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Zachm531

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Hey guys,
I really love the Lutheran tradition and it seems the most biblical. I currently attend a baptist church and am considering switching over to a Lutheran. My only concern is the infant baptism. I know Lutherans dont believe that baptism saves but is rather a means of application(of salvation). So why can an infant be baptized? If they fall away from the faith(and were baptized as an infant) how is that reconciled? And is faith needed for an infant-why or why not?
Thanks all :)
 

TKA_TN

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From the LCMS website:

"Lutherans believe that the Bible teaches that a person is saved by God's grace alone through faith alone in Jesus Christ. Baptism, we believe, is one of the miraculous means of grace (together with God's written and spoken Word) through which God creates the gift of faith in a person's heart.

Although we do not claim to understand how this happens or how it is possible, we believe (because of what the Bible says about Baptism) that when an infant is baptized God creates faith in the heart of that infant.

This faith cannot yet, of course, be expressed or articulated, yet it is real and present all the same (see, e.g., 1 Peter 3:21; Acts 2:38-39; Titus 3:5-6; Matt. 18:6; Luke 1:15; 2 Tim. 3:15; Gal. 3:26-27; Rom. 6:4; Col. 2:11-12; 1 Cor. 12:13).

Parents and sponsors of a baptized child bear the responsibility of teaching this child God's Word so that the child's faith may remain alive and grow (Matt. 28:18-20).

Confirmation is a time-honored church tradition (not required by God's Word, but we believe useful nonetheless) in which the child baptized as an infant is given the opportunity to confess for himself or herself the faith that he or she was unable to confess as an infant.

Faith is not “created” at confirmation, but it is rather confessed for all to hear so that the church can join and rejoice in this public confession, which has its roots in the faith which God Himself created in Baptism."
 
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TKA_TN

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And one more:

QUESTION: Why do Lutherans baptize infants?

ANSWER: Lutherans baptize infants because of what the Bible teaches regarding:

1.) God's command to baptize (Matt. 28:18-20; Mark 16:16; Acts 2:38). There is not a single passage in Scripture which instructs us not to baptize for reasons of age, race, or gender.

On the contrary, the divine commands to baptize in Scripture are all universal in nature. On the basis of these commands, the Christian church has baptized infants from the earliest days of its history.

Since those baptized are also to be instructed in the Christian faith, (Matt. 28:20), the church baptizes infants only where there is the assurance that parents or spiritual guardians will nurture the faith of the one baptized through continued teaching of God's Word.

2.) Our need for Baptism (Psalm 51:5; John 3:5-7; Acts 2:38; Rom. 3:23; Rom. 6:3-4). According to the Bible, all people–including infants–are sinful and fall short of the glory of God (Rom. 3:23).

King David confesses, “I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me" (Ps. 51:5). Like adults, infants die–sure proof that they too are under the curse of sin and death.

According to the Bible, Baptism (somewhat like Old Testament circumcision, administered to 8-day-old-babies – see Col. 2:11-12) is God's gracious way of washing away our sins – even the sins of infants – without any help or cooperation on our part. It is a wonderful gift of a loving and gracious God.

3.) God's promises and power (Acts 2:38; Mark 16:16; Acts 22:16; 1 Peter 3:21; John 3:5-7; Titus 3:5-6; Gal. 3:26-27; Rom. 6:1-4; Col. 2;11-12; Eph. 5:25-26; 1 Cor. 12:13).

Those churches which deny Baptism to infants usually do so because they have a wrong understanding of Baptism. They see Baptism as something we do (e.g., a public profession of faith, etc.) rather than seeing it as something that God does for us and in us.

None of the passages listed above, nor any passage in Scripture, describes Baptism as “our work” or as “our public confession of faith.”

Instead, these passages describe Baptism as a gracious and powerful work of God through which He miraculously (though through very “ordinary” means) washes away our sins by applying to us the benefits of Christ's death and resurrection (Acts 2:38-39; Acts 22:16), gives us a new birth in which we “cooperate” just as little as we did in our first birth (John 3:5-7), clothes us in Christ's righteousness (Gal. 3:26-27), gives us the Holy Spirit (Titus 3:5-6), saves us (1 Peter 3:21), buries us and raises us up with Christ as new creatures (Rom. 6:4; Col. 2:11-12), makes us holy in God's sight (Eph. 5: 25-26) and incorporates us into the body of Christ (1 Cor. 12:13).

All of this, according to the Bible, happens in Baptism, and all of it is God's doing, not ours. The promises and power of Baptism are extended to all in Scripture — including infants — and are available to all.

Parents and sponsors then have the privilege and responsibility of nurturing the baptized child in God's love and in His Word so that he or she may know and continue to enjoy the wonderful blessings of Baptism throughout his or her life.



Please come check us Lutherans out. You'll find friendly people who love Law and Gospel. Prayers.
 
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Zachm531

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And one more:

QUESTION: Why do Lutherans baptize infants?

ANSWER: Lutherans baptize infants because of what the Bible teaches regarding:

1.) God's command to baptize (Matt. 28:18-20; Mark 16:16; Acts 2:38). There is not a single passage in Scripture which instructs us not to baptize for reasons of age, race, or gender.

On the contrary, the divine commands to baptize in Scripture are all universal in nature. On the basis of these commands, the Christian church has baptized infants from the earliest days of its history.

Since those baptized are also to be instructed in the Christian faith, (Matt. 28:20), the church baptizes infants only where there is the assurance that parents or spiritual guardians will nurture the faith of the one baptized through continued teaching of God's Word.

