We need a mask and wash order, not a stay at home order
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Silmarien
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Nobody is undervaluing the importance of hygiene. I don't know where you've gotten the idea that people aren't taking precautions outside of Japan, but it's been about a month since you could even buy masks and hand sanitizer because they flew off the shelves.
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Japan struggling to get a grip on social distancing
In a Japanese travel advisor site, they said that anyone flying into Japan will be quarantined in a designated site for 14 days.
They have almost 2,000 confirmed cases now.
The government is giving aid to businesses that are suffering because of the virus.
In a Japanese travel advisor site, they said that anyone flying into Japan will be quarantined in a designated site for 14 days.
They have almost 2,000 confirmed cases now.
The government is giving aid to businesses that are suffering because of the virus.
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That goes against direct observation. As I go about in Chicagoland the overwhelming majority of people are not wearing masks. Not only do most Americans do a poor job of washing their hands, but most American doctors do, as well.
I don't know where you got the idea that I got the idea that people aren't taking precautions outside of Japan. What I said and what you think I said are obviously very different things. Go back and reread my OP.
That's nice. A mask is easy to make with a hanky and a shoelace. Most people are not wearing masks anyways. And hand sanitizer does not work as well as washing.
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Then you should stick around, so you can learn to correctly discriminate between data and personal anecdote. I used both, but you're calling both of them personal anecdote, or deliberately ignoring the data I cited.
However, maybe you can do some of the math I've already done, and give us the average weekly growth rate in terms of cases vs population density between Tokyo and Illinois, from January until March 27th, and then explain why the dramatic difference, if house arrest is so much more potent than hygiene?
I'll give you leg up. The Tokyo Metropolitan area has a population density of 6,349/km2. Illinois has 89.4/km2. By comparison to Tokyo-ites, Illinoisans already are social distancing, just by their density measures. Let's see what you come up with.
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Well, of course I do. Why would I actually find out facts like how 69% of the Japanese population use some form of Traditional Medicine, called Kampo, in Japan. Why would I bother to find out that TM is covered by most Japanese medical insurance? Nope, I am just some ignorant rube that spreads lies and misinformation on the internet, you know the type, right?
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Well they're your words, not mine, so I see no transgression in agreeing with them. In Japan, kampo is basically just herbal tea. The manufacturing and use is strictly regulated for quality in a way comparable to pharmaceuticals. It's less like the Chinese slaughtering rhinos for 'viagra' and more like American clinical studies where they're using eating mushrooms as a supplement to chemotherapy. Given that you compared it to uneducated Chinese people using Rhino horns then yeah, it looks like you're treating them as the same.
So yeah, you hit the nail on the head. But hey, don't let me stop you from conflating aggressive hygiene and sterilization with rhino-horn boners "because Japan".
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46AND2
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They are two completely different cultures. One of which has dealt with pandemics in the recent past, and the other not. One who's government takes it seriously, and the other with a president who sloughs it off as if there's nothing to worry about. Which one do you think has the populace who actually abides by the directives? It isn't social distancing that fails, it's the lack of adherence to it.
If you can't grasp the simple fact that you don't catch diseases you aren't exposed to due to limiting your interaction with potentially infected people....
BTW, Chicago is not exactly a small city....it has a population density of about 12k, nearly twice that of Tokyo. Where do you think most of the confirmed cases are in Illinois? Three guesses, first two don't count.
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expos4ever
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Oh good grief. So we are to trust your interpretation of data over that of basically all the qualified experts who are solidly behind the hardcore measures?
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1200 per square kilometer. not 12k per square km. You misread. Tokyo is six times as dense. That's 600%. Let's say you take a square kilometer of Chicago and a square km of Tokyo and distribute the respective numbers evenly. Then you will have roughly six times as much distance between the people in Chicago than in Tokyo. The "social distancing" recommendation is six feet. You can say, then, that in Cook County people are socially distanced by default, when compared with Tokyo.
That's the whole point. We should learn from them, rather than take the PROC approach.
Now now, don't insult Abe that way. He aspires to be every bit as diligent as Trump.
Wrong. I compared prefecture to a state. Prefectures are comparable to US states.
What Are The Best Materials for Making DIY Masks? - Smart Air Filters
A cotton blend mask can filter out 74% of 1 micron particles. Use a dishcloth and its 83%.
So yes, a hanky made of cotton blend fabric can filter out viruses. However, they can't filter out the VERY condescending words you're forced to eat now. Go, stand in front of the mirror, and say to your reflection "You think there's a problem with comparing the rough equivalent of a state to a state. And you think a hanky can't filter our virus particles. Wow"
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essentialsaltes
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Mebbe you've flipped your correlation and causation. Maybe they aren't socially isolating (yet) because the outbreak is not (yet) that severe.
Rather than their outbreak is not that severe, because they aren't socially isolating.
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46AND2
Forty six and two are just ahead of me...
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Oh, for goodness sakes. Tokyo is not six times as dense as Chicago. I did miss that your number was density in km instead of miles. So Chicago, using the same metric is about 4500/kmsq.
Wow. That's not how that works.
Patience. They are going to have to look into social distancing more, too....Their numbers are increasing. They had 200 more cases yesterday. In fact, their last 5 days have seen more new cases than any other one day since the outbreak.
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But I'm not saying "their out break is not that severe because they aren't socially isolating. I'm saying maybe their outbreak is not that severe because they reduce exposure through cleaning and masks.
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Tanj
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Viruses are way smaller than 1 micron. COVID19 is ~ 0.125 micron
No, it can't. Because ~30% isn't high enough. (the number I took from your link)
Not only that, but having done a stupid non real case test for penetration they then only test actual masks for fit. Where in that article is the fitness for a hanky tied up with a shoelace? Oh, right, nowhere.
Good luck with that.
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46AND2
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Or maybe their outbreak is not that severe....yet.
Tokyo confirms 68 new coronavirus cases, record daily increase
And today...highest single day increase yet in Tokyo...
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I wouldn't speak too soon.
The virus is hitting countries at different stages.
Japan's number of confirmed cases is still increasing just shy of America's; about 10% increase per day.
Given the relatively low number of cases right now is why it may look better. Once it sets in more it would be a lot worse due to the population density if measures weren't taken to control the virus.
If the economy has to suffer to save lives, so be it. We came back stronger than ever from the collapse in '08, we can do it again.
Surely this is what the pro-life Americans would want? Lives are more important than money, no?
The virus is hitting countries at different stages.
Japan's number of confirmed cases is still increasing just shy of America's; about 10% increase per day.
Given the relatively low number of cases right now is why it may look better. Once it sets in more it would be a lot worse due to the population density if measures weren't taken to control the virus.
If the economy has to suffer to save lives, so be it. We came back stronger than ever from the collapse in '08, we can do it again.
Surely this is what the pro-life Americans would want? Lives are more important than money, no?
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