The Bible teaches that salvation comes with conditions.

Alain Valdivia said:

And as to you saying that Gal 5:4 means ceremonial works I again would point you to verse 3 which says this, “I testify again to every man who accepts circumcision that he is obligated to keep the whole law.” Again, he is mentioning the whole Law (which includes moral precepts) being a requirement for salvation if you accept circumcision which he is denying all throughout this epistle. Moreover, in the 3rd chapter the Apostle says this, “For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, "Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them."” (‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:10). Notice how it says “abide by all things written in the Book of Law.” Who would deny that moral precepts are not included in the “all things written in the Book of the Law”?
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The Moral precepts were a part of the Old Law. This is true. But the Moral Law (like do not murder, do not steal, do not covet) did not die out because they continued in the Law of Christ or New Covenant Law. Do you believe the Law has changed? Hebrews 7:12 says the Law has changed. So Paul was not talking about ALL forms of Law. He was referring to the 613 laws of Moses as a whole or package deal. This does not mean certain aspects of the Law (like the Moral Law) has not been repeated as commands by Jesus and His followers to us. Paul never spoke against how if we seek not to murder, we have fallen from grace.

Again, 1 John 3:23. Do you not believe this law or command deals with salvation?
It is a commandment and it says we are to believe on Jesus. Are you not saved by having a belief on Jesus? Surely you are justified by this Law, right?

Alain Valdivia said:

You still haven’t touched those three texts I showed you. How can gentiles do what the Law says by nature if the Law was only ceremonial works?
“For when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them.” (Romans‬ ‭2:14-15‬). How can the Law accuse if it doesn’t include moral works? Or how can the Law show us our sin if it was just circumcision? Or how can the Law make us accountable to God if it didn’t prove our inability to keep it?
“Now we know that whatever the law says it speaks to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be stopped, and the whole world may be held accountable to God. For by works of the law no human being will be justified in his sight, since through the law comes knowledge of sin.” (‭‭Romans‬ ‭3:19-20‬). And why does Paul mentioned the 10th commandment in Romans 7 when talking about the inability for him to keep the Law If he didn’t have in mind moral commands?

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I am not saying it was ONLY ceremonial works. I am saying that the whole contract is null and void and we are now under a new contract with new commands. Some of these commands from the Old have been repeated in the New Contract, but that does not invalidate these laws because they are the same. New contract means new rules but that does not mean that certain things have remained the same. For example: If a man wanted to buy a house, the seller would have a contract written up to buy it. If the buyer made some changes to the contract, and the seller agrees to the changes, that does not mean that there are not some of the same rules or stipulations that remain the same from the Old Contract within the New Contract. The thing is that the buyer and the seller are now going to go by the New Contract.

Alain Valdivia said:

What new Laws did Christ bring? If I’m not mistaken, the command to love our neighbor and God are already in the Books of Moses.

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Jesus was making changes to the Law (even before the New Covenant went officially into effect with His death). For Jesus was primarily teaching New Covenant teachings and not Old Covenant teachings during His earthly ministry.

How so?

Jesus clearly was making changes to the Law (even before the cross):
(Which means He was not teaching primarily Old Covenant, but New Covenant):

The Old Way says:
"Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth"
(Matthew 5:38 cf. Exodus 21:23-25).

The New Way (by Jesus) says:
"But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also." (Matthew 5:39).


The Old Way says:
"Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment" (Matthew 5:21 cf. Numbers 35:30-32).

The New Way (by Jesus) says:
"But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire." (Matthew 5:22).


The Old Way says:
"Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself, but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths:" (Matthew 5:34 cf. Numbers 30:1-2, Deuteronomy 23:21).

The New Way (by Jesus) says:
34 "But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God's throne:
35 Nor by the earth; for it is his footstool: neither by Jerusalem; for it is the city of the great King.
36 Neither shalt thou swear by thy head, because thou canst not make one hair white or black.
37 But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil." (Matthew 5:34-37).


The Old Way says:
"And of thy mercy cut off mine enemies, and destroy all them that afflict my soul: for I am thy servant." (Psalms 143:12).

"And the city shall be accursed, even it, and all that are therein, to the LORD: only Rahab the harlot shall live, she and all that are with her in the house, because she hid the messengers that we sent." (Joshua 6:17).

"And they utterly destroyed all that was in the city, both man and woman, young and old, and ox, and sheep, and ass, with the edge of the sword." (Joshua 6:21).

16 "But of the cities of these people, which the LORD thy God doth give thee for an inheritance, thou shalt save alive nothing that breatheth:
17 But thou shalt utterly destroy them; namely, the Hittites, and the Amorites, the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites; as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee" (Deuteronomy 20:16-17).

"They did not destroy the nations, concerning whom the LORD commanded them" (Psalms 106:34).

The New Way (by Jesus) says:
"But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;" (Matthew 5:44).

