"Flat Earth" or "Globe Earth"

What is the shape of the Earth?

  • "Flat Earth"

    Votes: 7 10.4%
  • "Ball Earth"

    Votes: 60 89.6%

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Jermayn

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I have begin to think really what would be the purpose of God creating an unending space with millions/billions/trillions etc.. of planets sun etc.. what would be the need for satan to focus his efforts here. Or even God in His punishment of satan, why keep satan here on earth banish him trillions of miles away.

The reason is, that this is it, this is Gods creation, The Earth and Heavens, many time this is stated in the Bible. So why does satan focus his efforts here, on earth because there is no other place to go.

He will be judged here and imprisoned here somewhere on earth in the lake of fire.
Same as the bottomless pit how can a globe earth have a bottomless pit, this pit would eventually come on on the other side of a globe earth.

People simply have to dismiss a lot of the Bible to make their beliefs square with a globe earth.

There are these things called black holes that form when stars collapse at the end of their life. They exert MASSIVE amounts of gravitational force down into a singular point from every direction. They are kind of like a pit...without a bottom, but they don't last forever. Due to Hawking radiation, they eventually die, releasing things that may be trapped inside.

You really don't even need a black hole for this bottomless pit. Any spherical shaped object in the universe would create a bottomless gravity well. Think about it. If you fell to the center of a global earth and passed the very center, you'd be going back up, and begin to fall back towards the center.
 
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JacksBratt

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I doubt that non Christians know that.
All they see are the news headlines where someone is proclaiming the end of the world, some people have given away possessions etc because they are so convinced it will happen - and all the red faces when it doesn't. If they read/hear these people say the end is coming because the Bible says ..... and then it doesn't, what are they going to think?

Well, they are non Christians.. so... not much less than they already think... If they don't know the truth of the scriptures... then they are misinformed already.

People think wrongly about truth all the time...

If they, similarly, hear Christians saying "the world is flat because the Bible says ......", and then hear other evidence that it isn't flat, the most likely conclusion they will draw is that the Bible is false and Christians don't know what they are talking about.

Oh, I agree. I certainly wouldn't be using any FE theory to save people..... I just stated that some, on their own have embraced the FE view, and as a result, on their own.... came to believe the bible.

FE is not a tool for saving the lost... not at all.



Well if they are coming to Christ, that is good - as long as they don't leave him again when they find out that they believed a lie.

"as long as"..... Many people come to Christ based on false ideas... If they truly love Christ for who Christ is... then the "real" Christians... will not leave their faith... for whatever reason, false or true.. that they have come to Him.

There are a number of people who are scientists and Christians, who believe, and teach, that the world is round - and yet still believe and read the Bible as God's word.
Yes, that would be the vast majority... right?

Like I said... for me... it's a non issue and when we die, there will be a multitude of beliefs that will be proven to be in error..when I get to glory and all is revealed to me.

The best thing we can do... is love them and continue to reinforce their walk with Christ in the areas that are solid.



Firstly, you are making the assumption that scientists are atheists. Many may be, but some are Christians, and may have become Christians since they started studying science. I have heard people say that their scientific studies affirm their belief in God and his creation, not contradict it.
Secondly, the Bible does not teach science, the shape/age of the earth or anything else - its purpose is to reveal God.
Oh, I know, I work with applied science... There are many Christian scientists.. However, you cannot deny that the vast majority of scientists.... are Atheistic Darwinian evolutionists and will tell you that God is a myth... That is the foundation that they stand on.

Have you not realized that many atheists know the bible much better than a lot of Christians? I had a very long debate, here, with an atheist that knew the scriptures very well. They challenged me to the fact that if the scriptures were true.. as I professed.. to be the inerrant word of the omniscient creator.... then... the earth must be flat....

Yes, yes.. the bible is not a science book.. but it holds a lot of truth that is shown to be truth about science... written long before man knew it.


