Paul Enforces Animal Husbandry Law

Need answers · Mar 19, 2020

Dkh587 said:
Acts 15 actually proves that Gentiles who converted to the faith of Messiah & God were Sabbath keepers, and were expected to be obedient to the law of Moses/God.

Could you cite the specific Acts 15 scripture?

JackRT · Mar 19, 2020

HARK! said:
(CLV) 1Co 9:8
Not according to man am I speaking these things. Or is the law not also saying these things?

According to who then?

The what? The law? What law?

(CLV) 1Co 9:9
For in the law of Moses it is written: "You shall not muzzle the threshing ox." Not for oxen is the care of God!

So Paul is quoting YHWH's authoritative word?

Where did he get this, in a vision after Yahshua ascended?

(CLV) Dt 25:4
You shall not muzzle a bull when it threshes.

The TORAH?!?

(CLV) 1Co 9:10
Or is He undoubtedly saying it because of us? Because of us, for it was written that the plower ought to be plowing in expectation, and the thresher to partake of his expectation.

Wait! What's this? Paul is not only quoting of the 613; but he's applying it in a way that is deeper than what is actually written. HE'S SAYING IT BECAUSE OF US? We actually have to listen to YHWH's Torah?!? Where is he getting this? Was it written on his heart?

(CLV) 1Co 9:11
If, in expectation, we sow the spiritual in you, is it a great thing if we shall reap of your fleshly things?

Fleshly things? That sounds like works of the law.

(CLV) 1Co 9:12
If others are partaking of this right from you, are not rather we? Nevertheless we do not use this right, but we are forgoing all, lest we may be giving any hindrance to the evangel of Christ.

Wait a minute! Is Paul saying that if we don't obey YHWH's law, at even a deeper level than it is written; and actually do works of the Law; that the evangel of Messiah may be hindered?

That sounds awfully legalistic. So many have told me that I didn't have to do a thing except lay back and enjoy the grace.

This has absolutely nothing to do with "animal husbandry" which as to do with the selective breeding of animals.

Dkh587 · Mar 19, 2020

DamianWarS said:
We are not trying to broadly agree if Torah is God law because Paul already narrows its context to Christ's law so let's stick to the context Paul establishes. I could ask is the Torah of Moses the same as the Torah of Christ. It seems clear in 1 Cor 9 there is God/Christ Law and there is Law and these two are different. I would suggest that when Paul uses the term law he means the torah of Moses so this would mean when he uses God's/Christ law he is referring to something else.

I’m asking because you appear to be of the understanding that the law of Moses is not the law of God, and vice versa.

the law of God is the law of Moses. The law of God and the law of Moses are not 2 separate things.

Nehemiah 8:1-18

And all the people gathered themselves together as one man into the street that was before the water gate; and they spake unto Ezra the scribe to bring the book of the law of Moses, which Yahweh had commanded to Israel.

And Ezra the priest brought the law before the congregation both of men and women, and all that could hear with understanding, upon the first day of the seventh month.

And he read therein before the street that was before the water gate from the morning until midday, before the men and the women, and those that could understand; and the ears of all the people were attentive unto the book of the law.

And Ezra the scribe stood upon a pulpit of wood, which they had made for the purpose; and beside him stood Mattithiah, and Shema, and Anaiah, and Urijah, and Hilkiah, and Maaseiah, on his right hand; and on his left hand, Pedaiah, and Mishael, and Malchiah, and Hashum, and Hashbadana, Zechariah, and Meshullam.

And Ezra opened the book in the sight of all the people; (for he was above all the people and when he opened it, all the people stood up: And Ezra blessed Yahweh, the great God.

And all the people answered, Amen, Amen, with lifting up their hands: and they bowed their heads, and worshipped Yahweh with their faces to the ground.

Also Jeshua, and Bani, and Sherebiah, Jamin, Akkub, Shabbethai, Hodijah, Maaseiah, Kelita, Azariah, Jozabad, Hanan, Pelaiah, and the Levites, caused the people to understand the law: and the people stood in their place.

So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading.

And Nehemiah, which is the Tirshatha, and Ezra the priest the scribe, and the Levites that taught the people, said unto all the people, This day is holy unto Yahweh your God; mourn not, nor weep.

For all the people wept, when they heard the words of the law.

Then he said unto them, Go your way, eat the fat, and drink the sweet, and send portions unto them for whom nothing is prepared: for this day is holy unto our Lord: neither be ye sorry; for the joy of Yahweh is your strength.

So the Levites stilled all the people, saying, Hold your peace, for the day is holy; neither be ye grieved.

And all the people went their way to eat, and to drink, and to send portions, and to make great mirth, because they had understood the words that were declared unto them.

And on the second day were gathered together the chief of the fathers of all the people, the priests, and the Levites, unto Ezra the scribe, even to understand the words of the law.

And they found written in the law which Yahweh had commanded by Moses, that the children of Israel should dwell in booths in the feast of the seventh month: And that they should publish and proclaim in all their cities, and in Jerusalem, saying, Go forth unto the mount, and fetch olive branches, and pine branches, and myrtle branches, and palm branches, and branches of thick trees, to make booths, as it is written.

So the people went forth, and brought them, and made themselves booths, every one upon the roof of his house, and in their courts, and in the courts of the house of God, and in the street of the water gate, and in the street of the gate of Ephraim.

And all the congregation of them that were come again out of the captivity made booths, and sat under the booths: for since the days of Jeshua the son of Nun unto that day had not the children of Israel done so. And there was very great gladness. Also day by day, from the first day unto the last day, he read in the book of the law of God. And they kept the feast seven days; and on the eighth day was a solemn assembly, according unto the manner.

the law of Moses = the law of God

1 Chronicles 16:39-40

And Zadok the priest, and his brethren the priests, before the tabernacle of Yahweh in the high place that was at Gibeon, To offer burnt offerings unto Yahweh upon the altar of the burnt offering continually morning and evening, and to do according to all that is written in the law of Yahweh, which he commanded Israel

2 Chronicles 17:9

And they taught in Judah, and had the book of the law of Yahweh with them, and went about throughout all thecities of Judah, and taught the people.

2 Chronicles 34:14

And when they brought out the money that was brought into the house of Yahweh, Hilkiah the priest found a book of the law of Yahweh given by Moses

Nehemiah 9:3

And they stood up in their place, and read in the book of the law of Yahweh their God one fourth part of the day; and another fourth part they confessed, and worshipped Yahweh their God.

Malachi 4:4

Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which I commanded unto him in Horeb for all Israel, with the statutes and judgments.

