2 major questions

jasonMalloy1999 said:

1 i it true non baptised christians are unsave not born again and will go to hell as im a christian god works in my ife but i unable to be baptised

2 why do people say trumps the last president then its the end in 2 years im sick of it no one knows the end

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1. You do not need to be baptised in water to be saved. People say that because they misunderstand the Bible.
2. Some people seem to be intent on denying the truth. Why, I don't know. One Christians group went around the world saying that the world would end in 1984 and they had Bible verses to "prove" it. I don't know who is sillier, the people who preach this foolishness or the people who listen.

jasonMalloy1999 said:

1 i it true non baptised christians are unsave not born again and will go to hell as im a christian god works in my ife but i unable to be baptised

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You ARE able to be baptized. You just have not found out how to get it done yet. If you intend to be baptized God will honor your intent. Find a church that baptizes. Most do. Talk with the pastor. Do what he says.

Hello Jason,
You don't need to be baptized to be saved. But if you want to do a step forward in faith and be obedient to God you can do it, but it has to be your choice, God doesn't want to force anyone. It is not easy to find the right church for yourself. Why don't you pray to God about it, that he opens a door for you and shows you where to go. Maybe those churches that never replied you weren't the right way for you personally, only God knows. Just keep in connection to God, people will always disappoint you, also christians, but God always wants the best for you and he see's that you have an honest heart to look for him.

About the Trump and End of the world thing, you are right nobody knows. We can only see the signs from the bible in todays world, so we know we are close to the end. But we never know when it is, and people can't play God and poison other peoples minds with those dates that the world will end. Don't listen to it. Better pray for them... for their eyes to be opened to what they are doing.
Greetings, Lea

Aussie Pete said:

1. You do not need to be baptised in water to be saved. People say that because they misunderstand the Bible.

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'

1 Peter 3
21 There is also an antitype [of Noah's Ark] which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 22

Mark 16
15 And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. 16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.

jasonMalloy1999 said:

1 i it true non baptised christians are unsave not born again and will go to hell as im a christian god works in my ife but i unable to be

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jasonMalloy1999 said:

2 why do people say trumps the last president then its the end in 2 years im sick of it no one knows the end

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There's no need to listen to those people.

Matthew 24:36-44(NLT)

AvgJoe said:

There's no need to listen to those people.

Matthew 24:36-44(NLT)

36) “However, no one knows the day or hour when these things will happen, not even the angels in heaven or the Son himself. Only the Father knows.

37) “When the Son of Man returns, it will be like it was in Noah’s day. 38) In those days before the flood, the people were enjoying banquets and parties and weddings right up to the time Noah entered his boat. 39) People didn’t realize what was going to happen until the flood came and swept them all away. That is the way it will be when the Son of Man comes.

40) “Two men will be working together in the field; one will be taken, the other left. 41) Two women will be grinding flour at the mill; one will be taken, the other left.

42) “So you, too, must keep watch! For you don’t know what day your Lord is coming. 43) Understand this: If a homeowner knew exactly when a burglar was coming, he would keep watch and not permit his house to be broken into. 44) You also must be ready all the time, for the Son of Man will come when least expected.​

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And that prophecy wasn't even about the end of the world. It was about the destruction of Jerusalem which has long passed.

Al Touthentop said:

'

1 Peter 3
21 There is also an antitype [of Noah's Ark] which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 22

Mark 16
15 And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. 16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.

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Now if we could figure out why mark 16:16 wasn’t actually in the manuscripts and got added later....

GaveMeJoy said:

Now if we could figure out why mark 16:16 wasn’t actually in the manuscripts and got added later....

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It didn't get added later. It was in the original. And it is quoted by more than one first century writer over 100 years before it was claimed to be added. If it was added later, Polycarp could not have quoted it in his letters. Then you have Matthew 28 even if it were true that Mark 16:9-20 was an "addition."

Then you have John 3:5, Romans 6, Ephesians 2:1-6.....etc etc all the way to Revelation's 'blessed is he who takes part of the first resurrection,' one of several allusions to baptism in that book.

jasonMalloy1999 said:

i have contacted al my churches and tey never reply i called my astor and he always said hell call but never does it

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You contacted 'all my churches' but they don't respond. Either whoever you contacted forgot and needs to be asked again OR you need a different kind of church. So, ask again. And if the answer is an actual 'no' go hunting elsewhere. But first, ask them again until you get an actual 'no'. They should respond to you. But they get busy and people forget. Ask again.

