The Ghastly Eternal Torment Dogma

FineLinen said:

Do you notice the foundation for opening the door to the Saviour of Rectification?

"If you hear"

Welcome to the One who speaks ephphatha!

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If you hear---most, even when they hear, reject. After many callings, each one growing dimmer and dimmer because they have hardened their hearts---they no longer hear the Holy Spirit---that is the unforgiveable sin. Those who continue in Universalism have hardened their hearts against the truth. The Holy Spirit speaks all languages---no one has to have a special language.

FineLinen said:

Nonsense! I defy any one who has heard the Living One speak, has looked into the glory of His face to reject! ! !

Dear blind & deaf: the Lord of ephphatha will change your great need!

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No man can look into His face and live! And there are many who have---I was one. I left Him and went into the world for over 25 years. I flat out loud told Him to leave me alone, that I did not want anything to do with Him and that it was fine if I went to hell. It took nearly 30 years of Him calling me before I finally heard a small voice say---"I will not ask again." Still, I refused. It took a few more trials before I finally succumbed. It was a long, drawn out battle, He did win. But by just a very narrow thread. He was patient. I know many who did the same thing---and they never came back.
When Jesus is done as our High Priest, He will say it is done

Rev_16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
Rev_21:6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.

And then He says this:

Rev 22:10 And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand.
Rev 22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

At this point everyone will have run out of time and our decisions are final ones. We will be what we have chosen to be and there is no changing of the mind anymore. There is no 2nd chance and the wicked attacking the city is prove that they have an unrepentant heart and are destroyed. What God says will be done. His word is final. Universalism is a dead end in hell.

FineLinen said:

If just one person were condemned to eternal torment, then God’s purpose in creation would have been defeated.

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Not if His purpose for this world was to separate those who would choose to love Him of their own free will from those who would reject Him. If His intention was to ultimately force everyone to repent then there would be no reason for this world. He could’ve just created us to be obedient in the first place. God put the choice in our hands because He desires our love and fellowship. Without the free will to choose to love Him our love would have no value at all.

FineLinen said:

Your word for today = helko =

"I will draw/ drag off in power/ impel ALL mankind unto Myself."

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Draw
G1670


Lemma:

ἑλκύω


Transliteration:

helkýō


Pronounce:

hel'-ko


Part of Speech:

Verb


Language:

greek


Description:

1) to draw, drag off

2) metaph., to draw by inward power, lead, impel

The word helko doesn’t only mean to take by force.

FineLinen said:

My dear lady: It is wonderful you finally heard. The vast multitudes have never heard His voice (small or in ephphatha degrees). EVER!

I wish you well on the remainder of your journey into Him.

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I've been with Him for over 35 years now and will never leave Him again. As usual you did not address anything of value that was posted. Again, just mouthing stuff. You have noth9ng to give. This theory is not of |God and that is evident. There is no verse that states anyone comes out of the lake of fire into life eternal with God---I will keep repeating that every time you repeat the same stuff. If you read you bible instead of all those silly books you might be able to still hear the Holy Spirit before it is too late.
And everyone has the opportunity to hear the voice of God--most just reject it at the start. Even primitive peoples have their chance to do as God gives them to do or not.

Saint Steven said:

I was hoping you would point that out. (Many is not all) Thanks.

In verse 19, how many were made sinners through the disobedience of the one man? (all)
Therefore, how many will be made righteous through the obedience of the one man? (all)

Saint Steven said: ↑
Correct. Now apply the principle here.

Romans 5:18-19
Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people,
so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.
19 For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners,
so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.

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Well as I know me better than you do, I know I agree 100% with those verses!

But in order to receive th ejustification that Jesus gained- one has to trust in HIm and Clavary and the empty tomb! That opens the door for any and everyone to recieve what Jesus gained for them. But make no mistake- as it says in Acts 4:
Acts 4:12 King James Version (KJV)
12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

God put the caveat of believing in order to recieve! Now it is up to your side to show where the Bible says that the dead have a chance at repentance in light of Hebrews 9:27

27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

Jesus did not save all men- He made all men savable through His blood! Faith is required as is shown throughout the New Testament.

John 3:36 King James Version (KJV)
36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Jesus made it clear- even though He paid for their sins, and gave them justification, if they believe not- THEY WILL NOT SEE LIFE< bUT GODS WRATH IS ON THEM!

