Gog & Magog

Andrewn

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**THIS IS _NOT_ THE DISPENSATIONALISM FORUM**

Israel shares borders with Egypt, Jordan, Syria, and Lebanon. It's interesting that none of these countries are mentioned in the coalition that invades Israel in the end-time war of Gog and Magog (Ezekiel 38).

I find this interesting bec it never made sense in the past but it makes political sense now. Egypt and Jordan have amicable relationships with Israel. Syria is occupied by Russia. And Lebanon is occupied by Iran.

Do you think this war is immanent?
 
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keras

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The attack by Gog and his horde is not the next Prophesied event.
That will be the Sixth Seal, Day of the Lord's fiery wrath, Revelation 6:12-17, 2 Peter 3:7, Psalms 83, Zephaniah 1:14-18, +, that will change the world and set the scene for all that must happen before Jesus Returns.

When Gog attacks, he will come down upon a people living peacefully, undefended and trusting in God for their protection. Ezekiel 38:11 He will wipe Gog and his army out, Ezekiel 38:19, in order to display His power and make Himself known. Ezekiel 38:23

The people in the holy Land then, will be the Lord's faithful believers, the Christians, His Israelites by faith. Galatians 3:26-29
They will call their nation Beulah, Isaiah 62:1-7, and will choose their own leaders. Hosea 1:11, Jeremiah 30:21
 
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Douggg

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**THIS IS _NOT_ THE DISPENSATIONALISM FORUM**

Israel shares borders with Egypt, Jordan, Syria, and Lebanon. It's interesting that none of these countries are mentioned in the coalition that invades Israel in the end-time war of Gog and Magog (Ezekiel 38).

I find this interesting bec it never made sense in the past but it makes political sense now. Egypt and Jordan have amicable relationships with Israel. Syria is occupied by Russia. And Lebanon is occupied by Iran.

Do you think this war is immanent?
imminent, that it could be triggered quickly. But not imminent in order of events, because the ten kings and the little horn person must be in power before it happens. Gog/Magog should take place sometime within the next ten years, thereabouts. imo, sooner than later.
 
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Douggg

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The attack by Gog and his horde is not the next Prophesied event.
That will be the Sixth Seal, Day of the Lord's fiery wrath, Revelation 6:12-17, 2 Peter 3:7, Psalms 83, Zephaniah 1:14-18, +, that will change the world and set the scene for all that must happen before Jesus Returns.

When Gog attacks, he will come down upon a people living peacefully, undefended and trusting in God for their protection. Ezekiel 38:11 He will wipe Gog and his army out, Ezekiel 38:19, in order to display His power and make Himself known. Ezekiel 38:23

The people in the holy Land then, will be the Lord's faithful believers, the Christians, His Israelites by faith. Galatians 3:26-29
They will call their nation Beulah, Isaiah 62:1-7, and will choose their own leaders. Hosea 1:11, Jeremiah 30:21
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4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.
 
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keras

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keras

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The second chapter of Joel up to verse 28, is a sequence of events.

Verse 1- 11 is the Day of the Lord’s vengeance/ Middle East devastation/ Sixth Seal.

V 12-17 A call for the repentance of His people. V 18-19 They gather into the Land.

V 20 The Gog and Magog war. V 21-26 People of Zion, rejoice, I shall recompense you.

V 27 You will know that I am present in Israel and I am your God. This verse parallels Ezekiel 39:28 It is by His deeds that He is known, not by His presence, until His Return, after the Tribulation, therefore, all the above happens before that.

Joel 2:18-20 Then, the Lord showed His ardent love for His Land and was moved with compassion for His people. He answered their appeal and gave them food in plenty. I shall expose you to the danger of attack no longer. I shall remove the Northern peril [Gog and Magog] far from you, into the desert areas. The leading troops will be near the Dead Sea and the rearguard by the Mediterranean. Their rotting stench will rise up! The Lord has done great things!
 
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claninja

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**THIS IS _NOT_ THE DISPENSATIONALISM FORUM**

Israel shares borders with Egypt, Jordan, Syria, and Lebanon. It's interesting that none of these countries are mentioned in the coalition that invades Israel in the end-time war of Gog and Magog (Ezekiel 38).

I find this interesting bec it never made sense in the past but it makes political sense now. Egypt and Jordan have amicable relationships with Israel. Syria is occupied by Russia. And Lebanon is occupied by Iran.

Do you think this war is immanent?

God spoke to the prophets of Israel in Dreams/visions/parables/riddles (numbers 12:6-8, hosea 12:10). Thus we should use the NT to help us interpret these dreams/visions/parables/riddles.

I would argue the God's sacrificial feast that is prepared for "you" points to the cross. For we eat Christ's flesh and drink His blood for eternal life.


Ezekiel 39:17 As for you, son of man, thus says the Lord GOD: Speak to the birds of every sort and to all beasts of the field: ‘Assemble and come, gather from all around to my sacrificial feast that I am preparing for you, a great sacrificial feast on the mountains of Israel, and you shall eat flesh and drink blood

John 6:54 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.

I would argue the kings of the earth gathering against Christ refers to Pilate, herod, the gentiles, and Jews, crucifying Christ. Again pointing to the cross.

Revelation 19:19 Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth with their armies gathered together to wage war against the One seated on the horse, and against His army

Acts 4:25-27 You spoke by the Holy Spirit through the mouth of Your servant,c our father David ‘Why do the nations rage and the peoples plot in vain? The kings of the earth take their stand and the rulers gather together against the Lord and against His Anointed One.’ In fact, this is the very city where Herod and Pontius Pilate conspired with the Gentiles and the people of Israel against Your holy servant Jesus, whom You anointed.
 
