LDS Mormonism and Non-Mormons

Jamesone5

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Aug 7, 2019
1,758
318
Basin
✟97,413.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
For us there is only one God the Father and He is the God of LOVE.

A country singer can say they know about love or loving their dog and/or their wife. An atheist even can say they love someone.

What makes you think you have this special love from God?
 
Upvote 0

He is the way

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2018
8,103
359
Murray
✟113,072.00
Country
United States
Faith
Mormon
Marital Status
Married
Nice try. The word "as" is the problem there

Isaiah 29:10

11 And the vision of all is become unto you as the words of a book that is sealed, which men deliver to one that is learned, saying, Read this, I pray thee: and he saith, I cannot; for it is sealed:

Kind of like a disease with Mormons who never seem to read a verse fully and/or take it out of context.
I still see nothing wrong with Isaiah's vision and prophesy. the word "as" changes nothing.
 
Upvote 0

He is the way

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2018
8,103
359
Murray
✟113,072.00
Country
United States
Faith
Mormon
Marital Status
Married
A country singer can say they know about love or loving their dog and/or their wife. An atheist even can say they love someone.

What makes you think you have this special love from God?

Anyone can have that LOVE if they keep the commandments:

(New Testament | John 15:10)

10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
 
Upvote 0
Dec 16, 2011
5,208
2,548
57
Home
Visit site
✟234,667.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Anyone can have that LOVE if they keep the commandments:

(New Testament | John 15:10)

10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
One of the commandments is to refrain from worshiping false gods, because there is only One God and all the others are demons. Mormon theology results in gods who are false, so that anyone who embraces those gods is worshiping demons. It is impossible, therefore, for a Mormon believer to become perfected by obeying all the commandments. That is not to say that they are of necessity completely lacking in grace. But they can't receive a fullness of grace.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: 1 person
Upvote 0

Jamesone5

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Aug 7, 2019
1,758
318
Basin
✟97,413.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Anyone can have that LOVE if they keep the commandments:

(New Testament | John 15:10)

10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

so, tell me ---those who don't receive his love are those who break His commandments?. I though He was the God of love. Or really only those who keep his commandments? He must hates the whole human race according to you as "All have Sinned and fall short of the Glory of God" ---Romans 3:23

We've been through this before
1 John 4:19
We love Him because He first loved us.

And

1 John 4:8-10 (NKJV)
8 He who does not love does not know God, for God is love.In this the love of God was manifested toward us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through Him. 10 In this is love,not that we loved God, but that He loved us and sent His Son to be the propitiation for our sins.

Do you understand what manifested love is? Can you claim to have received it when we are definitely in a disagreement about God OR really, how many God's you Mormons worship?.

And---- what it means to live through Him?
 
Last edited:
  • Winner
Reactions: 1 person
Upvote 0

Rescued One

...yet not I, but the grace of God that is with me
Dec 12, 2002
35,508
6,395
Midwest
✟78,539.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Widowed
Keep up the good fight, my dear and I would say always acknowledge that only God could have delivered you from such deception.
:amen: It feels so good to give credit to Whom it is due!

John 17:24
24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

Ephesians 2:18
12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world: 13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. 14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us[Jew and Gentile]; 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; 16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: 17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. 18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

Ephesians 3:12
10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God, 11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord: 12 In whom we have boldness and access with confidence by the faith of him.
 
Upvote 0

He is the way

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2018
8,103
359
Murray
✟113,072.00
Country
United States
Faith
Mormon
Marital Status
Married
One of the commandments is to refrain from worshiping false gods, because there is only One God and all the others are demons. Mormon theology results in gods who are false, so that anyone who embraces those gods is worshiping demons. It is impossible, therefore, for a Mormon believer to become perfected by obeying all the commandments. That is not to say that they are of necessity completely lacking in grace. But they can't receive a fullness of grace.
If God the Father is a false God then we worship a false God. If not why do you accuse us of worshiping a false God?:

(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 8:5 - 6)

5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
 
Upvote 0

He is the way

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2018
8,103
359
Murray
✟113,072.00
Country
United States
Faith
Mormon
Marital Status
Married
so, tell me ---those who don't receive his love are those who break His commandments?. I though He was the God of love. Or really only those who keep his commandments? He must hates the whole human race according to you as "All have Sinned and fall short of the Glory of God" ---Romans 3:23

We've been through this before
1 John 4:19
We love Him because He first loved us.

