Trump affirms religious liberty in State of the Union: ‘We don’t punish prayer…tear down crosses’

redleghunter

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Donald Trump comes along speaking eloquent Christianese, with grandeur promises of promoting and endorsing their personal Christian faith. He basically promises to deliver them from what they see as the evils of liberalism. He's a cunning man and he knows how to persuade people into following him.
Were the executive policies of Obama helpful to Christians in their 1st Amendment free exercise of religion?

For example, did Obama’s abortion and birth control mandate help or hinder the Sisters of the Poor and other Christian churches opposed to abortion and abortifacient drugs?
 
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redleghunter

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I think it's truly disheartening that he is the man who represents the Office of the Presidency, the Republican Party, and America itself. It's almost as disconcerting as him being associated with the Christian faith.
Opinion noted. However, you have not provided evidence Trump is hostile to Christian churches freely exercising their religion.
 
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redleghunter

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I believe everyone should be free, not only those I agree with, but modern progressives don't feel the same, and have set forth attacking those who try to uphold their Christian faith...

I worry that if one of these progressives should rise to power, our freedoms will be a thing of the past and I absolutely appreciate the concerted effort to make sure our courts will keep us free for a little while longer..
President Obama already started this. With the Obama abortion and birth control mandate he put religious groups as the Roman Catholic Sisters of the Poor in a position where they had to sue to maintain their free exercise of religion.
 
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ArmenianJohn

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Do you believe, for example, a Catholic school should be able to apply their church beliefs when hiring teachers?
Of course. You really want to use the Catholic Church as an example?
 
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redleghunter

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Of course. You really want to use the Catholic Church as an example?
Why not apply the Catholic Church as we both know their catechism.

So you believe a Catholic school should be able to not select a teacher based on being in a same sex marriage and be protected under Amendment 1 of the US Constitution for doing so?
 
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ArmenianJohn

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Why not apply the Catholic Church as we both know their catechism.

So you believe a Catholic school should be able to not select a teacher based on being in a same sex marriage and be protected under Amendment 1 of the US Constitution for doing so?
Yes. I'm also against abortion. But these are two out of many, many issues. As for the Catholic Church, if they want to discriminate on homosexuality then they need to first stop shuffling around homosexual, pedophile priests. Hard to defend their not wanting to hire someone in a same-sex marriage when they are still harboring pedophiles in their clergy.

Conservatives, on the other hand, want to impose on us laws that prevent us from serving the Lord. For example, I'm coerced into supporting the killing of children at the border with my tax money. I'm coerced into giving tax money so that families can be separated which is against my Christian beliefs. What I fear is that we will get another four years or more of conservatives pushing through anti-Christian legislation that attacks my Christian faith. My freedoms are sold to the corporations with the most money, particularly in the military-industrial complex and prison-industrial complex, as well as big oil, media, the NRA, and on and on.
 
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joshua 1 9

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I watched most of it.
Most of his talk was based on buzz words: "Jobs are booming, incomes are soaring, poverty is plummeting, crime is falling, confidence is surging, our country is thriving. Our enemies are on the run and America is respected again. We are no longer used, abused and taken advantage of. Gone are the broken promises and endless excuses". He goes in like this for about an hour.
 
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GACfan

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Yes. I'm also against abortion. But these are two out of many, many issues. As for the Catholic Church, if they want to discriminate on homosexuality then they need to first stop shuffling around homosexual, pedophile priests. Hard to defend their not wanting to hire someone in a same-sex marriage when they are still harboring pedophiles in their clergy.

I don't consider the Catholic Church as a prime example for morality either.

Conservatives, on the other hand, want to impose on us laws that prevent us from serving the Lord. For example, I'm coerced into supporting the killing of children at the border with my tax money. I'm coerced into giving tax money so that families can be separated which is against my Christian beliefs. What I fear is that we will get another four years or more of conservatives pushing through anti-Christian legislation that attacks my Christian faith. My freedoms are sold to the corporations with the most money, particularly in the military-industrial complex and prison-industrial complex, as well as big oil, media, the NRA, and on and on.

