A basic flaw in Partial Preterist interpretation

claninja

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The typical view of Amils is that the time on earth involves a long period of binding (a thousand years), and a short period of loosing (Satan's little season) before the second coming. The description in heaven is just showing us what is happing in heaven while Satan is curtailed on earth. But the heavenly reign is unaffected by Satan's little season.


So, in your opinion on Amillennialism, as well as others, there are 2 aspects of the 1,000 years. Symbolically it refers to the period of time between the 1st advent and satan's little season, in which he is bound. But in another aspect, it symbolically refers to the period between the 1st and 2nd comings in relation to the saints reigning in heaven.

This explanation is a little confusing, and maybe why many Amils explain the millennium as between the 1st and 2nd advent, in order not to get too dogmatic.

Notice even Anthony Hoekema doesn't believe the great apostasy, tribulation, fullness of Israel, gospel going to all nations, etc....are exclusively just in the short time of satan's little season, but are happening now, and thus Jesus could return at anytime. I would argue this is more related to the traditional Amil position
. This is the position that I was taught growing up in the CRC.


The “signs of the times” have both present and future relevance. Amillennialists believe that the return of Christ will be preceded by certain signs: for example, the preaching of the gospel to all the nations, the conversion of the fullness of Israel, the great apostasy, the great tribulation and the coming of the Antichrist. These signs, however, must not be thought of as referring exclusively to the time just preceding Christ’s return. They have been present in some sense from the very beginning of the Christian era and are present now.’ This means that we must always be ready for the Lord’s return and that we may never in our thoughts push the return of Christ off into the far-distant future." (A brief Sketch of Amillennial Eschatology).
 
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sovereigngrace

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So, in your opinion on Amillennialism, as well as others, there are 2 aspects of the 1,000 years. Symbolically it refers to the period of time between the 1st advent and satan's little season, in which he is bound. But in another aspect, it symbolically refers to the period between the 1st and 2nd comings in relation to the saints reigning in heaven.

This explanation is a little confusing, and maybe why many Amils explain the millennium as between the 1st and 2nd advent, in order not to get too dogmatic.

Notice even Anthony Hoekema doesn't believe the great apostasy, tribulation, fullness of Israel, gospel going to all nations, etc....are exclusively just in the short time of satan's little season, but are happening now, and thus Jesus could return at anytime. I would argue this is more related to the traditional Amil position
. This is the position that I was taught growing up in the CRC.


The “signs of the times” have both present and future relevance. Amillennialists believe that the return of Christ will be preceded by certain signs: for example, the preaching of the gospel to all the nations, the conversion of the fullness of Israel, the great apostasy, the great tribulation and the coming of the Antichrist. These signs, however, must not be thought of as referring exclusively to the time just preceding Christ’s return. They have been present in some sense from the very beginning of the Christian era and are present now.’ This means that we must always be ready for the Lord’s return and that we may never in our thoughts push the return of Christ off into the far-distant future." (A brief Sketch of Amillennial Eschatology).

I have been describing the typical Amil position. The reign in heaven is letting us know what the dead in Christ are doing during that period. As CG said: Amil often generalize that the thousand years relate to the intra-Advent period, but that does not negate the fact that they see a time at the end when Satan will be released before the second coming.
 
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claninja

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We are looking at generalities! Before the cross the Gentiles were considered blind, ignorant, in bondage and living in darkness, deceived by the father of lies. Satan had them hoodwinked. He ruled the nations. He had them under his control. After the resurrection, the Gentiles were no longer deceived as the Gospel light shone throughout the nations. The veil of ignorance was lifted. They are now without excuse.

You seem to miss what Revelation 20 is talking about and overlook the seismic change in regard to the Gospel opportunity that exists today (in comparison to before the cross) in regard to the nations access to truth.

This truth is highlighted in Matthew 4:8-9 where the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.”

During the temptations of Christ in the desert, Satan offers Jesus the world if He would only bow down before him. Satan was well within his rights to make such an offer since Adam handed over world dominion to him when he allowed himself to be subject to Satan's will.

The parallel passage in Luke 4:5-7 says: “And the devil, taking him up into an high mountain, shewed unto him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. And the devil said unto him, All this power will I give thee, and the glory of them: for that is delivered unto me; and to whomsoever I will I give it. If thou therefore wilt worship me, all shall be thine.”

