Questions About Hell

smithed64

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That's not a commandment to feed and clothe your neighbor.

Common sense, does step in don't you know.
If you love your neighbor, you'll love all. And you'll know to do right by others. If you have it and can help others and don't. Then you are in the wrong.
The Word tells us that for us to know to do right and don't it is a sin against us.

You, myself and everyone has this thing that called a conscience.

The word is a compound word:

con=with
science=knowledge

God's laws are place upon our hearts from the beginning. We know from that what we aught to do and what we aught not to do. When we do something we know with knowledge whether or not it is right or not.

We know we aught to help someone who is need. But we don't always do it. Your better for doing it, so is the person your helping. It's also contagious. You help one person, someone sees you do that, then they help someone so on and so on.

It all stems from.

Love your neighbor as you love yourself. Which is a commandment. It is the second of the greatest commandments.
The first being. To Love the Lord with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind and with all your strength.

The other 10 commandments hinge on the two above. If you break one of the 10, your not doing the last two. If you don't do the last two, your breaking the other 10.
 
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Saint Steven

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2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness.
What did the term "All Scripture" mean at the time this was written? Does this say that it is the Word of God? Does the Bible declare anywhere that it is the Word of God? Or is the Word of God declared by the Bible to be something else entirely?
 
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Saint Steven

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He has already succeeded.
He sent His Son.

You'll be left out, if you choose to not repent of your sins. You being left out, is your fault. Not God's.
That's a failure on your part to believe in Christ, Repent of your sins, Trust in Christ and live a Holy life with Christ. To die to this world and live, walk and talk in the Spirit of God.
Are you claiming that everyone throughout all time has had an opportunity to do that? Or will some be left out? Thus a failure to save all.
 
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smithed64

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What did the term "All Scripture" mean at the time this was written? Does this say that it is the Word of God? Does the Bible declare anywhere that it is the Word of God? Or is the Word of God declared by the Bible to be something else entirely?

1. What did the term "All Scripture" mean at the time it was written?
It was the Tanak The three part collection of the Torah, Prophets and writings. Words written by man inspired by God. To tell the story of Israel and the coming of the King out of the line of David. Who would save Israel and bring it to Glory. That King is Jesus.

2. Yes, it does. It says, "Thus saith the Lord"
3. Yes it does, in the old testament and In the new.
4. Nope
 
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smithed64

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Are you claiming that everyone throughout all time has had an opportunity to do that? Or will some be left out? Thus a failure to save all.

Well, everyone throughout time is a broad statement don't you think?

Cause not everyone throughout time is alive today. Many didn't believe in God before Christ. But many did and they were saved by their faith in God. Before the law, they weren't judged by the law. But afterwards they were. And they gained their atonement thru sacrifice of the lamb for the shedding of Blood to cleanse them of their sins. Until God, stopped that practice. He then, gave eternal life to those who kept the covenant with Him and obeyed Him and kept the Faith. Until Christ came. He preached repentance and placing their Trust in Him. To get to the Father.

So, if your asking if some before salvation by Christ alone, faith alone and by Grace alone happened. Yes it did.


We are not Good. By any means. The way we think is right, is the road to death.
Only God is good.
We are born with sin. And until we repent of our sins, we live in them. If you die in your sins, not repenting of them and placing your trust in Christ. You will go to Hell.
If you become born again. Through Christ. You will live eternally with God.
 
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FineLinen

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This is a vital passage of Scripture, particularly because it is the ONLY one speaking of everlasting punishment by none other than the Lord Jesus Christ!

Put on your reading glasses. Focus on this important word from the Master, the Lord Lesous. It is really quite simple.

Take 5 =

There is one (1) passage of Canon for “everlasting punishment” (Matt.25). This one single verse is the cornerstone for the proponents of unending punishment.

According to the context of St. Matthew 25 and ONLY the context, please fill in the empty lines.

The foundation for “everlasting punishment” Matt. 25=

1.________________________________________?