Luke 2:22-23

And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to Yahweh; (As it is written in the law of Yahweh), Every male that openeth the womb shall be called holy to Yahweh) And to offer a sacrifice according to that which is said in the law of Yahweh), A pair of turtledoves, or two young pigeons.

When Paul says “I am not free from God’s law”, he is referring to the law of Moses, as evidenced above.

He even said he delights in the law of Moses(which is the law of God):

Romans 7:22

For I delight in the law of God after the inward man

and that carnal minds can not submit to the law of Moses(which is the law of God)

Romans 8:7

Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be

if the law of Messiah is the law of God, then the law of Messiah and the law of Moses are the same, because the law of Moses is the law of God.

this would mean that there is another law being discussed, that is not the law of God, Moses & Messiah.

DamianWarS · Mar 19, 2020

Dkh587 said:
I’m asking because you appear to be of the understanding that the law of Moses is not the law of God, and vice versa.

the law of God is the law of Moses. The law of God and the law of Moses are not 2 separate things.

In context they are different. Paul is free from the law... So which law is he free from if not the torah? Rather than pull all sorts of verses in the NT to support your thinking let's make sure first the context can support this. And in the context it cannot God's law is different than the law and Paul is clear with this.

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

Bible Highlighter said:
1 Timothy 1:8 says,

"But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;"
(1 Timothy 1:8).

Why didn't you include the next verse?

9 being aware of this, that law is not laid down for the just

Bible Highlighter said:
However, 1 Timothy 1:8 does not mean we can be justified by the Law of Moses.

"And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses." (Acts of the Apostles 13:39).

What exactly are these things that you could not be justified by the law YHWH gave to Moses?

9 being aware of this, that law is not laid down for the just

Matthew 1
19 1Now Joseph, her husband, being just and not willing to hold her up to infamy, intended covertly to dismiss her.

James 2:21
Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

James 2:24
Ye see then how that by works a man justified, and not by faith only.

Bible Highlighter said:
Neither does 1 Timothy 1:8 mean the whole of the Old Law is still in effect, either.

That's not what Yahshua says.

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

How so?

Well, here are a list of verses
(showing us the Old Law is no more as a package deal or covenant):

"When God speaks of a "new" covenant, it means he has made the first one obsolete. It is now out of date and will soon disappear." (Hebrews 8:13) (NLT).

Yes, we have a new covenant. This verse says nothing about YHWH's Law disappearing. People see what they want to see; even when the text is completely clear.

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

31 Lo, days are coming, an affirmation of Yahweh, And I have made with the house of Israel And with the house of Judah a new covenant, 32 Not like the covenant that I made with their fathers, In the day of My laying hold on their hand, To bring them out of the land of Egypt, In that they made void My covenant, And I ruled over them--an affirmation of Yahweh." 33 For this [is] the covenant that I make, With the house of Israel, after those days, An affirmation of Yahweh, I have given My law (Torah)in their inward part, And on their heart I do write it, And I have been to them for Elohim, And they are to me for a people."

Bible Highlighter said:
”Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.” (Romans 7:4).

Paul speaks of at least 8 types of law in his letter to the Romans.

Legal Terms:

The Law of Faith (Ch 3)
A Different Law (Ch 7)
The Law of My Mind (Ch 7)
The Law of Sin (Sin's Law) (Ch 7)
God's Law (Ch 7)
The Spirit's Law of Life (Ch 8)
The Law of Sin and Death (Ch 8)
The Law of Righteousness (Ch 9)

By Chapter 7 verse 4 he has only covered one, The Law of Faith. I don't think we're supposed to be dead to that one. Let's try another one.

Which one on the list do you suppose he's talking about? Could it be The Law of Sin and Death. That which is the result of disobedience to YHWH's Law?

Bible Highlighter said:
"But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter." (Romans 7:6).

Which law do you think Paul was saying that we are delivered from here?

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

(CLV) Ro 7:12
So that the law, indeed, is holy, and the precept holy and just and good.

(CLV) Ro 7:16
Now if what I am not willing, this I am doing, I am conceding that the law is ideal.

(CLV) Ro 7:22
For I am gratified with the law of God as to the man within,

(CLV) Ro 3:31
Are we, then, nullifying law through faith? May it not be coming to that! Nay, we are sustaining law.

This is a multiple choice question. Pick the one that best supports YHWH's word:

The Law of Faith (Ch 3)
A Different Law (Ch 7)
The Law of My Mind (Ch 7)
The Law of Sin (Sin's Law) (Ch 7)
God's Law (Ch 7)
The Spirit's Law of Life (Ch 8)
The Law of Sin and Death (Ch 8)
The Law of Righteousness (Ch 9)

Bible Highlighter said:
"Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;" (Colossians 2:14).

G1378
δόγμα dógma, dog'-mah; from the base of G1380

Definition of dogma
1a : something held as an established opinion
Definition of DOGMA

Bible Highlighter said:
20 "Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
22 Which all are to perish with the using; ) after the commandments and doctrines of men?
23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body: not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh."
(Colossians 2:20-23).

G1379
δογματίζω dogmatízō, dog-mat-id'-zo; from G1378

G1378
δόγμα dógma, dog'-mah; from the base of G1380

Definition of dogma
1a : something held as an established opinion
Definition of DOGMA

Bible Highlighter said:
“By abolishing in His [own crucified] flesh the enmity [caused by] the Law with its decrees and ordinances [which He annulled]; that He from the two might create in Himself one new man [one new quality of humanity out of the two], so making peace.” (Ephesians 2:15) (AMPC).

Excerpt from: Paul on the Law: Ephesians 2

15 (the enmity in His flesh), nullifying the law

Nullifying the LAW?!?.....

...But Yahshua said...

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

(CLV) Mt 5:19
"Whosoever, then, should be annulling one of the least of these precepts, and should be teaching men thus, the least in the kingdom of the heavens shall he be called. Yet whoever should be doing and teaching them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of the heavens

of precepts in decrees,

Oh! Well I guess I should have read on, before jumping to conclusions.

The law of precepts, "in" decrees...

What's a decree?

Definition of decree
(Entry 1 of 2)
1 : an order usually having the force of law a judicial decree by royal decree
2a : a religious ordinance enacted by council or titular head a papal decree
Definition of DECREE

G1378 δόγμα - Strong's Greek Lexicon Number
δόγμα
that which seems to one, an opinion, dogma
G1378 δόγμα - Strong's Greek Lexicon

Definition of dogma
1a : something held as an established opinion
Definition of DOGMA

Thayer:
1) doctrine, decree, ordinance
G1378 δόγμα - Strong's Greek Lexicon

Definition of doctrine

1a : a principle or position or the body of principles in a branch of knowledge or system of belief : dogma
Definition of DOCTRINE

Oh! Well that's very much different. It's the dogmatic, man made, Pharisaic, laws of the Talmud, that Yashua rebuked, that were done away with.