2.) Our need for Baptism (Psalm 51:5; John 3:5-7; Acts 2:38; Rom. 3:23; Rom. 6:3-4). According to the Bible, all people–including infants–are sinful and fall short of the glory of God (Rom. 3:23).

King David confesses, “I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me" (Ps. 51:5). Like adults, infants die–sure proof that they too are under the curse of sin and death.

According to the Bible, Baptism (somewhat like Old Testament circumcision, administered to 8-day-old-babies – see Col. 2:11-12) is God's gracious way of washing away our sins – even the sins of infants – without any help or cooperation on our part. It is a wonderful gift of a loving and gracious God.

3.) God's promises and power (Acts 2:38; Mark 16:16; Acts 22:16; 1 Peter 3:21; John 3:5-7; Titus 3:5-6; Gal. 3:26-27; Rom. 6:1-4; Col. 2;11-12; Eph. 5:25-26; 1 Cor. 12:13).

Those churches which deny Baptism to infants usually do so because they have a wrong understanding of Baptism. They see Baptism as something we do (e.g., a public profession of faith, etc.) rather than seeing it as something that God does for us and in us.

None of the passages listed above, nor any passage in Scripture, describes Baptism as “our work” or as “our public confession of faith.”

Instead, these passages describe Baptism as a gracious and powerful work of God through which He miraculously (though through very “ordinary” means) washes away our sins by applying to us the benefits of Christ's death and resurrection (Acts 2:38-39; Acts 22:16), gives us a new birth in which we “cooperate” just as little as we did in our first birth (John 3:5-7), clothes us in Christ's righteousness (Gal. 3:26-27), gives us the Holy Spirit (Titus 3:5-6), saves us (1 Peter 3:21), buries us and raises us up with Christ as new creatures (Rom. 6:4; Col. 2:11-12), makes us holy in God's sight (Eph. 5: 25-26) and incorporates us into the body of Christ (1 Cor. 12:13).

All of this, according to the Bible, happens in Baptism, and all of it is God's doing, not ours. The promises and power of Baptism are extended to all in Scripture — including infants — and are available to all.

Parents and sponsors then have the privilege and responsibility of nurturing the baptized child in God's love and in His Word so that he or she may know and continue to enjoy the wonderful blessings of Baptism throughout his or her life.



Please come check us Lutherans out. You'll find friendly people who love Law and Gospel. Prayers.
So when I was going through discipleship at my baptist church. The pastor made a claim that baptizing an infant is doing the child a disservice because an infant (who cant know right or wrong) after being baptized would be held accountable for all sins. Which now that i think about it seems really goofy and assumes that God couldnt know the circumstances. Anyway, what would your reply be to that?
 
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TKA_TN

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Maybe I’m off base here in my reasoning, but I’d say that the pastor, and this is no shot at him, is operating under the assumption listed above where he’s saying Baptism is something we do, rather than something God does for us and in us. God knows that children can’t fully reason right from wrong.

This goes back, for me at least, to Luther and the other Lutheran reformers who after him said that left to our own, we could never chose God because we’re so corrupted by sin. Baptism is one of the means of grace God gives us. My question to those who don’t believe in infant baptism is, why rob a child of that?

This is another reason I’m glad Lutheran churches still have confirmation. It lets kids know what God has already done for them.

Hope that helps, and if I’m way off base here, someone please step in.
 
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Zachm531

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Maybe I’m off base here in my reasoning, but I’d say that the pastor, and this is no shot at him, is operating under the assumption listed above where he’s saying Baptism is something we do, rather than something God does for us and in us. God knows that children can’t fully reason right from wrong.

This goes back, for me at least, to Luther and the other Lutheran reformers who after him said that left to our own, we could never chose God because we’re so corrupted by sin. Baptism is one of the means of grace God gives us. My question to those who don’t believe in infant baptism is, why rob a child of that?

This is another reason I’m glad Lutheran churches still have confirmation. It lets kids know what God has already done for them.

Hope that helps, and if I’m way off base here, someone please step in.
Yeah that makes sense to me. Ive been listening to Pastor Jordan Cooper, hes great
 
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TKA_TN

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Yeah that makes sense to me. Ive been listening to Pastor Jordan Cooper, hes great

He is. Pr. Bryan Wolfmueller has some great books out also. And if you ever get to listen to Pr. William Weedon, do so.
 
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AMM

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Also just to clarify the Lutheran teaching (I’m a former member of the LCMS, not just an EO pushing my own theology — I still have a fair bit of respect for the Lutheranism I grew up in) on baptism: baptism does save. Not in and of itself (see Luther’s small catechism, “how can water do such great things? Certainly not just water, but the word of God in and with the water does these things.”), of course. And yes, people can still fall away who were baptized as infants. But nonetheless, we can (and Lutherans do) say that Baptism does save
 
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Zachm531

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Also just to clarify the Lutheran teaching (I’m a former member of the LCMS, not just an EO pushing my own theology — I still have a fair bit of respect for the Lutheranism I grew up in) on baptism: baptism does save. Not in and of itself (see Luther’s small catechism, “how can water do such great things? Certainly not just water, but the word of God in and with the water does these things.”), of course. And yes, people can still fall away who were baptized as infants. But nonetheless, we can (and Lutherans do) say that Baptism does save
I was at a LCMS church today, the Pastor gave me a small catty so im going to read that
 
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