Punishment

There is a big difference between following Jesus and practising a religeon or political creed.

Love does not mean ignoring wrong behaviour and not seeking to teach correct behaviour.

God has never 'winked' at sinful behaviour and while he does not punish sinners in the here and now he will punish All who have not repented and accepted Jesus as there Lord and Saviour with permenant exile from his presence.
The alternative name for this is 'hell'.

The results of the error of man (and n^ns ) is shown in Scripture in many places.
Mankind, society, religion, is generally opposed to truth, and results in bad things, not good.

The results of truth is stated in Scripture also:

11 No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it.

Lilly54 said:

What a sad thing that so much abuse, murder and so on have taken place in the name of religion.

Click to expand...

In Yahuweh's Wisdom and Plan for demonstrating His Wisdom throughout all eternity, this was necessary to take place , and is in sharp contrast to the lives of the Ekklesia, as clearly described in Scripture.

This next excerpt of post>> is the second one I've read today, seems appropriate, at least in part, here >>

We Know His Voice


"So, it isn’t everyone who professes faith in Jesus Christ who has the promise of not being snatched out of the Lord’s hands, and the Father’s hands, but it is those who are listening to Jesus and His Word, who are paying attention to what he says, who are taking it to heart, and who are applying his truths to their lives, as a matter of practice, who can’t be snatched out of God’s hands."
=============================================================

p.s.
Study Bible
Trust in the LORD
…3Never let loving devotion or faithfulness leave you; bind them around your neck, write them on the tablet of your heart. 4Then you will find favor and high regard in the sight of God and man. 5Trust in the LORD with all your heart, and lean not on your own understanding;…
Berean Study Bible · Download

Lilly54 said:

Hebrews chapter 12. Verses 6 to 11.

Click to expand...

I don't see those verses as particularly troubling. They are talking about the discipline of God. The shedding of blood refers to Jesus' blood. It would be a pretty warped view to interpret them as a license for cruelty. You do refer to taking verses out of context, but this would be an extreme example.

Tolworth John said:

Love does not mean ignoring wrong behaviour and not seeking to teach correct behaviour.

Click to expand...

On the other hand, this attitude does serve as a license for both mental and physical abuse. (I'm not accusing you, Tolworth John, just using this line of your post to make a point). I hear this increasingly on right-wing Christian talk radio: "Love does not require tolerance." Well, no, but love does not require screaming, haranguing, isolating and mentally abusing, either. Love can simply make its point and move on, trusting the Holy Spirit to do the convicting.

Lilly54 said:

I often wondered why so much cruelty has been meted out by the likes especially of nuns in the Catholic faith and by those who puritannically interpret the Bible to serve their own warped minds. This kind of section of the Bible perhaps explains the dreadful ill treatment of orphaned vulnerable children and unmarried pregnant young girls etc.
Oh the dangers of taking verses of the Bible out of context and using to fuel human wickedness.

Click to expand...

Atrocities committed against people in the name of religion is sickening. Some of the worst and most angering things. I watched a show recently with unwed mothers losing their children against their will in the past with some of these organizations and religious based orphanages. I can't imagine what so many have went through. It was ran with nuns. They've done great things in history, but like everyone else, also much evil.

Lilly54 said:

Oh the dangers of taking verses of the Bible out of context and using to fuel human wickedness.

Click to expand...

Unfortunately this seems to be one of the favorite things of man to do.

AvisG said:

On the other hand, this attitude does serve as a license for both mental and physical abuse. (I'm not accusing you, Tolworth John, just using this line of your post to make a point). I hear this increasingly on right-wing Christian talk radio: "Love does not require tolerance." Well, no, but love does not require screaming, haranguing, isolating and mentally abusing, either. Love can simply make its point and move on, trusting the Holy Spirit to do the convicting.

Click to expand...

Do you have Children, or do you have dogs?

Both of these need to learn what is and is not acceptable behaviour. To do this one praises/rewards acceptable behaviour and rebukes/punishes unacctable behaviour.
That is saying 'Good Boy', smiling, giving little treats etc to reward in punishing saying 'NO', 'bad boy', frowning etc.

Both Children and dogs learn very quickly what is acceptable or not.

But the action of the parent/trainer is always one of intolerance of unacceptable behaviour.

In ahome that is loving and caring there is no abuse in this training even if punishments involve spanking as it is part of a system of consitent rewards and punishments that are graduate in responce.

There is more mental and spiritual abuse in homes where there is no consitency expected in behaviour or shown in the parents behaviour and as a result experienced in the upbringing.