Those are miracles, performed by the God who created this universe and has power over it. They are what happens when God shows his power and miraculously intervenes to heal, feed and save people. They reveal God, his power, his love, care and salvation.
They are completely different from saying "the Bible teaches that the earth is flat" or any particular shape.

They are truths where science was a put aside and contradicted...I'm sure that man has very much "wrong" about the way we see the world and it's ways and laws of "science".



The Bible doesn't contain the "truth about science" - that is not its purpose.

That's not it's purpose... but it does contain truths... about things that science proved later on.

There have been a tonne of scientific discoveries since the Bible was written and compiled.
Does the Bible teach about aeroplanes? Could people in Bible times have conceived that one day we would be able to go thousands of feet into the air and be taken from one place to another? Doubt it. Does the Bible teach about mobile phones, or being able to communicate like this; on a machine with someone who lives 1000s of miles away? Did Jesus say "you don't need to go into the world to make disciples; just Skype people, or go on social media"?
Scientists have discovered that all these things are possible. Are you going to ignore all modern day appliances, utilities and discoveries because the Bible doesn't teach them?

So, the bible doesn't talk about a dishwasher, or electricity... so.... all the other things that the bible did discuss, that were later proven by scientific discoveries mean nothing?

Oh, here's what many think is a biblical description of a squadron of helicopters:
Revelation 9:7-9 New King James Version (NKJV)

7 The shape of the locusts was like horses prepared for battle. On their heads were crowns of something like gold, and their faces were like the faces of men. 8 They had hair like women’s hair, and their teeth were like lions’ teeth. 9 And they had breastplates like breastplates of iron, and the sound of their wings was like the sound of chariots with many horses running into battle.



The trouble is that the verses you have quoted do not show what you say they show.
You have found a reference to "light divided", and say that it proves a prism. You have found a reference to the days of our lives being written in God's book, and say that this refers to DNA. It doesn't.

Were you expecting the word "atom" or "electron" or "proton"?

The authors of those verses, and the people listening to/reading them, would not have thought "ah yes, that is describing DNA. How amazing that God talks of this hundreds of years before scientists discover it."

Yep.. you're right, but, later on when mans knowledge caught up.. there it was all the time.



So it's not that important; certainly not worth arguing about.
Then, why are you here on this thread?



Not in the slightest.
I don't believe in a flat earth, yet I believe, and daily rejoice, that I am made in the image of a God who is love. I believe all people are made by him in his image. That is what leads me to treat people with compassion, care and understanding - they too were made by my Father. I am not unique in this belief - every Christian that I know believes in, and affirms, the love, and creativity, of God - and believes that the earth is round.
And God is not merely "close by; he is IN us, or can be if we ask him to be.
We are precious to him because he made us and his Son died for us - that is not at all the same as saying that the earth is the centre of the universe.

I don't disagree.... However, some have a different belief in the shape of the earth.... They have evidence that, to them, is solid and it backs up what they read in the scriptures.

Are there not other parts of the bible that solid Christians debate?



.
I could say the same about you.
You have been told to read the Bible a certain way and that it is somehow at odds with "evil" scientists, so you believe it.


Actually, there are many things that I have been taught, in accedemic institutions... that I have found to be incorrect. This world is Satan's domain and the best way to decieve the world is through the trusting minds of the student...

They are ready and able to be taught .. and as parents we have told them to trust those who teach...

If you listen to Ben Shapiro or Jordan Peterson, you will understand that the schools are Marxist and far left institutions of recruitment for the left.
 
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BobRyan

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What do you think is the shape of the Earth?

Is it a circular, relatively flat disk with a dome (firmament) over it. Or is it a ball in space?

Based on my reading of the scriptures, it is the former. However, I want to hear what you have to say.

It is a globe - because as scripture says "Job 26:10 10He marks out the horizon on the face of the waters for a boundary between light and darkness." -- which with a very large sun -- can only happen on a globe.
 
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JackRT

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There are these things called black holes that form when stars collapse at the end of their life. They exert MASSIVE amounts of gravitational force down into a singular point from every direction. They are kind of like a pit...without a bottom, but they don't last forever. Due to Hawking radiation, they eventually die, releasing things that may be trapped inside.

