“For many are called, but few are chosen.” —Matthew 22:14

redleghunter · Apr 18, 2020

The larger text below and poll is up.

Does this passage mean there is a difference between calling and choosing? It seems so.

How would one come to an understanding that a multitude would be called and then only some chosen?

In this case we can see the Gospel is this large general call as we are commanded by Christ to preach it to the world. The “few are chosen” is solely the work of God or what is called an effectual call from God. God provides the wedding garment.

Matthew 22: NASB

1Jesus spoke to them again in parables, saying, 2“The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a king who gave a wedding feast for his son. 3“And he sent out his slaves to call those who had been invited to the wedding feast, and they were unwilling to come. 4“Again he sent out other slaves saying, ‘Tell those who have been invited, “Behold, I have prepared my dinner; my oxen and my fattened livestock are all butchered and everything is ready; come to the wedding feast.”’ 5“But they paid no attention and went their way, one to his own farm, another to his business, 6and the rest seized his slaves and mistreated them and killed them.

7“But the king was enraged, and he sent his armies and destroyed those murderers and set their city on fire. 8“Then he said to his slaves, ‘The wedding is ready, but those who were invited were not worthy. 9‘Go therefore to the main highways, and as many as you find there, invite to the wedding feast.’ 10“Those slaves went out into the streets and gathered together all they found, both evil and good; and the wedding hall was filled with dinner guests.

11“But when the king came in to look over the dinner guests, he saw a man there who was not dressed in wedding clothes, 12and he said to him, ‘Friend, how did you come in here without wedding clothes?’ And the man was speechless. 13“Then the king said to the servants, ‘Bind him hand and foot, and throw him into the outer darkness; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’ 14“For many are called, but few are chosen.”

hedrick · Apr 18, 2020

In the context of the story, those chosen are those with the wedding garment. I don't think the last alternative quite gets it, because it's pretty clear that the guests put on the garment in response to the calling.

redleghunter · Apr 18, 2020

hedrick said:
In the context of the story, those chosen are those with the wedding garment. I don't think the last alternative quite gets it, because it's pretty clear that the guests put on the garment in response to the calling.

Interesting the man singled out did not have one and was surprised at the reaction.

JIMINZ · Apr 18, 2020

redleghunter said:
The larger text below and poll is up.

Does this passage mean there is a difference between calling and choosing? It seems so.

How would one come to an understanding that a multitude would be called and then only some chosen?

In this case we can see the Gospel is this large general call as we are commanded by Christ to preach it to the world. The “few are chosen” is solely the work of God or what is called an effectual call from God. God provides the wedding garment.

Matthew 22: NASB

1Jesus spoke to them again in parables, saying, 2“The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a king who gave a wedding feast for his son. 3“And he sent out his slaves to call those who had been invited to the wedding feast, and they were unwilling to come. 4“Again he sent out other slaves saying, ‘Tell those who have been invited, “Behold, I have prepared my dinner; my oxen and my fattened livestock are all butchered and everything is ready; come to the wedding feast.”’ 5“But they paid no attention and went their way, one to his own farm, another to his business, 6and the rest seized his slaves and mistreated them and killed them.

7“But the king was enraged, and he sent his armies and destroyed those murderers and set their city on fire. 8“Then he said to his slaves, ‘The wedding is ready, but those who were invited were not worthy. 9‘Go therefore to the main highways, and as many as you find there, invite to the wedding feast.’ 10“Those slaves went out into the streets and gathered together all they found, both evil and good; and the wedding hall was filled with dinner guests.

11“But when the king came in to look over the dinner guests, he saw a man there who was not dressed in wedding clothes, 12and he said to him, ‘Friend, how did you come in here without wedding clothes?’ And the man was speechless. 13“Then the king said to the servants, ‘Bind him hand and foot, and throw him into the outer darkness; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’ 14“For many are called, but few are chosen.”

OK, I will take it as a whole, as you wrote it.

Jesus only spoke to the Jewish People (Nation) in Parables.

Mat. 13:10,11
10) And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
11) He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

Mat. 13:34
All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spake he not unto them:

Those Parables were only about the Kingdom of God (Heaven) which He as their Promised Messiah was bringing to them but were not allowed to receive as Prophesied in Isaiah.

Mat 13:13-15
13) Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
14) And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
15) For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Isa. 6:9,10
9) And he said, Go, and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not.
10) Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed.

Now with all of that lad out and understood, it should then be obvious that when Jesus said, in the Parable of the Wedding Feast.

Mat 22:12-14
12) And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless.
13) Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
14) For many are called, but few are chosen.

It should be understood at this point, the MANY were the Jewish People, I will explain who the CHOSEN were in a second.

That He was speaking directly to and only about the Jewish People (Nation)
and not all of humanity (Mankind)

The Jews of that Time, Generation, are the only ones who are referred to in the Bible as.

The ELECT, or CHOSEN because.

