirits to see if they are of God or not? JESUS says the WORDS THAT I SPEAK UNTO YOU THEY ARE SPIRIT AND THEY ARE LIGHT *JOHN 6:63.
God's Word is the very source of truth and tells us if someone has been given a direct revelation from God or not as it is written again; To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them *ISAIAH 8:20 and again And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that said, I know him, and keeps not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him *1 JOHN 2:3-4. If there is no Word of God there is no standard has been given a direct revelation from God or not.
- Point 2 falls over....

JAL said: ↑ (3) The Sola Scriptura position logically contradicts conversion. If biblical exegesis is the only appropriate basis for reaching religious conclusions, the prospective convert has no appropriate basis to claim, conclude, or assert that Scripture itself is inspired. The solution is to admit that the maxim defined in point #1 is the basis for conversion, meaning the agnostic converts when he feels certain that accepting the gospel is the morally right thing to do. Arguably the Inward Witness is what causes him to feel certain about the gospel. And this isn’t just an event of the past – he needs this feeling of certainty DAILY to sustain saving faith, he especially needs this help if he is or becomes mentally ill (Alzheimers), or is an adolescent, or has no access to a Bible, and so on. This means that feelings of certainty are authoritative for the duration of the Christian life, contrary to the notion of exegesis as our only authority. In fact, exegesis cannot be the basis for conversion because there was no printing press for 90% of salvation history.

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Well this one is the easiest one of all to refute as it is the scriptures alone that show that conversion and salvation is the word of God alone we we believe and follow his Word *EPEHSANS 2:8-9; JOHN 3:16-21 etc. There is actually too many scriptures here that disagree with your teachings for example EPHESIANS 1:13 In whom you also trusted, AFTER THE YOU HEARD THE WORD OF TRUTH, THE GOSPEL OF YOUR SALVATION: in whom also after that you believed, you were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise. We are told in the scriptures that we are saved by God's GRACE THROUGH FAITH.. *EPHESIANS 2:8. Now if our salvation and conversion is by BELIEVING God's Word and faith comes by hearing and hearing comes only by the Word of God *ROMANS 10:17. How can you have conversion when there is no Word?
- Point three comes crashing down....

To be continued...

JAL said: ↑ (4) The Sola Scriptura position contradicts illumination. God is supposed to enlighten the human mind. He speaks to us. But the Sola Scriptura party says we should not trust a voice until we “check it out with Scripture.” This creates a logical contradiction. If I already understand Scripture well enough to determine the voice’s harmony or disharmony with it, why do I need the voice to help me understand Scripture? In the biblical view, God’s voice doesn’t need to be tested against Scripture but rather self-authenticates by causing us to feel certain about it. God's Words in the bible are defined as light. For example..

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PSLAMS 27:1 The LORD is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? the LORD is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?

PSLAMS 36:9 For with you is the fountain of life: in your light shall we see light.

PSLAMS 43:3 O send out your light and your truth: let them lead me; let them bring me to your holy hill, and to your tabernacles.

PSLAMS 119:105 YOUR WORD IS A LAMP UNTO MY FEET AND A LIGHT UNTO MY PATH.

PSALMS 119:130 THE ENTRANCE OF YOUR WORDS GIVES LIGHT; IT GIVES UNDERSTANDING TO THE SIMPLE

PROVERBS 6:23 FOR THE COMMANDMENT IS A LAMP AND THE LAW IS LIGHT; and reproofs of instruction are the way of life:

ISAIAH 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is NO LIGHT IN THEM

JOHN 1:1-4 [1], In the beginning was the WORD, and the WORD was with God, and THE WORD WAS GOD. [2], The same was in the beginning with God. [3], All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. [4], In him was life; and the life was the light of men. [5], And THE LIGHT (Word) SHINES IN DARKNESS; and the darkness comprehended it not.

JOHN 3:19-21 And this is the condemnation, that LIGHT IS COME INTO THE WORLD (the Word), and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. FOR EVERYONE THAT DOES EVIL HATES THE LIGHT, neither comes to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. BUT HE THAT DOES TRUTH COMES TO THE LIGHT, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are worked in God.