You really don't even need a black hole for this bottomless pit. Any spherical shaped object in the universe would create a bottomless gravity well. Think about it. If you fell to the center of a global earth and passed the very center, you'd be going back up, and begin to fall back towards the center.

In a reality planets gravity acts quite differently than the singularity of a Black Hole. If it were possible to drill a hole through the centre of a planet, you would actually notice gravity decreasing as you descended until you would be weightless at the centre.
 
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Jermayn

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In a reality planets gravity acts quite differently than the singularity of a Black Hole. If it were possible to drill a hole through the centre of a planet, you would actually notice gravity decreasing as you descended until you would be weightless at the centre.

Yes, this makes sense, as the mass of the planet would be above you.
 
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Zachm531

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You can go to any beach in the world and watch the ships sail over the horizon, or watch a lunar eclipse. Are we really having this debate right now???
Yep and if you pull out a high powered camera and zoom in you can still plainly see the the ship. And a lunar eclipse does not change the view of flat earth at all. It works better with two smaller, local great lights
 
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JacksBratt

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Under your theory then the fine folks in china should see the sunrise at the same time as those in New York.




case closed you lose
I am not a FE believer. However, I have researched the FE beliefs and model and it is, in my opinion, that this is necessary before you comment on things such as this.

The model is well thought out and your point is incorrect. The working of the sun and moon is well established on the FE model and in tune with what we observe.

If you take the time to look into it you will be surprised at how many things that we hold as proof of the globe, are in fact not...

Furthermore, even experiments like the one of Eratosthenes where the sun shines down a well or the sticks shadows are different lengths... are workable and can support either model.

Be careful though.. Many have started where you are standing.. and.. after looking into it.. ended up speaking at FE conferences....
 
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JacksBratt

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Do flat earthers think we are going to be battling a giant 7 headed Godzilla in the end times too?
I've listened to a lot of FE speakers... never heard of this.

Where did you find this concept? Or, is it just a opportunity for you to insult those that believe differently than you?
 
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JacksBratt

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There are these things called black holes that form when stars collapse at the end of their life. They exert MASSIVE amounts of gravitational force down into a singular point from every direction. They are kind of like a pit...without a bottom, but they don't last forever. Due to Hawking radiation, they eventually die, releasing things that may be trapped inside.

You really don't even need a black hole for this bottomless pit. Any spherical shaped object in the universe would create a bottomless gravity well. Think about it. If you fell to the center of a global earth and passed the very center, you'd be going back up, and begin to fall back towards the center.
I understand the "concept" of black holes.. I do believe that they have even said that they have located them and can "hear" them...

However, that is just faith in people that write down long math equations on a chalk board..
They could be real... may not even be.. Might just be fluff and mathematical theory..

And, just because a certain number of men and women all agree... doesn't make it true.

Admit it.. they could be making all of this up.. and you would never know
 
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JacksBratt

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It is a globe - because as scripture says "Job 26:10 10He marks out the horizon on the face of the waters for a boundary between light and darkness." -- which with a very large sun -- can only happen on a globe.
You are right... "with a very large sun".

Now, step back and think. If the sun is small and close... that changes everything. We are conditioned to believe that the sun is massive and very far away. Yet, it appears the exact... the exact same size as our moon, from our vantage point here on earth...

Then we have these:

upload_2020-2-8_11-3-38.jpeg


Crepuscular rays... These are much more explainable if the sun is very close.. A sun millions of miles away would give ALL parallel rays... A close sun would be a more realistic explanation for this splaying of the rays from a closer light source.
 
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Strong in Him

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'4 corners of the earth' and 'pillars of the earth' are figurative expressions.

I know they are.
But some people seem to think that if the Bible "mentions" a flat earth, it's teaching a scientific fact; that's it, case closed. I just wondered what their reaction was to the teaching that the earth has 4 corners and stands on pillars?
It would be inconsistent to say that one was scientific fact and the other only poetry.
 