Rom. 9:27
Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:

Isa 10:21,22
21) The remnant shall return, even the remnant of Jacob, unto the mighty God.
22 For though thy people Israel be as the sand of the sea, yet a remnant of them shall return: the consumption decreed shall overflow with righteousness.

This whole understanding only comes about by fully understanding
Why the Parables were spoken.
What the Parables were spoken about.
Who the Parables were spoken to.

The Gospel of Jesus Christ here on earth was, The Gospel of the Kingdom to the Jews.

Mat. 24:14
And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Because Jesus Ministry here on earth was only to the Jews.

Mat. 15:24
But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

redleghunter · Apr 19, 2020

JIMINZ said:
OK, I will take it as a whole, as you wrote it.

Jesus only spoke to the Jewish People (Nation) in Parables.

Mat. 13:10,11
10) And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
11) He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

Mat. 13:34
All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spake he not unto them:

Those Parables were only about the Kingdom of God (Heaven) which He as their Promised Messiah was bringing to them but were not allowed to receive as Prophesied in Isaiah.

Mat 13:13-15
13) Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
14) And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
15) For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

Isa. 6:9,10
9) And he said, Go, and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not.
10) Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed.

Now with all of that lad out and understood, it should then be obvious that when Jesus said, in the Parable of the Wedding Feast.

Mat 22:12-14
12) And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless.
13) Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
14) For many are called, but few are chosen.

It should be understood at this point, the MANY were the Jewish People, I will explain who the CHOSEN were in a second.

That He was speaking directly to and only about the Jewish People (Nation)
and not all of humanity (Mankind)

The Jews of that Time, Generation, are the only ones who are referred to in the Bible as.

The ELECT, or CHOSEN because.

Rom. 9:27
Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:

Isa 10:21,22
21) The remnant shall return, even the remnant of Jacob, unto the mighty God.
22 For though thy people Israel be as the sand of the sea, yet a remnant of them shall return: the consumption decreed shall overflow with righteousness.

This whole understanding only comes about by fully understanding
Why the Parables were spoken.
What the Parables were spoken about.
Who the Parables were spoken to.

The Gospel of Jesus Christ here on earth was, The Gospel of the Kingdom to the Jews.

Mat. 24:14
And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Because Jesus Ministry here on earth was only to the Jews.

Mat. 15:24
But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

The only real issue I have with what you wrote is there are those invited and that would be Israel as heirs. When the slaves starting going out to the fields and hedges that seems to be not those of the Promise of Abraham as they understood it at the time.

I think Jesus is telling them those that think they have the privilege will lose it for those God will choose to be His people.

JIMINZ · Apr 19, 2020

redleghunter said:
The only real issue I have with what you wrote is there are those invited and that would be Israel as heirs. When the slaves starting going out to the fields and hedges that seems to be not those of the Promise of Abraham as they understood it at the time.

I think Jesus is telling them those that think they have the privilege will lose it for those God will choose to be His people.

Right, the Slaves would be the Apostles spreading the Gospel of the Kingdom to the Jews first until the ELECT of GOD the Jews of that Generation was complete, Peter was sent to the Jews, it would then pass totally to the Gentiles, Paul was sent to the Gentiles.

redleghunter · Apr 19, 2020

JIMINZ said:
Right, the Slaves would be the Apostles spreading the Gospel of the Kingdom to the Jews first until the ELECT of GOD the Jews of that Generation was complete, Peter was sent to the Jews, it would then pass totally to the Gentiles, Paul was sent to the Gentiles.

Yes and that is exactly what happened. We had Pentecost then the Samaritans then Cornelius.

Hammster · Apr 19, 2020

JIMINZ said:
The Jews of that Time, Generation, are the only ones who are referred to in the Bible as.

The ELECT, or CHOSEN because.

Before I respond, I want to make sure I understand what you’re saying.

Are you saying that Gentiles are never referred to as elect or chosen?

1213 · Apr 19, 2020

redleghunter said:
...Does this passage mean there is a difference between calling and choosing? It seems so.
...

I agree with that, they are not the same. The invitation is for all, but all will be in the feast, because they are not “dressed” properly, are not righteous.

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23

Mountainmanbob · Apr 19, 2020

Was I sick in sin
or
dead in sin?

How can a dead man make the proper choice?
How can a dead man make any choice?

M-Bob

Hammster · Apr 19, 2020

From looking at some lexicons, “Friend” would be used almost sarcastically. Or ironically. Or whatever the right word is.

It was used for someone who would be there for their own personal gain. For instance, it’s used of Judas.

And Jesus said to him, “Friend, do what you have come for.” Then they came and laid hands on Jesus and seized Him.
— Matthew 26:50

So my take on this is that there are many invited to come. We preach the gospel to whoever we can. In this case, the gospel came to the Jews, and was rejected. So eventually the invitation went out to Jews and Gentiles. There needed to be a gathering, and those gathered were dressed in wedding clothes. This was a righteousness not their own. Then the “friend” shows up, but he’s not there for the right reason.

What we have is that none who were chosen actually agreed to be there. They were gathered. However it looks like they were pleased to be dressed in wedding clothes. I’m not going to die on this hill, but I think it’s akin to being born again. We don’t ask for it, but we are happy it happens.