I have yet to see a church that is able to baptise in the spirit.

As for 'the end', it's funny but the time of the boomers was the quietest and least disastrous on a non-human level in centuries but now that their time is coming to a close the world is heating up again and reality wil set in for them and others. They ain't seen nothing yet.

jasonMalloy1999 said:

i have contacted al my churches and tey never reply i called my astor and he always said hell call but never does it

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No church is going to values someone who emails or just turns up.
Churches baptise those they know through sharing in worship and service that they are Christian.
Talk to your minister tomorrow about baptism. Don't accept 'I will ring' ask when should you call At his house to talk about baptism, what day and what time?

If he won't say go to the next nearest church and start attending there every Sunday, get to know the minister and in six months ask about baptism.
Do check that the church does baptisms.

jasonMalloy1999 said:

1 i it true non baptised christians are unsave not born again and will go to hell as im a christian god works in my ife but i unable to be baptised

2 why do people say trumps the last president then its the end in 2 years im sick of it no one knows the end

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1. Baptism is not a requirement for salvation. Just take a look at the man on the cross next to the Lord Jesus. The Lord said to him, today you will be with me in paradise. He was never baptised. Some people may quote verses which they think prove otherwise but the Bible does not contradict itself, it is simply they don't fully understand the verses they are quoting.

Furthermore, to claim baptism is required for salvation means you are also relying on works to save you. Salvation is by faith alone, not by anything you do (works). Eph 2:8-9

Why are you unable to be baptised?

2. Quite right, people who say that don't know their Bibles.

fm107 said:

1. Baptism is not a requirement for salvation. Just take a look at the man on the cross next to the Lord Jesus. The Lord said to him, today you will be with me in paradise. He was never baptised.

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For one, you don't know he was never baptized. Two, he was under the old covenant. Three, Jesus' command recorded in Matthew and Mark, that disciples be baptized, came after this incident. He didn't provide exceptions to this command. Your injection of an exception is not found anywhere in the text.

Some people may quote verses which they think prove otherwise but the Bible does not contradict itself, it is simply they don't fully understand the verses they are quoting.

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This passage doesn't contradict those passages. Correct. It was a command.

Furthermore, to claim baptism is required for salvation means you are also relying on works to save you. Salvation is by faith alone, not by anything you do (works). Eph 2:8-9

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Works do save us. The works that Paul excluded were distinct and specific. In Ephesians he is excluding man-invented works of merit, not all works. He refers to baptism in verses 1-6 and tells them that this work is what saved them and that it was the grace of God. When he gets to 8-9 he tells them that the work they did do was "not of yourselves." Then he goes on to say in verse 10 that we were created to do God's works. Baptism isn't a work invented by man, it's a work invented by God and made effective through Christ's sacrifice.

"The baptism of John, did it come from man or from God?"

In Romans, Paul excluded the works of a then obsolete law. At the time that law was in place, those under it could only be saved doing its works. Once the new covenant was established, you could no longer go back to it and be justified.

"This is the work of God, that you believe in the one he sent."

If we aren't saved by works, then we can't be saved at all. Belief, Jesus says is itself a work.

Remission of sins comes through baptism. All you have to do is read the book of Acts and you see that the apostles never ceased to obey Jesus' command to baptize believers. Why? To wash away their sins. That's what it's for.

Al,

Not looking to get into an argument with you over this. Some of what you have said is correct but the main point your making that people who are not baptised are not saved is wrong.

There are many deathbed conversions that have happened throughout history - your standpoint is that there is no hope for such people. Those going down in a plane crash who turn to the Lord in the final minutes or are held hostage awaiting death - there are no hope for them because they haven't taken the baptismal plunge? Your viewpoint contradicts scripture and is legalistic.

On the flip side, there are many professing christians who do get baptised but are not saved.

I advocate that persons who believe in the Lord should be baptised but to claim it is needed for salvation is simply wrong. Your stance is that not carrying out a ceremonial action so to speak can keep you from getting to Heaven.

Finally, what if your from a muslim country and you believe in the Lord but cannot be baptised because there is no christian to baptise you and you don't have the funds to travel abroad to be baptised? What if you live in an area of Africa and there is severe drought that eventually kills you but there is no water to be baptised? Your viewpoint is wrought with difficulties and doesn't align with scripture my friend.

fm107 said:

Al,

Not looking to get into an argument with you over this. Some of what you have said is correct but the main point your making that people who are not baptised are not saved is wrong.

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The way one receives remission of sin is through water baptism. It didn't come from men, it came from God.