Well said.
 
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redleghunter

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Yes. I'm also against abortion. But these are two out of many, many issues. As for the Catholic Church, if they want to discriminate on homosexuality then they need to first stop shuffling around homosexual, pedophile priests. Hard to defend their not wanting to hire someone in a same-sex marriage when they are still harboring pedophiles in their clergy.

Conservatives, on the other hand, want to impose on us laws that prevent us from serving the Lord. For example, I'm coerced into supporting the killing of children at the border with my tax money. I'm coerced into giving tax money so that families can be separated which is against my Christian beliefs. What I fear is that we will get another four years or more of conservatives pushing through anti-Christian legislation that attacks my Christian faith. My freedoms are sold to the corporations with the most money, particularly in the military-industrial complex and prison-industrial complex, as well as big oil, media, the NRA, and on and on.
You really did not address what I presented but went off on a tangent. Would you like to address the following?

So you believe a Catholic school should be able to not select a teacher based on being in a same sex marriage and be protected under Amendment 1 of the US Constitution for doing so?
 
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redleghunter

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I don't consider the Catholic Church as a prime example for morality either.



Well said.
Would you like to actually address the issue?

So you believe a Catholic school should be able to not select a teacher based on being in a same sex marriage and be protected under Amendment 1 of the US Constitution for doing so?
 
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redleghunter

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Most of his talk was based on buzz words: "Jobs are booming, incomes are soaring, poverty is plummeting, crime is falling, confidence is surging, our country is thriving. Our enemies are on the run and America is respected again. We are no longer used, abused and taken advantage of. Gone are the broken promises and endless excuses". He goes in like this for about an hour.
Which are tangible accomplishments. But not the subject of the OP.
 
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MournfulWatcher

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Here is what conservative Christians are afraid of, for those wondering:

Masterpiece Cakeshop Owner Sued Again after Refusing to Bake ‘Gender Transition’ Cake | National Review
Masterpiece Cakeshop is being brought to court yet again.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ly-pizzeria-wont-cater-gay-weddings/70813430/
Pizzeria that won't cater gay weddings closes after receiving wave of backlash and threats.

US supreme court declines appeal of photographer who refused gay couple
Christian photography business brought to court for refusing to shoot gay wedding.

https://nypost.com/2019/11/01/woman-whacks-elderly-subway-preacher-with-high-heels-video/
An elderly Christian preacher attacked on the NYC subway, and has to get stitches.

Rainbow Cake Girl: The True Story | The American Conservative
Rainbow Cake Girl: The True Story | The American Conservative
The media slandered a Christian school over a girl who was supposedly expelled for simply posting a picture with a rainbow birthday cake, which was an outright lie that resulted in thousands of death threats and harassment letters/phone calls to those working at the school.

O’Rourke says churches against gay marriage should lose tax benefits, draws backlash
A Democratic presidential candidate suggested that Churches and religious schools or organizations are immoral for their stance against homosexuality and should be pressured by the government to accept it, without receiving any significant counters from his fellow candidates, who disagreed with specifically pressuring churches, but agreed with pressuring other private Christian institutions by removing financial benefits.
“Yes,” O’Rourke replied. “There can be no reward, no benefit, no tax break for anyone, or any institution, any organization in America, that denies the full human rights and the full civil rights of every single one of us. And so as president, we are going to make that a priority, and we are going to stop those who are infringing upon the human rights of our fellow Americans.”

Joe Biden (Text Join to 30330) on Twitter
Democratic candidate Joe Biden tweeted that there can be "no room for compromise" when it comes to transgender issues.

Christian Concern
We also are seeing what is happening to conservative Christians in other Western countries that have rapidly shifted towards Progressive policies, in places like Canada and the UK. We see the same attitude in virtually all Democrat politicians, who leave no room for compromise, and push for bills such as the so called Equality Bill (inspired by other countries progressive bills) which will force institutions to legally recognize gender ideology. The result of similar bills in places like the UK has been oppressive to conservative Christians. A youtube channel called "Christian Concern" is a UK organization that documents and informs people of what is happening to conservative Christians there. Their channel tells these multiple stories, including an elementary school girl who was suspended for saying she did not want to participate in LGBT Pride Week at her school, a man in a wheelchair dragged away by police officers for praying on the lawn of an abortion clinic, a Christian actress who was forced out of her career when people discovered her beliefs, a street preacher who was arrested after a crowd swarmed him and caused a scene, a woman who was convicted by a judge for refusing to use transgender pronouns and who was told by the judge that such beliefs were "not worthy of respect in a democratic society", and many, many more.