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d taylor

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The Bible doesn't describe the shape of God's creation; that is not its purpose.
The Bible talks about the 4 corners of the earth, Ezekiel 7:2, Revelation 7:1 and also the pillars of the earth, Job 9:6; Psalms 75:3. Is the earth square or rectangular? What are these pillars it stands on and what do they stand on/are they anchored to? What about the pillars of heaven, Job 26:11? What do they stand on?

Do you believe in the trinity.
 
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Chris V++

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I know they are.
But some people seem to think that if the Bible "mentions" a flat earth, it's teaching a scientific fact; that's it, case closed. I just wondered what their reaction was to the teaching that the earth has 4 corners and stands on pillars?
It would be inconsistent to say that one was scientific fact and the other only poetry.
Sorry:sorry: I though you were arguing for a four cornered flat earth held up by pillars :)
 
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d taylor

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Of course.

I do too, also believe in the Trinity.

As you say the Bible never says God created a flat earth.
But the Bible also never states God exist as a Trinity.

But like the flat earth God created, through the descriptions given in the Bible a person can come to understand that God exist as a Trinity. That also through the descriptions given a person when the believe Gods word from Genesis to Revelation can see, Gods created creation is not a Globe out in a non existent unending outer space.

But that His creation is much greater than the satanic lie. The King is above His kingdom looking down.

God gave Ezekiel a look at His place above His creation in Ezekiel 1 right through the raqia where in Genesis 1 God states He placed the created lights the sun, moon and stars above the earth to give light on the earth.

Not in a man/satan made up outer space thousands and millions and trillions+ miles away.
 
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d taylor

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I guess if science would come out with a theory that God is not a Trinity.

Many believers in the Trinity, would change their belief from believing that God exist as a Trinity, to not believing God exist as a Trinity. So they could square their beliefs with science.
 
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I do too, also believe in the Trinity.

As you say the Bible never says God created a flat earth.
But the Bible also never states God exist as a Trinity.

There are a number of verses that speak of the plurality of God.
Genesis 1:26 - "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness". The word for God is in its plural form here.
Genesis 11:6-7 - "The Lord said ..... 'let us go down and confuse their language'."
Isaiah 6:8 - "Who will go for us?"

The Christian Gospel is about the fact that the Word, who is God, became flesh - God himself took on flesh, and God himself paid the price for our sin.
Jesus told his disciples to baptise in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit, Matthew 28:19-20.
The Father, he Son and the Spirit are all God, yet there is only one God.

But like the flat earth God created, through the descriptions given in the Bible a person can come to understand that God exist as a Trinity.

I read the Bible and see God as a Trinity.
I do not read the Bible and see, or learn, that the earth is flat.

That also through the descriptions given a person when the believe Gods word from Genesis to Revelation can see, Gods created creation is not a Globe out in a non existent unending outer space.

The Bible says that God created the world and the universe.
It does not teach any more than that; it does not talk of other planets and the earth's position in relation to them. It doesn't talk about the nature and structure of the Solar system; only says that God made it.

But that His creation is much greater than the satanic lie.

Satanic lie? What Satanic lie?
I am certain that Satan wants to keep people's eyes off Jesus and uses any academic debate or niggling argument he can think of to distract us from God. But he doesn't care about the shape of the earth, or anything - as long as it's not cross shaped, because that's where his power was broken.

The King is above His kingdom looking down.

The King is among us and in us - if we ask him to be - and wants us to proclaim his kingdom and take it everywhere.

God gave Ezekiel a look at His place above His creation in Ezekiel 1 right through the raqia where in Genesis 1 God states He placed the created lights the sun, moon and stars above the earth to give light on the earth.

Not in a man/satan made up outer space thousands and millions and trillions+ miles away.

GOD made outer space.
Genesis makes it clear that God created everything. John 1:1-3 makes it clear that nothing was created without Jesus.
 
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