Holy laughter?

I am starting to think about what people do in public worship as compared to what they do when they are alone. When we are alone, there are no spectators, mentors, friends, or anyone else to impress. This is where our true heart and attitude toward God is most noticeable.

There are people who do all the demonstrative aspects of worship while in the presence of others, but never have the motivation to do the same things in private just with God. What would we think about that? Could it be that they are just putting on a show for others. If so, Jesus said that the praise that comes from the observers about the supposed "spirituality" of the person is all the reward they will get. So I wonder if a lot of public worship is just "man pleasing"?

I also wonder if much of public tongues-speaking is of the flesh and not the Spirit, because the Spirit will not motivate anyone to do anything that is inconsistent with the Scriptures. Paul said that we should speak in tongues in private to God and only speak in public if we mean to have the tongue interpreted. So, if people are speaking in tongues in disobedience to Paul's teaching, is it really an intelligible language that God understands and appreciates? Or is it fleshly nonsense and not of the Spirit at all?

This might be the same with "holy laughter" if it is only done in front of others in a public service, especially the "hysterical" laughter. Does the person have the same experience in private when it is only God who is observing? If not, then the manifestation could be suspect.

Jesus was very definite about what His attitude was toward those who loved to display their religiousness in front of others.

After over 40 years in the faith, I have become very reluctant to expressively worship in public services, yet I do not have this reluctance when I am alone with God. I feel much safer whooping it up when I am alone with Him. When I speak in tongues, the language is rich and expressive and I can feel very free and relaxed speaking to God, and it is fun, because I know that I am fellowshiping with God in the Spirit.

There is a Scripture that says that the Word was not made effective because it was not mixed with faith in those who heard it. I wonder that if worship, either in tongues, laughter, raising hands, dancing, etc., is done with the observers in mind, whether it is actually mixed with faith. Because without faith it is impossible to please God. So, is a lot of public worship pleasing to God? I'm having my doubts.

probinson said:

I'm not sure what the current definition of "Charismatic" is, but way back when I was on staff, I remember saying in a staff discussion that the term "Charistmatic" was so broadly defined, my dog could call himself "Charismatic".

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I think that an analogy can be made to the legal system. There are the statutes and legal definitions of things. But then there is a constantly evolving practical aspect of the law where cases are argued and precedents are made. The supreme court has been known to change the way law is interpreted by the way that they interpret the law in a specific set of circumstances in a specific case.

So you have the theory and then you have the way that the theory is applied in real life.

I think any definition of what it is to be a Charismatic has to have the theory , the doctrine that can be agreed on as the basic agreed upon doctrine.

But then there is the practical application of that theory. The way that actual Charismatic churches and individuals live it out. Thus being in a certain camp is only one of several ways to live out the basic Charismatic beliefs...

I meant it as a general statement, but the specific discussions that I had in mind are things like holy laughter or getting slain in the spirit. both common Charismatic experiences....Also the gifts in operation , Prophecy and words of knowledge , healings , etc...

It is one thing to disagree with a particular minister/ministry because of some special circumstances...Another to disagree with it because of it's Charismatic nature....While there is a grey area and no perfect way to define this , I think that in the extremes , it is somewhat more obvious....

There are those who speak skeptically of certain prophecies and those who speak skeptically of prophecy in general. The same could be said about other Charismatic practices....Whether it be angel sightings or laughing in the spirit. Some oppose only certain ones when there is basis for concern. Others oppose all of them because they really do not believe , in practice , that they can ever occur....In this world view , we all live in Nazareth and whenever Jesus visits , he is the carpenter's son only. There is no room for the supernatural in this world view...

MastersPiece said:

Why is it when some people disagree with another they feel they must make criticizing statements about how they said something? That's unnecessary.

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I apologize if I was excessively brusque in my tone. Originally I wrote that you expressed unsound theology, but then softened my phrasing after re-reading what you wrote.

It is not carelessly worded. On the contrary - I am possessed of the Spirit of God and it is HE who speaks thru me, not me myself who makes up those words. Do you make the words up NorrinRad?

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No. It is not like when I speak my native tongue, English. It is also not like when I speak any of the few Saxon expressions I know. Nor is it like when I playfully "fake" a foreign language a la... was it Syd Caesar who was known for that? God "gives the utterance," and yet there is no sense that He is "taking over."

Yes, people who are possessed still have a choice how to behave - we can choose to allow the Lord to operate thru us or to not allow Him. Same with the enemy - people have the choice to follow thru with the bidding of demons possessing them or not.

