We Are ISRAEL!!!
- Thread starter BrotherD
- Start date
Douggg
anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
- May 28, 2009
- 28,762
- 3,418
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Non-Denom
- Marital Status
- Private
The Mt. Sinai covenant never provided for eternal life. The new covenant (as being another covenant) in Christ provides eternal life, and is available to persons of all nations, tongues, kindreds, people. The new covenant was established with Jesus's death on the cross and resurrection. Israel as a whole has not accepted it, yet.
Israel will turn to Jesus and the new covenant in the middle of the coming 7 year 70th week of Daniel 9:27. Revelation 12:10.
Person do not become Jews, nor the church Israel, by virtue of becoming Christians. As some are claiming to have become Israel, and they have become Jews - an erroneous teaching.
When Jesus returns, to the Mt. of Olives, it will split in half, and the Jews there, the real Israel will escape harm - as their forefathers did in the day of Uzziah, the king of Judah. To them who claim to be Israel, does that apply to them? If not, they are not a Jew, nor Israel.
Zechariah 14;4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.
___________________________________________________________________
Being a new creation in Christ, is far above any notion of becoming Israel.
Upvote
0
- Oct 29, 2017
- 55,059
- 8,092
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Messianic
- Marital Status
- Private
So we won't see Moshe in the Kingdom?
(CLV) Dn 12:1
In that era Michael shall stand up, the great chief who is standing over the sons of your people. Then an era of distress will come to pass such as has not occurred since there was a nation on the earth, until that era. Now in that era your people shall escape all those found written in the scroll.
(CLV) Dn 12:2
From those sleeping in the soil of the ground many shall awake, these to eonian life and these to reproach for eonian repulsion.
(CLV) Dn 12:3
The intelligent shall warn as the warning of the atmosphere, and those turning many to righteousness will be as the stars for the eon and further.
(CLV) Ec 12:7
And the soil returns onto the earth just as it was, And the spirit, it returns to the One, Elohim, Who gave it.
(CLV) Isa 26:19
Your dead shall live! Their carcasses shall rise! Awake and be jubilant, tabernaclers of the soil! For the dew of light is your dew, And the land shall keep the Rephaim felled.
Upvote
0
I just wanted to make a statement concerning your post.
Someone can be taught the knowledge you have described here in a relatively short period of time.
But it takes years of serious Bible study to confirm it.
Upvote
0
- Oct 29, 2017
- 55,059
- 8,092
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Messianic
- Marital Status
- Private
Nonsense!
Where in scripture can you prove that the seed of Benjamin was absorbed by the seed of Judah?
Upvote
0
- Nov 14, 2017
- 9,760
- 5,632
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Christian
- Marital Status
- Single
- Politics
- US-Others
Revelation 5:5
King James Version
And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion (Jesus) of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.
The physical promised land ...
Psalm 25:13
His soul shall dwell at ease; and his seed (all in Him) shall inherit the earth.
Psalm 37:9,11,22,29,34
For evildoers shall be cut of (the lost) but those that wait upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth…
The promised land is the earth (when made new) and His people, His Israel, His church (all believers) shall dwell with Him in the New Jerusalem.
Yes ... there is now spiritual Israel (all believers in Christ) ... the physical promised land happens at the full completion of His plan.
Revelation - Chapter 21
Yes ... and that is what the poster is bringing forth ... we are all Israel spiritually and the physical (New Jerusalem) happens when we are on the new earth and dwelling physically with Him.
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
- Jun 6, 2014
- 3,049
- 1,770
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Christian
- Marital Status
- Private
The facts are based on the written word of God. We can’t make up our own facts.
Upvote
0
- Oct 29, 2017
- 55,059
- 8,092
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Messianic
- Marital Status
- Private
Are you being intellectually honest?
Why didn't you apply the same standard to the tribe of Benjamin, as you did to the tribe of Levi? If anything Levi was absorbed when they left the Northern Kingdom, to take refuge in the Southern Kingdom, the lands of Judah and Benjamin.
Before we continue in anymore of this mental gymnastics, let me make my point perfectly clear.
The tribe of Benjamin were not gentiles. In other words, in error, you omitted them from your assertion.
Upvote
0
S.O.J.I.A.
Dynamic UNO
- Nov 6, 2016
- 4,280
- 2,641
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Christian Seeker
- Marital Status
- Single
I asked where did Jesus say..
BTW, the context of that passage is talking about Israel and not heathen nations. in fact, the whole chapter of hosea 2 is about Israel's punishment and redemption. also, the romans 9 passage is referencing hosea 1:10 as well.
1 corinthians 12:2 also comments on how those who are israelites can be called gentiles/pegans if they go astray unto idols.
but again, where does Jesus say that he was going to save other nations other than Israel?
1 Corinthians 3:10-11. the apostles aren't going to establish another foundation other than the one Jesus laid.
Upvote
0
S.O.J.I.A.
Dynamic UNO
- Nov 6, 2016
- 4,280
- 2,641
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Christian Seeker
- Marital Status
- Single
romans 11 is a big one. lets deal with that...
in this chapter the gentiles are referred to as a wild olive tree that is going to be grafted into a cultivated olive tree. the greek word for "wild olive tree" is 'agrielaios' or the oleaster which is simply a subset of the natural olive tree. these "wild olives trees" refer to the Israelite diaspora that has been spread across all nations. not spiritually but physically.