Note: Yes, I am aware that the Old Way (Old Testament) also teaches to love one's enemies (Exodus 23:4-5) (Proverbs 25:21), but this was in context to their own Israelite people, and not pagan nations. Pagan nations were to be destroyed when God commanded the Israelites to destroy them. But Jesus taught a radically different way. Love your enemies, and do good to them that hate you, and to pray for those who persecute you.


The Old Way says:
20 "But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:
21 Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the harlot in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you.
22 If a man be found lying with a woman married to an husband, then they shall both of them die, both the man that lay with the woman, and the woman: so shalt thou put away evil from Israel." (Deuteronomy 22:20-22).

4 "They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.
5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?" (John 8:4-5).

The New Way (by Jesus) says:
"He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her. " (John 8:7).


Even after the cross, there were changes being made:

The Old Covenant says this about circumcision:
"And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant." (Genesis 17:14).

Yet, the New Covenant says this about circumcision:
"Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing."
(Galatians 5:2).


The Old Covenant says this about the Sabbath:
32 "And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day.
33 And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation.
34 And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him.
35 And the Lord said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp.
36 And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the Lord commanded Moses." (Numbers 15:32-36).

Yet, the New Covenant says this about the Sabbath:
"Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:" (Colossians 2:16).

So it appears things have changed.

This makes sense because again, Hebrews 7:12 says the Law has changed.

"For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law." (Hebrews 7:12).

“For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.”
(John 1:17).

Jesus said,
"Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil." (Matthew 5:17).

Jesus came not to abolish the Law (in the sense of destroying all forms of Law), but Jesus came to fulfill the Law (i.e. to nail to the cross those ordinances that were against us [like the Old Covenant ceremonial laws], and Jesus came to give us a more fulfilled and perfect way of obeying God via the commands that come directly from Him and His followers). For Jesus offered a more perfect way of loving God, and loving our neighbor (Which of course is only possible via if we are first saved by God's grace through faith).

Alain Valdivia said:

Brethren, I’m not going to lie. All of this writing back and forth is futile and tiring especially for me. I won’t continue writing in this thread but I still love you as a brother in Christ. We are men who are fallible and subject to error. My only hope is the blood of Christ for my salvation. Something you don’t know about me is that I lack assurance of my salvation. I don’t know if I’ll go to heaven or not. I can’t say. But I can say that my hope is in the Lord and if I perish I perish at the foot of the cross.

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While we should believe in the blood of Christ for salvation (Romans 3:25), we also have to walk in the light as he is in the light in order so that the blood of Jesus cleanses us from all sin (1 John 1:7). It is implied heavily in 1 John 2:9-11 that: Walking in the light = Loving your brother.

I believe the best way we can have an assurance in knowing the Lord if we find that we are keeping His commandments (1 John 2:3). For 1 John 2:4 says that the person who says they know the Lord and they do not keep His commandments, they are a liar, and the truth is not in them (Note: Jesus is "the TRUTH" - Jhn 14:6; So Jesus would not be in them if they are not keeping His commandments.). 1 John 5:12 says he that has the Son has life, and he that does not have the Son does not have life. So we need to abide in the Son (have fellowship with Him) otherwise we do not have life (eternal life). For Jesus alone possesses immortality or eternal life (See: 1 Timothy 6:16). Jesus is the bread of life. Man shall not live by bread alone but by every word of God. Jesus said, abide in me, and abide in my words.

Skidder said:

The only way to walk in His Spirit and preach the unconditional love of Christ is to KNOW that His cross is unconditional. But we must also know that there is nothing good in our flesh that can even begin to save us from the everyday power of sin. His blood is the only cure for both penalty of sin, and the everyday power of sin. We are saved from the penalty of sin through Jesus Christ and Him crucified but we are also being saved from the "power" of sin through this same sacrifice. The very reason Paul said He never sets aside the grace of God, or Christ died for nothing...

"I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!"

The grace of God in this verse is what Christ did. The context of this righteousness is our walk. We can only walk in His righteousness through the power of His Cross. Faith has something to lay hold of and it is very powerful!! The power of Christ in us is set forth by what He did. The notion that faith in an event in history will cause Christ to walk in us defies all human intellect. But that is the simplicity of Christ, and the power of God, He does the walking not us. We were not fit to walk, only to be crucified!

I believe to fully understand this unrelenting power of His grace we have to go back to the beginning. Have we progressed beyond the hope that set us free? Have we left the broken place where Jesus first took our hand? Let me tell you... His cross never changes! His mercy never changes! His grace never changes! Our Lord never changes! When we first knelt before the cross did we come with a stipulation? Did we express to our Lord He was not enough? Did we say, “Lord, if you will, I will”? Absolutely NOT! We came in need of rescue! We came like a child reaching for the hand of forgiveness. And our Lord who is rich in mercy and abounding in love embraced us with no strings attached. We knew without a doubt that Jesus is the ONLY WAY!

