Does creation get born again?

Shrewd Manager said:

Revelation teaches that when the obstacles to the gospel are removed - the sorceries of Babylon, the deceiver and his false trinity - most unbelievers will hear the word of the Lord and choose life. But some are so entrenched in their unbelief or love of the lie that they need extra help, so they're cast into the lake of fire, given a full dose of God's burning love. And they emerge from that immersion renewed in grace and truth.

So then, as it is written, the kings of the earth will bring their honour and glory to the throne, in supplication before the Almighty God, because at last they get it, they know who He is.

So you, too, must show love to foreigners, for you yourselves were once foreigners in the land of Egypt. (De 10:19)

You shall allot it as an inheritance for yourselves and for the foreigners who dwell among you and who have children. You are to treat them as native-born Israelites; along with you, they shall be allotted an inheritance among the tribes of Israel. (Ez 47:22)

"The second is this, 'YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.' There is no other commandment greater than these." (Mk 12:31)

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There is no changing of the mind after death. When Jesus is finished with His work as our High Priest, He will say it is done and that is it---time is up.

Rev_16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
Rev_21:6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
Rev 22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

Decisions have been made. They are final.

Jord Simcha said:

Universalism taught by David:
The Lord is good to all;
he has compassion on all he has made. Psalm 145:9

so that all people may know of your mighty acts
and the glorious splendor of your kingdom.
Your kingdom is an everlasting kingdom,
and your dominion endures through all generations. Psalm 145:12-13

You open your hand
and satisfy the desires of every living thing. Psalm 145:16

Universalism taught by Isaiah:

Isaiah 25:6-8

Universalism taught by Paul:

Colossians 1:20, 1 Timothy 4:10, Romans 5:19

Universalism taught by John the Baptist:

Luke 3:6

Universalism implied by an angel to Maria & Joseph:

Luke 2:10

Universalism alluded to by Jesus:

John 3:17, John 8:12, John 6:51

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Gods goodness is extended universally- but salvation is only for those who trust in teh death, burial and physical resurrection of Jesus as the payment for thier sin. Even Jesus said that the many find everlasting destruction!

Matt. 7:13, Matt. 25:46

Shrewd Manager said:

Helpful scriptures there, thanks for your post.

So do you think that they support the view that the same divine method is applied to the individual being born again/ renewed/ restored/ regenerated by the Spirit, but on universal scale?

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Personal opinion? No! Man is born in the image of God while nature is recreated with the curse of sin removed! (Romans 8)

Shrewd Manager said:

God's wrath is but for a moment. All our righteousness is but filthy rags. Jesus died for all, where sin abound grace abounds all the more. See the son, see the father. He is light, there is no darkness in Him.

You seem to be stuck in the common misconception that some ppl don't deserve salvation. It's precisely the least deserving that need it the most.

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I'm not stuck on some misconception that some people don't deserve salvation; I'm firmly convicted of the truth that NO ONE deserves salvation!

The mercy of God is demonstrated in that He saved some; when He didn't have to save any! Scripture is very clear; there are people who end up eternally in the lake of fire.

Shrewd Manager said:

Circles are not spheres. It's not flat earthers per se who believe there's a dome. The Hebrew conception of the firmament was a solid crystalline dome...as a molten looking-glass (Job 37:18). Here's a pearl for you, check Rev 4:6:

and before the throne there was as it were a sea of glass, like crystal.

And Rev 20:9:

And they came up on the broad plain of the earth

If that's not case closed right there, here's a short list:
The Firmament Biblical Verses

Not sure how the stars can all fall to earth under stupid modern theoretical gnostic cosmology. Or how God stretcheth out the heavens like a tent to dwell in, over a baal-shaped earth.

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Ironic that the website you reference here speaks of "domed firmament". (Again, a dome is a half a sphere. There's nothing in that argument that states earth itself is not a sphere.)

But hey; if you want to believe it isn't; despite the realities we live in that contradict that belief...