2.________________________________________?

3.________________________________________?

4.________________________________________?

5.________________________________________?
 
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FineLinen

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Our God is a consuming Fire

Fire Is A Beneficent Agent

How shallow is the common view of “fire” as only or chiefly a penal agent. Fire, in Scripture, is the element of…

“Life”…Isa. 4:5

“Purification”…Matt. 3:3

“Atonement”…Lev. 16:27

“Transformation”…2 Pet. 3:10

And never ever of preservation alive for purposes of anguish.

And the popular view selects precisely this latter use, never found in Scripture, and represents it as the sole end of God’s fiery judgments! If we take either the teaching of Scripture or of nature, we see that the dominant conception of fire is of a beneficent agent. Nature tells us that fire is a necessary condition of life; its mission is to sustain life; and to purify, even when it dissolves.

Extinguish the stores of fire in the universe, and you extinguish all being; universal death reigns. Most strikingly is this connection of fire and life shown in the facts of nutrition. For we actually burn in order to live; our food is the fuel; our bodies are furnaces; our nutrition is a process of combustion; we are, in fact, “aflame to the very tips of our fingers.” And so it is that round the fireside of life and work gather: when we think of home we speak of the family hearth.

Fire Is The Sign Of God’s Being

And what Nature teaches, Scripture enforces in no doubtful tone. It is significant to find the Great Source of life constantly associated with fire in the Bible.

Fire is the sign, not of God’s wrath, but of His being.

When God comes to Ezekiel there is a “fire unfolding itself” (Ezek. 1:4, 27) and “the appearance of fire.” (Ezek. 8:2)

Christ’s eyes are a flame of “fire” (Rev. 1:14).

The seven lamps of “fire” are the seven Spirits of God (Rev. 4:5). So a fiery stream is said “to go before God,” His throne is fiery flame, its wheels are burning fire (Daniel 7:9,10). His eyes are lamps of fire (Dan. 10:6); He is a wall of fire (Zeph. 2:5). At His touch the mountains smoke (Psl. 104:32). And God’s ministers are a flame of fire (Psl. 104:4…Heb. 1:7). It is not meant to deny that the Divine Fire chastises and destroys.

Purification, Not Ruin Is The Final Outcome

It is meant that purification, not ruin, is the final outcome of that fire from above, which consumes–call it, if you please, a paradox–in order that it may save. For if God is Love, then by what but by love can His fires be kindled? They are, in fact, the very flame of love; and so we have the key to the words, “Thy God is a consuming Fire,” and “Thy God is a merciful God” (Deut. 4:24-31). So God devours the earth with fire, in order that finally all may call upon the name of the Lord (Zeph. 3:8,9)–words full of significance.

So Isaiah tells us of God’s cleansing the daughters of Zion by the spirit of burning (Isa. 4:4)–suggestive words. And, so again, “By fire will the Lord plead with all flesh.” (Isa. 66:16) And Christ coming to save, comes to purify by “fire.” (Mal. 3:2).

Fire A Sign Of Favourable Response?

Let us note, also, how often “fire” is the sign of a favourable answer from God; when God appears to Moses at the Bush it is in “fire:” God answers Gideon by “fire;” and David by “fire.” (1 Chron. 21:26) Again, when He answers Elijah on Carmel, it is by “fire;” and in “fire” Elijah himself ascends to God. So God sends to Elisha, for aid, chariots and horses of “fire.” So when the Psalmist calls, God answers by “fire.” (Psl. 18:6-8)

And by the pillar of “fire” God gave His law. And in “fire” the great gift of the Holy Ghost descends at Pentecost."

Fire Is The Portion Of All

These words bring us to the New Testament. There we find that “fire,” like judgment, so far from being the sinner’s portion ONLY, is the portion of all. Like God’s judgment again, it is not future merely, but present; it is “already kindled,” always kindled: its object is not torment, but cleansing. The proof comes from the lips of our Lord Himself. “I am come to send fire on the earth,” for it is certain that He came as a Saviour. Thus, coming to save, Christ comes with fire, nay, with fire already kindled. He comes to baptize with the Holy Ghost, and with fire.