Hallelu YAH!

that He should be creating the two, in Himself, into one new humanity, making peace;"

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

Bible Highlighter said:
1 Timothy 1:8 says,

"But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;"
(1 Timothy 1:8).

Why didn't you include the next verse?

9 being aware of this, that law is not laid down for the just

Bible Highlighter said:
However, 1 Timothy 1:8 does not mean we can be justified by the Law of Moses.

"And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses." (Acts of the Apostles 13:39).

What exactly are these things that you could not be justified by the law YHWH gave to Moses?

9 being aware of this, that law is not laid down for the just

Matthew 1
19 1Now Joseph, her husband, being just and not willing to hold her up to infamy, intended covertly to dismiss her.

James 2:21
Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

James 2:24
Ye see then how that by works a man justified, and not by faith only.

Bible Highlighter said:
Neither does 1 Timothy 1:8 mean the whole of the Old Law is still in effect, either.

That's not what Yahshua says.

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

How so?

Well, here are a list of verses
(showing us the Old Law is no more as a package deal or covenant):

"When God speaks of a "new" covenant, it means he has made the first one obsolete. It is now out of date and will soon disappear." (Hebrews 8:13) (NLT).

Yes, we have a new covenant. This verse says nothing about YHWH's Law disappearing. People see what they want to see; even when the text is completely clear.

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

31 Lo, days are coming, an affirmation of Yahweh, And I have made with the house of Israel And with the house of Judah a new covenant, 32 Not like the covenant that I made with their fathers, In the day of My laying hold on their hand, To bring them out of the land of Egypt, In that they made void My covenant, And I ruled over them--an affirmation of Yahweh." 33 For this [is] the covenant that I make, With the house of Israel, after those days, An affirmation of Yahweh, I have given My law (Torah)in their inward part, And on their heart I do write it, And I have been to them for Elohim, And they are to me for a people."

Bible Highlighter said:
”Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.” (Romans 7:4).

Paul speaks of at least 8 types of law in his letter to the Romans.

Legal Terms:

The Law of Faith (Ch 3)
A Different Law (Ch 7)
The Law of My Mind (Ch 7)
The Law of Sin (Sin's Law) (Ch 7)
God's Law (Ch 7)
The Spirit's Law of Life (Ch 8)
The Law of Sin and Death (Ch 8)
The Law of Righteousness (Ch 9)

By Chapter 7 verse 4 he has only covered one, The Law of Faith. I don't think we're supposed to be dead to that one. Let's try another one.

Which one on the list do you suppose he's talking about? Could it be The Law of Sin and Death. That which is the result of disobedience to YHWH's Law?

Bible Highlighter said:
"But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter." (Romans 7:6).

Which law do you think Paul was saying that we are delivered from here?

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

(CLV) Ro 7:12
So that the law, indeed, is holy, and the precept holy and just and good.

(CLV) Ro 7:16
Now if what I am not willing, this I am doing, I am conceding that the law is ideal.

(CLV) Ro 7:22
For I am gratified with the law of God as to the man within,

(CLV) Ro 3:31
Are we, then, nullifying law through faith? May it not be coming to that! Nay, we are sustaining law.

This is a multiple choice question. Pick the one that best supports YHWH's word:

The Law of Faith (Ch 3)
A Different Law (Ch 7)
The Law of My Mind (Ch 7)
The Law of Sin (Sin's Law) (Ch 7)
God's Law (Ch 7)
The Spirit's Law of Life (Ch 8)
The Law of Sin and Death (Ch 8)
The Law of Righteousness (Ch 9)

Bible Highlighter said:
"Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;" (Colossians 2:14).

G1378
δόγμα dógma, dog'-mah; from the base of G1380

Definition of dogma
1a : something held as an established opinion
Definition of DOGMA

Bible Highlighter said:
20 "Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
22 Which all are to perish with the using; ) after the commandments and doctrines of men?
23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body: not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh."
(Colossians 2:20-23).

G1379
δογματίζω dogmatízō, dog-mat-id'-zo; from G1378

G1378
δόγμα dógma, dog'-mah; from the base of G1380

Definition of dogma
1a : something held as an established opinion
Definition of DOGMA

Bible Highlighter said:
“By abolishing in His [own crucified] flesh the enmity [caused by] the Law with its decrees and ordinances [which He annulled]; that He from the two might create in Himself one new man [one new quality of humanity out of the two], so making peace.” (Ephesians 2:15) (AMPC).

Excerpt from: Paul on the Law: Ephesians 2

15 (the enmity in His flesh), nullifying the law

Nullifying the LAW?!?.....

...But Yahshua said...

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

(CLV) Mt 5:19
"Whosoever, then, should be annulling one of the least of these precepts, and should be teaching men thus, the least in the kingdom of the heavens shall he be called. Yet whoever should be doing and teaching them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of the heavens

of precepts in decrees,

Oh! Well I guess I should have read on, before jumping to conclusions.

The law of precepts, "in" decrees...

What's a decree?

Definition of decree
(Entry 1 of 2)
1 : an order usually having the force of law a judicial decree by royal decree
2a : a religious ordinance enacted by council or titular head a papal decree
Definition of DECREE

G1378 δόγμα - Strong's Greek Lexicon Number
δόγμα
that which seems to one, an opinion, dogma
G1378 δόγμα - Strong's Greek Lexicon

Definition of dogma
1a : something held as an established opinion
Definition of DOGMA

Thayer:
1) doctrine, decree, ordinance
G1378 δόγμα - Strong's Greek Lexicon

Definition of doctrine

1a : a principle or position or the body of principles in a branch of knowledge or system of belief : dogma
Definition of DOCTRINE

Oh! Well that's very much different. It's the dogmatic, man made, Pharisaic, laws of the Talmud, that Yashua rebuked, that were done away with.

Hallelu YAH!

that He should be creating the two, in Himself, into one new humanity, making peace;"

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

Bible Highlighter said:
"The old [former] rule [commandment; regulation] is now set aside [nullified; abolished], because it was weak and useless [ineffective]." (Hebrews 7:18) (EXB).

Let's look at a literal translation of this verse, in context:

Romans 7 (CLV)

15 And it is still more superabundantly sure, if a different priest is rising according to the likeness of Melchizedek,

This is about Messiah's Priesthood. Now we have context.

16 Who has not come to be according to the law of a fleshy precept, but according to the power of an indissoluble life."

He did not come to be High Priest according to the law regarding the Levitical Priesthood. Precept (singular) A single instruction. BTW the Levitical Priesthood will be making sacrifices when the Israel is back in the land, under Yahshua, for the Millennial Reign. That covenant still stands.