JOHN 17:17 SANCTIFY THEM THROUGH THE TRUTH THY WORD IS TRUTH

JOHN 8:12 Then spoke Jesus again to them, saying, I AM THE LIGHT OF THE WORLD (The Word): he that follows me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

JOHN 8:31-32 [31], Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, IF YOU CONTINUE IN MY WORD THEN YOU ARE MY DISCIPLES INDEED AND YOU SHALL KNOW THE TRUTH AND THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

JESUS is the living Word of God and His Word is the light of the world. There is NO ILLUMINATION outside of Gods' WORD which is the LIGHT of the WORLD.
-Pont 4 crashes down

JAL said: ↑ (5) The Sola Scriptura position ties God’s hands from running the church. Suppose God wants me to do something right now. MUST he wait until I happen to reach that same conclusion exegetically, perhaps after four years of seminary? No. All He needs to do is give me a distinct (“loud and clear”) feeling of certainty that the action is urgently required. A humorous example will illustrate the point. Suppose your vehicle has slipped on an icy road and is about to head over an embankment. God shouts to an angel, ‘Go save that guy!’. The angel says to himself, “I don’t feel certain that was God speaking. I’ll need some time to check it out with Scripture.”

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On the contrary Gods' Word is His instruction manual for running his Church and His directions for all those who believe and follow His Word (eg 2 TIMOTHY 3:16-17; EPHESIANS 4:11-12; TITUS 1:5-9; MATTHEW 18:19-20; EPEHESIANS 5:18-21; MATTHEW 18:17; 1 CORINTHIANS 14:26; HEBREWS 13:16; 1 TIMOTHY 3:15; 1 PETER 2:4-5; EPHESIANS 5:23 etc. Too many more scriptures here.
-Point 5 comes crashing down

To be continued...

JAL said: ↑ (6) The Sola Scriptura position casts unacceptably dark shadows on God’s character, because it consigns Christians to rely on exegesis – essentially play guessing games – even on life-and-death decisions. For example we are told not to expect a Direct Revelation providing us a feeling of 100% certainty whether dropping a bomb on Hiroshima (which killed 200,000 people) is the morally right thing to do. But far more than that. 100 billion have lived and died since the world began. Here too, we have to play guessing games about the most effective way to reach them with the gospel.

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There is no guessing games dear friend for those who believe and follow God's Word and prayerfully seek God through His Word and want to know what Gods' truth is. In fact God promises those who rely on His Word to be their guide and teacher here *JOHN 14:26; JOHN 16:13; JOHN 7:17; JOHN 8:31-36; 1 JOHN 5:3. This is a part of the new covenant promise to all those who believe and follow God's Word as shown in HEBREWS 8:10-11.
-Point 6 comes crashing down

JAL said: ↑ (7) With 100 billion souls at stake, the primacy of Direct Revelation is the correct stance. Even if I’m wrong about this theory, I’m still right about it. How so? Because with so much at stake, I need to feel 100% certain about whether I’m right or wrong about the theory, in order to conduct evangelism responsibly. Exegesis is a fallible science that cannot hope to achieve 100% certainty. The pursuit of Direct Revelation is thus the correct stance no matter which religion turns out to be the true one, and thus does not need any biblical support to establish itself as correct. Paul placed superlative emphasis on Direct Revelation when he commanded, ‘Eagerly desire spiritual things, especially the gift of prophecy” (1Cor 14:1). In fact the NT defines evangelism as prophetic utterance (see post 179 on another thread, and post 180), for only an irresponsible/negligent God would entrust the evangelism of 100 billion souls to humanly fallible approaches.

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Your theory is wrong as shown through the scriptures already as our salvation is by God's GRACE THROUGH FAITH *EPEHSANS 2:8-9; JOHN 3:16-21 etc. There is actually too many scriptures here that disagree with your teachings for example EPHESIANS 1:13 In whom you also trusted, AFTER THE YOU HEARD THE WORD OF TRUTH, THE GOSPEL OF YOUR SALVATION: in whom also after that you believed, you were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise. We are told in the scriptures that we are saved by God's GRACE THROUGH FAITH.. *EPHESIANS 2:8. Now if our salvation and conversion is by BELIEVING God's Word and faith comes by hearing and hearing comes only by the Word of God *ROMANS 10:17. How can you have conversion when there is no Word?
- Point 7 comes crashing down....

