Islam Why call Muhammad a prophet?

Godistruth1 said:

See its u who says jesus knows the hour and chose not to tell his disciples about it and therefore lied. He should have made it clear that in his human form he did not know. Yet what he said is clearly is in line with the islamic view that jesus did not know the hour. Why are u trying to make jesus into something he never said he was.

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Am I supposed to reply to this or laugh because I did laugh when I saw this post of yours. Again here’s you putting words into my mouth that I never said, I said Christ in his waking human consciousness did not know the hour, however in his divine subconsciousness he had knowledge of everything just as we see in his post resurrection conversation with the Apostle Peter, according to Mohammandism your faith, only Allah knows the hearts of men, how is Christ also having that knowledge in line with your faith? You simply post nonsense after nonsense, and then come back with new nonsense.

Al Masihi said:

Am I supposed to reply to this or laugh because I did laugh when I saw this post of yours. Again here’s you putting words into my mouth that I never said, I said Christ in his waking human consciousness did not know the hour, however in his divine subconsciousness he had knowledge of everything just as we see in his post resurrection conversation with the Apostle Peter, according to Mohammandism your faith, only Allah knows the hearts of men, how is Christ also having that knowledge in line with your faith? You simply post nonsense after nonsense, and then come back with new nonsense.

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Hahaaaa. U know its not funny when u know u make up your own stuff all the time with no proof from the bible at all. All there are, are excuses. Lets hear it from u what does the conversation say?

Godistruth1 said:

Hahaaaa. U know its not funny when u know u make up your own stuff all the time with no proof from the bible at all. All there are, are excuses. Lets hear it from u what does the conversation say?

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So John 16:30 isn’t proof from the Bible that Christ knows everything?

Al Masihi said:

So John 16:30 isn’t proof from the Bible that Christ knows everything?

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"Now know we that thou knowest all things, and needest not that any man should ask thee: by this we believe that thou camest forth from God."

How ironic in the same verse the disciples confirm that Jesus was sent by God and did not say you are God. Clearly he is a messenger of God not the son of God. There are far many verses in bible saying it was God who sent jesus and all the verses which u consider confirm the divinity of jesus are all ambiguous.

Godistruth1 said:

"Now know we that thou knowest all things, and needest not that any man should ask thee: by this we believe that thou camest forth from God."

How ironic in the same verse the disciples confirm that Jesus was sent by God and did not say you are God. Clearly he is a messenger of God not the son of God. There are far many verses in bible saying it was God who sent jesus and all the verses which u consider confirm the divinity of jesus are all ambiguous.

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That doesn’t refute anything that’s are belief, Christ was sent by God the Father into the world, this doesn’t contradict our at all. Him being sent by God the Father doesn’t exclude him from the deity of the Father. The Word of God that is begotten of the same essence was sent to the World by the Father to do his will in Earth as it is in Heaven. According to Mohammdanism your faith a messenger cannot know everything so your assertions are refuted by this passage alone.

Al Masihi said:

That doesn’t refute anything that’s are belief, Christ was sent by God the Father into the world, this doesn’t contradict our at all. Him being sent by God the Father doesn’t exclude him from the deity of the Father. The Word of God that is begotten of the same essence was sent to the World by the Father to do his will in Earth as it is in Heaven. According to Mohammdanism your faith a messenger cannot know everything so your assertions are refuted by this passage alone.

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Are Jesus, holy ghost and Father equal in power according to paulism which is your faith?

Godistruth1 said:

Are Jesus, holy ghost and Father equal in power according to paulism which is your faith?

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All members of the trinity are co-equal and co-eternal in terms of the divine essence. I think you misunderstand me, I’m not insulting you by calling you a Mohammadan, Mohammed is whom you you serve and he is your master, so that’s who you are and Islamic scholars accept the term by the way. There’s no such thing as Paulism because we don’t serve Paul, we serve Christ whom Paul himself serves. We are Christians and our faith is Christianity just as you are a Mohammadan and your faith is Mohammadanism.

Al Masihi said:

All members of the trinity are co-equal and co-eternal in terms of the divine essence

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What are the things they are not co-equal in?

Al Masihi said:

I think you misunderstand me, I’m not insulting you by calling you a Mohammadan, Mohammed is whom you you serve and he is your master, so that’s who you are and Islamic scholars accept the term by the way

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Hey Im also not insulting u, you follow paul in most of what u do so ill continue calling u paulian. Also i dont know any major Islamic scholar who uses that terminology. Im sure your are familiar with the terms islam and Muslim and u already know when to use them.

mindlight said:

Think of it terms of spheres. The biggest sphere is everything that God knows which is indeed everything. Jesus chose to limit himself to a smaller sphere when He became a man so that He could save us. But when He returned to the Father he was restored to the big sphere. What He said while on Earth was given to Him by the Father who knew all, but He was only given what was helpful to know for His mission and not everything.

When you speak of Muhammad you do not pretend he knew everything. You say he only repeated what He was given. Such are the limits of a man. An incarnate God is different however.