17 For He is attesting that "Thou art a priest for the eon according to the order of Melchizedek, 18 For, indeed, there is coming to be a repudiation of the preceding precept

Again, a single instruction. Yahshua is not on Earth. There was a transference of the High Priesthood to the heavens.

because it is weak and without benefit;"

Earthly priest die' they sin; they have to make sacrifices for themselves. It's all right here in this letter.

19 for the law perfects nothing, yet it is the superinduction

Big word! What does it mean?

Definition of superinduce
1 : to introduce as an addition over or above something already existing
Definition of SUPERINDUCE

of a better expectation,

The law perfects nothing yet it is an addition

through which we are drawing near to God."

Well, I could take that a lot of ways; but certainly not in a way that would make me want to abolish the law.

Hebrews was written as a letter; and it should be read as such. Just a few verses down, in the next chapter, we have this:

(CLV) Hb 8:10
"For this is the covenant which I shall be covenanting with the house of Israel after those days," the Lord is saying: "Imparting My laws to their comprehension, On their hearts, also, shall I be inscribing them, And I shall be to them for a God, And they shall be to Me for a people.

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

(CLV) Mt 5:19
"Whosoever, then, should be annulling one of the least of these precepts, and should be teaching men thus, the least in the kingdom of the heavens shall he be called. Yet whoever should be doing and teaching them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of the heavens

Bible Highlighter said:
9 “Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;
10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.” (Hebrews 9:9-10).

This whole chapter is about the Priesthood. We have a new High Priest who atones for transgression of the law.

Bible Highlighter said:
16 “For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.” (Hebrews 9:16-17).

(CLV) Hb 9:16
For where there is a covenant, it is necessary to bring in the death of the covenant victim,

(CLV) Hb 9:17
for a covenant is confirmed over the dead, since it is not availing at any time when the covenant victim is living.

Do you know what these verses mean? This doesn't help you case for abolishing the law.

Yikes!

(CLV) Jer 34:18
I will make the men, the trespassers of My covenant, who do not carry out the words of the covenant which they contracted before Me, like the calf which they cut in two and passed between its sundered parts,

This is how Hebrews made covenants. The would cut an animal in half; and both men would walk between the divided parts. If one man broke the covenant; then the other man could do to him what was done to the animal.

Bible Highlighter said:
”And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament…” (Hebrews 9:15).

Ummm....Even if Yahshua is the covenant victim; it's still not helping your case.

Bible Highlighter said:
27 “And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.” (Matthew 26:27-28).

re·mis·sion
1. the cancellation of a debt, charge, or penalty:

....not remission of obedience to YHWH's law!

(CLV) Tit 2:14
Who gives Himself for us, that He should be redeeming us from all lawlessness and be cleansing for Himself a people to be about Him, zealous for ideal acts.

Bible Highlighter said:
50 “Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; “ (Matthew 27:20-51).

YHWH has left the building.

Bible Highlighter said:
8 “Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;
9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.” (Hebrews 10:8-9).

Why do you infer that he took away the law?

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

(CLV) Mt 5:19
"Whosoever, then, should be annulling one of the least of these precepts, and should be teaching men thus, the least in the kingdom of the heavens shall he be called. Yet whoever should be doing and teaching them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of the heavens

He took away the sacrifices of the Levitical High Priesthood. YHWH never had pleasure in the offerings. He wanted us to be righteous. You are to follow Yahshua's example. You are now to be the sacrifice.

(CLV) Ro 12:1
I am entreating you, then, brethren, by the pities of God, to present your bodies a sacrifice, living, holy, well pleasing to God, your logical divine service,

Bible Highlighter said:
“And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.” (Acts of the Apostles 15:1).

Then Paul circumcised Timothy.

Bible Highlighter said:
“But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.” (Acts of the Apostles 15:5).

Then Paul circumcised Timothy.

Bible Highlighter said:
“Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment” (Acts of the Apostles 15:24).

Then Paul circumcised Timothy

Bible Highlighter said:
28 "For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;

29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well." (Acts of the Apostles 15:28-29).

These were the very basics for those just coming to faith. Surely you don't believe that as a believer that you can be a lying murderous drunkard.

Do you?

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

Bible Highlighter said:
7 "But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.
11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious." (2 Corinthians 3:7-11).

Paul on the Law: 2 Corinthians 3

In context:

Continued from: Paul on the Law: Ephesians 2

2 Corinthians 3 (CLV)
1 Are we beginning again to commend ourselves? Or need we not, even as some, commendatory letters to you or from you? 2 You are our letter, engraven in our hearts, known and read by all men,

Interesting the letter isn't a thing; it's a who. Who might that be?

Does the last verse of the previous chapter give us a clue?

17 For we are not as the majority, who are peddling the word of God, but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God in Christ, are we speaking."

3 for you are manifesting a letter of Christ, dispensed by us, and engraven, not with ink, but with the spirit of the living God, not on stone tablets, but on the fleshy tablets of the heart."

A letter of Messiah written in the Ruach of YHWH, engraved on our hearts. That's quite a letter!

(CLV) Jer 31:31
Behold, the days are coming, averring is Yahweh, when I will contract a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah.

(CLV) Jer 31:32
Not like the covenant which I contracted with their fathers in the day I held fast- into their hand to bring them forth from the land of Egypt, which covenant of Mine they themselves annulled while I was Possessor over them, averring is Yahweh.

(CLV) Jer 31:33
For this is the covenant which I shall contract with the house of Israel after those days, averring is Yahweh: I will put My law within them, And I shall write it on their heart; I will become their Elohim, And they shall become My people.

(CLV) Ro 2:15
who are displaying the action of the law written in their hearts, their conscience testifying together and their reckonings between one another, accusing or defending them,

4 Now such is the confidence we have through Christ toward God 5 (not that we are competent of ourselves, to reckon anything as of ourselves, but our competency is of God),

Those who walk in the ways of YHWH, do it not of their own power; but by YHWH's power through Messiah.

6 Who also makes us competent dispensers of a new covenant, not of the letter, but of the spirit,

The Ruach Ha'Kodesh reminds you of YHWH's Law, when your eyes aren't on it.

Well either that, or we're abolishing the law of YHWH, written in the Ruach of YHWH, engraved on our hearts.

Let's see what else Paul has to say about YHWH's law:

(CLV) Ac 24:14
"Yet I am avowing this to you, that, according to the way which they are terming a sect, thus am I offering divine service to the hereditary God, believing all that is written, according to the law and in the prophets,

(CLV) Ac 25:8
Paul defending that "Neither against the law of the Jews, nor against the sanctuary, nor against Caesar did I any sin."

