No ventilators for those over the age of 60

solid_core

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I'm curious, do you speak Czech? Then how do you know that what she said is being accurately translated? And how do you know you are understanding the nuances of what she is saying?

To give you a great example, think of some of the "debates" here about things Trump said -- with liberals claiming he said one thing, and his supporters claiming he meant something entirely different, that the liberals are concentrating on a few words and not the overall message.

Language is complex and I'd need to know that I can trust the translation -- rather than just some YouTube video -- especially one that I'm not even seeing a translation for (buy maybe I'm missing something). I didn't see a link for this video in this thread, but could have missed it.
I am Czech.
 
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RestoreTheJoy

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Did you read it?

Quote:
"As his department receives coronavirus patients who are terminally ill, the focus is to allow patients to meet loved ones and communicate with them during their last moments despite the quarantine regulations. Other reports claim that, as the number of dead increases, some families find themselves unable to secure a proper burial for their loved ones.

Peleg said that, from what he sees and hears in the hospital, the instructions are not to offer access to artificial respiratory machines to patients over 60, as such machines are limited in number. "

Hearsay as to what may be happening in the rest of the hospital.

His department handles terminally ill patients.
 
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Tanj

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So, you have no intention of starting a war between Australia and Czechia :).

I'd probably get thrown in an internment camp. in the 1940s my passport would have read "Australian Citizen, Czech National"
 
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Sketcher

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China has demonstrated the strength of an absolute dictatorship and of a population accustomed to dictatorial control. Italy has demonstrated the weakness of a democracy and a mind set focused on "freedoms".

Future historians will reflect that it was in the year 2020 AD that eventual global mastery was handed to the Chinese by the failure of America to act as a world leader. Have your grand children learn Mandarin now and their grandchildren may have a future.

Note: I am expressing what I suspect to be the case, not what I would like to be the case.
They lied about the origin of the virus, they could easily be lying about the curve over there truly flattening.
Report: China Stopped Testing for COVID-19. That's Why There Are Zero New Cases.
 
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ZNP

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Ophiolite

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They lied about the origin of the virus, they could easily be lying about the curve over there truly flattening.
Report: China Stopped Testing for COVID-19. That's Why There Are Zero New Cases.
1. Provide sound, documented evidence that they lied about the origin of the virus.
2. Explain how lying about the cure truly flattening would in any way detract from my statements in the post you responded to. (Helpful hint: it would reinforce my statements.)
3. Explain to me why I should pay any more attention to a member who thinks PJ media* is a reliable source for anything other than fertiliser for garden produce?
 
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BobRyan

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Open borders policy did not help them --

Coronavirus: European borders likely to remain open despite crisis in Italy, observers say

=====================

Communists in Russia made it "illegal to report a crime" and so "Crime was low" in Russia during the height of communism.

Old communist patterns and habits die hard -
Report: China Stopped Testing for COVID-19. That's Why There Are Zero New Cases.
 
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JCFantasy23

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This tweet where the man's wife died and a medical announcement is very scary
Malcolm Nance on Twitter

The full memo from hospital in question that they are preparing to send out, This is the full memo, and it’s been said by Henry Ford Hospital that they aren’t at this point yet, but they’re preparing. They definitely don’t have enough tests, but ventilators are still in supply.

This is here and not ITaly, but pointing out the same issues and can will happen here in the U.S.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EUGipLhXkAA0j25?format=jpg&name=medium
EUGipLhXkAA0j25
 
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Sketcher

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1. Provide sound, documented evidence that they lied about the origin of the virus.
China Spins Tale That the U.S. Army Started the Coronavirus Epidemic
2. Explain how lying about the cure truly flattening would in any way detract from my statements in the post you responded to. (Helpful hint: it would reinforce my statements.)
If they are not testing anymore and thereby being careless, then we can't know if the curve has truly flattened over there. They can lift their bans and cause another outbreak. That doesn't reinforce China's position. That compromises it.
3. Explain to me why I should pay any more attention to a member who thinks PJ media* is a reliable source for anything other than fertiliser for garden produce?
You seem to already trust Communist propagandists. Might as well upgrade to me.
 
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redleghunter

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It can just as easily happen anywhere else when the health care services get overrun with cases. This is why it's so important to slow the spread down.
Slowing the spread is key as you indicated. Unfortunately Italy did not do that until they were overwhelmed.
 
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Ophiolite

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So, just to be clear, you are not talking about an initial lie. A pity you didn't make that clear in your original post. We wouldn't both have wasted our time.

