Question for rapture people

keras

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Why are you saying Israel was Christian?
Because Paul say we are the Israel of God. Galatians 6:14-16
Jesus came to save us, Matthew 15:24, if He was referring to just the Jews, then He failed in His mission.
Who is the House of Israel?
A study of the first two chapters of Hosea shows us that Israel was to be cast off and divorced from God. They were to be scattered (“Jezreel”); they were to have no mercy (“Lo-ruhamah”); and they were to be no longer God’s people (“Lo-ammi”). But at the same time, God promised that they would be regathered under one Head (Jesus Christ) and come out of captivity. In fact, God told them He would “betroth thee unto Me in righteousness” (Hosea 2:19). The prophecy culminates with a Hebrew play on words. The name “Jezreel” means “God scatters,” but it also means “God sows.” (One must scatter the seed in order to sow it in the field.) Thus, at first the name prophesies that Israel was to be scattered; but ultimately it shows God’s Purpose—to sow Israel in the earth in order to multiply her as the sand of the sea, so as God remains faithful to His promise to Abraham.


Hosea 2:23 And I will sow her unto Me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not My people, Thou art My people; and they shall say, Thou art My God.
In other words, even though God did indeed cast off His people Israel, scattering them in the nations by the hand of the Assyrians, God’s ultimate Purpose was to sow them in the earth, so that they would multiply and fulfill the promise to Abraham. Furthermore, Hosea prophesied that; in the very place (of their captivity) where it is said that they are not God’s people (Israel), they would be Christians known as; “the Sons of the living God." Hosea 1:10, Romans 9:24-26

The problem is that most Christians try to make the Jews fulfill these prophesies, when the House of Judah, is fact, fulfilling an entirely different set of prophecies. God in His great mercy has allowed them nearly 2000 years to change their hearts to Him and to accept Jesus as Messiah.

If people realized that the Jews are to fulfill the prophecies of the House of Judah, instead of those dealing with the lost House of Israel, they would not have made this mistake. The Jews were certainly “cast off” in 586 BC and again in 70-135 A.D., even as Israel was cast off during 745-712 B.C.—but the difference is that the prophets uniformly prophesy good things for lost Israel even during the time of their captivity; while severe judgments were pronounced upon Jerusalem and the Jewish people.

Note that Ezekiel 21:14 tells of 3 Judgements. The next one, to come; will be by the Hand of the Lord Himself. Ezekiel 21:1-7

In Jeremiah 18:1-10, God says that the House of Israel was marred in the Potter’s hand, so God was going to beat down the wet clay and remake it into a vessel fit for His use. Then beginning in verse 11, God begins to prophesy about Jerusalem and Judah. First comes an indictment for their sins, and then in Jeremiah 19:1-15 we see that Jeremiah was to take an old earthen vessel (as opposed to wet clay that was pliable), he was to go to the city dump and smash the earthen vessel there, saying: Even so will I break this people and this city, as one breaks a potter’s vessel, that cannot be made whole again, and they shall bury them in Tophet, till there be no place to bury. Thus will I do unto this place, says the Lord, and to the inhabitants thereof, and even make this city as Tophet.
God’s choice of an allegory to suit each House is amazing!

An old clay vessel, once broken, cannot be remade into another vessel. Only wet, pliable clay can be used to remake a vessel. The House of Israel is like the pliable clay; but the House of Judah will be smashed and never again be built into a vessel of honour.

At the end of the first Temple era, God departed from it and Ezekiel saw the glory depart. Ezekiel 10:4-19 It has never returned to the Temple. Even when Zerubbabel rebuilt the Temple in 515 B.C., the glory did not return to it when they dedicated it to God. The work was good and was allowed by God, but the site itself was cursed.

This is consistent with the New Testament prophecies regarding the cursed fig tree, Matt. 21:21 the parable of the vineyard, Matt. 21:43-44 and the parable of the citizens who hated Him and would not allow Him to reign over them. Luke 19:27

The point is, these peoples must still be around to fulfill these distinct prophecies for Israel and for the cursed fig tree. The lost House of Israel must exist to be remade into another vessel and Judah must exist to be virtually wiped out. Isaiah 22:14

The problem comes when people think that the smashed vessel is going to be rebuilt into a vessel fit for God’s use, and when those same people wrongly think that the original House of Israel is lost forever and the Jews are the only Israel.