So many are called, the invitation to believe on the finished work of Christ goes out. But the chosen are those who are gathered and dressed in the wedding clothes. These are the elect.

JIMINZ · Apr 19, 2020

Hammster said:
Before I respond, I want to make sure I understand what you’re saying.

Are you saying that Gentiles are never referred to as elect or chosen?

With everything I wrote you are unable to determine what it was I said.?

Are you saying the Gentiles after that time are referred to as elect or chosen?

Hammster · Apr 19, 2020

JIMINZ said:
With everything I wrote you are unable to determine what it was I said.?

Are you saying the Gentiles after that time are referred to as elect or chosen?

Yes.

JIMINZ · Apr 19, 2020

Hammster said:
Yes.

Where does this referring take place?

Hammster · Apr 19, 2020

JIMINZ said:
Where does this referring take place?

The epistles. Oh, and John 10.

redleghunter · Apr 19, 2020

Mountainmanbob said:
Was I sick in sin
or
dead in sin?

How can a dead man make the proper choice?
How can a dead man make any choice?

M-Bob

That’s simple goat logic. We should be listening to your goats. Not all of them because I think you have an atheist goat?

Mountainmanbob · Apr 19, 2020

redleghunter said:
That’s simple goat logic. We should be listening to your goats. Not all of them because I think you have an atheist goat?

They said, that they would welcome a debate with you. They are pretty busy. Tomorrow morning 4:30am is open?
Second goat pen on left.
M

JIMINZ · Apr 19, 2020

I'm only trying to get this straight, (correct).

I asked you.

JIMINZ said:
Are you saying the Gentiles after that time are referred to as elect or chosen?

My question was, Gentile Christians from 2000 yrs. ago to today?

You responded.

Hammster said:
Yes.

I asked you.

JIMINZ said:
Where does this referring take place?

You responded.

Hammster said:
The epistles. Oh, and John 10.

You are with this post, saying that you believe Gentiles were called THE ELECT in the Epistles, and in John 10.

The word ELECT does not appear in John 10, the word CHOSEN does but only in relation to the Disciples (Apostles).

Where then does the use of the word ELECT refer to Gentiles after THAT TIME 2,000 yrs, ago.

It is me belief the Church has misunderstood the word ELECT and inadvertently, mistakenly applied it to themselves over the last 2,000 yrs.

Hammster · Apr 19, 2020

JIMINZ said:
I'm only trying to get this straight, (correct).

I asked you.

My question was, Gentile Christians from 2000 yrs. ago to today?

You responded.

I asked you.

You responded.

You are with this post, saying that you believe Gentiles were called THE ELECT in the Epistles, and in John 10.

The word ELECT does not appear in John 10, the word CHOSEN does but only in relation to the Disciples (Apostles).

Where then does the use of the word ELECT refer to Gentiles after THAT TIME 2,000 yrs, ago.

It is me belief the Church has misunderstood the word ELECT and inadvertently, mistakenly applied it to themselves over the last 2,000 yrs.

I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; I must bring them also, and they will hear My voice; and they will become one flock with one shepherd.
— John 10:16

So, as those who have been chosen of God, holy and beloved, put on a heart of compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience; bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord forgave you, so also should you.
— Colossians 3:12-13

For this reason I endure all things for the sake of those who are chosen, so that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus and with it eternal glory.
— 2 Timothy 2:10

Paul, a bond-servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, for the faith of those chosen of God and the knowledge of the truth which is according to godliness,
— Titus 1:1

I don’t think the church has gotten it wrong.

JIMINZ · Apr 19, 2020

Hammster said:
I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; I must bring them also, and they will hear My voice; and they will become one flock with one shepherd.
— John 10:16

So, as those who have been chosen of God, holy and beloved, put on a heart of compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience; bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord forgave you, so also should you.
— Colossians 3:12-13

For this reason I endure all things for the sake of those who are chosen, so that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus and with it eternal glory.
— 2 Timothy 2:10

Paul, a bond-servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, for the faith of those chosen of God and the knowledge of the truth which is according to godliness,
— Titus 1:1

I don’t think the church has gotten it wrong.

OK, I will go so far as to say, Christians of today could possibly be called CHOSEN but only in the sense and understanding, God has DRAWN them to Christ for the purpose of Salvation.

This is only because the Term CHOSEN cannot be nailed down as readily as the Term ELECT can.....So then at this point, it's a given subject to change.

The Term ELECT however does not ever refer to anyone other than the Jews of that specific time, (That Generation), who accepted Christ as their Messiah, Savior and Lord. As Per my Post #4

Would I be correct in assuming you disagree with the whole of my post #4

“For many are called, but few are chosen.” —Matthew 22:14

What does this verse and parable tells us?

The Gospel is for all to hear, but God sovereignly chooses

This only applies to Israel the audience

Choosing here really means the people at the feast and not God

If we already have a wedding garment God chooses us.

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