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keras

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No, I am saying that it is Jews, who become Christians during the second half of the seven years, because it is their ancestors who escaped harm in similarly fashion in the days of Uzziah, King of Israel.
This teaching is a construct of the 'rapture' theory, where the Church goes to heaven and the Jews go thru the GT and then convert. Neither idea is scripturally supported.
I can and have; provided dozens of scriptures that prove both ideas are wrong and will never happen.
 
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Andrewn

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The attack by Gog and his horde is not the next Prophesied event.
That will be the Sixth Seal, Day of the Lord's fiery wrath, Revelation 6:12-17, 2 Peter 3:7, Psalms 83, Zephaniah 1:14-18, +, that will change the world and set the scene for all that must happen before Jesus Returns.

When Gog attacks, he will come down upon a people living peacefully, undefended and trusting in God for their protection. Ezekiel 38:11 He will wipe Gog and his army out, Ezekiel 38:19, in order to display His power and make Himself known. Ezekiel 38:23
Being Amil, myself, I think the wars of Armageddon and Gog & Magog are the same.
 
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keras

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Being Amil, myself, I think the wars of Armageddon and Gog & Magog are the same.
Impossible. Just read the descriptions of, the reasons for and the results of both those battles, is proof enough that they are quite separate.
G/M comes first, then when Jesus Returns, Armageddon takes place.
 
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Douggg

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Being Amil, myself, I think the wars of Armageddon and Gog & Magog are the same.
If you look at Ezekiel 39:17-20, those verses correspond to Revelation 19:17-18, which is the Armageddon event.

However - those verses follow Gog/Magog by 7 years. The feast on Gog's army is in Ezekiel 39:4.

When Gog/Magog invades Israel, she will be living in a state of rest, and security (Ezekiel 38:11). Which doesn't match the conditions when Armageddon takes place at the end of the great tribulation.

So it will be Gog/Magog. Then the 7 years of Daniel 9:27. Ending with Armageddon in Ezekiel 39:17-20.
 
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keras

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If you look at Ezekiel 39:17-20, those verses correspond to Revelation 19:17-18, which is the Armageddon event.
But it isn't the same event at all.
There are similarities but Ezekiel 39:17 says the G/M army is God's sacrifice and Armageddon is a simple disposal operation.
The description of beasts and birds feasting on the dead, is just metaphorical for a huge slaughter.
There are virtually no wild beasts or carrion birds around, in anywhere of the holy land today.
 
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Douggg

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There are similarities but Ezekiel 39:17 says the G/M army is God's sacrifice and Armageddon is a simple disposal operation.
The underlined is a terrible inaccurate denigrating characterization of Armageddon. Armageddon is at Jesus's return. Gog/Magog is 7 years earlier. And that is 100% zero chance of being wrong.

The Gog/Magog event ends in Ezekiel 39:16, which is the concluding statement of how the land will have been cleansed. Read the text, keras. Ezekiel 39:11-16 is all about cleaning the land post Gog/Magog. Then in Ezekiel 39:17-20, Ezekiel is told to prophesy again about a different feast. And Jesus himself is speaking in Ezekiel 39:21-29.


11 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will give unto Gog a place there of graves in Israel, the valley of the passengers on the east of the sea: and it shall stop the noses of the passengers: and there shall they bury Gog and all his multitude: and they shall call it The valley of Hamongog.

12 And seven months shall the house of Israel be burying of them, that they may cleanse the land.

13 Yea, all the people of the land shall bury them; and it shall be to them a renown the day that I shall be glorified, saith the Lord GOD.

14 And they shall sever out men of continual employment, passing through the land to bury with the passengers those that remain upon the face of the earth, to cleanse it: after the end of seven months shall they search.

15 And the passengers that pass through the land, when any seeth a man's bone, then shall he set up a sign by it, till the buriers have buried it in the valley of Hamongog.

16 And also the name of the city shall be Hamonah. Thus shall they cleanse the land.
 
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Over three hours of methodical proof, and your refutation is simply "they are clueless?"

What critical flaw did you find in their work, which would warrant such a tall claim as to dismiss the entire body of their extensive research?
 
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Douggg

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Over three hours of methodical proof, and your refutation is simply "they are clueless?"

What critical flaw did you find in their work, which would warrant such a tall claim as to dismiss the entire body of their extensive research?
As soon as the speaker started in video 3 exposing on Revelation 12 about what John saw in heaven - not realizing that John was being presented the vision - and it was not intended to be an account at the time of creation, which no-one is claiming in the first place - the speaker was making a straw-man argument. And as soon as the speaker declares there is no gap between the 69th and 70th week of Daniel 9. That's when I stopped watching that video.
,
In the video,

in which the speaker identifies tubal and meshech as regions around the world including the United States, South America, South Africa, Japan at 1:22.15 near the end of the video.

I did not watched most of the other video's because I had already gave two hours of my time for for the speaker never actually getting around to Gog-Magog the attack, and the speaker never acknowledged that it is Jesus Himself speaking in Ezekiel 39:21-29 having returned to the earth (in the future). Which was especially disappointing because of the lead in, the speaker gave about "Fresh Revelation" his group "The God Culture" had discovered regarding Gog/Magog in hype.

If you can provide a synopsis of highlights of the videos in specified terms - it would be appreciated. Like when does the speaker claim Gog/Magog's attack on Israel will take place.
 
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Andrewn

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G/M comes first, then when Jesus Returns, Armageddon takes place.
I don't understand your timeline. Usually, Premils say that Armageddon takes place at beginning of the Millennium and G/M at its end.
 
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Andrewn

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