If they are not testing anymore and thereby being careless, then we can't know if the curve has truly flattened over there. They can lift their bans and cause another outbreak. That doesn't reinforce China's position. That compromises it.
It doesn't compromise my characterisation of China as a dictatorship with a population accustomed to dictatorship, which was my point. You seem to think I am defending China, or promoting them in some way.

Let me make it clear - as it has been to anyone with their eyes open for the last couple of decades - China will almost certainly be the single super-power of this century on the strength of their dictatorial methods, commitment to technology and long term planning, where "long term" is something greater than an election cycle. The USA is effectively yielding it's leadership role through its farcical bipartisanship: a divided country, with much to be divided about.

You seem to already trust Communist propagandists. Might as well upgrade to me.
I presume you are talking about the Chinese. I suggest you re-read what I wrote and ask me questions if you still don't understand it. I can try to do a better job of explaining, once I grasp the nature of your confusion.
 
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redleghunter

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There should not be much surprise how COVID 19 got to Italy and spread so rapidly.

The fingerprints of where Chinese citizens and businesses travel have become epicenters. This is not xenophobic. It’s just reality. The industrial cities in northern Italy have over 375,000 Chinese resident workers most from the Wuhan area. There are three flights per day from Rome to Wuhan and return daily (or was before Italy became the epicenter).

Here’s some background links on what I just wrote above.

Big trouble in Italy’s ‘little China’ as authorities crack down on sweatshop factories and vigilantes

The Chinese Workers Who Assemble Designer Bags in Tuscany

Official statistics indicate there are at least 320,794 Chinese citizens in Italy, although these figures do not account for illegal immigration, former Chinese citizens who have acquired Italian nationality or Italian-born people of Chinese descent.

These workers do visit home for various holidays.

Chinese people in Italy - Wikipedia


There are (maybe were) three daily flights from Rome to Wuhan.

Flights from Wuhan to Rome, Italy as low as CN¥1,250
 
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redleghunter

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What would you like them to do? Let the 40- and 50-year olds die instead?
Why is age the metric. Why not make heavy smokers don’t get the machines. See what happens when people play God.
 
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keith99

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This would explain the enormous death rate in Italy. It's people over 60 who are most vulnerable to COVID-19. Not helping them is equivalent to closing hospitals!!!

Only in Italy!

So far. Expect the same anywhere else that reaches the same point.
 
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ZNP

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So far. Expect the same anywhere else that reaches the same point.
I doubt it, NYC is a very good example, they are aggressively adding ICU beds by the thousands, they are doubling the number of ventilators they have by aggressively beating the bushes, and they are doubling them again by using 1 ventilator for 2 people, and they have car manufacturers and vacuum cleaner manufacturers making more, and they have brought 40,000 health care professionals out of retirement to help. It looks like NYC will be much better prepared for the worst of this than Italy was.
 
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ZNP

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A ventilator is a machine that pumps air into the lungs via a plastic tube that has been inserted. Basically an electric fan hooked up to a plastic tube. It doesn't sound like something that GM, Ford, or Dyson would have too much trouble making by the thousands.
 
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keith99

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I doubt it, NYC is a very good example, they are aggressively adding ICU beds by the thousands, they are doubling the number of ventilators they have by aggressively beating the bushes, and they are doubling them again by using 1 ventilator for 2 people, and they have car manufacturers and vacuum cleaner manufacturers making more, and they have brought 40,000 health care professionals out of retirement to help. It looks like NYC will be much better prepared for the worst of this than Italy was.

But New York City and surrounding areas face a problem that most of Italy does not. People coming into work on packed subway trains. Infections transmitted before the current actions were taken could very well lead to the curve in New York being very compressed.

Thinking of my last work most could work from home, but discounting that and for the skeleton crew that would have been needed at least getting there would have been no problem. Hop in the car. Drive to work and enter.

New York has a major problem with relaxing restrictions. For many the subways are teh only viable mode of transit. A breeding ground waiting for new victims once reopened.
 
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ZNP

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But New York City and surrounding areas face a problem that most of Italy does not. People coming into work on packed subway trains. Infections transmitted before the current actions were taken could very well lead to the curve in New York being very compressed.

Thinking of my last work most could work from home, but discounting that and for the skeleton crew that would have been needed at least getting there would have been no problem. Hop in the car. Drive to work and enter.

New York has a major problem with relaxing restrictions. For many the subways are teh only viable mode of transit. A breeding ground waiting for new victims once reopened.
Packed subway cars? Not the video I have seen. Buses are generally the viable mode of transportation for everyone, but yesterday we saw three completely empty buses.
 
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