JAL said: ↑ (8) It would be irresponsible/negligent of God to confine us to religious documents tainted by man-made opinions. And yet that is precisely what Sola Scriptura entails. In order to learn Greek and Hebrew, for example, I have to learn it from a man-made Lexicon. As the efficacious Voice of God, only Direct Revelation can hope to achieve full insulation from the opinions of men. Here’s another example of the man-made taint. Exegesis is an application of human reason and human scholarship in an effort to construct proofs of what the biblical text does or does not say. All proofs, however, are built on top of assumptions that, in turn, need to be proven. This leads to an infinite regress of unproven assumptions. The only way to break out of this infinite loop is to provisionally stipulate some man-made presumptions hoping the readers will concur. And that is precisely how all exegesis proceeds.

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Your starting off point 8 with a false premise. The bible is not a religous document tainted by man made opinions. The scriptures teach that ALL SCRIPTURE IS GIVEN BY INSPIRATION OF GOD and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness *2 TIMOTHY 3:16. Everything else falls down from here because your building on a false premise that is not biblical. You also deny God's promises to those who seek him to know the truth of His Word in JOHN 14:26; JOHN 16:13; 1 JOHN 2:27; JOHN 8:31-32; JOHN 7:17.
- Point 8 comes crashing down....

JAL said: ↑ (9) The Sola Scriptura party prioritizes scholarship over the Voice, contrary to human purpose. God did not create us out of a need for Bible scholars. He created us to fellowship with us – to speak with us.

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Actually this is another false premise. God's Word alone teaches that "IF ANY MAN WILLS TO DO HIS (God's) WILL HE SHALL KNOW OF THE DOCTRINE IF IT BE OF GOD OR NOT *JOHN 7:17; These promises of course are conditional on seeking God with all of your heart *JEREMIAH 29:13, asking God to be your guide and teacher *JOHN 14:26; and believing his promises *HEBREWS 11:6; JOHN 16:13 and continuing to in God's Word *JOHN 8:31-32. God speaks with us through His Word *JOHN 6:63.
- Point 9 comes crashing down....

JAL said: ↑ (10) Jesus made it clear that exegesis is an inferior revelator of truth. How so? If exegesis were superior to Direct Revelation, then Bible scholars would unfold all the mysteries of Scripture while leaving the prophets stranded in cognitive darkness by comparison. This is an exact reversal of the actual state of affairs. Jesus put it like this: “Jesus said, “I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned [the bible scholars], and revealed them unto babes.” Christ’s words are far more than just an abstract advisory – it was His actual experience. By virtue of Direct Revelation, Christ’s understanding of the Scriptures utterly dwarfed that of the Sola Scriptura parties of His day (the Pharisees, Sadducees, and the teachers of the law).“Revealed them unto babes.” A babe accepts a message from his father because he feels certain about his father’s voice, not because he is scholarly enough to evaluate the veracity of the message, or “test it against Scripture”.

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This one is also buiding on faulty foundations. As the scriptures define Gods' Word as TRUTH in JOHN 7:17 SANCTIFY THEM THROUGH THE TRUTH; THY WORD IS TRUTH. God was revealing the truth of the WORDS of JESUS to those who would receive them. How do you think these babes received the truth if it was not through the very Words of JESUS who is the living Word of God *JOHN 1:1-4; 14?
- Point 10 comes crashing down....

JAL said: ↑ (11) There is no clear evidence for the primacy of “testing it against Scripture”. For example there is no proof that the Bereans examined the Scriptures without recourse to the Light of the Holy Spirit (Direct Revelation). And the argument based on 2 Tim 3:16-17 is saddled with difficulties. For example it says “profitable” rather than sufficient. It is directed to a “man of God” (Timothy) which is a phrase strongly intimating prophethood. And it’s not even clear in what sense “profitable” – in my view Scripture is profitable precisely in the sense of pointing to us toward Direct Revelation. On the contrary, the “testing of the spirits” simply involves checking whether they agree or disagree with things taught by the Spirit via the Voice of Direct Revelation – that is the upshot of passages such as John 16:12-15 and 1John 2:20-22 and 1John 2:26-28. Note there is no mention of biblical exegesis in these passages, as the test. Only the anointing is mentioned.

