[Catholics Only] Poll: Has Russia been consecrated to the Immaculate Heart of Mary?

Fenwick said:

I didn't realize this was such a controversial topic, I figured it was well agreed upon that it hadn't and claims to the contrary were rejected.

I was just going to ask a question about 'why not', but now I'm gonna add a poll in here to see how many folks believe it has or hasn't.

If you think it hasn't, that's where my original question comes in:

What has been the impediment to accomplishing this? I know communism surely stood in the way before, but since it's fall is the Russian Orthodox Church the main obstacle? Has it been our own bishops? Has it been the Masonic infiltration and influence in the hierarchy of the Church? Perhaps all of the above?

What do you think?

Click to expand...

I think it was done adequately enough.

chevyontheriver said:

I think it was done adequately enough.

Click to expand...

such a on the fence answer for a yes or no question. You sound like an anglican.

Fenwick said:

I didn't realize this was such a controversial topic, I figured it was well agreed upon that it hadn't and claims to the contrary were rejected.

I was just going to ask a question about 'why not', but now I'm gonna add a poll in here to see how many folks believe it has or hasn't.

If you think it hasn't, that's where my original question comes in:

What has been the impediment to accomplishing this? I know communism surely stood in the way before, but since it's fall is the Russian Orthodox Church the main obstacle? Has it been our own bishops? Has it been the Masonic infiltration and influence in the hierarchy of the Church? Perhaps all of the above?

What do you think?

Click to expand...

it was a simple request. If one has to explain their answer with a paragraph or 2, it really tells you something. It is yes or no. The fact that it ain't clear, likely means it hasn't.

Fenwick said:

It was claimed that Sister Lucía wrote in the 1980s that the consecration done in 1984 was accepted, but the authenticity isn't accepted by the experts at the Fatima Center—including Christopher Ferrara and Fr. Nicholas Gruner.

Click to expand...

Interesting, this is the first time I've heard that there's a serious question about the authenticity of the letter. Thanks!

concretecamper said:

such a on the fence answer for a yes or no question. You sound like an anglican.

Click to expand...

I think it was clear enough that my answer was indeed a 'yes'. Not a glowing endorsement of how exactly it was done, but nonetheless a 'yes'.

Yes on the consecration, but in my view, but on the broader question: at Akita it was said that man had not heeded the message of Fatima, and punishment would follow a continued failure to heed it.

Where are we now? Gay marriage. Abortion on demand.all the Indifferences and Sacrileges , that offend our Lord. Then pachamama, bow down to idols, is it a coincidence that immediately after that , sister Agnes spoke again, and then in days came corona, which has closed all the churches and cancelled our Eucharist, and heralds implosion of our economies, and the fall out from that.

Is it significant that sister Agnes says the rosary is now our weapon and does not mention the Eucharist?

I do not think the whole third secret has been revealed, which could be another poll. I think the “ etc “ in Lucias writings, signifies an entire missing explanation of the vision, ( just as the others were explained) I have all the original texts and I read Portuguese.

Mountainmike said:

Yes on the consecration, but in my view, but on the broader question: at Akita it was said that man had not heeded the message of Fatima, and punishment would follow a continued failure to heed it.

Click to expand...

Exactly. It's us common Catholics for whom our own consecrations are either missing or partial. Who here is 'totus tuus'? Not me. Akita - I'm glad you brought up Akita.

Where are we now? Gay marriage. Abortion on demand.all the Indifferences and Sacrileges , that offend our Lord. Then pachamama, bow down to idols, is it a coincidence that immediately after that , sister Agnes spoke again, and then in days came corona, which has closed all the churches and cancelled our Eucharist, and heralds implosion of our economies, and the fall out from that.

Click to expand...

I think almost everybody missed it that. For those who missed it, Sr. Agnes Sasagawa had another message on October of 2019. When did the Wuhan virus first make it's appearance? Not long after that, December 31st, there were dozens of cases. Did they start about two months before with patient zero? Hmmm? We deserve FAR worse than Covid-19. As a society and even as a Church.

Is it significant that sister Agnes says the rosary is now our weapon and does not mention the Eucharist?

Click to expand...

Might be because we can all do the rosary when the churches are shut down.

I do not think the whole third secret has been revealed, which could be another poll. I think the “ etc “ in Lucias writings, signifies an entire missing explanation of the vision, ( just as the others were explained) I have all the original texts and I read Portuguese.

Click to expand...

One wonders. I don't lose a lot of sleep over it though. Just like I don't lose sleep over the date of the second coming. I think the full extent of the third secret might be an awful thing, but that ultimately we don't need to know to do the work we need to do. I suspect we do need to pray, even in sackcloth and ashes, rosaries and other prayers, with sacraments when and if we can catch them.

The last stanza of the Hail Mary is about asking Mary to pray for us now and the hour of our death. It was apparently added in a time of plague. I think it's entirely fitting for now.

Why sow confusion? Who does that come from? Or are messages from God a puzzle to be figured out? Our God is not the author of confusion. If someone can explain this, I’m all ears.

Michie said:

Why sow confusion? Who does that come from? Or are messages from God a puzzle to be figured out? Our God is not the author of confusion. If someone can explain this, I’m all ears.

Click to expand...

If you accept my premise, that the full third secret was not released then it is the withholding of it by man that caused confusion.

I also don’t believe it is earth shattering other than confirmation of Akita punishment, but I think it prophesies the implosion of the church, cardinal against cardinal, with the church attempting to address present day problems by watering down doctrine.

it is also selective, our ladies promise “ in Portugal the dogma of the faith will always be preserved”, and indeed Portugal is a wonderful place for catholic’s, the feast day celebration is something else, worth seeing!

Coronavirus is a slow killer, the- cure- destruction of the world economy will be far worse than the disease , where mans stupidity believing he is in control has led to making it far worse not better.

Maybe this will add value. From Jimmy Aiken's Mysterious World:

The Third Secret of Fatima

Deleted - sorry.

That is too harsh. They are answering on the fly. Much of it is not structured, so does not age as well as specific studies on particular topics.

I have seen old programmes archived, I have never seen anything ditched for other than staleness. I have heard that accusation made elsewhere by protestants who criticise everything and anything with many disingenuous arguments. Some eastern church commentators also love disingenuous arguments when speaking of the latin church. So it isnt just protestants.

If you look at such as Akins book on "salvation controversy" it is very good.

It identifies that the differences between protestant views and catholic views on justification and salvation are in part tied up with differences between different meanings used for the words. Like what is "faith" all must mean more than intellectual assent. Well worth the read.

Judge them on their structured works.

Markie Boy said:

I don't know - I listened a little - I don't trust anything tied to Catholic Answers staff. I have seen that site erase stuff that did not work well for them, rather than try to answer it. It was just dishonest. And if you went back to read the threads, you'll never see the full discussion - cuz it's just gone.

I pretty much don't trust anything connected to CA, or their staff.

Click to expand...

Deleted - sorry.

I thought Aiken did a pretty fair job of explaining both sides of the issue in a historical context.

I have read various things on the consecrations and I still don't know if they fulfilled what was requested at Fatima.

I also have had the "feeling" that the full third secret wasn't told to the laity, at least.

I wasn't aware that Sr. Agnes had given another message last October. I say the rosary everyday and I'll certainly remember that about the second half being added for the plague. I didn't realize that.