ETERNAL SECURITY/ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED

Skidder said:

And that is the very reason in your mind that ETERNAL LIFE is not ETERNAL. You have changed the definition of ETERNAL to fit both of your false doctrines.

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Eternal Life is not the same thing as Eternal Destruction.
Eternal Life is not a super power or a magical wish from a genie.
Eternal Life is a person named Jesus Christ.
For Jesus alone possesses immortality (See: 1 Timothy 6:16).
And Scripture says that the he that has the Son, has life, and he that does not have the Son, does not have life (1 John 5:12).
How can we have an assurance that we know the Son?
1 John 2:3 says we can have an assurance that we know the Lord if we find that we are keeping His commandments.
1 John 2:4 says that person who says they know the Lord and they do not keep His commandments, they are a liar, and the truth is not in them.

Skidder said:

This guy just fulfilled what I said to you earlier because he changed the definition of eternal, so now Hell is no longer eternal in his mind. Like I said "one false doctrine always leads to another".

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Eternal Life is still eternal but how do you access Eternal Life? That is the issue. You think Eternal Life is like a super power or wish granted to you that cannot be revoked. Eternal Life is a thing that is exclusive to Christ Jesus and that is why we have to abide in Christ. If a believer sins, and they refuse to confess of their sin to Jesus, and forsake them, then the Lord will leave that person as a result of their rebellion against God. This makes sense because why would GOD who is holy want to live in a sinful temple?

Skidder said:

I see what you are saying, I too struggled with that, but if you look close at those verses you posted it says "for God is able to graft them in again". And right now the Jewish nation as a whole is still in that unbelief against the Christ, but if you look at those prophecies they were no longer unbelievers when that point of repentance comes. And I believe that is how He grafts them back in again.

"And I will pour on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem the Spirit of grace and supplication; then they will look on Me whom they pierced. Yes, they will mourn for Him as one mourns for his only son, and grieve for Him as one grieves for a firstborn."

"For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, 'Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.'"

I

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I think another good point to bring up is that Paul also said this earlier in Romans 2.

“For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh. But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, but from God.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭2:28-29‬ ‭NASB‬‬

So the reference in Romans 11 could be to those who are a Jew inwardly but do not believe that Christ is the messiah yet.

Skidder said:

This guy just fulfilled what I said to you earlier because he changed the definition of eternal, so now Hell is no longer eternal in his mind. Like I said "one false doctrine always leads to another".

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I never changed the definition of anything. That is a false accusation. Please quote where exactly I allegedly changed the definition of eternal.

Skidder said:

This guy just fulfilled what I said to you earlier because he changed the definition of eternal, so now Hell is no longer eternal in his mind. Like I said "one false doctrine always leads to another".

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Why do you think names can be blotted out of the book of life?
Eternal Life is a person. What you do decides if you are abiding in the person who has eternal life. If salvation was forever sealed upon your life (like a magical wish or super power), then names in the book of life could never be blotted out.

"He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels." (Revelation 3:5).

Please take note that a similar thing is said in a previous chapter that does clearly relate to salvation.

"...He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death." (Revelation 2:11).

Anyways, let's keep reading about "the Book of Life" in Revelation.

"And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works." (Revelation 20:12).

"And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire." (Revelation 20:15).

Going back to the beginning, we are told to "overcome" as a part of not having our name blotted out of the book of life. So salvation is conditional. One has to overcome.

Skidder said:

No surprise that your "eternal" hell matches your "eternal" life. Neither are eternal.

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If something is destroyed, it is destroyed for all eternity. That thing remains destroyed for all time. Paul says "everlasting destruction." You either believe what he says in Thessalonians or you don't believe it.

Also, eternal life is eternal. But again, who has eternal life? Jesus alone possesses immortality (1 Timothy 6:16). Jesus is the way, the truth, and the LIFE. Jesus is eternal life!!!! So you have to abide in the Son to have life. This is what 1 John 5:12 says. Eternal life is only eternal for you if you abide in the source of eternal life (Which is a person named Jesus Christ).

