Samoa shutting down government to try to stop deadly measles outbreak

Go Braves · Dec 11, 2019

Occams Barber said:
The children I'm referring to are the ones who've died of measles.

Kennedy and idiots like him, have contributed to the low vaccination rates in Samoa.

Spreading anti-vaccination propaganda is the moral equivalent of putting poison in the water supply.
OB

QFT.

Saricharity · Dec 12, 2019

The outbreak in Samoa is horrific. The death rate is something around 1 in 65 people. Statistics weren't even that bad in 1960 before the MMR vaccine...back then it was something like 1 in 10,000. Something definitely is awry, and it has nothing to do with people who chose not to vaccinate. Of course, as with anything people don't understand, we must find a scapegoat so, by all means, create your red herring and blame the anti-vaxxers...blame RFK Jr., blame whomever you chose but the fact of the matter is, it serves no useful purpose and creates needless fear and hatred.

Now, WHO is rushing in and "helping" these poor people by vaccinating everyone including already immune-compromised people (read people already infected with measles, telling them it's a 'cure' which it is definitely not.) It is a live virus vaccine. And it isn't just for measles. It covers mumps and rubella, adding more to their already-taxed immune systems. They are prescribing antibiotics for a VIRUS which has been proven to make things far worse. And to top it all off, they are giving small, sick children fever reducers. It is no wonder people are dying.

Maybe we should consider their diets and overall health and the fact that they are Vit A deficient. The Samoan people are not healthy at all and that makes them very susceptible to diseases of any kind. It may not be a third world country but it is definitely not a first world country either and certainly not comparable to North America.

https://pafpnet.spc.int/attachments/article/692/Samoa Household Nutrition in Brief.pdf

We already know how important Vit A is:

https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/pediatrics/91/5/1014.full.pdf

I fear that Samoa is a testing ground for future outbreaks. Let's just experiment on these people and find out what works (and what so obviously doesn't) so we will know for the next outbreak. Because of those dangerous anti-vaxxers and RFK Jr, we know there will be more outbreaks, right?

Saricharity · Dec 12, 2019

Tanj said:
anti vaxxers are only really happy when they are murdering and torturing infants.

Yes, this is why anti-vaxxers get up in the morning. They seek out infants to torture and people to murder. Your comment is ridiculous and does nothing but stir up division.
If you believe so strongly in vaccines then thoroughly educate yourself on the science and educate others face to face. No one will be convinced on any social media platform.

Cimorene · Dec 12, 2019

Occams Barber said:
The children I'm referring to are the ones who've died of measles.

Kennedy and idiots like him, have contributed to the low vaccination rates in Samoa.

Spreading anti-vaccination propaganda is the moral equivalent of putting poison in the water supply.
OB

What makes it even more morally wretched is they do this with so much haughtiness & sanctimony! They're proud of themselves. Smh. They've watched Vaxxed & read blogs by quacks like Suzanne Humphries, posts on Fb & act like they know more than the World Health Organisation.

Cimorene · Dec 12, 2019

Tanj said:
anti vaxxers are only really happy when they are murdering and torturing infants.

Not just infants. Though they're the most vulnerable.

Cimorene · Dec 12, 2019

Occams Barber said:
The Samoan measles death toll has now risen to 63 including 55 children under 4.

Samoan health authorities are asking people to stay at home while they go house to house seeking those who aren't vaccinated. These efforts have been severely hampered by local and international anti vaxxer propaganda aimed at the Samoan population.

A local 'healer'/anti vaxxer has been arrested under state of emergency legislation.

Anti-vaxxer arrested as Samoa battles measles epidemic

Communications Minister Afamasaga Rico Tupai said anti-vaxxers spreading conspiracy theories were hindering the unprecedented public health mobilisation.

"The anti-vaxxers unfortunately have been slowing us down," he told TVNZ.

"We've had children who have passed away after coming to the hospital as a last resort and then we find out the anti-vaccine message has got to their families and that's why they've kept these kids at home."

He warned anti-vaxxers: "Don't get in the way, don't contribute to the deaths".