And

1 John 4:8-10 (NKJV)
8 He who does not love does not know God, for God is love.In this the love of God was manifested toward us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through Him. 10 In this is love,not that we loved God, but that He loved us and sent His Son to be the propitiation for our sins.

Do you understand what manifested love is? Can you claim to have received it when we are definitely in a disagreement about God OR really, how many God's you Mormons worship.

And---- what it means to live through Him?
Yes we have been through this and the Bible is clear about this:

(New Testament | 2 Peter 2:20 - 22)

20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

(New Testament | John 5:14)

14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

(New Testament | Hebrews 6:4 - 6)
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
 
Upvote 0

Jamesone5

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Aug 7, 2019
1,758
318
Basin
✟97,413.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Yes we have been through this and the Bible is clear about this

(New Testament | 2 Peter 2:20 - 22)

20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

How do you have the knowldge of the Lord [God] and Saviour Jesus Christ when you don't even recognize Him as part of the One True God?

(New Testament | John 5:14)

14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

And you of course sin no more? Or can you before God say: "I do not sin--ever"?

(New Testament | Hebrews 6:4 - 6)
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Were you once enlightened through the True Holy Ghost? Unless you can positively answer to those verses----they do NOT apply to you. The True Holy Ghost [Spirit] tells us to discern error---yours obviously tells you to accept error. You have already proved to me that you do not know how to read the Bible.
With trying to make Moses, God to Aaron in your rendering without the simple word "as".
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Ran77

Senior Contributor
Mar 18, 2004
17,177
270
Arizona
✟36,652.00
Faith
Mormon
Marital Status
Married
This is also something that you made up. I didn't use those words. I didn't make that claim. Those are your words. And that is your spin on what was meant.




Once again, this is something you made up---Ran77

You seem to post random nonsense that somehow makes your false claims make sense to only you.
You did say "You [meaning I] made things up" and then you continue on with this false claim. I am guessing you have now reached 6 or 7 of these false claims.
Want to try for more?
What? does Mormonism teach one to only to look outward to point out the imaginary sins of others? When your claim against me is essentially bearing false witness. Do we even have to teach you what that is?

Are you so frustrated that you cannot win even one argument?

When someone attempts to claim that I have said something that I haven't, I point it out. That is neither random nor looking at anything imaginary. The evidence is there. If people choose to ignore that evidence, that is beyond my control and my concern.
 
  • Like
Reactions: He is the way
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Ran77

Senior Contributor
Mar 18, 2004
17,177
270
Arizona
✟36,652.00
Faith
Mormon
Marital Status
Married
The statement that forms the title for this thread is not true. At least not for the main branch of the LDS church. The members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints believe that all who turned to the Savior have come unto Christ. Since I'm not sure what the current rules are for quoting our church website, I will paraphrase what it says.

Begin with a molecule of faith. Simply having the desire to believe gives room for the promises of God to find a home in your heart. And that is enough to start.

The rest of the article mentions; repent and change what we can, taking His name upon us, and following the Son. These are the steps that the members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints believe to be "Coming unto Christ."

Bump.
 
Upvote 0
Dec 16, 2011
5,208
2,548
57
Home
Visit site
✟234,667.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
If God the Father is a false God then we worship a false God. If not why do you accuse us of worshiping a false God?:

(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 8:5 - 6)

5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
He who denies the Son does not have the Father either (1 John 2:23). When a man lies and says that the Son is not of one, timeless essence with the Father, He denies that the Son is truly God. If you deny the Eternally existing Word of the Eternally existing Father (Eternal means "without beginning and without end") then you deny the Father also. Scripture does not lie. False teachers, on the other hand, lie about many things. They distort the face of God by their false teachings, and create gods after their own imperfect reasoning powers.
 
Upvote 0
Dec 16, 2011
5,208
2,548
57
Home
Visit site
✟234,667.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
If God the Father is a false God then we worship a false God. If not why do you accuse us of worshiping a false God?:

(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 8:5 - 6)

5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
I say your god is false because of this: The Word of God (the Son) is the "Mind" of the Father. The very "Mind" of the Father became flesh. If you deny the "Mind" of the Father, you deny the Father. So whatever "version" of the Father you are worshiping... it's a false version, and is absolutely and without any doubt whatsoever a false god.