Plainly, the Christian peoples are the House of Israel, the Overcomers for God, as Jacob was. Jesus came to save the House of Israel, Matthew 15:24, who must be the Christian peoples; or Jesus failed in His mission.

The Jews will never change and Bible prophecy says they will be virtually wiped out.
 
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summerville

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Because Paul say we are the Israel of God. Galatians 6:14-16
Jesus came to save us, Matthew 15:24, if He was referring to just the Jews, then He failed in His mission.
Who is the House of Israel?
A study of the first two chapters of Hosea shows us that Israel was to be cast off and divorced from God. They were to be scattered (“Jezreel”); they were to have no mercy (“Lo-ruhamah”); and they were to be no longer God’s people (“Lo-ammi”). But at the same time, God promised that they would be regathered under one Head (Jesus Christ) and come out of captivity. In fact, God told them He would “betroth thee unto Me in righteousness” (Hosea 2:19). The prophecy culminates with a Hebrew play on words. The name “Jezreel” means “God scatters,” but it also means “God sows.” (One must scatter the seed in order to sow it in the field.) Thus, at first the name prophesies that Israel was to be scattered; but ultimately it shows God’s Purpose—to sow Israel in the earth in order to multiply her as the sand of the sea, so as God remains faithful to His promise to Abraham.


Hosea 2:23 And I will sow her unto Me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not My people, Thou art My people; and they shall say, Thou art My God.
In other words, even though God did indeed cast off His people Israel, scattering them in the nations by the hand of the Assyrians, God’s ultimate Purpose was to sow them in the earth, so that they would multiply and fulfill the promise to Abraham. Furthermore, Hosea prophesied that; in the very place (of their captivity) where it is said that they are not God’s people (Israel), they would be Christians known as; “the Sons of the living God." Hosea 1:10, Romans 9:24-26

The problem is that most Christians try to make the Jews fulfill these prophesies, when the House of Judah, is fact, fulfilling an entirely different set of prophecies. God in His great mercy has allowed them nearly 2000 years to change their hearts to Him and to accept Jesus as Messiah.

If people realized that the Jews are to fulfill the prophecies of the House of Judah, instead of those dealing with the lost House of Israel, they would not have made this mistake. The Jews were certainly “cast off” in 586 BC and again in 70-135 A.D., even as Israel was cast off during 745-712 B.C.—but the difference is that the prophets uniformly prophesy good things for lost Israel even during the time of their captivity; while severe judgments were pronounced upon Jerusalem and the Jewish people.

Note that Ezekiel 21:14 tells of 3 Judgements. The next one, to come; will be by the Hand of the Lord Himself. Ezekiel 21:1-7

In Jeremiah 18:1-10, God says that the House of Israel was marred in the Potter’s hand, so God was going to beat down the wet clay and remake it into a vessel fit for His use. Then beginning in verse 11, God begins to prophesy about Jerusalem and Judah. First comes an indictment for their sins, and then in Jeremiah 19:1-15 we see that Jeremiah was to take an old earthen vessel (as opposed to wet clay that was pliable), he was to go to the city dump and smash the earthen vessel there, saying: Even so will I break this people and this city, as one breaks a potter’s vessel, that cannot be made whole again, and they shall bury them in Tophet, till there be no place to bury. Thus will I do unto this place, says the Lord, and to the inhabitants thereof, and even make this city as Tophet.
God’s choice of an allegory to suit each House is amazing!

An old clay vessel, once broken, cannot be remade into another vessel. Only wet, pliable clay can be used to remake a vessel. The House of Israel is like the pliable clay; but the House of Judah will be smashed and never again be built into a vessel of honour.

At the end of the first Temple era, God departed from it and Ezekiel saw the glory depart. Ezekiel 10:4-19 It has never returned to the Temple. Even when Zerubbabel rebuilt the Temple in 515 B.C., the glory did not return to it when they dedicated it to God. The work was good and was allowed by God, but the site itself was cursed.