Manifestly, through Adam’s sin, Satan was able to present a legitimate temptation to Christ. The fact the devil had the capability to tempt the Lord with this enticement proves he enjoyed authority over the nations that had to be broken. Ultimately, God permitted Satan to have this authority. But it was Adam that relinquished this rule over the earth in the Fall. After all, this was a definite and a real legitimate temptation. The devil had huge power over this world.

God controlled one single nation. Satan controlled the nations plural.

Acts 14:16 confirms that God in times past suffered all nations (ethnos) to walk in their own ways.”

Acts 17:30 says, And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent.”

Ephesians 2:11-13 confirms this, saying, “ye being in time past Gentiles (ethnos) in the flesh, who are called uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: but now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.”

Did that mean that all Gentiles were wholesale lost or deceived? No! Many Gentiles found Christ in the OT. It was a general observation at the prevailing spiritual condition of the mass of the people. That is all Rev 20 is saying.

The Scriptures often depict the Gentiles in the Old Testament as deceived, without hope, blinded, ignorant and darkened. The Bible repeatedly describes the Gentiles in the New Testament as enlightened. That does not suggest that all were blind in the Old Testament or that all will be enlightened in the New Testament. These are simply sweeping generalities establishing the Gospel climate in either era. The widespread light didn’t shine on the nations throughout the Old Testament. Today, it does exist as the Gospel is preached throughout the nations. Before the cross, the Gospel was largely withheld from the nations. After the cross, the Gospel spread like wildfire throughout the globe. Like Israel in the Old Testament, the Gentiles in the New Testament have now had the light shone on them through the great commission.

Imprisonment, blindness, darkness, hopelessness and ignorance are always tied together in Scripture.

Isaiah 60:1-3 says, Arise, shine; for thy light is come, and the glory of the LORD is risen upon thee. For, behold, the darkness shall cover the earth, and gross darkness the people: but the LORD shall arise upon thee, and his glory shall be seen upon thee. And the Gentiles shall come to thy light, and kings to the brightness of thy rising.”

Isaiah 61:1 says, “The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the broken hearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound.”

Zacharias the father of John the Baptist was filled with the Holy Ghost in Luke 1:78-80 and prophesied: “Through the tender mercy of our God; whereby the dayspring from on high hath visited us, To give light to them that sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the way of peace.”

Simeon acknowledged in Luke 2:30-32 says: For mine eyes have seen thy salvation, Which thou hast prepared before the face of all people; A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel."

Prior to Christ’s earthly ministry believers knew that the Gospel was going to go the Gentiles.

The general broad deception that engulfed the Gentiles in ignorance and darkness is lifted. They now can receive if they believe. That does not suggest the majority will. Acts 13:46-48 says, “Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, it was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you [the Jews]: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the ethnos (or) Gentiles. For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the ethnos (or) Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth. And when the ethnos (or) Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.”

From Acts 10 (and the incident at Cornelius’ house) the Gospel was released unto the darkened Gentiles in a significant manner. They would now be brought from darkness of heathenism unto the light of Christ and His Gospel. The unequivocal words from Paul and Barnabas above confirm that the tide had markedly turned and that the Gospel had opened up to the blinded Gentiles in a very definite way. With the rare exception of the city of Nineveh, the Gospel was previously restricted to the small individual “nation” of natural Israel before the Cross. The nations were totally engulfed with a blanket of darkness which was now being removed. The enforcement of Satan’s defeat at the Cross would now be realized by the people of God through the faithful preaching of the Word of God. The devil would be spiritually bound as the kingdom of God advanced with the Gospel. This spiritual binding ensures he is unable to defeat the work of the Church of Jesus Christ evangelizing the nations. It was only after Calvary that the good news of salvation was widened out to embrace the heathen “nations” of the world.

For example, Romans 9:30 attests: the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.”

Many times the New Testament uses broad sweeping statements about the salvation of the Gentiles. This in Rev 20 is just another parallel teaching. It is written throughout the New Testament. Satan has lost his wholesale deception of the Gentile nations. Revelation 20 is one of many general sweeping unqualified statements pertaining to the lifting of the deception on the Gentile nations. This started 2000 years ago. The first resurrection enabled the enlightenment of the nations.


Again I agree with just about all of this.