Your god is puny in comparison to "True God of True God". Your God has an equal called "matter" which has existed along with him from eternity, and which he depends upon to create anything. Your god doesn't even exist except as a demon. It is the same demon, or demons, who appeared in a vision to your false prophet, and other false prophets. Our God is True. Jesus Christ, the Son, is the incarnate "Mind" of God the Father, and together with the Holy Spirit They exist without beginning or end, and call all things into existence (including "matter" itself) which did not exist prior. Our God depends upon nothing, but is beyond all our understanding of perfection. Your god, since a God Who is more perfect can be thought of, is not really God. It's not even a remote possibility.

But you do know that what I'm saying is true. We always know, even if we won't admit it to ourselves, what the truth is. You just don't, at this juncture, have what is necessary to muster up any desire to repent of this false religion you belong to and promote. As in the case of all of us, our sinful pride and love of the world is standing in the way of true repentance.
 
Upvote 0

mmksparbud

Well-Known Member
Dec 3, 2011
17,312
6,821
73
Las Vegas
✟255,978.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Widowed
Politics
US-Others
If God the Father is a false God then we worship a false God. If not why do you accuse us of worshiping a false God?:

(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 8:5 - 6)

5 For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
6 But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

But you know you do not worship the same God the Father, Son and Holy Ghost you do. Your Father had a father and he had a father and so on, your God has wives, your God did not create from nothing, your Holy Ghost can only be at one place at a time, ours is everywhere. Your God was dependent on Satan to bring about the fall in order for us to have children, your God did not create the angels or Lucifer, ours did. Ours is the Creator God, yours really isn't He has to have matter alrerady in existance in order to create anything. Our God had no other God before Him and will have none after---your God has a bunch of God's before Him and countless more after Him when men become Gods. Our God the Father and His Son will be on the new earth together with all His saved. ours, has a select few who can be in His presence. Ouyrs has only One Son, yours has many, Jesus is just one of them. Our Jesus is fully God---your's is just one of the gods. Ours created Adam and Eve and gave them the ability to procreate and give life to their children---your God had us with one of His wives and we have to come to earth and become human to gain knowloedge of how to to obey God. The list goes on and on---you serve a different God than we do. It is a weak, inept, god---Ours is all powerful, all knowing, from everlasting to everlasting and can knock you god down, just as He did Dagon. The day will come, soon, when you will see it for yourself---hope it's not too late for you.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: truefiction1
Upvote 0

Jamesone5

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Aug 7, 2019
1,758
318
Basin
✟97,413.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
(Old Testament | Exodus 4:16)

16 And he shall be thy spokesman unto the people: and he shall be, even he shall be to thee instead of a mouth,

(Old Testament | Exodus 7:1)

1 AND the LORD said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.


Moses was a god to Pharaoh.

You have trouble with the little words don't you?

Here it is the word "a".--As in A god to Pharaoh or really one who can judge Pharaoh.


Remedial reading lessons might help the Mormons., but then it only what they want to see.


So far you have proved to me only that you cannot comprehend the Bible
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

He is the way

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2018
8,103
359
Murray
✟113,072.00
Country
United States
Faith
Mormon
Marital Status
Married
(New Testament | 2 Peter 2:20 - 22)

20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

How do you have the knowldge of the Lord [God] and Saviour Jesus Christ when you don't even recognize Him as part of the One True God?

(New Testament | John 5:14)

14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

And you of course sin no more? Or can you before God say: "I do not sin--ever"?

(New Testament | Hebrews 6:4 - 6)
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Were you once enlightened through the True Holy Ghost? Unless you can positively answer to those verses----they do NOT apply to you. The True Holy Ghost [Spirit] tells us to discern error---yours obviously tells you to accept error. You have already proved to me that you do not know how to read the Bible.
With trying to make Moses, God to Aaron in your rendering without the simple word "as".
You said: "How do you have the knowldge of the Lord [God] and Saviour Jesus Christ when you don't even recognize Him as part of the One True God?

There is only one way to know God and that is by keeping the commandments:

(New Testament | 1 John 2:4)

4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

Who is Jesus' God and Father:

(New Testament | John 20:17)

17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

You said: And you of course sin no more? Or can you before God say: "I do not sin--ever"?