This is consistent with the New Testament prophecies regarding the cursed fig tree, Matt. 21:21 the parable of the vineyard, Matt. 21:43-44 and the parable of the citizens who hated Him and would not allow Him to reign over them. Luke 19:27

The point is, these peoples must still be around to fulfill these distinct prophecies for Israel and for the cursed fig tree. The lost House of Israel must exist to be remade into another vessel and Judah must exist to be virtually wiped out. Isaiah 22:14

The problem comes when people think that the smashed vessel is going to be rebuilt into a vessel fit for God’s use, and when those same people wrongly think that the original House of Israel is lost forever and the Jews are the only Israel.

Plainly, the Christian peoples are the House of Israel, the Overcomers for God, as Jacob was. Jesus came to save the House of Israel, Matthew 15:24, who must be the Christian peoples; or Jesus failed in His mission.

The Jews will never change and Bible prophecy says they will be virtually wiped out.

I don't think Matthew or Paul should have changed the content of Isaiah or Hosea. The Jews expected the Messiah to be an anointed warrior king who would defeat their Roman enemies. Jesus didn't vanquish the Romans.
 
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Murray J

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Preface: I'm of the mind that there is no rapture. But I was wondering for those who believe in one, can you provide Old Testament proof that God or anyone else spoke of it? In Amos, it's said that God doesn't do anything except He reveal it to the prophets first. And please, if you're going to post, you can respond with something better than an abstract bit in Genesis where it's said that Enoch was taken up. OK? Thanks!

Jesus was a prophet and Yahweh revealed to Him things that imminently were going to happen. Just as Amos said. Your text in Amos is the answer to your question.
 
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summerville

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islamic-antichrist-88-638.jpg
 
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Davy

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You used the wrong word: not "abused" but rather "understood." There have been countless people who have died and gone to heaven but got prayed back to their bodies - that have told us countless times about the mansions in heaven. Some have seen their OWN mansion. Some have seen some mansions under construction. Some more recent have been told all the mansions are finished. There is no more building going on. As a side journey, some saw preparations for the marriage supper: tables spread along the River of Life as far as the eye could see, with chairs at the tables and NAMES on each chair. Even more recently people have been told the preparations for the marriage supper are complete: heaven is only waiting on the saints to arrive!

The word "mansions" in John 14:2 simply means 'abodes'. They represent the priest's chambers in the future Millennial temple of Ezekiel 40-47 that will be ON EARTH. God's Word tells us Jesus will gather His Church on His way to Jerusalem, on earth.


Why not actually read your Bible for yourself, instead of heeding men's doctrines? The Scriptures are clear, Jesus is coming to gather His Church ON HIS WAY TO JERUSALEM ON EARTH, to the Mount of Olives specifically:


John 14:3
3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto Myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

KJV

1 Thess 4:14-17
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with Him.

15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
KJV

Acts 1:10-12
10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as He went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
11 Which also said, 'Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, Which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen Him go into heaven.'

12 Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.
KJV

Zech 14:3-5
3 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

4 And His feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with Thee.
KJV
 
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Davy

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Once again because you accept the retranslation of the word of God you have confused the millenial kingdom with the New Jerusalem.

I see you're making up stuff again. The 1611 KJV is still the best English Bible translation to date.

And you do not even read the very verses you seek to use to disprove the truth of the Bible!

Another false accusation by you. I never said the Millennium was the new Jerusalem. The beloved city and camp of the saints in Rev.20 is not the new Jerusalem. Nor is the one in Rev.22:14-15, because the wicked are still present outside its gates. But God's River and the tree of life are shown in that same time. Thus we are shown some changes on earth with Christ's return, and you will surely recognize. All peoples will.

Jesus has gone to prepare a place for us. Where is He now ??? Heaven. And since He hs gone to prepare a place for us He will come again and receive unto Himself that where He is (not will be) there we will be also!!!!

In the John 14 Scripture, He said He will 'come again'. The Acts 1 Scripture says He will return in like manner how He ascended to Heaven. 1 Thess.4 says He will 'descend' while bringing the asleep saints with Him, and will catch up the alive saints. That particular Scripture doesn't say where He is coming to for there is no need to repeat that again in 1 Thess.4, for the brethren with Paul that read the Scriptures no doubt well understood the 'where' from Zechariah 14, which tells us His feet will touch down upon the Mount of Olives, bringing all the saints with Him.