This idea that Paul said different things from the rest of scripture is a nonsense there is no difference,

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There are things that paul said that directly contradict what jesus said in many places. For me it looks christians take the easier path. I may be wrong in this but this is how it looks to me honestly.

Al Masihi said:

All members of the trinity are co-equal and co-eternal in terms of the divine essence. I think you misunderstand me, I’m not insulting you by calling you a Mohammadan, Mohammed is whom you you serve and he is your master, so that’s who you are and Islamic scholars accept the term by the way. There’s no such thing as Paulism because we don’t serve Paul, we serve Christ whom Paul himself serves. We are Christians and our faith is Christianity just as you are a Mohammadan and your faith is Mohammadanism.

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Again asking . Where are they not equal in power?

mindlight said:

Christ and Muhammad or the members of the Trinity?

Muhammad is not the equivalent of Christ cause he is not God. Because he does not save us and he is not the firstborn from the dead who enables us to be resurrected. Also because as this thread has shown his connection with the Divine is ambiguous, strong on creation and judgment but weak on Redemption, love and prophecy and much of what he says contradicts those who came before him.

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My question is are the persons in trinity equal in power or not

Godistruth1 said:

Again asking . Where are they not equal in power?

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Define what you mean by power, they are co-equal I’m everything regarding the divine essence and it’s attributes except in regards to authority since there’s a hierarchy of authority in the trinity of which the Father is supreme and the source of the Trinity, however if you refer to abilities they are all co-equal, the Son does everything he sees the Father doing.

Al Masihi said:

Define what you mean by power

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Power to do everything equally

Al Masihi said:

Father is supreme and the source of the Trinity

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Hmm so they indeed are not equal in some ways. Can God the father forgive sins without Jesus playing any part?

Godistruth1 said:

Power to do everything equally

Hmm so they indeed are not equal in some ways. Can God the father forgive sins without Jesus playing any part?

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All members do everything equally in respect to the divine essence. All members of the trinity forgive sins, Christ forgives Sin’s with the Father’s authority by the power of the Holy Spirit so all members of the trinity play a part in the forgiveness of sins.

Al Masihi said:

All members do everything equally in respect to the divine essence. All members of the trinity forgive sins, Christ forgives Sin’s with the Father’s authority by the power of the Holy Spirit so all members of the trinity play a part in the forgiveness of sins.

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If Jesus takes authorization from Father and needs power of Holy Spirited, then neither Jesus nor Holy Spirit are perfect Devine persons.
As Jesus forgives only with Father's authority and needs Holy Spirit power to forgive.
Holy Spirit doesn't have authority and can't be called for forgiveness.
If Father gives authority and power then he is more superior than Jesus and Holy Spirit.
Then they're not equal Devine persons but in different degree of Devine power.


Your thoughts simply destroy the Trinity believe from its roots.

Limo said:

If Jesus takes authorization from Father and needs power of Holy Spirited, then neither Jesus nor Holy Spirit are perfect Devine persons.
As Jesus forgives only with Father's authority and needs Holy Spirit power to forgive.
Holy Spirit doesn't have authority and can't be called for forgiveness.
If Father gives authority and power then he is more superior than Jesus and Holy Spirit.
Then they're not equal Devine persons but in different degree of Devine power.


Your thoughts simply destroy the Trinity believe from its roots.

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This was an odd reply, fortunately I won’t have to answer Christ will:

All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will receive from me what he will make known to you."

John 16:15

Christ naturally possesses the authority of the Father being begotten of the same essence. He doesn’t need to take authorization every time he forgives sins, he already possess the authority, and the Holy Spirit works in Union with that authority to forgive sins. The works of the Holy Spirit are never separate or apart from other members of the Godhead such as the Father and Son, there has never been a time when the Son or Spirit was without authority since the Son, because the Son was begotten before all creation and the Holy Spirit eternally proceeds from the Father through the Son. No person of the trinity needs the other, they work in absolute unity with each other, when the Father raises the dead and gives life so do the Son and Holy Spirit. Christ doesn’t take authority from the Father he possesses that authority by nature of being God the Son, the Holy Spirit that eternally proceeds from the essence of the Father acts in unity with the Son and Father, also just as a simple refutation of your argument, you having a boss doesn’t make you less human than your boss. So you have been refuted on the trinity again.

Al Masihi said:

All members do everything equally in respect to the divine essence. All members of the trinity forgive sins, Christ forgives Sin’s with the Father’s authority by the power of the Holy Spirit so all members of the trinity play a part in the forgiveness of sins.

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So whats your proof that forgiveness is only through jesus. Jesus never taught to ask forgiveness through him. He even asked father to forgive the people directly and never said oh forgive them father through me!

Godistruth1 said:

So whats your proof that forgiveness is only through jesus. Jesus never taught to ask forgiveness through him. He even asked father to forgive the people directly and never said oh forgive them father through me!

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When Jesus saw their faith, He said to the paralytic, "Son, your sins are forgiven."

Mark 2:5

Then Jesus said to her, "Your sins are forgiven."

Luke 7:48

This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins.

Matthew 26:28