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I think most of the demonized and spirit-affected people delivered by Jesus or the disciples in the Gospels and Acts would be surprised to learn they had such a "choice." And I think Saul and his servants in 1 Sam. 19 would be surprised to hear that they had a "choice" in their behavior; the latter is the only case I know of in Scripture where the prophetic Spirit "took over" people, and it was clearly punitive.

In both cases, depending on the level with which one is "sold out" to whom they serve, that is the level of power the person operates in.

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How very "spiritual" that sounds. Looking at Scripture, one could easily infer that the Corinthians were very "sold out" in that the Spirit manifested among them quite dramatically. But they were disorderly, competitive, factious, and tolerant of egregious incest. Operating in "power" does not prove one is "sold out."

I want to be FULLY sold out to my God & King = this means if He decides He wants to move me to roll on the floor laughing then so be it.. perhaps it will knock the religiousity off of some folks to see that.. lol (although say with all honesty that I secretly hope He doesn't use me as a laughing-roller, but if He does then He will move me in that way). And just for the record = I did not say anything about being disorderly or 'out of control' - please do not make assumptions or try to put words in people's mouths. Bless you.

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I appreciate a joyous, celebratory church service, with loud music and dancing in the aisles. My concern is with endorsing or encouraging "out of control" behavior. I don't see that taught in Scripture, and I've not been favorably impressed by most of what I've seen of it in practice.

Thanks for the apology & explanation NorrinRadd

I will sidestep the debate as some of what you wrote regarding the demon possessed people opens a whole other can of worms. You're entitled to your position, and I'll hold to mine. Bless you.

Going forward.. I'm not one for disorder or out of control behaviour. I was always the quietest person in any church sitting at the very back just in case things got too uncomfortable for me so I could slip-out-the-back-jack. I used to sit back there and watch people waving their flags and laughing and I would think, "that's not God!".... until the day Abba told me to MIND MY OWN BUSINESS.. lol ..So I took His advice and started concentrating on my own worship. How He deals with others while they worship is not for me to judge...so I don't. I've never been in a service where the people conglomerately have missed God. Even if something doesn't quite sit with my spirit, we need to make room for the Lord to make the adjustment with the individual.. If they don't get it figured out then someone can help the person in love.
I'll side step the other debates offered in your post also. Debates are senseless and everyone just stubbornly adheres to their own end. It's not edifying. I know what Papa has taught me & I know His voice - Anyone can find scriptures to make fit into whatever point they want to make, that's why I listen to Abba's directions & explanations

Yitzchak said:

I think it is the height of stupidity and pride to judge something that God does. Laughing in the spirit has been around for a long, long time...But in more recent history , it has been a very common practice in Charismatic Churches....It is wrong that people so often post anti Charismatic ideas in the Charismatic forums.

There is no scripture which forbids the practice of laughing in the spirit. it is just personal prejudice that supports these attacks....

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Watchman4hm said:

I agree..I think the problem is that everyone who is saved is "Spirit Filled"..But not necessarily "Charismatic" or with the gifts I.E. "Charisma"..So they speak out of what they know instead of allowing there to be more than what they know..

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I hope this place doesn't add even MORE rules and MORE segregation into separate ghettos. It almost sounds as though you're saying that because these things have a "long" history in Charismatic circles, one cannot criticize them or even QUESTION their legitimacy and still be considered "Charismatic." It's bad enough that the rules of the Pentecostal subforum would disallow Gordon Fee, an AG minister, son of an AG pastor, and self-identified Pentecostal.

The definition of "charismatic" that I understand is to be associated with the supernatural work of the Holy Spirit. Therefore a true charismatic (note the small "c") is a person whose walk with God and ministry is characterised by healings and miracles and a powerful impact on unsaved people through the gifts of the Spirit (prophesy, word of knowledge and wisdom, discerning of spirits, etc.).

I think that the term "charismatic" has now been hijacked by people and church denominations to describe demonstrative worship, dancing, speaking publicly in tongues, laughing, shouting, etc. There seems to be a real lack of real power to make the impact on the unsaved community that existed in the book of Acts where thousands of idol worshiping pagans came to Christ because they saw that the power of Christ was far greater than the power of their own gods. Also, in revival times, when the power of the Holy Spirit was evident, it resulted in whole communities coming to Christ.

