Does ‘willful sinning’ threaten my salvation?

Sabertooth

Repartee Animal: Quipping the Saints!
Supporter
Jul 25, 2005
10,491
7,061
62
Wisconsin
Visit site
✟952,659.00
Country
United States
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
No, but continued refusal to repent (when convicted) does.

Salvation requires that you must follow Jesus. Persistent refusal to do that (after some unknown grace period) annuls Salvation unless/until you resume following Him again.

Jesus taught this in John 15:1-8.
 
Upvote 0

BBAS 64

Contributor
Supporter
Aug 21, 2003
9,850
1,708
58
New England
✟484,381.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
No, but continued refusal to repent (when convicted) does.

Salvation requires that you must follow Jesus. Persistent refusal to do that (after some unknown grace period) annuls Salvation unless/until you resume following Him again.

Jesus taught this in John 15:1-8.

Good day, Sabertooth

Did you get that from the youtube presentation?

Love John 15 Best devotional is Murray on the this passage.

Sam Storm does a really good job here : John 15 – The Vine and the Branches | Effectual Grace
I am wanting to get DA Carson's work on John to read his exegetical work on this passage.

In Him,

Bill
 
  • Useful
Reactions: St_Worm2
Upvote 0

Sabertooth

Repartee Animal: Quipping the Saints!
Supporter
Jul 25, 2005
10,491
7,061
62
Wisconsin
Visit site
✟952,659.00
Country
United States
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Did you get that from the youtube presentation?
No. It was more of a response to the thread's title. (I will go back and look at the video, later.)
 
Upvote 0

Presbyterian Continuist

Senior Veteran
Supporter
Mar 28, 2005
21,810
10,792
76
Christchurch New Zealand
Visit site
✟827,333.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Was Paul wilfully sinning when he said in Romans 7 that he loved the law of God in his heard but found another law in his body that caused him to do the things he didn't want to do, and not do the things he wanted?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Carl Emerson

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2017
14,667
9,977
78
Auckland
✟376,644.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The issue he did not touch on was that a believer with genuine saving enduring faith can be deceived, led astray, fall into serious sin for a period and still recover because He puts boundaries on our behaviour if we are truely His.

This is because genuine conversion includes surrendering our free will to Him...

Thy will be done.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Kaon and Leet
Upvote 0

Carl Emerson

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2017
14,667
9,977
78
Auckland
✟376,644.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Was Paul wilfully sinning when he said in Romans 7 that he loved the law of God in his heard but found another law in his body that caused him to do the things he didn't want to do, and not do the things he wanted?

No...
 
Upvote 0

Presbyterian Continuist

Senior Veteran
Supporter
Mar 28, 2005
21,810
10,792
76
Christchurch New Zealand
Visit site
✟827,333.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
The issue he did not touch on was that a believer with genuine saving enduring faith can be deceived, led astray, fall into serious sin for a period and still recover because He puts boundaries on our behaviour if we are truly His.
In Calvin's Institutes there is a very interesting comment. He says that people can be deceived and have their faith corrupted, but their basic faith in Christ is still on that solid foundation, and it is because their faith is on the solid foundation of Christ, that a deceived person will eventually recover and his head will come back into synchronisation with his heart.
 
Upvote 0

crossnote

Berean
Supporter
May 16, 2010
2,903
1,593
So. Cal.
✟250,151.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
  1. In shady, green pastures, so rich and so sweet,
    God leads His dear children along;
    Where the water’s cool flow bathes the weary one’s feet,
    God leads His dear children along.
    • Refrain:
      Some through the waters, some through the flood,
      Some through the fire, but all through the blood;
      Some through great sorrow, but God gives a song,
      In the night season and all the day long.
  2. Sometimes on the mount where the sun shines so bright,
    God leads His dear children along;
    Sometimes in the valley, in darkest of night,
    God leads His dear children along.
  3. Though sorrows befall us and Satan oppose,
    God leads His dear children along;
    Through grace we can conquer, defeat all our foes,
    God leads His dear children along.
  4. Away from the mire, and away from the clay,
    God leads His dear children along;
    Away up in glory, eternity’s day,
    God leads His dear children along. -George A. Young
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Kenny'sID

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Feb 28, 2016
18,185
7,001
69
USA
✟585,304.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Of course it does...how can anyone not know that?

Example:

1 Timothy 4:1

Now the Holy Spirit tells us clearly that in the last times some will turn away from the true faith; they will follow deceptive spirits and teachings that come from demons.

Pay close attention to the term "Clearly", and it is just that, and should need no explanation, but knowing the OSASR's like I do, and their ability to attempt to deceive, well...

If you want to tell us they never had that "saving faith", then look again, they had "true faith" or just faith is really all they needed to say. And if they had faith at one point, they had to fall away form it in order to abandon the faith....meaning they fell from salvation...simple

That's just one of many, you know, the verses the clown on the video completely left out.
 
Upvote 0

Carl Emerson

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2017
14,667
9,977
78
Auckland
✟376,644.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Of course it does...how can anyone not know that?

Example:

1 Timothy 4:1

Now the Holy Spirit tells us clearly that in the last times some will turn away from the true faith; they will follow deceptive spirits and teachings that come from demons.

Pay close attention to the term "Clearly", and it is just that, and should need no explanation, but knowing the OSASR's like I do, and their ability to attempt to deceive, well...

If you want to tell us they never had that "saving faith", then look again, they had "true faith" or just faith is really all they needed to say. And if they had faith at one point, they had to fall away form it in order to abandon the faith....meaning they fell from salvation...simple

That's just one of many, you know, the verses the clown on the video completely left out.

Not so simple...

In the verse you quote ...

1 Timothy 4:1

Now the Holy Spirit tells us clearly that in the last times some will turn away from the true faith; they will follow deceptive spirits and teachings that come from demons.

They were turning away from the true faith - this does not mean they had it. They were presented with the truth and then presented with a deception and followed that instead.

Luke 8:12 covers this outcome...

"The seeds along the path are those who hear, but the devil comes and takes away the word from their hearts, so that they may not believe and be saved...
 
Last edited:
  • Useful
Reactions: St_Worm2
Upvote 0

d taylor

Well-Known Member
Oct 16, 2018
10,551
4,684
59
Mississippi
✟248,097.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Jesus took away the sin of the world, sin is not an issue. The issue is do you have The Messiah's Eternal Life, if not then you do not have salvation.

A person has either trusted in The Messiah for His free gift of His Eternal Life or they have not.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: JIMINZ
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

HTacianas

Well-Known Member
Jul 9, 2018
8,459
8,968
Florida
✟321,876.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Single
Was Paul wilfully sinning when he said in Romans 7 that he loved the law of God in his heard but found another law in his body that caused him to do the things he didn't want to do, and not do the things he wanted?

Romans 7 does not say that Paul did anything. He didn't. He described his struggle with coveting. He saw things he wanted and as much as he tried to control himself he still desired them.
 
Upvote 0