It's sad that you apparently do not... read the Zechariah 14 and Acts 1 Scriptures about Christ's return, and where He specifically is going to return with His saints to, i.e., to Jerusalem on earth.

And no Jesus will not touch down at eh Mount of Olives!

That is a direct denial of the written Scripture in Zechariah 14 and Acts 1. There's no help for your deception while you deny the very Scripture that tells us where Jesus is coming to.
 
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nolidad

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No, the battle of Armageddon is fought at Armageddon. Petra is not involved.

Rev 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
Rev 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
Rev 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.

When Christ arrives there, Satan's armies are already there and ready.

That is the standard dispensational answer, that I even held till about 15 years ago.

The word gather is synago (a root of the word synagogue) which simply means to gather or marshall.

Har-Megiddo or the valley of Jezreel is where the antiochristr marshalls his forces, the same as the allies in WW 2 marshalled their forces for D-Day in England.

But remember the Antichrist is seeking to remove all Jews from earth! Why? Because he knows the basis of Jesus return is for a Jew to fulfill This:

Matthew 23:36-39 King James Version (KJV)
36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.

37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

All Israel does get saved in th elast three days of the trib, they call upon Jesus and as all Jews from Jerusalem fled to Petra that is where the antichrist is heading and where Jesus returns!

Isaiah makes this clear:

Isaiah 63:1-3 King James Version (KJV)
63 Who is this that cometh from Edom, with dyed garments from Bozrah? this that is glorious in his apparel, travelling in the greatness of his strength? I that speak in righteousness, mighty to save.

2 Wherefore art thou red in thine apparel, and thy garments like him that treadeth in the winefat?

3 I have trodden the winepress alone; and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments, and I will stain all my raiment.
 
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nolidad

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keras

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Nope! Bozrah/Petra was in the mountains of trans JOrdanian desert.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/ef/11/4c/ef114c6f741d9be7f637dda65a36f58c.jpg
I have visited both places. Also Sela, which was the Capital of Edom.
None of those ancient sites have anything to do with the end times.
They all are used as allegories for modern places, like Jerusalem, [Tel Aviv] today is likened to Sodom.

The Lord will punish Edom; Bozrah, now the ungodly nations of the world. Isaiah 63:1-6
Judah too He will uproot... Jeremiah 12:14 and all the holy Land will become desolate and de-populated. Zephaniah 1:14-18, Jeremiah 21:11-14, Isaiah 22:14
 
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Jesus came for the lost sheep of Israel, not Christians.

He came to convert them to Christianity. The first believers were Israelites/Jewish/Hebrew and it was they that were the first Bride of Christ, the first Christian church and the first body of Christ. Gentiles join them as new additions of these things.
 
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Murray J

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Jesus came for the lost sheep of Israel, not Christians.

Ephraim or Israel were considered Hellenized half breeds and bad Jews by Judah.

Yes, Jesus came for the lost sheep of Israel but I don't know why you added 'not Christians.' Do you have a bible text for your 2nd sentence that I can examine?
 
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summerville

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He came to convert them to Christianity. The first believers were Israelites/Jewish/Hebrew and it was they that were the first Bride of Christ, the first Christian church and the first body of Christ. Gentiles join them as new additions of these things.

How do you overlook the fact that Jesus was an observant Jew?
Some called him Rabbi. He didn't come to created a new religion.
 
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summerville

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Yes, Jesus came for the lost sheep of Israel but I don't know why you added 'not Christians.' Do you have a bible text for your 2nd sentence that I can examine?

I'll have to look for a Bible text.. Meanwhile for the POV of an archaeologist read Israel Finklestein.


Culturally Judeans despised their northern neighbors as country cousins, their lack of Jewish sophistication being compounded by their greater openness to Hellenistic influence. Linguistically Galileans spoke a distinctive form of Aramaic whose slovenly consonants (they dropped their aitches!) were the butt of Judean humor.
7 Differences Between Galilee and Judea in the Time of Jesus
www.thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/justin-taylor/7-differences-between-galilee-and-judea-in-the-ti…
 
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summerville

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The Experience of Israel and Judah: A Lesson for Today ...
https://www.ucg.org/the-good-news/the-experience-of-israel-and-judah-a-lesson-for-today
  • Israel’s Sins and Downfall
  • Judah Follows in Israel’s Footsteps
  • Will We Learn from Their example?
  • Those of the northern kingdom of Israel were especially flagrant in their violations of the original covenant God had made with their fathers.