@Skidder

I would like for you to do me a favor. Memorize the following verses.
Put them on the inside of you.

Memorize 1 Timothy 6:16, 1 John 5:12, 1 John 2:3, and 1 John 2:4.
If you memorize them and truly seek their meaning prayerfully, and accept them, you will not speak against what these verses plainly say.

Skidder said:

Even if someone rose from the dead and told you of this awful place, would you still deny?

Luke 16:29-31
Abraham said to him, ‘They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.’ 30 And he said, ‘No, father Abraham; but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.’ 31 But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, NEITHER will they be persuaded THOUGH ONE RISE FROM THE DEAD’ ”

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Yes. I believe hell is a real and literal place of fiery torment. I believe in Dualistic Conditional Immortality (i.e. hell exists but the wicked will be erased from existence in the Lake of Fire after they are punished for a time), and I do not believe in traditional Conditional Immortality (which adheres to soul sleep). I agree with traditional Conditional Immortality proponents that the Lake of Fire leads to annihilation, but we do not agree on hell. Hell is very real.

Bible Highlighter said:

In Romans 7:14-24: Paul is recounting his past experience as a Pharisee when he followed the Law of Moses (the 613 laws of Moses) as the sole source of his salvation. He struggled to keep the Law but he could not do so because he did not have Jesus Christ in His life to overcome sin. For Paul later says in Romans 13:14, "Put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and do not make any provision for the flesh, so as to fulfil the lusts thereof."

Paul also later says in Romans 8:13, "For if you live after the flesh, you shall die: but if you through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, you shall live."

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Thank you.

Skidder said:

Eternal is forever, if it could be lost it was never eternal.

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We receive eternal life either after we die or on judgement day. What we have now in this life is the hope and promise of eternal life that is if we abide in Christ and endure to the end.

Emsmom1 said:

Thank you.

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You are most welcome, sister.

BNR32FAN said:

We receive eternal life either after we die or on judgement day. What we have now in this life is the hope and promise of eternal life that is if we abide in Christ and endure to the end.

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Thank you. Here are some great verses that reflect our "hope in eternal life."

"In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;" (Titus 1:12).

"That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life."
(Titus 3:7).

Now, I think we (as faithful believers) can have an assurance of our "hope in eternal life" (1 John 5:13) but this by keeping His commandments (1 John 2:3, John 15:10). I mean.... we are to keep Christ's commandments and not the Torah or the 613 laws of Moses.

Skidder said:

Well I believe that Jesus is the only sacrifice for sins, not human effort. If you believe you can lose your salvation you preach works gospel, which is no gospel at all, no matter how much you try to rationalize in your head that your flesh is not filthy rags. It is either by His blood, or the self righteous stench of human effort, it cannot be both.

Just how much of your flesh do you have to mix with His blood to keep your false salvation?

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How do you understand 1 John 1:7?
Does it not essentially say that we are to walk in the light, and that by doing so, the blood of Jesus cleanses us from all sin?
Do you know what "walking in the light" even means?
1 John 2:9-11 basically says that "walking in the light" is loving your brother.
This truth is supported by 1 John 3:10.
Are not those who are born of God do righteousness?
1 John 2:29 says exactly that.
So I am not exactly sure why you think a believer can just have a belief alone on Jesus for salvation (While being disobedient or sinful in some way). For to fight against works or holy living as a part of salvation means one is for the opposite position of holy living or works (Which is sin and disobedience). Is God really for people disobeying Him? Think.

Skidder said:

Well I believe that Jesus is the only sacrifice for sins, not human effort. If you believe you can lose your salvation you preach works gospel, which is no gospel at all, no matter how much you try to rationalize in your head that your flesh is not filthy rags. It is either by His blood, or the self righteous stench of human effort, it cannot be both.

Just how much of your flesh do you have to mix with His blood to keep your false salvation?

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Also, why did Jesus warn against how sin can destroy our souls?
Why did his followers do the same thing after the cross?