Ezekiel 11:17
Paul pretty much substantiates this in romans 11:26-32
"that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. And so all Israel will be saved"
"Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all."
romans 11 really is just Paul talking about Israelites being gathered from the heathen nations they were cast away to and brought back into the fold.
in this chapter the gentiles are referred to as a wild olive tree that is going to be grafted into a cultivated olive tree. the greek word for "wild olive tree" is 'agrielaios' or the oleaster which is simply a subset of the natural olive tree. these "wild olives trees" refer to the Israelite diaspora that has been spread across all nations. not spiritually but physically.
Ezekiel 11:17
Paul pretty much substantiates this in romans 11:26-32
"that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. And so all Israel will be saved"
"Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all."
romans 11 really is just Paul talking about Israelites being gathered from the heathen nations they were cast away to and brought back into the fold.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
You can see others have the same concern about clarity and others disagree and are in fact asserting either two-covenant or replacement theologies (erroneously).
I, personally, think one of the easiest ways to grasp Good's purpose is to realize how God used history itself as a witness to the gospel. Israel, the geo-political nation-state is nothing more than a symbol, a type, a foreshadowing of Christ crucified, resurrected and firstborn. Christ himself is the temple of God (Jn. 2:21). The church is the temple of God (1 Cor. 3:16). The OT temple was simply another image for Christ crucified and resurrected. Fundamentally the entire Bible is about Christ, not humans. Christ is Israel.
Hosea 11:1
"When Israel was a youth I loved him, And out of Egypt I called My son."
"When Israel was a youth I loved him, And out of Egypt I called My son."
Matthew 2:13-15
"Now when they had gone, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to Joseph in a dream and said, 'Get up! Take the child and his mother and flee to Egypt, and remain there until I tell you; for Herod is going to search for the child to destroy Him.' So Joseph got up and took the child and his mother while it was still night, and left for Egypt. He remained there until the death of Herod. This was to fulfill what had been spoken by the Lord through the prophet: 'Out of Egypt I called My Son.'"
"Now when they had gone, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to Joseph in a dream and said, 'Get up! Take the child and his mother and flee to Egypt, and remain there until I tell you; for Herod is going to search for the child to destroy Him.' So Joseph got up and took the child and his mother while it was still night, and left for Egypt. He remained there until the death of Herod. This was to fulfill what had been spoken by the Lord through the prophet: 'Out of Egypt I called My Son.'"
To understand the truth of "We are Israel," we must first understand the truth of "Israel is the Messiah," and the fact we are not the Messiah; we are the body of Christ, not Christ. In Christ there is neither Jew nor Gentile.
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
Douggg
anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
- May 28, 2009
- 28,762
- 3,418
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Non-Denom
- Marital Status
- Private
Not by virtue of the Mt. Sinai covenant.
But by believing on the Lord Jesus Christ, His death and resurrection, for forgiveness of sins as though they never happen.
Upvote
0
- Oct 29, 2017
- 55,059
- 8,092
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Messianic
- Marital Status
- Private
YesheYahu (Isa) 43:
11 I, even I, am YHWH; and beside Me there is no savior.
YesheYahu (Isa) 45:21-25
21 Tell and bring them near; yes let them take counsel together: who has declared this from ancient time? who has told it from that time? have not I YHWH? and there is no Elohiym else beside Me; a just Elohiym and a Savior; there is none beside Me.
22 Look to Me, and be saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am Elohiym, and there is none else.
23 I have sworn by Myself, the word is gone out of My mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That to Me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.
24 Surely, shall one say, in YHWH I have righteousness and strength: even to Him shall men come; and all that are incensed against Him shall be ashamed.
25 In YHWH shall all the seed of Israel be justified, and shall glory.
Hoshea 13:4
4 Yet I am YHWH, your Elohiym from the land of Egypt, and you shall know no ‘god’ but Me: for there is no savior besides Me.
YesheYahu (Isa) 12:2
2 Behold, Elohiym is my salvation; I will trust, and not be afraid: for Yahh YHWH is my strength and my song; He is also my salvation
Upvote
0
- Jun 25, 2018
- 9,326
- 8,735
- 55
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Baptist
- Marital Status
- Married
- Politics
- US-Republican
I'm having a difficult time figuring out even what verses your quoting (I've only been Christian these 5 years)
Can you type chapter and verse accurately? (This way I can examine scripture for myself to see the points your making)
Your translation is giving me a headache..
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
- Oct 29, 2017
- 55,059
- 8,092
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Messianic
- Marital Status
- Private
YesheYahu (Isaiah) 43:
11 I, even I, am YHWH; and beside Me there is no savior.
YesheYahu (Isaiah) 45:21-25
21 Tell and bring them near; yes let them take counsel together: who has declared this from ancient time? who has told it from that time? have not I YHWH? and there is no Elohiym else beside Me; a just Elohiym and a Savior; there is none beside Me.
22 Look to Me, and be saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am Elohiym, and there is none else.
23 I have sworn by Myself, the word is gone out of My mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That to Me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.
24 Surely, shall one say, in YHWH I have righteousness and strength: even to Him shall men come; and all that are incensed against Him shall be ashamed.
25 In YHWH shall all the seed of Israel be justified, and shall glory.
Hoshea (Hosea) 13:4
4 Yet I am YHWH, your Elohiym from the land of Egypt, and you shall know no ‘god’ but Me: for there is no savior besides Me.
YesheYahu (Isaiah) 12:2
2 Behold, Elohiym is my salvation; I will trust, and not be afraid: for Yahh YHWH is my strength and my song; He is also my salvation
(English alterations)
YHWH is the name of the Father and Elohim of our Messiah. Sorry but I won't budge when it comes to taking his name in vain.
Upvote
0
Similar threads