1. Both poles have time spans when the sun never rises; or it never sets.
2. Why do the days in summer get longer the further north (or south) you go dependent upon the time of the year.
3. How do shadows get longer the further from the equator you move?

But hey; believe what you want.

Shrewd Manager said:

Yes, but isn't it infinitely more likely that the crash was staged using military tech wizardry to distract ppl from God and the important issues of the day, and instead lead them away to speculate endlessly in a superstitious manner about anti-Christ kind of things?

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There's plenty of lies and darkness out there that the government does not have to stage some distraction to keep people from thinking about God. (That argument is silly nonsense.) Something either crashed in Roswell NM in 1947 or it didn't. It's that easy. And given that I don't see a logical reason to make up that something crashed; I conclude something crashed. Aviation accidents happen all the time. What actually crashed; that's the question that remains.

Shrewd Manager said:

I believe it's a case of 'His blood be upon us and upon our children.' Cursed themselves, which brings us back to the wrath of God abiding on those who wilfully reject Him. But scripture teaches that they will eventually be saved. Grace abounding over sin, every tongue confessing, every knee bowing, the delivery of the Abrahamic covenant, the downpayment of which was made in holy blood at Calvary. The gospel is always good news for all mankind. Christ's victory is total and eternal. Nobody eludes the hound of heaven.

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The wrath of God abides on all (outside of being atoned for) because all reject Him.

Scripture doesn't teach that the Jews will eventually be saved "just because they are Jews"; some will, just as some gentiles are saved. The gospel goes into all the world and salvation to every kindred, tribe, tongue and nation to prove that God has not confined redemption to a certain people based on race, ethnic origin and even to a certain understanding "religion".

There were people who were atoned for "of every kindred, tribe, tongue and nation" long before Jesus ever walked the earth. They understood that atonement as much as had been revealed to them via the witness of the creation. The gospel going into "all the world" or Jesus being the Redeemer for "all humanity" means redemption isn't confined to a particular nation. Yet at the same token, it doesn't mean universal atonement either.

Shrewd Manager said:

You've got me thinking Steve, may I take a little time to come back to you with my humble opinions?

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Yes, please. Thank you in advance for your continued efforts.

Shrewd Manager said:

There you go, where sin abounds, grace abounds just a little.

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Wow. What a great response. - lol

I am finding myself more and MORE appalled with the position of Damnationism. As clearly illustrated in the quote below.

As if to say, "Stop whining about the countless billions suffering eternal conscious torment with no hope of escape. Can you just rejoice that God didn't choose you to burn? They are getting what we all deserved."

I guess that is what it means to be created in the image of our heavenly Father. We deserve to burn. Wow. Unbelievable. (there go I but for the grace newly discovered) =o)

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The Righterzpen said: ↑
The mercy of God is demonstrated in that He saved some; when He didn't have to save any!

Shrewd Manager said:

There you go, where sin abounds, grace abounds just a little. Look, my God doesn't do things by halves. He's absolute.

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God's "absoluteness" (what ever it is you define that as) does not obligate Him to redeem all. It doesn't even obligate Him to redeem any! Scripture is very clear. There are people who face eternal torment; as well as other entities. "Fallen angels" as they are referred to.

Angels aren't even included in those capable of being redeemed. There's no "second chance" for Satan.

Shrewd Manager said:

Where does scripture clearly say ppl end up eternally in the LoF? It says no such thing.

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Now, it's my understanding that you don't deny there is a Lake of Fire. You just believe that people eventually "get out of" the Lake of Fire.

Scriptural evidence is pretty clear that eternal punishment is indeed eternal. Anyone who does an honest search on the Internet of the simple question "Is damnation eternal" will find it. There's 8 million hits on a google search for "scripture about eternal wrath".

Here's but one example of cited Scripture passages that state specifically that God's wrath is eternal.

https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/...tional-verses-for-eternal-punishment-in-hell/

Shrewd Manager said:

It says the nations go into the holy fire as enemies of God (Rev 20:9 and 15), they emerge renewed as friends (Rev 21:24-26), and they come for healing by Christ (Rev 22:2). Blindingly simple. I thank God He's kept these things from the wise and prudent.