(CLV) Ro 2:12
for whoever sinned without law, without law also shall perish, and whoever sinned in law, through law will be judged.

(CLV) Ro 3:31
Are we, then, nullifying law through faith? May it not be coming to that! Nay, we are sustaining law.

(CLV) Ro 7:12
So that the law, indeed, is holy, and the precept holy and just and good.

(CLV) Ro 7:22
For I am gratified with the law of God as to the man within,

I'll just go with my first intuition.

for the letter is killing, yet the spirit is vivifying." 7 (Now if the dispensation of death, by letters chiseled in stone,

Obviously this is speaking of YHWH's Law. Why does Paul call it the 'dispensation of death'? When we break the law, the wages are death.
Is the law death? No; death is the result of disobedience to YHWH.

Those who are led by YHWH's Ruach, are obedient to the Torah. The Spirit's Law of Life frees them from disobedience to the Torah, The law of Sin and Death.

See: Paul on the Law: Romans Chapter 8

Those who die to sin; are reborn in the Ruach.

came in glory, so that the sons of Israel were not able to look intently into the face of Moses, because of the glory of his face, which was being nullified, 8 how shall not rather the dispensation of the spirit be in glory?

Why do you suppose that the glory in the face of Moses was being nullified? Moses gained that glory in the presence of YHWH's righteous glory. Moses was the mediator between YHWH and Israel; but Israel didn't want to see YHWH's glory in Moses; any more than they had a will to obey YHWH's law.

YHWH Ruach gives us the will to obedience to YHWH's Torah.

Hallelu YAH!

9 For if in the dispensation of condemnation is glory,

YHWH's law condemns those who don't keep YHWH's law.

When we turn from sin in faith; and we are washed clean through YHWH's grace; glory be to YHWH!

much rather the dispensation of righteousness is exceeding in glory."

What is righteousness?

Definition of righteous
1 : acting in accord with divine or moral law : free from guilt or sin
Definition of RIGHTEOUS

Righteousness is obedience to YHWH's law.

10 For that also which has been glorified has not been glorified in this particular, on account of the glory transcendent." 11 For if that which is being nullified was nullified through glory, much rather that which is remaining, remains in glory."

What was nullified? It was YHWH's glory; as Israel didn't take their marriage vow seriously. They turned away from their husband in disobedience to his authority. They refused to glorify his righteousness.

Was YHWH's righteousness nullified?

Of course not!

12 Having, then, such an expectation, we are using much boldness, 13 and are not even as Moses. He placed a covering over his face, so that the sons of Israel were not to look intently to the consummation of that which is being nullified."

Israel was blotting out their marriage covenenant with YHWH, even as it began. They were a rebellious wife.

They didn't want to be free of sin. They wanted to rebel in their own wicked ways.

14 But their apprehensions were calloused, for until this very day the same covering is remaining at the reading of the old covenant, not being uncovered."

They didn't want to hear his Torah, anymore than they could bear to see the light of his glory.

15 for only in Christ is it being nullified.

YHWH writes his law on our hearts in Yahshua. You can't just turn your eyes away, or put your fingers in your ears, as the Ruach Ha'Kodesh speaks what YHWH has planted at your core. If you walk with Yahshua; your wicked ways are behind you. The new covenant is in Messiah

But till today, if ever the reading of Moses should be reached, a covering is lying on their heart."

Israel didn't want to hear the Torah. It wasn't in their hearts. They didn't take their marriage vow seriously.

16 Yet if ever it should reach a turning back to the Lord, the covering is taken from about it.)"

Love of YHWH is keeping his Torah.

(CLV) 1Jn 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we may be keeping His precepts. And His precepts are not heavy,

17 Now the Lord is the spirit; yet where the spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom."

Not the bondage of sin.

What is sin?

(CLV) 1Jn 3:4
Everyone who is doing sin is doing lawlessness also, and sin is lawlessness.

(CLV) Ps 119:44
I shall indeed keep your law continually, For the eon and further.

(CLV) Ps 119:45
I shall indeed walk in wideness, (at liberty) For I have sought after Your precepts.

18 Now we all, with uncovered face, mirroring the Lord's glory, are being transformed into the same image, from glory to glory, even as from the Lord, the spirit."

If we are YHWH's children; people should be able to see the Father in us. We should be a reflection of his glory.

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

Bible Highlighter said:
The way we can fulfill the Old Law is by putting into action with a New Covenant teaching:

"For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." (Galatians 5:14).

In context:

Paul on the Law: Galatians 5

Continued from: Paul on the Law: Galatians 4

Galatians 5 (CLV)
1 For freedom Christ frees us! Stand firm, then, and be not again enthralled with the yoke of slavery."

What is Messiah freeing us from? Is it YHWH's Law?

Where in scripture can we find that YHWH's law is slavery?

(CLV) Ja 1:25
Now he who peers into the perfect law, that of freedom, and abides, not becoming a forgetful listener, but a doer of the work, this one will be happy in his doing.

That doesn't sound like slavery.

What does Paul say about the law?

(CLV) Ro 7:12
So that the law, indeed, is holy, and the precept holy and just and good.

What might this bondage be?

Let's look at this letter in context. After all, it was written to be read as a letter, not a sound byte.

CLV) Ga 2:4
Yet, it was because of the false brethren who were smuggled in, whoa came in by the way to spy out our freedom which we have in Christ Jesus, that they shall be enslaving us-

Ahh! I see. We're back to the Pharisees, and the traditions of men.
Paul on the Law: Galatians 2

(CLV) Ga 4:3
Thus we also, when we were minors, were enslaved under the elements of the world.Paul on the Law: Galatians 4

Ah yes, and the elements of the world. That's in opposition to the Law of YHWH
The word "again" in that verse, settles it. The Galatians weren't Torah observant before Paul, so they couldn't return to the Torah, if they didn't come from it.

Clearly again, Paul did not abolish YHWH's Law.

2 Lo! I, Paul, am saying to you that if you should be circumcising, Christ will benefit you nothing." 3 Now I am attesting again to every man who is circumcising, that he is a debtor to do the whole law."

Again, in context to the Pharisees. Paul is reminding the Galatians that if you are to be saved by the law; you must keep all of the law perfectly.

4 Exempted from Christ were you who are being justified in law. You fall out of grace.

Is Paul saying that by keeping YHWH's law through faith that we fall from grace? Of course not!

(CLV) Ro 3:31
Are we, then, nullifying law through faith? May it not be coming to that! Nay, we are sustaining law.