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Your premise again is faulty. You state here "there is no clear evidence for the primacy of testing it against the scriptures" which is not biblical as the scriptures teach "TO THE LAW AND THE TESTIMONY IF THEY SPEAK NOT ACCORDING TO THIS WORD THERE IS NO TRUTH IN THEM" ISAIAH 8:20 and again "HE THAT SAYS I KNOW HIM (GOD) IF AND KEEPS NOT HIS COMMANDMENTS (The Word) IS A LIAR AND THE TRUTH IS NOT IN HIM *1 JOHN 2:3-4. It is God's Word alone that defines the scriptures are TRUTH. "SANCTIFY THEM THROUGH THE TRUTH THY WORD IS TRUTH *JOHN 17:17 and again "THE WORDS THAT I SPEAK UNTO YOU THEY ARE SPIRIT AND THEY ARE LIFE *JOHN 6:63. Your post here makes no sense. How can you test someone against the Spirit when the scriptures show that the Spirit is the Spirit of the WORD OF GOD *JOHN 6:63?
- Point 11 comes crashing down....

to be continued...

JAL said: ↑ (12) Paul’s definition of a church (and note that all subsequent definitions are man-made) envisions a church charismatically governed by recipients of Direct Revelation: “God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues” (1 Cor 12).

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According to the sciptures the GREEK word for "CHURCH" is - G1577 ἐκκλησία; ekklēsia From a compound of G1537 and a derivative of G2564; a calling out, that is, (concretely) a popular meeting, especially a religious congregation (Jewish synagogue, or Christian community of members on earth or saints in heaven or both): - assembly, church. God's church therefore are all those who believe and follow God's Word as the scriptures teach "WHERE TWO OF THREE ARE GATHERED TOGETHER IN MY NAME THERE I AM IN THE MIDST OF THEM" *MATTHEW 18:20. What you have posted above is not Pauls definition of Church. 1 CORINTHIANS 12 is about Spiritual gifts in the Church (those who believe and follow Gods' Word) and the different positions and roles within God's Church. Which once again is shown and directed by GOD'S WORD!
- Point 12 comes crashing down....

JAL said: ↑(13) The inability of exegesis to provide 100% certainty casts yet another aspersion on God’s Fatherly character. If He isn’t willing to provide Direct Revelation to all of us, He is expecting us to perpetually labor in the gospel without hope of ever really being certain that we are propagating the true religion, or even being fully certain that we ourselves are saved. Some Father He is!

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Your repeating your self here again and claiming things that are not biblical but simply your opinion. As shown in some previous points the scriptures teach that ALL SCRIPTURE IS GIVEN BY INSPIRATION OF GOD and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness *2 TIMOTHY 3:16. Everything else falls down from here because your building on a false premise that is not biblical. You also deny God's promises to those who seek him to know the truth of His Word in JOHN 14:26; JOHN 16:13; 1 JOHN 2:27; JOHN 8:31-32; JOHN 7:17.
- Point 13 comes crashing down....

JAL said: ↑ (14) A close analysis of the first epistle to the Corinthians strongly suggests an incredibly strict definition of spiritual maturity identifiable only with mature prophets. This epistle is prolific with references to Spirit-inspired speech such as prophecy and ascribes superlative revelation only to the mature, in keeping with Number 12:8-10. I have a thread on this epistle here. Relevant posts on that thread include: Post 7, and Post 33, and Post 46, and Post 47, and post 52, and post 58.

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ISAIAH 28:9-13 [9], WHOM WILL HE TEACH KNOWLEDGE? AND WHOM WILL HE MAKE TO UNDERSTAND THE MESSAGE? THEM THAT ARE WEANED FROM THE MILK, AND DRAWN FROM THE BREASTS? [10], FOR IT IS PRECEPT UPON PRECEPT, PRECEPT UPON PRECEPT; LINE UPON LINE, LINE UPON LINE; HERE A LITTLE, THERE A LITTLE. [11], Nay, but by men of strange lips and with another tongue will he speak to this people [12], to whom he said, This is the rest, give ye rest to him that is weary; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear. [13], THEREFORE SHALL THE WORD OF JEHOVAH BE UNTO THEM PRECEPT UPON PRECEPT, PRECEPT UPON PRECEPT; LINE UPON LINE, LINE UPON LINE; HERE A LITTLE, THERE A LITTLE; THAT THEY MAY GO, AND FALL BACKWARD, AND BE BROKEN, AND SNARED, AND TAKEN.