So then it is your opinion that satan has been unable to deceive anyone for the last 2,000 years in order to persecute or come against the church then, correct?
 
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claninja

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I have been describing the typical Amil position. The reign in heaven is letting us know what the dead in Christ are doing during that period. As CG said: Amil often generalize that the thousand years relate to the intra-Advent period, but that does not negate the fact that they see a time at the end when Satan will be released before the second coming.

Does not the typical Amil position believe that Christ could come at any moment, and thus we must always be ready?
 
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sovereigngrace

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Again I agree with just about all of this.

So then it is your opinion that satan has been unable to deceive anyone for the last 2,000 years in order to persecute or come against the church then, correct?

This truth relates to the Gentiles as a whole. It is a generality! But individuals can still be deceived by Satan. This is not a contradiction. It is repeated throughout the OT and the NT. It is telling us that the Gentiles are no longer ignorant. A light has shone on them for 2000 years, giving them the opportunity to see and believe.
 
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sovereigngrace

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Does not the typical Amil position believe that Christ could come at any moment, and thus we must always be ready?

Typically yes. But most of us believe there will be a notable and wide-scale intensification of persecution of the Church before Jesus comes. To what degree and scale none of us truly knows.
 
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DavidPT

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The description in heaven is just showing us what is happing in heaven while Satan is curtailed on earth. But the heavenly reign is unaffected by Satan's little season.


What could make sense if Revelation 20:4 supported it, the thousand years are meaning the NT church era as Amils have proposed. But that no one continues to reign a thousand years after they have died, though, thus no contradiction to reigning a thousand years, but would be a contradiction if they are still reigning a thousand years during satan's little season. And when the thousand years expire, the saved still alive at the time are basically on their own, thus are made war with, then overcome, and some killed, by the beast during the 42 month reign. In order to do what? To test them, to make them white like the following suggests.

Daniel 12:7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

Daniel 12:10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.
11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.
12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days

Unfortunately, Revelation 20:4 doesn't allow for the 42 month reign of the beast after the thousand years. But if it did, and that if I were Amil, I see the above making far better sense than what Amils typically propose, thus this would be the direction I would be trying to go in if it were me and that I was Amil.
 
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sovereigngrace

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What could make sense if Revelation 20:4 supported it, the thousand years are meaning the NT church era as Amils have proposed. But that no one continues to reign a thousand years after they have died, though, thus no contradiction to reigning a thousand years, but would be a contradiction if they are still reigning a thousand years during satan's little season. And when the thousand years expire, the saved still alive at the time are basically on their own, thus are made war with, then overcome, and some killed, by the beast during the 42 month reign. In order to do what? To test them, to make them white like the following suggests.

Daniel 12:7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

Daniel 12:10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.
11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.
12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days

Unfortunately, Revelation 20:4 doesn't allow for the 42 month reign of the beast after the thousand years. But if it did, and that if I were Amil, I see the above making far better sense that what Amils typically propose, thus this would be the direction I would be trying to go in if it were me and that I was Amil.

Not so! You are forcing your flawed Premil teaching on the Amil understanding of the beast and the millennium, and then rejecting it as untenable. That doesn't work. That is why it doesn't fit. Amils believe that the beast and Satan are bound in spiritual chains within a spiritual prison during the thousand years. This limits the scale of their influence, compared to before the cross, but does not prevent them deceiving or hurting those who want to accept their lies and evil.

The 42 months correlates with Satan's little season.
 
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Davy

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No you haven't. You just continue to generically state that that my position of what Amil means is opposite of the Amil quotes I provided, which makes no sense.

My positional on Amil is the exact same as the following 5 quotes.

1.) A MOD from another forum defines the Amil position as symbolic for starting at Christ's ascension and ending with the return of Christ:


Why Christians Should Embrace Partial Preterism

"One particular problem is the use of term amillennialism. Amillennialism means no millennial period set between two specific events in history matching 1000 years. In the amillennial view, the 1000 years is symbolic and starts at the Ascension of Christ and ends with the physical return of Christ at the Second coming. "

2.) The Millennial Kingdom by John Walvoord in regards to Amillinnialsim:

"The present age is between the first and second comings is the fulfillment of the millennium. Its adherents are divided on whether the millennium is being fulfilled now on earth (Augustine) or whether it is being fulfilled by the saints in heaven (Kliefoth)".