Therefore, it is that Christ teaches in solemn passage (usually misunderstood, Mark 9:43) that everyone shall be salted with fire. And so the “fire is to try every man’s work.” He whose work fails is saved (mark the word saved), not damned “so as by fire,” by consuming what is evil, saves and refines.

The antient tradition that represents Christ as saying, “He that is near Me is near fire,” expresses a vital truth. So Malachi, describes Christ as being in His saving work “like a refiner’s fire.” And so, echoing Deut 4:24-31, we are told that “our God is a consuming Fire,” i.e., God in His closest relation to us; God is Love; God is Spirit: but “Our God is a consuming Fire”–a consuming Fire, “by which the whole material substance of sin is destroyed.”

When, then, we read (Psl. 18:12) that “coals of fire” go before God, we think of the deeds of love which are “coals of fire” to our enemies. (Rom. 12:20) Thus, we who teach hope for all men, do not shrink from but accept, in their fullest meaning, these mysterious “fires” of gehenna, of which Christ speaks (kindled for purification), as in a special sense the sinner’s doom in the coming ages. But taught by the clearest statements of Scripture (confirmed as they are by many analogies of Nature), we see in these “fires” not a denial of, but a mode of fulfilling, the promise–

"Behold, I make all things new."

-Christ Triumphant-
 
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DennisTate

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Questions Without Answers On Hell

Questions Without Answers

  1. As we are required to love our enemies, may we not safely infer that God loves His enemies? (Matt. 5:44)
  2. If God loves His enemies, will He punish them more than will be for their good?
  3. Would endless punishment be for the good of any being?
  4. As God loves His friends, if He loves His enemies also, are not all mankind the objects of His love?
  5. If God loves those only who love Him, what better is He than the sinner? (Luke 6:32-33)
  6. As "love thinketh no evil," can God design the ultimate evil of a single soul? (1 Cor. 13:5)
  7. As "love worketh no ill," can God inflict, or cause, or allow to be inflicted, an endless ill? (Rom. 13:10)
  8. As we are forbidden to be overcome by evil, can we safely suppose that God will be overcome by evil? (Rom. 12:21)
  9. Would not the infliction of endless punishment prove that God HAD been overcome by evil?
  10. If man does wrong in returning evil for evil, would not God do wrong if He was to do the same?
  11. Would not endless punishment be the return of evil for evil?
  12. As we are commanded "to overcome evil with good," may we not safely infer that God will do the same? (Rom. 12:21)
  13. Would the infliction of endless punishment be overcoming evil with good?
  14. If God hates the sinner, does the sinner do wrong in hating Him?
  15. Is God a changeable being? (James 1:17)



Jeremiah 23:20
"The anger of the LORD shall not return, until he have executed, and till he have performed the thoughts of his heart: in the latter days ye shall consider it perfectly."


I believe that information is coming out now that could not have been understood five hundred years before the latter days.

Non-linear time or Multiverse Theory and how it can fit with Ezekiel 37
and Revelation 20
and Romans 11
can make the scriptures on hell look more humane.....but a good healthy fear of hell was certainly taught by Jesus in Matthew 5.

Jhn 16:25
"These things have I spoken unto you in proverbs: but the time cometh, when I shall no more speak unto you in proverbs, but I shall shew you plainly of the Father.



Multiverse Theory and multiple Ezekiel 37 type events.
 
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Saint Steven

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1. What did the term "All Scripture" mean at the time it was written?
It was the Tanak The three part collection of the Torah, Prophets and writings. Words written by man inspired by God. To tell the story of Israel and the coming of the King out of the line of David. Who would save Israel and bring it to Glory. That King is Jesus.
So, we agree that it could not have meant the whole Bible at the time it was written. Good.