The government-backed its tough rhetoric by arresting vocal anti-vaccination campaigner Edwin Tamasese late Thursday and charging him with incitement against a government order.

Officials said they acted after Tamasese had ignored previous warnings to stop his campaign.

Tamasese, who has no medical training, has railed against vaccines on his Facebook page and advocates using quack remedies such as papaya leaf extract to treat measles.

In a final post on Thursday before his arrest Tamasese described the vaccination drive as "the greatest crime against our people", and said vitamin C would save children.
OB

Anti-vaxxers are definitely gonna get in the way & contribute to the deaths. That's what they're infamous for. I'm friends IRL with @Stanfordella, she presented a paper at a national conference on how Americans export anti-vaxxer misinformation & the ramifications of that. Misinformation has been called one of the biggest threats to global public health. She worked for a Congressman who convinced Amazon to remove the fraud documentary Vaxxed & other misleading AV junk from their platform bc of how it propagates misinformation.

There's anti-vaxxers who are so completely arrogant & ignorant they've sent boxes of vitamin A to Samoa & encouraged that ppl take that instead of the vaccine even though that's seriously stupid & reckless. But they read on Facebook or something that it was gonna be helpful so that's what they did.

Occams Barber · Dec 12, 2019

Saricharity said:
The outbreak in Samoa is horrific. The death rate is something around 1 in 65 people. Statistics weren't even that bad in 1960 before the MMR vaccine...back then it was something like 1 in 10,000. Something definitely is awry, and it has nothing to do with people who chose not to vaccinate. Of course, as with anything people don't understand, we must find a scapegoat so, by all means, create your red herring and blame the anti-vaxxers...blame RFK Jr., blame whomever you chose but the fact of the matter is, it serves no useful purpose and creates needless fear and hatred.

Now, WHO is rushing in and "helping" these poor people by vaccinating everyone including already immune-compromised people (read people already infected with measles, telling them it's a 'cure' which it is definitely not.) It is a live virus vaccine. And it isn't just for measles. It covers mumps and rubella, adding more to their already-taxed immune systems. They are prescribing antibiotics for a VIRUS which has been proven to make things far worse. And to top it all off, they are giving small, sick children fever reducers. It is no wonder people are dying.

Maybe we should consider their diets and overall health and the fact that they are Vit A deficient. The Samoan people are not healthy at all and that makes them very susceptible to diseases of any kind. It may not be a third world country but it is definitely not a first world country either and certainly not comparable to North America.

https://pafpnet.spc.int/attachments/article/692/Samoa Household Nutrition in Brief.pdf

We already know how important Vit A is:

https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/pediatrics/91/5/1014.full.pdf

I fear that Samoa is a testing ground for future outbreaks. Let's just experiment on these people and find out what works (and what so obviously doesn't) so we will know for the next outbreak. Because of those dangerous anti-vaxxers and RFK Jr, we know there will be more outbreaks, right?

You’re confusing and compounding three separate factors which determine the severity of a measles (or any other) epidemic

1. The likelihood of being exposed to measles

Put simply, the more people who have measles the more likely it is that an individual will be exposed to potential infection. Conversely if less people have measles you are less likely to be exposed to measles. Mass vaccination reduces the likelihood of catching measles by reducing the number of measles cases. This is the often quoted concept of ‘herd immunity’.

2. The likelihood of contracting measles following exposure

Those who are vaccinated will be unlikely to contract measles when exposed to the disease. While there is evidence to suggest that Vitamin A deficiency can increase the severity of a measles infection, I am not aware of any evidence that Vitamin A will reduce the risk of contracting measles. Even if this were shown to be the case it does not invalidate using vaccination to reduce risk.