The city of Spokane, Washington, during the ministry of John G Lake there, became the "healthiest city in the USA". The local hospital had to close because of a lack of sick people. That is the power of the Holy Spirit. In the revival in Wales in the late 1800s and early 1900s, gambling houses, brothels, and taverns went out of business through lack of customers, and had to close, because so many people in those towns and cities came to Christ. That is also the effect of the power of the Holy Spirit.

Just think of your city. How many Charismatic and Pentecostal churches are there, and who are boasting that they are Spirit filled and are moving in the power of the Holy Spirit. How many gambling casinos, brothels, and liquor stores and bars are there in the same city. If the power of the Holy Spirit was really moving, why are they still in business? Could it be that all the boasting of these churches is empty, and in reality, they are having no impact on the unsaved community to the degree that the godless business are threatened?

Heard of the story of the Emperor's new clothes. Maybe people should be coming forward and saying "the emperor's go no clothes on", which would be the same as , "with all the hallelujah hootnannying going on in church, no one is getting saved out there in the community, therefore the Holy Spirit is not involved here."

Good post, Oscar - challenging.

When Toronto started, there was a sense that God was getting us ready for mission. I think He did. We gained understanding of His Father heart and His power. Great things to take to the lost.

But the mission didn't happen, not as I was expecting at any rate.

That said, I'm finding it easier to talk to people in the street. Easier to see strangers in the street healed. Easier to engage people with the Gospel.

I don't think this is just me - from what I here this is common.

Add to that things like the Alpha course and in the UK at least, the Healing on the Streets initiative, we are seeing more people touched by the power of God than we used to. Maybe, maybe, this is the start of something. Something unlike previous moves of God (or maybe this is how the famous revivals started).

I personlly wouldn't put down the laughter or the other things. In my experience during those times of laughing and falling over, behind the scenes God was, and still is, doing some deep profound things in my life. Some of my friends say the same thing.

Blessings,

Mike

Heard an interview by neurosugeon ,Dr Avery Jackson , who has written "God's Prescription Bbok" He explained some of the benefits of laughter. It's anmazing how God made our bodies. Not surprised He blesses with laughter.

ByTheSpirit said:

Well theres certainly not a scripture that says and thus when the Spirit comes youll laugh your behind off, but there are two accounts in Acts that could be interpretted in that way. In Acts 8 when the Samaritans received the Holy Spirit, the Bible says people saw their reactions and manifestations and knew something incredible had happened. In acts 2 on Pentecost the church was filled and those standing around started jeering them thinking thy were drunk, so its possible I suppose but no definitive answer from the Bible. Atleast none that I know of.

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We find the Lord has a sense of humor when we really get to know Him. It kind of surprises you because you don't really see that in the Bible. Like in the OP, you can find little things like the reaction when the Spirit fell in Acts. There is David dancing without the appropriate clothing, and a few other things. But it is not just His humor that comes as if drunk like the saying do not be drunk with wine but be filled with the Holy Spirit. There is also a more light hearted humor.

Now if we have questions about things we don't understand, and since His sheep hear His voice, should we seeking what He has to say about these things. I did - and instantly I picked up Him talking to me. He told me, "Karl, Isaac was the promised son."

Isaac means laughter, and as the promised son to Abraham, was a type of Christ. So laughter is promised!!

Yet while Jesus Christ is the true promised Son to us, not everyone receives Him. So, who is going to know about the Lord's sense of humor? Isn't it going to be those who receive Him?

The Lord also told me, "Karl, like instructions are given to servants, wisdom to sons, jokes to friends, so 'I love you' is said to a bride."

We should all serve the Lord, be as sons and daughters to God, get to know Him as a friend, and hear Him tell us "I love you" because we are like a bride to Him. Also, we all need to grow in the Lord, regardless. Still, some don't seem to hear from Him, nor even seek His voice for answers. Some seem to only hear instructions. Other also pick up wisdom from Him. And others find out about His laughter or sense of humor. Sadly, not all have heard Him tell them, "I love you." I remember the first time I heard that from Him. I was driving when He told me and tears filled my eyes so much that I had trouble seeing the stop sign I was approaching.

There is a relationship that we are suppose to have, or perhaps I should write that we are supposed to be developing, with the Lord. Like any relationship, the more time you spend on it the closer the relationship comes. The Bible is good for getting you looking for Jesus Christ and that relationship with Him, but the Bible is not what we are looking for. Jesus Christ is who we are looking for.