2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness.

2. Yes, it does. It says, "Thus saith the Lord"
Where? I don't see that in the verse.

3. Yes it does, in the old testament and In the new.
I disagree. The Bible does not to my knowledge claim itself to be the Word of God.

Is not Jesus the Word of God? Did not the Word of God come to the Prophets?
Does that mean that Jesus was a Bible? Does that mean that a Bible came to the Prophets?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Saint Steven said:
What did the term "All Scripture" mean at the time this was written? Does this say that it is the Word of God? Does the Bible declare anywhere that it is the Word of God? Or is the Word of God declared by the Bible to be something else entirely?

2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness.
 
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Saint Steven

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So, if your asking if some before salvation by Christ alone, faith alone and by Grace alone happened. Yes it did.
Since Christ, has everyone had the opportunity to receive him?
 
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Saint Steven

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We are not Good. By any means. The way we think is right, is the road to death.
Only God is good.
We are born with sin. And until we repent of our sins, we live in them. If you die in your sins, not repenting of them and placing your trust in Christ. You will go to Hell.
If you become born again. Through Christ. You will live eternally with God.
This is what we have been told all our lives. That we are bad and unlovable and deserving of hell. That Jesus came to save us from what God was planning to do to us. Then we can be saved while everyone else burns for all of eternity with no hope of escape.

Will you be able to enjoy heaven knowing that below you countless billions are suffering unspeakable horrors at the hand of your loving heavenly Father? Some of them possibly your own loved ones, or those you have know.

What if the things we have been told, which you related in your post were not actually the master plan? What if that was not what God is up to? What if there is another side to this story. God's plans for his children with a happy ending. The redemption and restoration of all creation. A story in which God does not fail.

1 John 2:2
He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins,
and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

Romans 11:32
For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.

Romans 5:18-19
Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people,
so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.
19 For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners,
so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.

Colossians 1:20
and through him to reconcile to himself all things,
whether things on earth or things in heaven,
by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.

1 Timothy 2:3-4
This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4 who wants all people to be saved
and to come to a knowledge of the truth.

1 Corinthians 15:22
For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.
 
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Saint Steven

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We are not Good. By any means. The way we think is right, is the road to death.
Only God is good.
This view is poison for your mind.
For the "saved" it creates an "us and them" attitude. It elevates the "saved" above the "lost". It fails to recognize that we were all created by God and he is the Father of all humankind. That God wills to have a relationship with all his children, rather than toss the vast majority (countless billions) in a forever burning furnace. What kind of father would do that?

Imagine a Father of compassion and the God of all comfort. A loving God that actually thinks we are good and worthy of his embrace. Our Father God feeds the birds of the air. Are we not much more valuable than they? Seems so.

2 Corinthians 1:3-4
Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of compassion and the God of all comfort, 4 who comforts us in all our troubles, so that we can comfort those in any trouble with the comfort we ourselves receive from God.

Matthew 6:26
Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they?
 
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FineLinen

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This is a vital passage of Scripture, particularly because it is the ONLY one speaking of everlasting punishment by none other than the Lord Jesus Christ!

Put on your reading glasses. Focus on this important word from the Master, the Lord Lesous. It is really quite simple.

Take 6 =

There is one (1) passage of Canon for “everlasting punishment” (Matt.25). This one single verse is the cornerstone for the proponents of unending punishment.

According to the context of St. Matthew 25 and ONLY the context, please fill in the empty lines.

The foundation for “everlasting punishment” Matt. 25=

1.________________________________________?

2.________________________________________?

3.________________________________________?

4.________________________________________?

5.________________________________________?
 