5 For we, in spirit, are awaiting the expectation of righteousness by faith."

What is righteousness?

Definition of righteous
1 : acting in accord with divine or moral law
Definition of RIGHTEOUS

6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision is availing anything, nor uncircumcision, but faith, operating through love."

(CLV) Jn 14:24
He who is not loving Me, is not keeping My words. And the word which you are hearing is not Mine, but the Father's Who sends Me.

(CLV) Jn 15:10
If ever you should be keeping My precepts, you will be remaining in My love, according as I have kept the precepts of My Father and am remaining in His love.

(CLV) 1Jn 2:5
Yet whoever may be keeping His word, truly in this one the love of God is perfected. In this we know that we are in Him:

(CLV) 1Jn 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we may be keeping His precepts. And His precepts are not heavy,

(CLV) 2Jn 1:6
And this is love, that we may be walking according to His precepts. This is the precept, according as you hear from the beginning, that you may be walking in it;

7 You raced ideally! Who hinders you not to be persuaded by the truth? 8 This persuasion is not of Him Who is calling you. 9 A little leaven is leavening the whole kneading. 10 I have confidence in you in the Lord that in nothing you will be disposed otherwise. Now he who is disturbing you shall be bearing his judgment, whosoever he may be." 11 Now I, brethren, if I am still heralding circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? Consequently the snare of the cross of Christ has been nullified." 12 Would that those who are raising you to insurrection struck themselves off also! 13 For you were called for freedom, brethren, only use not the freedom for an incentive to the flesh, but through love be slaving for one another." 14 For the entire law is fulfilled in one word, in this: "You shall love your associate as yourself." 15 Now if you are biting and devouring one another, beware that you may not be consumed by one another." 16 Now I am saying, Walk in spirit, and you should under no circumstances be consummating the lust of the flesh." 17 For the flesh is lusting against the spirit, yet the spirit against the flesh. Now these are opposing one another, lest you should be doing whatever you may want."

Lawlessness

Is the Spirit of YHWH in opposition to the Law of YHWH?

Of course not.

Verse 5 just stated that in the spirit we are awaiting righteousness, that is obedience to the law.

(CLV) Ro 7:25
I thank God, through Jesus Christ, our Lord. Consequently, then, I myself, with the mind, indeed, am slaving for God's law, yet with the flesh for Sin's law.

18 Now, if you are led by spirit, you are not still under law."

(CLV) Ro 7:25
I thank God, through Jesus Christ, our Lord. Consequently, then, I myself, with the mind, indeed, am slaving for God's law, yet with the flesh for Sin's law.

Which law do you suppose you are not under, when led by the Ruach HaKodesh?

(CLV) Ezk 36:26
I will give you a new heart, And a new spirit will I bestow within you, And I will take away the heart of stone from your flesh, And I will give you a heart of flesh.

(CLV) Ezk 36:27
My spirit shall I bestow within you, And I will make it that you shall walk in My statutes and observe My ordinances, And you will obey them.

If you are of the spirit you aren't under the law; as you aren't under sin. You're obedient to the law.

This was covered Here: Paul on the Law: Galatians 4

Romans 7
14 For we are aware that the law is spiritual, yet I am fleshly, having been disposed of under Sin." 15 For what I am effecting I know not, for not what I will, this I am putting into practice, but what I am hating, this I am doing." 16 Now if what I am not willing, this I am doing, I am conceding that the law is ideal."

19 Now apparent are the works of the flesh, which are adultery, prostitution, uncleanness, wantonness, 20 idolatry, enchantment, enmities, strife, jealousies, furies, factions, dissensions, sects, 21 envies, murders, drunkennesses, revelries, and the like of these, which, I am predicting to you, according as I predicted also, that those committing such things shall not be enjoying the allotment of the kingdom of God."

Because they continued breaking YHWH's law; therefore they were under the law. They were slaves of sin. They were in the flesh.

22 Now the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 meekness, self-control: against such things there is no law." 24 Now those of Christ Jesus crucify the flesh together with its passions, and lusts." 25 If we may be living in spirit, in spirit we may be observing the elements also." 26 We may not become vainglorious, challenging one another, envying another."

Hallelu YAH!

Paul on the Law: Galatians 6

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

Bible Highlighter said:
"That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit." (Romans 8:4).

In context:

Paul on the Law: Romans Chapter 8

Continued from: Romans Chapter 7

Romans 8 (CLV)
1 Nothing, consequently, is now condemnation to those in Christ Jesus. Not according to flesh are they walking, but according to spirit, 2 for the spirit's law of life in Christ Jesus frees you from the law of sin and death.

Notice the word consequently. This passage is a conclusion, predicated on the scripture that we have read thus far.

I hadn't noticed it, until I started dissecting this book for understanding; but Paul has a very interesting way of making his points. Up until now he has, for the most part, been defining his point. He lays out the definitions, without laying out the terms first. It has taken him seven preceding chapters, to bring us to the terms of his point.

Paul has revealed two more laws in this chapter.

There are two laws here. Some see the word law, in this letter; and are indoctrinated to believe that it could mean only one thing; that the Torah is abolished. One can't even understand the writings of Paul without understanding the Torah. He said so himself in chapter seven.

Following one of these laws leads to life.

Following the other leads to death.

For those who misunderstand Paul in saying that were not under THE law; which of these two laws do you suppose is according to YHWH's will?

You will choose one. That is the only choice you have. We are either under one law or another. We are all under A law.

Which of these two laws would you suppose is in line with obedience to YHWH's law (Torah) which Yahshua followed; as he told us to follow his example?

3 For what was impossible to the law, in which it was infirm through the flesh, did God, sending His own Son in the likeness of sin's flesh and concerning sin, He condemns sin in the flesh,

The Law of Sin and Death

4 that the just requirement of the law may be fulfilled in us, who are not walking in accord with flesh, but in accord with spirit."

The Law of Faith
The Law of God (Torah)
The Spirit's Law of Life

5 For those who are in accord with flesh are disposed to that which is of the flesh,

The Law of Sin and Death

yet those who are in accord with spirit to that which is of the spirit."

The Law of Faith
The Law of God (Torah)
The Spirit's Law of Life

6 For the disposition of the flesh is death,

The Law of Sin and Death

yet the disposition of the spirit is life and peace,

The Law of Faith
The Law of God (Torah)
The Spirit's Law of Life

7 because the disposition of the flesh is enmity to God, for it is not subject to the law of God, for neither is it able." 8 Now those who are in flesh are not able to please God.

The Law of Sin and Death

If you are in the flesh; you are hostile to YHWH. If you are in the flesh; you will not obey his Torah; nor are you able. The Ruach Ha'Kodesh leads us out of the flesh, through circumcision of the heart.