3.) From the Handbook of Evangelical Theology by Robert Lightner quoting from J.G. Vos:

"Amillennialism teaches that there will be a parallel and contemporaneous development of good and evil-God's kingdom and satan's kingdom-in this world, which will continue until the second coming."

4.) Even theopedia defines it the same way:

Amillennialism
(Greek: a- "no" + millennialism) is the view in Christian eschatology which states that Christ is presently reigning through the Church, and that the "1000 years" of Revelation 20:1-6 is a metaphorical reference to the present church age which will culminate in Christ's return"

5.) Anthony Hoekema
"Amillennialists interpret the millennium mentioned in Revelation 20:4-6 describing the present reign of the souls of the deceased believers with Christ in heaven. They understand the binding of satan mentioned in the first three verses of this chapter as being in effecting DURING THE ENTIRE PERIOD BETWEEN THE FIRST AND SECOND COMINGS OF CHRIST."



More generic statements that don't actually address anything I posted, with more blatantly untrue statements that I misrepresent Amil. All of the quotes I provided support the traditional view of Amil.



Anthony Hoekema, an Amil, agrees with the traditional view that has the binding of Satan during the "entire period" between the 1st and 2nd comings.

"Amillennialists interpret the millennium mentioned in Revelation 20:4-6 describing the present reign of the souls of the deceased believers with Christ in heaven. They understand the binding of satan mentioned in the first three verses of this chapter as being in effecting DURING THE ENTIRE PERIOD BETWEEN THE FIRST AND SECOND COMINGS OF CHRIST."

Still waiting for you to provide evidence that Amil means anything else then what I have stated with supporting quotations.



The irony just continues. I'm misrepresenting other people's views?

From the Handbook of Evangelical Theology by Robert Lightner QUOTING FROM J.G. VOS:


"Amillennialism teaches that there will be a parallel and contemporaneous development of good and evil-God's kingdom and satan's kingdom-in this world, which will continue until the second coming."

We can clearly see that J.G. Vos believes the millennium continues until the 2nd coming from the above quote.

Now, the quote your provided doesn't even state that satans little season occurs "after" the millennium. It states that at the "end" of this long period of time satan will have a little season.

Thus, J.G. Vos' position is consistent with what Amil teaches. The millennium is symbolic for the time between the ascension and the 2nd coming. At the end, not after this millennium, satan has a little season. This is consistent with the Amil diagram posted by CG in post 395.

Please don't misrepresent J.G. Vos.

However... each one of those declared Amill positions do NOT... agree with God's Word as written.

1 Peter 5:8
8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
KJV

John 14:30
30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in Me.
KJV


What? You mean Peter said Satan is STILL WALKING ABOUT, seeking whom he may devour??

As I have said before, men's doctrine of Preterism reveals how deep in deception that men can create for themselves.
 
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claninja

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Typically yes. But most of us believe there will be a notable and wide-scale intensification of persecution of the Church before Jesus comes. To what degree and scale none of us truly knows.

I don't know about "most", but I would agree many do have a heavy interest in end times stories. I wouldn't be so surprised if Amils are beginning to take a page out Premils speculative interpretation of Revelation.
 
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claninja

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This truth relates to the Gentiles as a whole. It is a generality! But individuals can still be deceived by Satan. This is not a contradiction. It is repeated throughout the OT and the NT. It is telling us that the Gentiles are no longer ignorant. A light has shone on them for 2000 years, giving them the opportunity to see and believe.

What is the purpose of the deceiving? To persecute the church

Revelation 20:7-9 When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle. Their number is like the sand of the seashore. And they marched across the broad expanse of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. But fire came down from heaven and consumed them.

The persecution was occurring as early as the 1st century.

2 Thessalonians 1:5-10 All this is clear evidence of God’s righteous judgment. And so you will be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which you are suffering. After all, it is only right for God to repay with affliction those who afflict you, and to grant relief to you who are oppressed and to us as well, when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in blazing fire. He will inflict vengeance on those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus.They will suffer the penalty of eternal destruction, separated from the presence of the Lord and the glory of His might, on the day He comes to be glorified in His saints and regarded with wonder by all who have believed, including you who have believed our testimony.

the purpose of satan's persecution, under God's authority, of the church was to produce endurance, hope, and grow the faith of the true Church

2 thessalonians 2:3-4 We are obligated to thank God for you all the time, brothers, as is fitting, because your faith is growing more and more, and your love for one another is increasing. That is why we boast among God’s churches about your perseverance and faith in the face of all the persecution and affliction you are enduring.