He once told me a poem about a treasure. It's too long for here, but in the poem there was a map and many people thought the map was the treasure. The Bible is the 'map' my friends, but it is not the treasure!! It points you to the Kingdom of God, of which Jesus Christ is the King and the door to the treasure. And in the Kingdom there is great treasure and riches. So it is that some have testified about Holy Laughter, and others don't believe . So who follow the instructions in the map?

Life Warrior said:

I keep noticing it happen to people during different meetings. Wondering what it's about?
Just had a quick look for information about it, and there are many who say it is genuinely from the Holy Spirit, but there are also those who say it is something false. The Bible does not speak about it, or if it does, then vaguely.

What are peoples thoughts on this?

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And the government will be upon His shoulders. From Isaiah. I when prayed for began to laugh, but it was closing time and maybe it was a mistake, the priest said stop Holy Spirit and the laughing stopped. I would have liked maybe needed to keep laughing.

Another priest prayed for a young lady in inner pain, maybe depression, and she laughed for over half an hour, after which she became well. And she stayed well.

The Bible is a summary, and we can't expect everything God does is exactly written about before.

GoldenKingGaze said:

And the government will be upon His shoulders. From Isaiah. I when prayed for began to laugh, but it was closing time and maybe it was a mistake, the priest said stop Holy Spirit and the laughing stopped. I would have liked maybe needed to keep laughing.

Another priest prayed for a young lady in inner pain, maybe depression, and she laughed for over half an hour, after which she became well. And she stayed well.

The Bible is a summary, and we can't expect everything God does is exactly written about before.

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The priest said "stop Holy Spirit"?

Incredible - that someone would think to order God about?

We do that though, and God complies at times. I guess He doesn't have to but He choices too, for reasons. Jesus was fully God and the priests choose to had Him taken captive and dragged way to Pilot, who was willing to let Him go but the people cried out against Him. So like a lamb He went to the cross.

I supposed He didn't have too. Being the King of kings He could have call on legions of angels, but for reasons He summited to the authorities in place here on earth. Yet what will the Father do to those people, who given authority for a time made such choices.

It is not us is it?

We don't use our God given authority here on earth to do such a thing, do we?


I was once taking a class offered at my church which was on the ministry of the Holy Spirit. As I sat in my chair suddenly there appeared to me a spiritual being sitting next to me. He looked happy, but had two chains wrapped around Him. So I began a conversation with Him using my spiritual senses. He told me He was the Spirit of God and the two chains represented the two chains that Paul was bound with. He continued to explain that the two chains were our personal relegion and our cooperate relegion.

Our relegion is our understanding of God. We each have an understanding of how God is, and we each have a church we attend which as a group has an understanding of God, which we call our relegion. they both represent the understanding of men as an individual and as I group. Leaning on our understanding, either our own or the understanding of the group is actually listening to the Lord and seeking Him.

We all have understanding and it is important for us to develop that, as individuals and as a group. Still our thouhts are not His thoughts and concerning Jesus the Father commanded, "Listen to Him", and it is written "Seek First the Kingdom of God", which of course is lead by the King of kings, Jesus Christ.

Also consider, there is something written about us being a nation of priests and it is written to priests:

Mal 2:1,2 "And now this commandment is for you, O priests. If you do not listen, and if you not take it to heart to give honor to My name, "says the Lord of hosts, then I will send the curse upon you and I will curse your blessings; and indeed, I have cursed then already, because you are not taking it to heart.

My friends, that is us. We do not listen and God sends the curse upon us, and indeed, He has already cursed our blessing because we did not listen. So shouldn't we work at changing that. And don't think that you are exempt because of the position you have been put in. Indeed, God may have put you in a position where you should be more aware, so that you might now consider.

Well praise God. I believe "all good things come from God". Its Him that is being talked about preached about. He is getting the glory. You never feel worse. He is all you think about.

Just seeing this thread.

I've watched a handful of videos about the so-called "Holy Laughter", and my thoughts aren't good ones. I don't get a good feeling off of it at all. It, along with the roaring and barking, seems very infested with spirits that aren't godly.

Life Warrior said:

I keep noticing it happen to people during different meetings. Wondering what it's about?
Just had a quick look for information about it, and there are many who say it is genuinely from the Holy Spirit, but there are also those who say it is something false. The Bible does not speak about it, or if it does, then vaguely.

What are peoples thoughts on this?

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Where is an example of this in the early church?


Some proof texts I have heard over the years are:

Job 8:21He will yet fill your mouth with laughter, and your lips with shouts of joy.

Psalm 126:2Then our mouth was filled with laughter, and our tongue with shouts of joy; then it was said among the nations, ‘The Lord has done great things for them.’