The scriptures shown above prove that God teaches us knowledge through his Word. Being drawn from the breasts means those who accept God as their saviour from sin. Still do not believe?

HEBREWS 5:13 FOR EVERY ONE THAT PARTAKETH OF MILK IS WITHOUT EXPERIENCE OF THE WORD OF RIGHTEOUSNESS; for he is a babe. (see also HEBREWS 5:12;

These scriptures prove the "Spiritual Maturity" comes once again by the WORD OF GOD!
- Point 14 comes crashing down....

JAL said: ↑ (15) The new birth must be defined as a revelatory vision of Christ, albeit usually not very distinct ("loud and clear") in our immaturity, because the human mind, unable on its own to properly self-conceive a ineffably holy God, would only worship a conceptual idol (viz. the Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses who worship the 'God' of their exegesis but it's not the true God). This, said Vincent, is the "new vision of the new man. He sees not only God, but the kingdom of God" (Vincent’s Word Studies on John 3:5) because "the new birth imparts a new vision" (Ibid., on Jn 3:11). Gordon Fee rightly insisted that 2Cor 3:18 ascribes to all believers a direct beholding of Christ in the most literal sense. This is a vision that cannot be exegetically "tested against Scripture" for the reason already stated - the human mind cannot exegetically conceive an ineffably holy God.

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Goodness what waffle. The new birth is not complicated if is a revelation of JESUS Christ through the scriptures as we BELIEVE and follow God's Word. The new birth is when we die to to walk in newness of life and happens when we choose to give our lives to Christ to believe and follow what God's Word says. As it is written in the scriptures. JOHN 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER BELIEVES ON HIM (The WORD see JOHN 1:1-4; 14) SHOULD NOT PERISH BUT HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE *JOHN 3:16 and again "WE ARE SAVED BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH..." EPHESIANS 2:8. If we are Born again we have receved God's forgiveness for our sins and are now free to walk in newness of life through God's Spirit *ROMANS 8:1-4; GALATIANS 5:16. That the righteousness of Gods LAW is fulfulled in those who believe and follow God's Word (ROMANS 8:4). Those who are born again no longer practice sin *1 JOHN 3:6-9. This is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil *1 JOHN 3:10. Everything shared here is revealed in Gods' Word in relation to the new birth from the WORD OF GOD *see JOHN 3:3-7; 1 JOHN 3:4-10; ROMANS 8:1-4; GALATIANS 5:16; ROMANS 6:1-23; HEBREWS 8:10-12; ROMANS 3:31 if you want the detail.
- BOOM Point 15 comes crashing down....

JAL said: ↑ (16) Witnessing is biblically defined as impromptu Spirit-inspired speech:"When you are brought before synagogues, rulers and authorities, do not worry about how you will defend yourselves or what you will say, 12for the Holy Spirit will teach you at that time what you should say" (Luke 12). This flies in the face of the notion that a voice cannot be accepted until we "check it out with Scripture". Instead it confirms that if we feel certain enough about a revelation to proclaim it in good conscience, we can freely do so.

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Witnessing is based on the good news of the Word of God. God's Spirit is the Spirit of the Word of God *JOHN 6:63. He is our guide and teacher that leads us to understand God's truth through his Word *JOHN 16:13 as we pray and ask God to teach us and guide us *JOHN 14:26. Gods' Spirit being the Spirit of the Word *JOHN 6:63 according to the scriptures works through God's Word not outside of it.
- BOOM Point 16 and the whole building comes crashing down ....

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The scriptures show dear friend your building your house on sifting sand. JESUS says in his very own words; "Every one that HEARETH THESE WORDS AND DOES THEM NOT, shall be likened unto a foolish man, who built his house upon the sand. The rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and smote upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall thereof *MATTHEW 7:26-27.

Your buiding your house on sifting sand dear friend and it has fallen over. Please cosider this as a help to you and a blessing and may God help you as you seek him through his Word.