Lastly, I have my own personal experience of losing a scholarship and being failed in my Choir class for refusing to participate in a concert that was done in support of the LGBT movement, as well as the other seven young women who stood with me side by side to appeal for our rights, but were denied even the opportunity to refuse to sing the parts we disagreed with. I learned that I could not trust progressive Christians to stand up for our rights even if we disagreed (the choir director who kicked us out goes to a Methodist church), and watched as our FERPA rights were violated as the choir director informed the choirs that certain people would not be participating in the concert because of their religious beliefs. None but one professor came to our defense. The provost, dean of students, and other department higher ups turned us away.

This story is not unique; many others have experienced similar strife from liberal educators, corporations, judges, politicians, and media. I have more examples than what I have posted here. But I can assure naysayers, our fears are not imagined. I learned that a year and a half ago in my choir director's office as he told us there would be "consequences for [our] actions".
 
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redleghunter

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Here is what conservative Christians are afraid of, for those wondering:

Masterpiece Cakeshop Owner Sued Again after Refusing to Bake ‘Gender Transition’ Cake | National Review
Masterpiece Cakeshop is being brought to court yet again.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ly-pizzeria-wont-cater-gay-weddings/70813430/
Pizzeria that won't cater gay weddings closes after receiving wave of backlash and threats.

US supreme court declines appeal of photographer who refused gay couple
Christian photography business brought to court for refusing to shoot gay wedding.

https://nypost.com/2019/11/01/woman-whacks-elderly-subway-preacher-with-high-heels-video/
An elderly Christian preacher attacked on the NYC subway, and has to get stitches.

Rainbow Cake Girl: The True Story | The American Conservative
Rainbow Cake Girl: The True Story | The American Conservative

The media slandered a Christian school over a girl who was supposedly expelled for simply posting a picture with a rainbow birthday cake, which was an outright lie that resulted in thousands of death threats and harassment letters/phone calls to those working at the school.

O’Rourke says churches against gay marriage should lose tax benefits, draws backlash
A Democratic presidential candidate suggested that Churches and religious schools or organizations are immoral for their stance against homosexuality and should be pressured by the government to accept it, without receiving any significant counters from his fellow candidates, who disagreed with specifically pressuring churches, but agreed with pressuring other private Christian institutions by removing financial benefits.
“Yes,” O’Rourke replied. “There can be no reward, no benefit, no tax break for anyone, or any institution, any organization in America, that denies the full human rights and the full civil rights of every single one of us. And so as president, we are going to make that a priority, and we are going to stop those who are infringing upon the human rights of our fellow Americans.”

Joe Biden (Text Join to 30330) on Twitter
Democratic candidate Joe Biden tweeted that there can be "no room for compromise" when it comes to transgender issues.

Christian Concern
We also are seeing what is happening to conservative Christians in other Western countries that have rapidly shifted towards Progressive policies, in places like Canada and the UK. We see the same attitude in virtually all Democrat politicians, who leave no room for compromise, and push for bills such as the so called Equality Bill (inspired by other countries progressive bills) which will force institutions to legally recognize gender ideology. The result of similar bills in places like the UK has been oppressive to conservative Christians. A youtube channel called "Christian Concern" is a UK organization that documents and informs people of what is happening to conservative Christians there. Their channel tells these multiple stories, including an elementary school girl who was suspended for saying she did not want to participate in LGBT Pride Week at her school, a man in a wheelchair dragged away by police officers for praying on the lawn of an abortion clinic, a Christian actress who was forced out of her career when people discovered her beliefs, a street preacher who was arrested after a crowd swarmed him and caused a scene, a woman who was convicted by a judge for refusing to use transgender pronouns and who was told by the judge that such beliefs were "not worthy of respect in a democratic society", and many, many more.