3. The severity of a contracted measles infection

The severity of the infection and the risk of death depends on a host of factors including:

Demographics (young kids are more likely to have more severe symptoms and less likely to be vaccinated)
Health status (this includes things like diet and Vitamin A deficiency)
Availability of medical care
Standard of medical care
Willingness to access medical care (anti-vaxx propaganda has been significant in reducing willingness to access medical care)
Delays in accessing medical care

In a country like Samoa, with a background standard of poor general health, it's even more important to use vaccination as a cheap and effective way of minimising exposure to disease.
OB

Go Braves · Dec 12, 2019

Cimorene said:
Anti-vaxxers are definitely gonna get in the way & contribute to the deaths. That's what they're infamous for. I'm friends IRL with @Stanfordella, she presented a paper at a national conference on how Americans export anti-vaxxer misinformation & the ramifications of that. Misinformation has been called one of the biggest threats to global public health. She worked for a Congressman who convinced Amazon to remove the fraud documentary Vaxxed & other misleading AV junk from their platform bc of how it propagates misinformation.

There's anti-vaxxers who are so completely arrogant & ignorant they've sent boxes of vitamin A to Samoa & encouraged that ppl take that instead of the vaccine even though that's seriously stupid & reckless. But they read on Facebook or something that it was gonna be helpful so that's what they did.

I also follow her on Twitter. She wrote that letter herself, when working for that congressman. You can tell she wrote it if you match it up to how she writes around here. It was her idea on account of her working on her degree in global health, understanding how damaging misinformation is to it. She'd gone to South Africa, saw a big measles outbreak there fueled by anti-vaxxers, lost a buddy she'd made there on account of it. The pics she shared were gruesome as heck. Necessary to see but gruesome. She had the letters reviewed by her professors at Stanford Medical School so it wasn't like she was just relying on her little college gal self or the congressman. They didn't just send a letter to Amazon they sent it to leaders throughout Silicon Valley. Instagram, YouTube, Facebook, even to Pinterest and Go Fund Me IIRC. They all took measures to thwart anti-vaxxer misinformation!

She credited anti-vaxxers on this forum for being the first ones to expose her to anti-vaxxer ideology back when she was a HS kid. So in a way anti-vaxxers deserve the credit for helping to take down anti-vaxxer propaganda.

Tanj · Dec 13, 2019

Saricharity said:
Yes, this is why anti-vaxxers get up in the morning.

Pretty much.

They seek out infants to torture and people to murder. Your comment is ridiculous and does nothing but stir up division.

There is nothing I can say, nothing I can do which is more ridiculous than anything one of the reality deniers does.

If you believe so strongly in vaccines then thoroughly educate yourself on the science

Well, I have a PhD, and 30 years experience in vaccine research. What more education would you have me get?

and educate others face to face. No one will be convinced on any social media platform.

Hence the derision.

Cimorene · Dec 13, 2019

Tanj said:
Pretty much.

There is nothing I can say, nothing I can do which is more ridiculous than anything one of the reality deniers does.

Well, I have a PhD, and 30 years experience in vaccine research. What more education would you have me get?

Hence the derision.

Ok I mean that's definitely reasonable & your qualifications are impressive and & all but is your PhD from Google University? Bc really if you wanna be taken seriously by an anti-vaxxer you're gonna need to be able to recite from Vaxxed, quote Del Bigtree & Suzanne Humphries, defend Andrew Wakefield, & give information about "shedding, adjuvants & vitamin A you found on memes! 30 years of vaccine research? Pffff. Come back when you've spent 30 years on Facebook & YouTube!

I'm totally kidding of course & I completely respect your experience. You made me laugh so I wanted to return the favour, lol.

Cimorene · Dec 13, 2019

keith99 said:
It is far too late for vaccinations once an outbreak is raging. Oh it would help but not for at least 2-3 weeks. AND the way typical mass vaccinations happen it could worsen things by exposing people NOW.

Idk that that's the case bc the ppl who hadn't been vaccinated were told to stay home & put red flags outside so the medical crews could come to them with the vaccine rather than the other way around.

