LDS How many negative charges has been made about JS character in LDS History? Just, curious.

Jamesone5

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I suspect his foes got what they deserved.
You suspect---another false "I hope this happens"?

And while I do not declare myself an actual foe of Joseph Smith---I believe he is a false prophet who has deluded millions. And I will take that belief to my death.

Something going to happen to me--in your estimation?
 
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He is the way

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What was that?
(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 12:14)

14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
(New Testament | Revelation 21:7 - 8)

7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
 
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Jamesone5

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(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 12:14)

14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
(New Testament | Revelation 21:7 - 8)

7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Another thing you quote and do not understand
7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son

I though according to Mormon construst we were already sons and daughters of God----not shall be a son.

So are you relegating me to the lake of fire in the End, because I say Joseph Smith is a false prophet?
 
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He is the way

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Another thing you quote and do not understand
7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son

I though according to Mormon construst we were already sons and daughters of God----not shall be a son.

So are you relegating me to the lake of fire in the End, because I say Joseph Smith is a false prophet?
(New Testament | Hebrews 12:6 - 9)

6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
 
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Jamesone5

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(New Testament | Hebrews 12:6 - 9)

6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

We have been over this before

8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons

These NOT SONS, who is their Father?

And come now--you want to say it. You think I am relegated to the Lake of Fire because I do NOT accept Joseph Smith and actually view him as a false prophet.
 
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mmksparbud

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(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 12:14)

14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
(New Testament | Revelation 21:7 - 8)

7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Only if they did not repent of murdering him. Otherwise, the future of a false prophet is the same as you quoted.
 
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He is the way

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We have been over this before

8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons

These NOT SONS, who is their Father?
(New Testament | John 8:42 - 45)

42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

(New Testament | John 14:15)

15 ¶ If ye love me, keep my commandments.
 
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Jamesone5

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(New Testament | John 8:42 - 45)

42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

(New Testament | John 14:15)

15 ¶ If ye love me, keep my commandments.

So I see, the Mormon construct is false about God being our literal Father. The Creation account is right after all.

And once again you posted the verses about being cast into the lake of fire. You saying I am going there because I say Joseph Smith is one of these?

Matthew 24:11
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
 
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So I see, the Mormon construct is false about God being our literal Father. The Creation account is right after all.

And once again you posted the verses about being cast into the lake of fire. You saying I am going there because I say Joseph Smith is one of these?

Matthew 24:11
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
You said: "So I see, the Mormon construct is false about God being our literal Father. The Creation account is right after all."

This is a misunderstanding of the scriptures I posted, God is the FATHER of spirits. There are several scriptures exclaiming that God is our Father. It is through disobedience that that we lose that designation.
 
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Jamesone5

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You said: "So I see, the Mormon construct is false about God being our literal Father. The Creation account is right after all."

This is a misunderstanding of the scriptures I posted, God is the FATHER of spirits. There are several scriptures exclaiming that God is our Father. It is through disobedience that that we lose that designation.

Lose the designation? you are making things up.

Either God is our Father OR He is not and created us. He certainly did not cram our spirit into our body.

Once again---- "Am I destined to go to the lake of fire because I reject JS or not?"
You certainly are not the first Mormon that insulated what they think befalls me after I left your Church.
 
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He is the way

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Lose the designation? you are making things up.

Either God is our Father OR He is not and created us

Once again---- "Am I destined to go to the lake of fire because I reject JS or not?"
God is the Father of spirits:

(New Testament | Hebrews 12:6 - 9)

6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
As for your rejecting Joseph Smith as a prophet of God, I am not your judge. God has given all judgement to His Son Jesus Christ:

(New Testament | John 5:22 - 23)

22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
 
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Jamesone5

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God is the Father of spirits:

(New Testament | Hebrews 12:6 - 9)

6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
As for your rejecting Joseph Smith as a prophet of God, I am not your judge. God has given all judgement to His Son Jesus Christ:

(New Testament | John 5:22 - 23)

22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

I see--- so you KNOW the BoM is true and Joseph Smith was a true prophet but You do NOT know if anyone who rejects your " I knows" is following the right pathway. As I said--your "I knows" ends up being a belief. The gauntlet that Mormons set up is really right versus wrong with no exceptions.

.

As to literal fathers or God being the literal Father of our spirits--you might look at this because it aligns with the Hebrew rendering of the word Father

Easton's Bible Dictionary

Father
a name applied (1) to any ancestor (Deut. 1:11; 1 Kings 15:11; Matt. 3:9; 23:30, etc.); and (2) as a title of respect to a chief, ruler, or elder, etc. (Judg. 17:10; 18:19; 1 Sam. 10:12; 2 Kings 2:12; Matt. 23:9, etc.). (3) The author or beginner of anything is also so called; e.g., Jabal and Jubal (Gen. 4:20, 21; comp. Job 38:28).

Applied to God (Ex. 4:22; Deut. 32:6; 2 Sam. 7:14; Ps. 89:27, 28, etc.). (1.) As denoting his covenant relation to the Jews (Jer. 31:9; Isa. 63:16; 64:8; John 8:41, etc.).