And nothing has changed! This glorious salvation from sin extends beyond just the penalty of sin. When we first believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, through the greatest love story ever told, we receive a full pardon from all our sins (past, present, and future). But throughout our day by faith in this same gospel we are delivered from the everyday POWER of sin. If we fall from His grace we don't lose our salvation from the PENALTY OF SIN (we can’t be uncrucified with Christ), but rather our salvation from everyday POWER OF SIN. A loss that can even lead to death if we don't return to His cross. So YES, we can lose our salvation from the POWER OF SIN if we turn away from a grace that is sufficient. And I believe this is the crux of the whole argument by those who think they can lose their "salvation". They don't see that this salvation is present as well as eternal. Through their own eyes they put their value of the blood of Christ as conditional, rather than how the Father sees the blood as unconditional through His righteousness! "When I see the blood, I will pass over you". We have something far greater than the blood of bulls and goats over our doorposts! God's wrath AGAINST SIN has been completely satisfied ONLY THROUGH THE BLOOD OF HIS DEAR SON... NO MORE, NO LESS!!

1 Corinthians 5:5
deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

Exodus 12
And when I see the blood, I will pass over you

Grace and Peace...

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Please offer me a word for word commentary in your own words on 1 John 1:7.
I believe it is clear in what it is saying.

IF... we walk in the light... the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin (1 John 1:7).

IF = a condition and not a guarantee.
What we must do is "walk in the light" in order to: ...... Have the blood of Jesus cleanse us from all sin (Which is salvation). Walking in the light = Loving your brother (Which is strongly implied by the use of other words in 1 John 2:9-11).

1 John 3:10 says,
"In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother."

Not sure you caught what this verse said.
We know the difference between the children of God vs. the children of the devil by the fact that the person who does not righteousness is not of God, and by the fact that they do not love their brother.
Meaning: They are a child of the devil. For he that commits sin is of the devil (1 John 3:8).

For whoever hates his brother is like a murderer and no murderer has eternal life abiding in Him (1 John 3:15).

This does not sound like salvation is unconditional to me.

It sounds like I have to love my brother in order to have eternal life.
Paul says that the keeping of the Moral Law (like do not murder, do not steal, do not covet) is a part of loving your neighbor (See: Romans 13:8-10). Obviously our brother is included as being our neighbor. So if we are not keeping the Moral Law, we are not loving our brother or neighbor. Meaning: We do not have eternal life abiding in us because 1 John 3:15 says that whoever hates his brother is like a murderer and no murderer has eternal life abiding in him.

Oh, and this does not mean we have to be practicing that sin in order to be considered in violating God's commands. Numbers 35:16-18 says it only takes one act of murder to be a murderer.

Skidder said:

The only way to walk in His Spirit and preach the unconditional love of Christ is to KNOW that His cross is unconditional.

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No. That is not what the Bible teaches. I have provided verses that show that our salvation is conditional in the OP. Please show me a verse that says, "the only way to walk in His Spirit and preach the unconditional love of Christ is to know that His cross is unconditional." In other words, no such verse exists in the Bible. Jesus also tells us to pick up our cross and to deny ourselves and come follow Him (Matthew 16:24). Yes, we must first be saved by God's grace (i.e. Justification - Which is a process of salvation that is without the deeds of the Law or works), but that is not where the process of salvation ends. There is Sanctification (Living Holy by the power of God working through us) (2 Thessalonians 2:13) (Romans 8:13) (Hebrews 12:14), and Glorification (Being taken home to be with the Lord) (1 Peter 5:4, 1 Peter 1:4, 1 Corinthians 15:51-57, 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17) that must also come in the salvation process.

You said:

But we must also know that there is nothing good in our flesh that can even begin to save us from the everyday power of sin.His blood is the only cure for both penalty of sin, and the everyday power of sin.

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Not true, my friend. Again, in addition to believing in the blood of Jesus for salvation (Romans 3:25), 1 John 1:7 also teaches that walking in the light (righteous living) = the blood of Jesus cleansing us from all sin, too. Also....

Here are Ways For a Believer To Overcome Grievous Sin by God's Word and With the Help of Jesus: (Important Note (PLEASE READ): Please understand that I am not talking about overcoming minor sins, like imperfections of character here (Note: An example of a sin of imperfection of character would be that a person may not always be a great listener, and or they may not take out the trash on time, or they go 5mph over the speed limit a little, etc.); But grievous sin (like murder, theft, adultery, coveting, etc.), these are sins that the Bible describes as sins leading to spiritual death. In other words, I am NOT talking about Sinless Perfectionism here) (I believe Sinless Perfection deals with putting away "sins that do not lead to spiritual death - 1 John 5:17 and it is not exclusively talking about just meeting the basic requirements for living holy - According to the New Testament). Anyways, here is my list from Scripture that shows how a believer can overcome "grievous sin" or sins that lead to spiritual death.


Anyways, I will try and reply to the rest of what you wrote at a later time.
Happy New Year in the Lord;
May God's good ways be upon you always.

With loving kindness to you in Christ,

Sincerely,

~J.