9 Yet you are not in flesh, but in spirit, if so be that God's spirit is making its home in you.

The Law of Faith
The Law of God (Torah)
The Spirit's Law of Life

Now if anyone has not Christ's spirit, this one is not His."

The Law of Sin and Death

10 Now if Christ is in you, the body, indeed, is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is life because of righteousness."

What is Righteousness?

Definition of righteous
1 : acting in accord with divine or moral law
Definition of RIGHTEOUS

The Law of Faith
The Law of God (Torah)
The Spirit's Law of Life

11 Now if the spirit of Him Who rouses Jesus from among the dead is making its home in you, He Who rouses Christ Jesus from among the dead will also be vivifying your mortal bodies because of His spirit making its home in you."

The Law of Faith
The Law of God (Torah)
The Spirit's Law of Life

12 Consequently, then, brethren, debtors are we, not to the flesh, to be living in accord with flesh, 13 for if you are living in accord with flesh, you are about to be dying.

The Law of Sin and Death

Yet if, in spirit, you are putting the practices of the body to death, you will be living." 14 For whoever are being led by God's spirit, these are sons of God." 15 For you did not get slavery's spirit to fear again, but you got the spirit of sonship, in which we are crying, "Abba, Father!" 16 The spirit itself is testifying together with our spirit that we are children of God. 17 Yet if children, enjoyers also of an allotment, enjoyers, indeed, of an allotment from God, yet joint enjoyers of Christ's allotment, if so be that we are suffering together, that we should be glorified together also." 18 For I am reckoning that the sufferings of the current era do not deserve the glory about to be revealed for us. 19 For the premonition of the creation is awaiting the unveiling of the sons of God.

The Law of Faith
The Law of God (Torah)
The Spirit's Law of Life

20 For to vanity was the creation subjected, not voluntarily, but because of Him Who subjects it, in expectation"

The Law of Sin and Death

21 that the creation itself, also, shall be freed from the slavery of corruption into the glorious freedom of the children of God." 22 For we are aware that the entire creation is groaning and travailing together until now. 23 Yet not only so, but we ourselves also, who have the firstfruit of the spirit, we ourselves also, are groaning in ourselves, awaiting the sonship, the deliverance of our body." 24 For to expectation were we saved. Now expectation, being observed, is not expectation, for what anyone is observing, why is he expecting it also? 25 Now, if we are expecting what we are not observing, we are awaiting it with endurance." 26 Now, similarly, the spirit also is aiding our infirmity, for what we should be praying for, to accord with what must be, we are not aware, but the spirit itself is pleading for us with inarticulate groanings." 27 Now He Who is searching the hearts is aware what is the disposition of the spirit, for in accord with God is it pleading for the saints." 28 Now we are aware that God is working all together for the good of those who are loving God, who are called according to the purpose" 29 that, whom He foreknew, He designates beforehand, also, to be conformed to the image of His Son, for Him to be Firstborn among many brethren." 30 Now whom He designates beforehand, these He calls also, and whom He calls, these He justifies also; now whom He justifies, these He glorifies also." 31 What then, shall we declare to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? 32 Surely, He Who spares not His own Son, but gives Him up for us all, how shall He not, together with Him, also, be graciously granting us all? 33 Who will be indicting God's chosen ones? God, the Justifier? 34 Who is the Condemner? Christ Jesus, the One dying, yet rather being roused, Who is also at God's right hand, Who is pleading also for our sakes? 35 What shall be separating us from the love of God in Christ Jesus? Affliction, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword? 36 According as it is written that "On Thy account we are being put to death the whole day, We are reckoned as sheep for slaughter." 37 Nay! in all these we are more than conquering through Him Who loves us. 38 For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor messengers, nor sovereignties, nor the present, nor what is impending, nor powers, 39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus, our Lord."

The Law of Faith
The Law of God (Torah)
The Spirit's Law of Life

Hallelu YAH!

Legal Terms:

The Law of Faith (Ch 3)
A Different Law (Ch 7)
The Law of My Mind (Ch 7)
The Law of Sin (Sin's Law) (Ch 7)
God's Law (Ch 7)
The Spirit's Law of Life (Ch 8)
The Law of Sin and Death (Ch 8)

Roman Chapter 9

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

DamianWarS said:
In context they are different. Paul is free from the law... So which law is he free from if not the torah? Rather than pull all sorts of verses in the NT to support your thinking let's make sure first the context can support this. And in the context it cannot God's law is different than the law and Paul is clear with this.

Paul mentions at least 8 different categories of law, in his letter to the Romans alone. Which one, if any, of these is Paul referring to?

The Law of Faith (Ch 3)
A Different Law (Ch 7)
The Law of My Mind (Ch 7)
The Law of Sin (Sin's Law) (Ch 7)
God's Law (Ch 7)
The Spirit's Law of Life (Ch 8)
The Law of Sin and Death (Ch 8)
The Law of Righteousness (Ch 9)

It's a multiple choice question.

Here are some hints:

(CLV) Ac 24:14
"Yet I am avowing this to you, that, according to the way which they are terming a sect, thus am I offering divine service to the hereditary God, believing all that is written, according to the law and in the prophets,

(CLV) Ac 25:8
Paul defending that "Neither against the law of the Jews, nor against the sanctuary, nor against Caesar did I any sin."

(CLV) Ro 2:12
for whoever sinned without law, without law also shall perish, and whoever sinned in law, through law will be judged.

(CLV) Ro 3:31
Are we, then, nullifying law through faith? May it not be coming to that! Nay, we are sustaining law.

(CLV) Ro 7:12
So that the law, indeed, is holy, and the precept holy and just and good.

(CLV) Ro 7:16
Now if what I am not willing, this I am doing, I am conceding that the law is ideal.

(CLV) Ro 7:22
For I am gratified with the law of God as to the man within,

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

DamianWarS said:
1 Cor 9:20

Which of Paul's many categories of law, do you suppose he is referring to in that verse.

Here's the very next verse:

(CLV) 1Co 9:21
to those without law as without law (not being without God's law, but legally Christ's), that I should be gaining those without law.

OK, so he's not talking about not being under the Torah; so which one of Paul's many categories of law?

Here are 8 of them from his letter to the Roman's alone.

The Law of Faith (Ch 3)
A Different Law (Ch 7)
The Law of My Mind (Ch 7)
The Law of Sin (Sin's Law) (Ch 7)
God's Law (Ch 7)
The Spirit's Law of Life (Ch 8)
The Law of Sin and Death (Ch 8)
The Law of Righteousness (Ch 9)

Is it one of these that Paul isn't under? Maybe A Different law?