  • They adopted practices of pagan nations, including child sacrifice, one of the heinous sins of the Canaanites who had occupied the land before them. They also copied the Canaanites’ practice of ritual fornication—the mixing of sex with idolatrous religious worship. Sexual morality sank to a new low (Amos 2:7 Amos 2:7That pant after the dust of the eart...
 
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nolidad

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Another false accusation by you. I never said the Millennium was the new Jerusalem. The beloved city and camp of the saints in Rev.20 is not the new Jerusalem. Nor is the one in Rev.22:14-15, because the wicked are still present outside its gates. But God's River and the tree of life are shown in that same time. Thus we are shown some changes on earth with Christ's return, and you will surely recognize. All peoples will.

Wrong again. REv. 22 is the New Jerusalem, the holy city that came down from heaven. Why?

for it is where the Father and Son are. Also it is where teh tree of life and the river of life are.

I see you're making up stuff again. The 1611 KJV is still the best English Bible translation to date.

I love the KJV, but for a standard size translation, the amplified is the best. Otherwise it is the 10 volume Kittels English translation of the Greek NT.


In the John 14 Scripture, He said He will 'come again'. The Acts 1 Scripture says He will return in like manner how He ascended to Heaven. 1 Thess.4 says He will 'descend' while bringing the asleep saints with Him, and will catch up the alive saints. That particular Scripture doesn't say where He is coming to for there is no need to repeat that again in 1 Thess.4, for the brethren with Paul that read the Scriptures no doubt well understood the 'where' from Zechariah 14, which tells us His feet will touch down upon the Mount of Olives, bringing all the saints with Him.

It's sad that you apparently do not... read the Zechariah 14 and Acts 1 Scriptures about Christ's return, and where He specifically is going to return with His saints to, i.e., to Jerusalem on earth.

You are confusing the rapture with the second physical coming of Jesus to the Earth.

The rapture is the great snatching away of the church to go to heaven to stand before the bema seat judgment and receive her rewards and then marry the Lamb! Jesus does not come to earth and it does not even say if anyone sees HIm coming. Also the trumpet is not heard in the actual second coming while it is in the rapture.

When Jesus comes again physically, it is to establish the 1,000 year kingdom! He gathers all before him and separates the sheep from the goats. The sheep go into paradise earth, and the goats to hell to await the lake of fire.

That is a direct denial of the written Scripture in Zechariah 14 and Acts 1. There's no help for your deception while you deny the very Scripture that tells us where Jesus is coming to.

Once again you practice the false "close enough is good enough" fulfillment of biblical prophecy!

Jesus comes from Bozrah/petra where he breaks the siege of the antichrist to wipe out all Israel.

Isaiah 63:1-3 King James Version (KJV)
63 Who is this that cometh from Edom, with dyed garments from Bozrah? this that is glorious in his apparel, travelling in the greatness of his strength? I that speak in righteousness, mighty to save.

2 Wherefore art thou red in thine apparel, and thy garments like him that treadeth in the winefat?

3 I have trodden the winepress alone; and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments, and I will stain all my raiment.

Revelation 19:11-16 King James Version (KJV)
11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, King Of Kings, And Lord Of Lords.

It is very possible that after he destroys the armies of the antichrist at Petra, he returns to heaven to gather the saints and angels and returns and then ascends the Mount of Olives as stated in Zechariah 14.
 
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summerville

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Wrong again. REv. 22 is the New Jerusalem, the holy city that came down from heaven. Why?

for it is where the Father and Son are. Also it is where teh tree of life and the river of life are.



I love the KJV, but for a standard size translation, the amplified is the best. Otherwise it is the 10 volume Kittels English translation of the Greek NT.




You are confusing the rapture with the second physical coming of Jesus to the Earth.