(New Testament | Hebrews 10:26)

26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

You said: "Were you once enlightened through the True Holy Ghost? Unless you can positively answer to those verses----they do NOT apply to you. The True Holy Ghost [Spirit] tells us to discern error---yours obviously tells you to accept error. You have already proved to me that you do not know how to read the Bible.
With trying to make Moses, God to Aaron in your rendering without the simple word "as".

Everyone understands the scriptures differently. I do not believe that the word "as" nullifies the whole scripture.
 
Upvote 0

He is the way

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2018
8,103
359
Murray
✟113,072.00
Country
United States
Faith
Mormon
Marital Status
Married
You have trouble with the little words don't you?

Here it is the word "a".--As in A god to Pharaoh or really one who can judge Pharaoh.


Remedial reading lessons might help the Mormons.

Here is you other problem and your KJ version says it differently.

and thou shalt be to him instead of God.

Neither version says "He is God to him" not even "a" god.

So far you have proved to me only that you cannot comprehend the Bible

I believe you have been shown a different way to understand the scriptures.
 
Upvote 0

He is the way

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2018
8,103
359
Murray
✟113,072.00
Country
United States
Faith
Mormon
Marital Status
Married
He who denies the Son does not have the Father either (1 John 2:23). When a man lies and says that the Son is not of one, timeless essence with the Father, He denies that the Son is truly God. If you deny the Eternally existing Word of the Eternally existing Father (Eternal means "without beginning and without end") then you deny the Father also. Scripture does not lie. False teachers, on the other hand, lie about many things. They distort the face of God by their false teachings, and create gods after their own imperfect reasoning powers.
Who is the God of Jesus?
 
Upvote 0
Dec 16, 2011
5,208
2,548
57
Home
Visit site
✟234,667.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
You said: "How do you have the knowldge of the Lord [God] and Saviour Jesus Christ when you don't even recognize Him as part of the One True God?

There is only one way to know God and that is by keeping the commandments:

(New Testament | 1 John 2:4)

4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

Who is Jesus' God and Father:

(New Testament | John 20:17)

17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

You said: And you of course sin no more? Or can you before God say: "I do not sin--ever"?

(New Testament | Hebrews 10:26)

26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

You said: "Were you once enlightened through the True Holy Ghost? Unless you can positively answer to those verses----they do NOT apply to you. The True Holy Ghost [Spirit] tells us to discern error---yours obviously tells you to accept error. You have already proved to me that you do not know how to read the Bible.
With trying to make Moses, God to Aaron in your rendering without the simple word "as".

Everyone understands the scriptures differently. I do not believe that the word "as" nullifies the whole scripture.
You're not keeping His commandments because you are worshiping a false god
Who is the God of Jesus?
Jesus is both God and man. As man, God is His God. But God is the Father, Word of the Father, and Spirit of the Father: One God, Not 3 gods.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

He is the way

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2018
8,103
359
Murray
✟113,072.00
Country
United States
Faith
Mormon
Marital Status
Married
I say your god is false because of this: The Word of God (the Son) is the "Mind" of the Father. The very "Mind" of the Father became flesh. If you deny the "Mind" of the Father, you deny the Father. So whatever "version" of the Father you are worshiping... it's a false version, and is absolutely and without any doubt whatsoever a false god.

Your god is puny in comparison to "True God of True God". Your God has an equal called "matter" which has existed along with him from eternity, and which he depends upon to create anything. Your god doesn't even exist except as a demon. It is the same demon, or demons, who appeared in a vision to your false prophet, and other false prophets. Our God is True. Jesus Christ, the Son, is the incarnate "Mind" of God the Father, and together with the Holy Spirit They exist without beginning or end, and call all things into existence (including "matter" itself) which did not exist prior. Our God depends upon nothing, but is beyond all our understanding of perfection. Your god, since a God Who is more perfect can be thought of, is not really God. It's not even a remote possibility.

But you do know that what I'm saying is true. We always know, even if we won't admit it to ourselves, what the truth is. You just don't, at this juncture, have what is necessary to muster up any desire to repent of this false religion you belong to and promote. As in the case of all of us, our sinful pride and love of the world is standing in the way of true repentance.
God the Father is mighty enough to make man equal to Himself.
 
Upvote 0