Lastly, I have my own personal experience of losing a scholarship and being failed in my Choir class for refusing to participate in a concert that was done in support of the LGBT movement, as well as the other seven young women who stood with me side by side to appeal for our rights, but were denied even the opportunity to refuse to sing the parts we disagreed with. I learned that I could not trust progressive Christians to stand up for our rights even if we disagreed (the choir director who kicked us out goes to a Methodist church), and watched as our FERPA rights were violated as the choir director informed the choirs that certain people would not be participating in the concert because of their religious beliefs. None but one professor came to our defense. The provost, dean of students, and other department higher ups turned us away.

This story is not unique; many others have experienced similar strife from liberal educators, corporations, judges, politicians, and media. I have more examples than what I have posted here. But I can assure naysayers, our fears are not imagined. I learned that a year and a half ago in my choir director's office as he told us there would be "consequences for [our] actions".
Now wait for the ambiguous slander you receive here at a Christian site on a Christian only area.
 
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redleghunter

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Lastly, I have my own personal experience of losing a scholarship and being failed in my Choir class for refusing to participate in a concert that was done in support of the LGBT movement, as well as the other seven young women who stood with me side by side to appeal for our rights, but were denied even the opportunity to refuse to sing the parts we disagreed with. I learned that I could not trust progressive Christians to stand up for our rights even if we disagreed (the choir director who kicked us out goes to a Methodist church), and watched as our FERPA rights were violated as the choir director informed the choirs that certain people would not be participating in the concert because of their religious beliefs. None but one professor came to our defense. The provost, dean of students, and other department higher ups turned us away.
I am so sorry your religious liberty which is protected by the 1st Amendment was not supported by your choir director who claims to be Christian as well.

I believe you are showing grace in your comments as I’m sure this blatant discrimination against your faith, you also received unkind and slanderous comments from others in the choir.
 
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joshua 1 9

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So you believe a Catholic school should be able to not select a teacher based on being in a same sex marriage and be protected under Amendment 1 of the US Constitution for doing so?
The issue on the table is if we the people should allow people to choose their own education. Rather then to only provide a public education. `
 
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redleghunter

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The issue on the table is if we the people should allow people to choose their own education. Rather then to only provide a public education. `
That is another good issue but not relevant to the OP.
 
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MournfulWatcher

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I am so sorry your religious liberty which is protected by the 1st Amendment was not supported by your choir director who claims to be Christian as well.

I believe you are showing grace in your comments as I’m sure this blatant discrimination against your faith, you also received unkind and slanderous comments from others in the choir.
Thank you. Thankfully, I am not very involved with the music department, so I did not receive any ill comments. The rest who are actual music majors have had worse directed at them, but thankfully the controversy has died down, although the vague feeling of dissatisfaction and uneasiness remains. We worked hard to stay under the radar with our peers.
 
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joshua 1 9

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Do you believe, for example, a Catholic school should be able to apply their church beliefs when hiring teachers?
That is an exercise of their religious liberty.
 
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joshua 1 9

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So you believe a Catholic school should be able to not select a teacher based on being in a same sex marriage and be protected under Amendment 1 of the US Constitution for doing so?
Now your changing the subject. Same sex marriage is not religious liberty. It maybe a 1st Amendment issue. Are you suggesting that there is a contradiction in the Constitution? Does giving rights to same sex marriage violate our religious freedom and our religious rights? The court already ruled on the wedding cake issue. You have to sell them a cake but you do not have to decorate the cake in way that you approve of what they are doing. We have the freedom NOT to give our approval to others if what they are doing is in conflict with what we believe.

The parable of the tax collector deal with this sort of self righteousness. "But the tax collector stood at a distance, unwilling even to lift up his eyes to heaven. Instead, he beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner!’ I tell you, this man, rather than the Pharisee, went home justified. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but the one who humbles himself will be exalted.” (Luke 18:13)

 
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