The rapture is the great snatching away of the church to go to heaven to stand before the bema seat judgment and receive her rewards and then marry the Lamb! Jesus does not come to earth and it does not even say if anyone sees HIm coming. Also the trumpet is not heard in the actual second coming while it is in the rapture.

When Jesus comes again physically, it is to establish the 1,000 year kingdom! He gathers all before him and separates the sheep from the goats. The sheep go into paradise earth, and the goats to hell to await the lake of fire.



Once again you practice the false "close enough is good enough" fulfillment of biblical prophecy!

Jesus comes from Bozrah/petra where he breaks the siege of the antichrist to wipe out all Israel.

Isaiah 63:1-3 King James Version (KJV)
63 Who is this that cometh from Edom, with dyed garments from Bozrah? this that is glorious in his apparel, travelling in the greatness of his strength? I that speak in righteousness, mighty to save.

2 Wherefore art thou red in thine apparel, and thy garments like him that treadeth in the winefat?

3 I have trodden the winepress alone; and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments, and I will stain all my raiment.

Revelation 19:11-16 King James Version (KJV)
11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, King Of Kings, And Lord Of Lords.

It is very possible that after he destroys the armies of the antichrist at Petra, he returns to heaven to gather the saints and angels and returns and then ascends the Mount of Olives as stated in Zechariah 14.

Bozrah and Petra are NOT the same place.

The sharp sword in the mouth of Jesus is TRUTH.

Treading the winepress symbolizes crushing grapes and spilling blood. The Temple was destroyed in late August.. in the time of the grape harvest.
 
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nolidad

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I have visited both places. Also Sela, which was the Capital of Edom.
None of those ancient sites have anything to do with the end times.
They all are used as allegories for modern places, like Jerusalem, [Tel Aviv] today is likened to Sodom.

The Lord will punish Edom; Bozrah, now the ungodly nations of the world. Isaiah 63:1-6
Judah too He will uproot... Jeremiah 12:14 and all the holy Land will become desolate and de-populated. Zephaniah 1:14-18, Jeremiah 21:11-14, Isaiah 22:14

You are allegorizing way too much. You read between the lines and completely ignore what is written in the lines.

Israel in the mid point of the trib flees Jerusalem and its surroundings, Scripture says it is a placed God already prepared, in the montains, wilderness and desert! Petra fits all of them!

Too bad you didn't read Jer. 12:15.

Yes the land will be desolate- it is the end of the tribulation or 70th week of Daniel!

Rev. 12: 6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

The woman is Israel and she has a place prepared. Micah 2:12 intimates this as well

Only Petra fulfills that the place Israel flees is in the mountains, wilderness for 3 1/2 years (REv. 12:6 &14)

Also it is a place that is defensible as the munitions of rocks in Is. 33, his bread and water will be given him. Also remember that the Anitchrist will not conquer Edom, Moab and the chief of Ammon.

Yes God will punish Edom and Moab, they and Egypt will be waste places during themillenial kingdom.

I too have been to Petra.
 
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summerville

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You are allegorizing way too much. You read between the lines and completely ignore what is written in the lines.

Israel in the mid point of the trib flees Jerusalem and its surroundings, Scripture says it is a placed God already prepared, in the montains, wilderness and desert! Petra fits all of them!

Too bad you didn't read Jer. 12:15.

Yes the land will be desolate- it is the end of the tribulation or 70th week of Daniel!

Rev. 12: 6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

The woman is Israel and she has a place prepared. Micah 2:12 intimates this as well

Only Petra fulfills that the place Israel flees is in the mountains, wilderness for 3 1/2 years (REv. 12:6 &14)

Also it is a place that is defensible as the munitions of rocks in Is. 33, his bread and water will be given him. Also remember that the Anitchrist will not conquer Edom, Moab and the chief of Ammon.

Yes God will punish Edom and Moab, they and Egypt will be waste places during themillenial kingdom.

I too have been to Petra.

LOLOL.. They fled to PELLA not Petra.

Petra - BibArch
www.bibarch.com/archaeologicalsites/petra.htm
Some confuse Petra with Pella. The latter apparently served as a refuge for Jerusalem Christians in the 66-70 CE Roman war with Jewish zealots in the Holy Land.
 
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