Ecclesiastes 10:19Feasts are made for laughter; wine gladdens life, and money meets every need.

Sirach 19:30A person’s attire and hearty laughter, and the way he walks, show what he is.

ByTheSpirit said:

Well theres certainly not a scripture that says and thus when the Spirit comes youll laugh your behind off, but there are two accounts in Acts that could be interpretted in that way. In Acts 8 when the Samaritans received the Holy Spirit, the Bible says people saw their reactions and manifestations and knew something incredible had happened. In acts 2 on Pentecost the church was filled and those standing around started jeering them thinking thy were drunk, so its possible I suppose but no definitive answer from the Bible. Atleast none that I know of.

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13 Even Simon himself believed. After being baptized, he stayed constantly with Philip and was amazed when he saw the signs and great miracles that took place.

jamadan said:

It definitely can be a powerful touch from God, particularly for some. It is not to be saught after. But ifvit happens, enjoy it. Whether or not it happens doesn't have any meaning. I've known people who've never experienced it who are far more anointed in the power if the Spirit than many i know whovseem to uncontrollably laugh at every spiritual experience. Unfortunately, as with everything, many err ny focusing on the laughter and seeking it or trying to make it happen in others. There are many who laughvas a way to draw at tention to themselves and to feel accepted. In other words, they're faking it. This is more true today. Revival groupies often show primed to laugh and don't even realize they're operating in the flesh.

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1 Corinthians 14:40
but all things should be done decently and in order.

Life Warrior said:

Are we somehow able to test it to see if it realy is the Holy Spirit? Does 1 John chapter 4 work in this situation?

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We are from God. Whoever knows God listens to us, and whoever is not from God does not listen to us. From this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error.

Faulty said:

The typical experience I hear relayed about this usually includes remarks like "I couldn't stop" or "it just took over" or "it overwhelmed me", etc.

One if the fruits if the Spirit is self control. If it violates this, it isn't the Spirit.

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Jeremiah 29:26The Lord himself has made you priest instead of the priest Jehoiada, so that there may be officers in the house of the Lord to control any madman who plays the prophet, to put him in the stocks and the collar.

1 Corinthians 14:32 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
32 The spirits of prophets are under the control of the prophets themselves.

Tobias said:

I don't think this is a good test. Many people recognize the work of the HS by the fact that what is happening is somewhat out of their control. Otherwise, how do they know it's not just themselves?


The ability to throw cold water on the work of the Holy Spirit is probably something we all can do. Most of us do not care to try... but if we wanted to we could object to what the Spirit is doing and put a stop to it. Especially when it is our own participation that we are concerned with. I think this is always an option when it comes to manifestations of the Spirit.


People who use the phrase: "I couldn't stop" are not necessarily saying they were possessed by evil spirits. No, more often than not they are saying that the laughter (or whatever) was something that they didn't choose to do on their own. Perhaps the words they are using to describe the experience violates the scriptures in the way you suggest Faulty, but I don't think what they are meaning to say they were possessed beyond their control.

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If out of control and not in good order it is not of God.

K2K said:

Issac!!!


The offspring of Abraham was named laughter.

Ps 78 Explains that He teaches us with parables and dark sayings

In Acts, when the Spirit fell, the non-believers thought the devote men were drunk!!

If you hear someone speaking in another language you don't think they are drunk, you just think they are foriegners. But the non-believers were scoffing at those who recieved the Spirit because they thought they were drunk!!

Why did they appear to be drunk, to the non-believer? And note: those non-believers were of the Jewish root.

Abraham was a man who believed. But the true Abraham is Jesus Christ, and if Abraham rightful heir was named laughter, then guess what? Those born of the Spirit have laughter. A Holy laughter. But then again, there were those Jews who did not recieve the Spirit and the Gifts of the Spirit.

So the Spirit came with tongues of fire, which not just produced men speaking in another language, but doing so as to appear drunk, not just foriegn.

So we see the the first born of Abraham is called laugther, we see Jesus explain that we must be born again, we see the first of those born again by the Spirit speaking in tongues and behaving in such a way as to be thought of as drunk (not just foriegn), then see people today suddenly filled with the Spirit which produces in them the speaking in tongues and Holy laughter, and we can't put the pieces together, even after we read a studied about all of it.

I would suggest the some need to start talking to the Lord, and see if He then doesn't send the Spirit which produces in you an Issac.

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In Acts 2, They were mocking the Apostles by saying they were drunk. I do not think what they said was genuine.