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FineLinen

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  1. If God knew when He created man, that some would be eternally wretched, did He not will this to be their doom?
  2. If God willed the endless misery of a part of His creatures, why is it said that "he will have all men to be saved?" -- (1 Tim. 2:4)
  3. If the Scriptures should testify, that God "will have all men to be damned," could we safely infer that a part might be saved?
  4. If the Scriptures testify, that God "will have all men to be saved," can we safely infer that a part may be damned?
  5. If God made an endless hell before He created man, did He know there would be any use for it?
  6. If God knew there would be use for an endless hell, must He not have created some men for endless misery?
  7. If God made an endless hell, was it included in the works which He pronounced "very good?" -- (Gen. 1:31)
  8. If there be an endless hell, and it was not made before the creation of men, when was it made?
 
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Eloy Craft

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  • If God knew when He created man, that some would be eternally wretched, did He not will this to be their doom?
No. God hoped
  • If God willed the endless misery of a part of His creatures, why is it said that "he will have all men to be saved?" -- (1 Tim. 2:4)
  • God loves his creations


  • If the Scriptures should testify, that God "will have all men to be damned," could we safely infer that a part might be saved?
  • That's a no-thing. Like a square circle

  • If the Scriptures testify, that God "will have all men to be saved," can we safely infer that a part may be damned?
  • No

  • If God made an endless hell before He created man, did He know there would be any use for it?
  • Yes It was made for angels

  • If God knew there would be use for an endless hell, must He not have created some men for endless misery?
  • No

  • If God made an endless hell, was it included in the works which He pronounced "very good?" -- (Gen. 1:31)
  • No. He divided the the light from dark. The light is good but the day declared without a judgment .
 
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Eloy Craft

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If there be an endless hell, and it was not made before the creation of men, when was it made?

3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 And God saw that the light was good; and God separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, the first day.
 
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Eloy Craft

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  • If God knew when He created man, that some would be eternally wretched, did He not will this to be their doom?
No. God hoped

Dear God: I hope You have Your Spirit fingers crossed!
Big time!
Well, Jesus lit a fire under our butts to gitt'r done.:)

Romans 8

For the creation waits with eager longing for the revealing of the children of God; 20 for the creation was subjected to futility, not of its own will but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope 21 that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to decay and will obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God. 22

God put faith and hope in man to fulfill creation and complete His plan.
 
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Big time!
Well, Jesus lit a fire under our butts to gitt'r done.:)

Romans 8

For the creation waits with eager longing for the revealing of the children of God; 20 for the creation was subjected to futility, not of its own will but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope 21 that the creation itself will be set free from its bondage to decay and will obtain the freedom of the glory of the children of God. 22

God put faith and hope in man to fulfill creation and complete His plan.

Dear Eloy: This my friend is the Hope of all hopes. The A.& O. has Himself subjected the entire krisis to frustration, tyranny and decay to the end the entire ktisis shall be delivered.

Not tis, the entire ta pante SHALL BE delivered!
 
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smithed64

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So, we agree that it could not have meant the whole Bible at the time it was written. Good.

2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness.


Where? I don't see that in the verse.

Your right it's not in this verse. I wasn't speaking of this verse. You ask if the Bible says it is the Word of God. The Bible is the Word of God. The scripture that Paul and the rest spoke of was the Tanak, the Pentatuch, Poetry, and the Great and minor Prophets. And In those books it is said, Thus saith the Lord.

There are many scriptures that show that the scriptures are God's Word.

Isa 34:16
Isa 55:11
Job 23:12
John 5:39
John 17:17
Luke 11:28
Luke 24:45
Matt 4:4
Psalms 12:6

Just a few.


I disagree. The Bible does not to my knowledge claim itself to be the Word of God.

Is not Jesus the Word of God? Did not the Word of God come to the Prophets?
Does that mean that Jesus was a Bible? Does that mean that a Bible came to the Prophets?

John 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word is God.

Your right He is called the Word. Which also backs up the scriptures, that it is the Word of God.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Saint Steven said:
What did the term "All Scripture" mean at the time this was written? Does this say that it is the Word of God? Does the Bible declare anywhere that it is the Word of God? Or is the Word of God declared by the Bible to be something else entirely?

2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness.
 
Upvote 0