Saint Steven said:

That's a smoke screen.
You said you agreed 100 percent with the last batch. What happened?

Matthew 12:40
For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish,
so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

Note: Christ was laid in an above ground tomb. Where is the heart of the earth?

1 Peter 3:18-20
For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God.He was put to death in the body but made alive in the Spirit. 19 After being made alive, he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits— 20 to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water,

Ephesians 4:8-10
This is why it says:
“When he ascended on high,
he took many captives
and gave gifts to his people.”
9 (What does “he ascended” mean except that he also
descended to the lower, earthly regions?
10 He who descended is the very one who ascended
higher than all the heavens,
in order to fill the whole universe.)

1 Peter 4:6
For this is the reason the gospel was preached even to those who are now dead,
so that they might be judged according to human standards in regard to the body,
but live according to God in regard to the spirit.

Romans 14:9
For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living.

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tEH HEART OF THE EARTH IS WHERE THE PLACE OF THE DEAD IS- THE THREE COMPARTMENTS OF HELL---HADES/SHEOL, TARTARUS, ABRAHAMS BOSOM/PARADISE!.

The spirits in prison were those saved souls since Adam who could not enter heaven because the blood of Jesus (which only can remove sins) had not yet been shed! That is why He tols the penitnet thief that on that day he would be with HIm in Paradise! Jesus went to Abrahams Bosom to preach the good news that the wait was over. Then at His ascension He took th ose souls in paradise with him and that section of hell is closed!

mmksparbud said:

What you all fail to understand is that God's fire does not destroy sin, but the sinner.

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1 Corinthians 3:12-15 ESV
Now if anyone builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw— 13 each one's work will become manifest, for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed by fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done. 14 If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. 15 If anyone's work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire.

DNB said:

Exegetically one dimensional, was meant.
BTW, according the quote that you cited, how does fiery torment change one's heart?
You claim that this is the purifying phase, a very integral part of universalism theology. What exactly is the significance behind this 'torture', and the efficacious cleansing aspect?

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We aren't claiming it is torture. We'll leave that to the Damnationists.
Jesus did say we will all be salted with fire. That's everyone.
Granted, we don't have a lot to go on.

Mark 9:45-49 ESV
And if your foot causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life lame than with two feet to be thrown into hell. 47 And if your eye causes you to sin, tear it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into hell, 48 ‘where their worm does not die and the fire is not quenched.’ 49 For everyone will be salted with fire.

nolidad said:

God put the caveat of believing in order to recieve! Now it is up to your side to show where the Bible says that the dead have a chance at repentance in light of Hebrews 9:27

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Was Jesus wasting his time when he preached to the imprisoned spirits before his resurrection? They were already dead, right?

nolidad said:

tEH HEART OF THE EARTH IS WHERE THE PLACE OF THE DEAD IS- THE THREE COMPARTMENTS OF HELL---HADES/SHEOL, TARTARUS, ABRAHAMS BOSOM/PARADISE!.

The spirits in prison were those saved souls since Adam who could not enter heaven because the blood of Jesus (which only can remove sins) had not yet been shed! That is why He tols the penitnet thief that on that day he would be with HIm in Paradise! Jesus went to Abrahams Bosom to preach the good news that the wait was over. Then at His ascension He took th ose souls in paradise with him and that section of hell is closed!

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Thanks. That proves that salvation can come after death.

mmksparbud said:

Those who continue in Universalism have hardened their hearts against the truth.

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That is an absolute falsehood! You owe us an apology!

mmksparbud said:

If you hear---most, even when they hear, reject. After many callings, each one growing dimmer and dimmer because they have hardened their hearts---they no longer hear the Holy Spirit---that is the unforgiveable sin. Those who continue in Universalism have hardened their hearts against the truth. The Holy Spirit speaks all languages---no one has to have a special language.

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You are claiming that we are not saved!

Interesting to note that the CFs consider Annihilationism just as unorthodox as Universalism. See list below.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unorthodox Christian theological topics include (but are not limited to):

• Annihilationism
• Full Preterism
• Open Theism
• Universalism

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mmksparbud said:

Universalism is a dead end in hell.

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There it is again. Uncalled for.