There are many deathbed conversions that have happened throughout history - your standpoint is that there is no hope for such people. Those going down in a plane crash who turn to the Lord in the final minutes or are held hostage awaiting death - there are no hope for them because they haven't taken the baptismal plunge? Your viewpoint contradicts scripture and is legalistic.

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It doesn't contradict scripture at all. I didn't make the rules and it is unfortunate that people call out to God in their final minutes having had their whole lives to repent. The question is where one draws the line and it would appear from scripture that God set up the conditions a certain way. Even a person who believes that dead faith could save a person has to draw a line at belief.

On the flip side, there are many professing christians who do get baptised but are not saved.

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You and I do not have any ability to judge that other than their works. An unrepentant person can get baptized and not be saved. I agree with that.

I advocate that persons who believe in the Lord should be baptised but to claim it is needed for salvation is simply wrong. Your stance is that not carrying out a ceremonial action so to speak can keep you from getting to Heaven.

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It's not an empty ceremony. Jesus preached against empty ceremonies.

25 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you cleanse the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of extortion and self-indulgence. 26 Blind Pharisee, first cleanse the inside of the cup and dish, that the outside of them may be clean also.

Baptism cleans the inside of the cup. Here Jesus is teaching the Pharisees who rejected John's baptism that they practiced empty ceremonies that did nothing and rejected the 'ceremony' that actually accomplished purification. To teach that baptism is just an empty ceremony is to teach exactly the opposite of what Jesus taught.

Finally, what if your from a muslim country and you believe in the Lord but cannot be baptised because there is no christian to baptise you and you don't have the funds to travel abroad to be baptised? What if you live in an area of Africa and there is severe drought that eventually kills you but there is no water to be baptised? Your viewpoint is wrought with difficulties and doesn't align with scripture my friend.

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What if you don't confess or believe or repent? These what if's are not a reason to disregard the purpose, reason and command of baptism.

29 But the house of Israel says, ‘The way of the Lord is not right.’ Are My ways not right, O house of Israel? Is it not your ways that are not right?

God laid out the rules, not men. It's not a sin to point out that baptism saves us from our past sins. That's what Paul preached and later wrote about, what Peter preached and later wrote about and the importance of baptism is in virtually every new testament book, including Revelation.

6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

The first resurrection is baptism. See Romans 6.

Al Touthentop said:

And that prophecy wasn't even about the end of the world. It was about the destruction of Jerusalem which has long passed.

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There seems to be 2 schools of thought, on this chapter, that 1) the whole chapter is about the destruction of the temple or 2) part of the chapter is about the destruction of the temple and part is about the end times. I'm with #2, who believes that the quoted verses are referring to the end times.

Al,

In the Old Testament, being baptised was not a prerequisite for being saved but your maintaining that now it is a prerequisite for being saved.

1. Keeping it simple and short, can you give your reasons for why you think this was not a barrier to men in the Old Testament and why suddenly in the New Testament you think this barrier is erected? That men must be baptised to be saved?

2. Do you know how people were saved in the Old Testament? What did they had to do to get to Heaven?

Al Touthentop said:

I didn't make the rules and it is unfortunate that people call out to God in their final minutes having had their whole lives to repent.

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Many hear the gospel for the first time on their deathbeds.

Al Touthentop said:

It's not an empty ceremony.

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I never said it was an empty ceremony, although it has meaning and I believe all professing christians should be baptised, it does not bare on a person's salvation.

fm107 said:

Al,

In the Old Testament, being baptised was not a prerequisite for being saved but your maintaining that now it is a prerequisite for being saved.

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The old covenant was fulfilled and the new covenant requires baptism.

1. Keeping it simple and short, can you give your reasons for why you think this was not a barrier to men in the Old Testament and why suddenly in the New Testament you think this barrier is erected? That men must be baptised to be saved?

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Simply because that's what the scripture says and what Jesus said. Baptism replaces animal sacrifice and is made effective by Christ's sacrifice.

2. Do you know how people were saved in the Old Testament? What did they had to do to get to Heaven?

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By following the law of Moses. The reason Paul said in Romans that no one could be justified by the law of Moses is because it was obsolete. Remission under the law of Moses came from animal sacrifice.

Many hear the gospel for the first time on their deathbeds.

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OK. And?

I never said it was an empty ceremony, although it has meaning and I believe all professing christians should be baptised, it does not bare on a person's salvation.

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If it doesn't accomplish anything then its an empty ceremony.