Romans 5:3 Not only that, but we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope

Thus I would argue satan's little season should be associated with his casting out of heaven, for that is when His time is short.

Revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you who dwell in them! But woe to the earth and the sea; with great fury the devil has come down to you, knowing he has only a short time.

Revelation 20:3 And he threw him into the Abyss, shut it, and sealed it over him, so that he could not deceive the nations until the thousand years were complete. After that, he must be released for a brief period of time.

Unless do you believe satan has 2 little seasons?
 
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sovereigngrace

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What is the purpose of the deceiving? To persecute the church

Revelation 20:7-9 When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle. Their number is like the sand of the seashore. And they marched across the broad expanse of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. But fire came down from heaven and consumed them.

The persecution was occurring as early as the 1st century.

2 Thessalonians 1:5-10 All this is clear evidence of God’s righteous judgment. And so you will be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which you are suffering. After all, it is only right for God to repay with affliction those who afflict you, and to grant relief to you who are oppressed and to us as well, when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in blazing fire. He will inflict vengeance on those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus.They will suffer the penalty of eternal destruction, separated from the presence of the Lord and the glory of His might, on the day He comes to be glorified in His saints and regarded with wonder by all who have believed, including you who have believed our testimony.

the purpose of satan's persecution, under God's authority, of the church was to produce endurance, hope, and grow the faith of the true Church

2 thessalonians 2:3-4 We are obligated to thank God for you all the time, brothers, as is fitting, because your faith is growing more and more, and your love for one another is increasing. That is why we boast among God’s churches about your perseverance and faith in the face of all the persecution and affliction you are enduring.

Romans 5:3 Not only that, but we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope

Thus I would argue satan's little season should be associated with his casting out of heaven, for that is when His time is short.

Revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you who dwell in them! But woe to the earth and the sea; with great fury the devil has come down to you, knowing he has only a short time.

Revelation 20:3 And he threw him into the Abyss, shut it, and sealed it over him, so that he could not deceive the nations until the thousand years were complete. After that, he must be released for a brief period of time.

Unless do you believe satan has 2 little seasons?

Wrong. This relates to the end.
 
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sovereigngrace

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However... each one of those declared Amill positions do NOT... agree with God's Word as written.

1 Peter 5:8
8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
KJV

John 14:30
30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in Me.
KJV


What? You mean Peter said Satan is STILL WALKING ABOUT, seeking whom he may devour??

As I have said before, men's doctrine of Preterism reveals how deep in deception that men can create for themselves.

Can an incarcerated prisoner still kill, steal or destroy?
 
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Davy

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What is the purpose of the deceiving? To persecute the church

Revelation 20:7-9 When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle. Their number is like the sand of the seashore. And they marched across the broad expanse of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. But fire came down from heaven and consumed them.

The persecution was occurring as early as the 1st century.

2 Thessalonians 1:5-10 All this is clear evidence of God’s righteous judgment. And so you will be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which you are suffering. After all, it is only right for God to repay with affliction those who afflict you, and to grant relief to you who are oppressed and to us as well, when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in blazing fire. He will inflict vengeance on those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus.They will suffer the penalty of eternal destruction, separated from the presence of the Lord and the glory of His might, on the day He comes to be glorified in His saints and regarded with wonder by all who have believed, including you who have believed our testimony.

the purpose of satan's persecution, under God's authority, of the church was to produce endurance, hope, and grow the faith of the true Church

2 thessalonians 2:3-4 We are obligated to thank God for you all the time, brothers, as is fitting, because your faith is growing more and more, and your love for one another is increasing. That is why we boast among God’s churches about your perseverance and faith in the face of all the persecution and affliction you are enduring.

Romans 5:3 Not only that, but we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope

Thus I would argue satan's little season should be associated with his casting out of heaven, for that is when His time is short.

Revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you who dwell in them! But woe to the earth and the sea; with great fury the devil has come down to you, knowing he has only a short time.

Revelation 20:3 And he threw him into the Abyss, shut it, and sealed it over him, so that he could not deceive the nations until the thousand years were complete. After that, he must be released for a brief period of time.