(2.) Believers are called God's "sons" (John 1:12; Rom. 8:16; Matt. 6:4, 8, 15, 18; 10:20, 29). They also call him "Father" (Rom. 1:7; 1 Cor. 1:3; 2 Cor. 1:2; Gal. 1:4)

Still laughing about this:

It is through disobedience that that we lose that designation.---He is the Way
 
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He is the way

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I see--- so you KNOW the BoM is true and Joseph Smith was a true prophet but You do NOT know if anyone who rejects your " I knows" is following the right pathway. As I said--your "I knows" ends up being a belief. The gauntlet that Mormons set up is really right versus wrong with no exceptions.

.

As to literal fathers or God being the literal Father of our spirits--you might look at this because it aligns with the Hebrew rendering of the word Father

Easton's Bible Dictionary

Father
a name applied (1) to any ancestor (Deut. 1:11; 1 Kings 15:11; Matt. 3:9; 23:30, etc.); and (2) as a title of respect to a chief, ruler, or elder, etc. (Judg. 17:10; 18:19; 1 Sam. 10:12; 2 Kings 2:12; Matt. 23:9, etc.). (3) The author or beginner of anything is also so called; e.g., Jabal and Jubal (Gen. 4:20, 21; comp. Job 38:28).

Applied to God (Ex. 4:22; Deut. 32:6; 2 Sam. 7:14; Ps. 89:27, 28, etc.). (1.) As denoting his covenant relation to the Jews (Jer. 31:9; Isa. 63:16; 64:8; John 8:41, etc.).

(2.) Believers are called God's "sons" (John 1:12; Rom. 8:16; Matt. 6:4, 8, 15, 18; 10:20, 29). They also call him "Father" (Rom. 1:7; 1 Cor. 1:3; 2 Cor. 1:2; Gal. 1:4)

Still laughing about this:

It is through disobedience that that we lose that designation.---He is the Way
(New Testament | Matthew 23:9)

9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

(New Testament | Hebrews 12:7 - 8)

7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

In other words if a person is disobedient they loose the designation of son.
 
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Jamesone5

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(New Testament | Matthew 23:9)

9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.

(New Testament | Hebrews 12:7 - 8)

7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

In other words if a person is disobedient they loose the designation of son.

How does one loose that designation?

Chastisement or chastening or enduring those thing or not is NOT disobedience. , When you say "you only hope to endure to the End"---you have lost everything if you fail to endure? , Tried to keep your obedience, but failed at enduring?

No wonder Mormonism is on such shaky ground.



And since we are talking about Father and sons--God deals with you as with sons. God is the Father of spirits, but it says not "the Father of ALL spirits". And we can lose that designation as sons of the Father of spirits?

God goes back and what? unfathers you? He pretends that His Fathering never happened?
 
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How does one loose that designation?

Chastisement or chastening or enduring those thing or not is NOT disobedience. , When you say "you only hope to endure to the End"---you have lost everything if you fail to endure? , Tried to keep your obedience, but failed at enduring?

No wonder Mormonism is on such shaky ground.



And since we are talking about Father and sons--God deals with you as with sons. God is the Father of spirits, but it says not "the Father of ALL spirits". And we can lose that designation as sons of the Father of spirits?

God goes back and what? unfathers you? He pretends that His Fathering never happened?
You said: "How does one loose that designation?" I thought the scripture I posted was plain enough to understand. God chastises His children for not keeping His commandments and doing His will. This is the second death. Those who suffer the second death are removed from the Father forever:

(New Testament | Revelation 2:11)

11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.

(New Testament | Revelation 20:13 - 15)

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


(New Testament | Revelation 21:8)

8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Salvation is for the obedient:

(New Testament | Hebrews 5:8 - 9)

8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
 
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Jamesone5

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You said: "How does one loose that designation?" I thought the scripture I posted was plain enough to understand. God chastises His children for not keeping His commandments and doing His will. This is the second death. Those who suffer the second death are removed from the Father forever:

(New Testament | Revelation 2:11)

11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.

(New Testament | Revelation 20:13 - 15)

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


(New Testament | Revelation 21:8)

8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Salvation is for the obedient:

(New Testament | Hebrews 5:8 - 9)

8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Uh, loose is this:

loose
not strict or exact.
"a loose interpretation" OR
(of a garment) not fitting tightly or closely.

Lose on the other hand is the word you are looking for --but obviously you have not until now figured that out.

And what?
God chastises His children for not keeping His commandments and doing His will--He is the Way

So, people who are not obeying Him are the only ones who are suffering chastisement? You think that you are good and that makes you immune from suffering? Good luck with that notion.

What about Job----was he really, really bad and that is why he lost his children and all his possessions?. You are talking like his friends who, God chastised for NOT trusting in HIM.
 
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Uh, loose is this:

loose
not strict or exact.
"a loose interpretation" OR
(of a garment) not fitting tightly or closely.

Lose on the other hand is the word you are looking for --but obviously you have not until now figured that out.
copied it from your post
 
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Jamesone5

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copied it from your post
And you said:
"How does one loose that designation?" I thought the scripture I posted was plain enough to understand.---he is the Way

And then I added this:


God chastises His children for not keeping His commandments and doing His will--He is the Way

So, people who are not obeying Him are the only ones who are suffering chastisement? You think that you are good and that makes you immune from suffering? Good luck with that notion.

What about Job----was he really, really bad and that is why he lost his children and all his possessions?. You are talking like his friends who, God chastised for NOT trusting in HIM.
 
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