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

Need answers said:
I agree there is only one Church. I specified Gentile to highlight that these are gentiles not Jews, i then referenced Acts 15 which discusses gentiles and the Torah.

The New Covenant is with Israel. Yahshua was commissioned only for the lost sheep of the House of Israel.

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

JackRT said:
This has absolutely nothing to do with "animal husbandry" which as to do with the selective breeding of animals.

an·i·mal hus·band·ry
/ˈanəməl ˈhəzbəndrē/
noun

1. the science of breeding and caring for farm animals.

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

Bible Highlighter said:
I believe we are primarily under New Covenant Law, and not the Old Covenant Law. Meaning we follow primarily those commands that come from Jesus and His followers. We do not look to the Old Law as a means to obey God (because it is a contract that is no longer in effect as a whole), but that does not mean there are not good things within the Old Law that can be used (or obeyed) lawfully.

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

Need answers · Mar 20, 2020

HARK! said:
The New Covenant is with Israel. Yahshua was commissioned only for the lost sheep of the House of Israel.

John 10:16 And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd.

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

Need answers said:
John 10:16 And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd.

What fold would this be?

(CLV) Jn 10:19
A schism came again among the Jews because of these words.

He was talking to the Judaeans. Remember, Israel had been carried of into captivity.

DamianWarS · Mar 20, 2020

HARK! said:
Paul mentions at least 8 different categories of law, in his letter to the Romans alone. Which one, if any, of these is Paul referring to?

The Law of Faith (Ch 3)
A Different Law (Ch 7)
The Law of My Mind (Ch 7)
The Law of Sin (Sin's Law) (Ch 7)
God's Law (Ch 7)
The Spirit's Law of Life (Ch 8)
The Law of Sin and Death (Ch 8)
The Law of Righteousness (Ch 9)

It's a multiple choice question.

Here are some hints:

(CLV) Ac 24:14
"Yet I am avowing this to you, that, according to the way which they are terming a sect, thus am I offering divine service to the hereditary God, believing all that is written, according to the law and in the prophets,

(CLV) Ac 25:8
Paul defending that "Neither against the law of the Jews, nor against the sanctuary, nor against Caesar did I any sin."

(CLV) Ro 2:12
for whoever sinned without law, without law also shall perish, and whoever sinned in law, through law will be judged.

(CLV) Ro 3:31
Are we, then, nullifying law through faith? May it not be coming to that! Nay, we are sustaining law.

(CLV) Ro 7:12
So that the law, indeed, is holy, and the precept holy and just and good.

(CLV) Ro 7:16
Now if what I am not willing, this I am doing, I am conceding that the law is ideal.

(CLV) Ro 7:22
For I am gratified with the law of God as to the man within,

Right... but the context is 1 Cor 9

DamianWarS · Mar 20, 2020

HARK! said:
Which of Paul's many categories of law, do you suppose he is referring to in that verse.

Here's the very next verse:

(CLV) 1Co 9:21
to those without law as without law (not being without God's law, but legally Christ's), that I should be gaining those without law.

OK, so he's not talking about not being under the Torah; so which one of Paul's many categories of law?

Here are 8 of them from his letter to the Roman's alone.

The Law of Faith (Ch 3)
A Different Law (Ch 7)
The Law of My Mind (Ch 7)
The Law of Sin (Sin's Law) (Ch 7)
God's Law (Ch 7)
The Spirit's Law of Life (Ch 8)
The Law of Sin and Death (Ch 8)
The Law of Righteousness (Ch 9)

Is it one of these that Paul isn't under? Maybe A Different law?

No need to guess, he tells us the category, it's Christ law. But at least I'm glad you agree in this context God's law is not Torah.

HARK! · Mar 20, 2020

DamianWarS said:
But at least I'm glad you agree in this context God's law is not Torah.

Nonsense.

DamianWarS said:
No need to guess, he tells us the category, it's Christ law. But at least I'm glad you agree in this context God's law is not Torah.

Paul says very specifically That he is not without God's law, (Torah) He goes on to say that he legally belongs to Messiah; I infer as bride of Messiah.

PASSOVER
“And this day shall be unto youfor a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD {Yahweh} throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance FOREVER.” (Exodus 12:14)

UNLEAVENED BREAD
“And ye shall observe the feast of unleavened bread; for in this selfsame day have I brought your armies out of the land of Egypt: therefore shall ye observe this day in your generations by an ordinance FOREVER.” (Exodus 12:17)

SHAVUOT (Feast of Weeks)
“And ye shall proclaim on the selfsame day, that it may be an holy convocation unto you: ye shall do no servile work therein: it shall be a statute FOREVER in all your dwellings throughout your generations.” (Leviticus 23:21)

YOM KIPPUR
Ye shall do no manner of work: it shall be a statute FOREVER throughout your generations in all your dwellings.

FEAST OF TABERNACLES (Booths / Sukkot)
And ye shall keep it a feast unto YHWH seven days in the year. It shall be a statute FOREVER in your generations: ye shall celebrate it in the seventh month.(Leviticus 23:41)

Numerous New Testament examples show where people were intending to keep the Feasts, were keeping them, and would keep them again the in Kingdom. Those passages include: Luke 2:42; John 5:1; 7:2, 10, 14; 12:20; Matthew 26:2, 17, 29; Acts 18:21; and 1Corinthians 5:8.

Yahshua himself kept the feasts as he calls us to follow his example.

May each of us be like the Apostle Paul when he said clearly and with total resolve, "I must by all means keep this Feast!"

(CLV) Re 12:17
And the dragon is angry with the woman, and came away to do battle with the rest of her seed, who are keeping the precepts of God and who have the testimony of Jesus.

(CLV) Re 14:12
Here is the endurance of the saints, who are keeping the precepts of God and the faith of Jesus."

(CLV) Isa 2:2
And it will come to pass in the latter days, The Mount of the House of Yahweh shall be established on the summit of the mountains, And it shall be lifted up above the hills, And all the nations will stream unto it.

(CLV) Isa 2:3
Many peoples will come and say: Come, and let us ascend to the Mount of Yahweh, To the house of the Elohim of Jacob; And He shall direct us out of His ways, So that we may indeed walk in His paths. For from Zion shall go forth the law, And the word of Yahweh from Jerusalem.

Paul Enforces Animal Husbandry Law

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Follower of Isa Al Masih

שמע

שמע

שמע

שמע

שמע

שמע

שמע

שמע

שמע

שמע

שמע

Well-Known Member

שמע

Follower of Isa Al Masih

Follower of Isa Al Masih

שמע

Similar threads