Ok so Idk if you remember bc it's been a while but I think you've been in threads where an anti-vaxxer kept talking about this hygiene protocol method but was copying from an AV a totally revisionary version of history in re to it. Claiming it, not vaccines were responsible for the eradication of smallpox. So the method isn't really that unique but it basically consisted of quarantines, implementing higher hygiene standards and vaccination. So that's kinda what the Samoa gov. is doing but they're doing the real version not the fake AV one. And instead of making ppl leave home to quarantine in a hospital they were quarantining at home. But that same dr who came up with the method had said that with measles it was way harder than smallpox bc of how the 2 are so different. Ella's written about this all Idk if I'm getting it right but think I am getting the gist of it right. Hopefully she'll contribute to this thread but she's got finals then is going to Europe so Idk.

Cimorene · Dec 13, 2019

keith99 said:
It is far too late for vaccinations once an outbreak is raging. Oh it would help but not for at least 2-3 weeks. AND the way typical mass vaccinations happen it could worsen things by exposing people NOW.

You'd said something b4 about rugby in Samoa in relation to the measles outbreak, maybe you could explain more?

Occams Barber · Dec 13, 2019

In Post #23 I mentioned the relationship between Vitamin A and measles. What I didn't make clear was the nature of the relationship. Let me make it very clear:

Vitamin A does not prevent a measles infection.
Vitamin A does not cure a measles infection.
Vitamin A can help to minimise the symptoms of measles particularly where the patient has a Vitamin A deficiency. As a result it can act to reduce the death rate.

Vitamin A and Measles | History of Vaccines

By playing on the confusion between measles and Vitamin A, anti-vaxxers have (intentionally?) created the impression that it can prevent infection. This is not true.
OB

keith99 · Dec 13, 2019

While the population is smaller, about 1/5 that of Samoa nearby American Samoa is also dealing with a measles outbreak. The news source I found reported all of 9 cases, 5 of people who had traveled outside of American Samoa. Genetically and culturally the same, with one huge difference. American Samoa is well vaccinated while Samoa is poorly vaccinated. Tonga and Fiji are at some risk being somewhere in-between when it comes to vaccination rates.

keith99 · Dec 13, 2019

Cimorene said:
You'd said something b4 about rugby in Samoa in relation to the measles outbreak, maybe you could explain more?

Rugby players consider all other Rugby players almost kin. Even fans feel a sort of kinship with other Rugby nations. The outbreak was talked about on recent Rugby telecasts and both Oz and NZ sent help early in the outbreak.

JackRT · Dec 13, 2019

Measles is such a highly infectious disease that the herd immunity level is calculated to be between 90 and 95%.

essentialsaltes · Dec 13, 2019

The pacific island nation of Samoa has been making headlines over the past month due to a significant measles outbreak. At last count, 4,995 measles cases had been recorded, and 72 people, mostly young children, had died.

Tragically, 40% of recorded deaths have been in babies under one year old, and nearly 90% among children less than five.

keith99 · Dec 13, 2019

essentialsaltes said:
The pacific island nation of Samoa has been making headlines over the past month due to a significant measles outbreak. At last count, 4,995 measles cases had been recorded, and 72 people, mostly young children, had died.

Tragically, 40% of recorded deaths have been in babies under one year old, and nearly 90% among children less than five.

No real surprise because of anti-vaxers jumping on one case of medical neglegence and claiming it showed that vaccines are deadly ....

Prior to the outbreak, Samoa had notoriously low vaccination rates, with data from the WHO and UNICEF estimating that the country's national immunization coverage fell from 74% to 34% between 2017 and 2018.

No wonder those that are the least vaccinated pay the highest price.

Low vaccination rate and deadly medical mistake led to Samoa measles outbreak: health experts

essentialsaltes · Dec 13, 2019

Wow.

With a population of 200,000, Samoa has fewer people than Geelong or Hobart. So a significant proportion of the population has been affected. More than one in five Samoan babies aged six to 11 months have contracted measles during this outbreak, and more than one in 150 babies in this age group have died.

ruthiesea · Dec 14, 2019

I can’t remember the origin of the this, but for ant-vaxxers if the CDC says that Romain lettuce is contaminated you throw away all you have. If the CDC says that vaccines save lives you say that they are shills for the drug companies.

Samoa shutting down government to try to stop deadly measles outbreak

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