Unless do you believe satan has 2 little seasons?

Preterist wrongly believe the "little season" idea applies only to the time in Rev.20 after Satan is loosed.

The short time of Rev.12 is for the coming tribulation prior to Christ's Millennial reign of Rev.20, and it's easy to prove.

Rev 12:9-12
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.


11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.


12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
KJV


That reveals the "short time" after Satan is cast out of the heavenly is for the time of great tribulation just prior to His 2nd coming to gather His Church.
 
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Davy

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Can an incarcerated prisoner still kill, steal or destroy?

Satan is not bound in his pit prison yet.

1 Peter 5:8
8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
KJV
 
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Davy

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Satan being cast out of heaven refers to the end and not the cross?

Actually, BOTH ideas are not likely our Lord Jesus' meaning...

In John 12:31 Jesus said now the prince of this world will be cast out. That is traditionally thought to mean at the cross. I don't think so, because remember what Peter said about Satan still walking about seeking to devour, so we can't apply that to mean Satan being cast out of this world. It has to mean our Lord was pointing to some other event.

Lo and behold, Jesus said in John 14:30 that hereafter, meaning after the cross, the prince of this world 'cometh'. The Rev.12:7 forward event links to this I strongly believe. It is about the future when Satan and his angels are cast out of the heavenly dimension down to our earthly dimension, which is what will cause the time of great tribulation upon Christ's Church.

So that can't be about the time of the cross, nor the time after the thousand years of Rev.20. It can only be about the time starting with the tribulation, which is just before the end of this present world.
 
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claninja

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Actually, BOTH ideas are not likely our Lord Jesus' meaning...

In John 12:31 Jesus said now the prince of this world will be cast out. That is traditionally thought to mean at the cross. I don't think so, because remember what Peter said about Satan still walking about seeking to devour, so we can't apply that to mean Satan being cast out of this world. It has to mean our Lord was pointing to some other event.

Lo and behold, Jesus said in John 14:30 that hereafter, meaning after the cross, the prince of this world 'cometh'. The Rev.12:7 forward event links to this I strongly believe. It is about the future when Satan and his angels are cast out of the heavenly dimension down to our earthly dimension, which is what will cause the time of great tribulation upon Christ's Church.

So that can't be about the time of the cross, nor the time after the thousand years of Rev.20. It can only be about the time starting with the tribulation, which is just before the end of this present world.

Jesus said satan would be cast out the cross

John 12:21-33 Now judgment is upon this world; now the prince of this world will be cast out. And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to Myself.” He said this to indicate the kind of death He was going to die.

Jesus said satan would be coming after the cross.

John 14:30 I will not speak with you much longer, for the prince of this world is coming, and he has no claim on Me

Lo and behold, revelation 12 ties both together, satan is cast out heaven at the ascension of Christ and thrown to earth where he persecutes the people of God.
 
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Davy

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Jesus said satan would be cast out the cross

John 12:21-33 Now judgment is upon this world; now the prince of this world will be cast out. And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to Myself.” He said this to indicate the kind of death He was going to die.

Jesus indeed defeated the devil on His cross, and that sealed the ultimate prophecy of Satan's fate to perish in the lake of fire. But Peter in 1 Peter 5:8 showed Satan was not bound, nor cast out of this world yet at the cross.

Jesus said satan would be coming after the cross.

John 14:30 I will not speak with you much longer, for the prince of this world is coming, and he has no claim on Me

The KJV...

John 14:30
30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in Me.

KJV

That "Hereafter" is in the NT manuscripts. It points to after the cross. And indeed, after the cross our Lord Jesus appeared and spoke with His disciples for a short period afterwards. That moves the event of Satan "cometh" to some time after the cross.

Lo and behold, revelation 12 ties both together, satan is cast out heaven at the ascension of Christ and thrown to earth where he persecutes the people of God.

The actual time Rev.12:7 forward shows when Satan is cast down to the earth is for the tribulation. The event of Archangel Michael making a "stand" in Daniel 12:1 is in association with that Rev.12:7 war. And what follows in Dan.12:1 is the time of trouble the world has never seen before, nor ever will again, i.e., the tribulation.
 
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sovereigngrace

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Satan is not bound in his pit prison yet.

1 Peter 5:8
8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
KJV

Answer the question: Can an incarcerated prisoner still kill, steal or destroy?
 
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