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LOL Why'd you omit verse 10 of Revelation 20?

10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

LOL Why'd you omit verse 27 of Revelation 21?

24 And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.

(Note: this verse is not speaking of the unsaved!)

25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.

26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.

27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

(If they won't be allowed to enter the city; they must still exist.)

Revelation 22:2

The tree given for the healing of the nations does not state that all individuals of all nations are healed.

Yeah, blindingly simple. Thanks for the Scriptures that confirm my understanding that wrath is eternal!

Shrewd Manager said:

These are abstruse questions which call for any number of speculative answers. We don't do magick around here.

Why not try a more direct route like - why is there no detectable motion or measurable curvature to the earth? Many attempts to obtain the direct proofs have failed, so the fool resorts to jumping at shadows.

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LOL - "abstruse questions" because you can't answer them! It must be magic to get poles that have seasons of no sunrise and seasons of no sunset. That's only possible on a star centric solar system with spherical planets.

Now as to the question of "detectable motion" or "measurable curvature".

"Detectable motion" - If you get in an airplane and fly east; you expend less fuel and get there quicker than if you fly that same route west. Why is that? That is because if you are moving in the direction of the spherical planet (the same direction as the "jet stream" is moving; you will use less fuel, and get there faster. If you are moving counter to the direction of the planet; you are fighting wind currents that are traveling the direction they are because of the mass of the planet is rotating in that direction.

"Measurable curvature" Have you ever flown in an airplane at cruising altitude of 35,000. feet? From that altitude, you can see the curvature of the earth so long as you have a full view of the horizon with no cloud cover.

But hey; if you want to believe the earth is flat? Go right ahead. You're never going to convince me of your belief though.

Shrewd Manager said:

Well that's my faith, and I'm not about to poison the pure higher truth with some petty carnal idea that God "can't or won't" some. His will is to have all come to know Him so He can be all in all. His promise is that all nations be blessed. His gospel good news for all. Jesus died for all. And God renews all things in the time of restoration of all things. Amen.

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Well, don't worry. God will answer you come that day.

Shrewd Manager said:

And you don't think God can arrange that in His infinite goodness and wisdom?

And what if everlasting destruction is a good thing, because it burns away the dross and renews the man back to the image of God? Wouldn't that interpretation be more consistent with God's character, His salvific plan and the idiom of the day (eg hyperbole and prophetic rhetoric to emphasise a point)?

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Except nothing in the Scripture says everlasting destruction burns away the dross and renews the man back to the image of God. There is no name under heaven where men can be saved other than Christ Jesus. To believe that you can get out of God's wrath by burning away of your own dross would be salvation based on self. If that were possible; there's no need for the Redeemer.

Saint Steven said:

Wow. What a great response. - lol

I am finding myself more and MORE appalled with the position of Damnationism. As clearly illustrated in the quote below.

As if to say, "Stop whining about the countless billions suffering eternal conscious torment with no hope of escape. Can you just rejoice that God didn't choose you to burn? They are getting what we all deserved."

I guess that is what it means to be created in the image of our heavenly Father. We deserve to burn. Wow. Unbelievable. (there go I but for the grace newly discovered) =o)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Righterzpen said: ↑
The mercy of God is demonstrated in that He saved some; when He didn't have to save any!

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So rejoice when God choses you to burn.... because what a mercy to burn off your dross!

Shrewd Manager said:

And you don't think God can arrange that in His infinite goodness and wisdom?



And what if everlasting destruction is a good thing, because it burns away the dross and renews the man back to the image of God? Wouldn't that interpretation be more consistent with God's character, His salvific plan and the idiom of the day (eg hyperbole and prophetic rhetoric to emphasise a point)?

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God could have done anything he wanted! Bu8t when He declared that most will go to everlasting punishment then that is the choice He made! It is not for us to rationalize it, but accept what His Word says.

If it was simply that fine. But the Bible says it is never ending punishment- so it is never ending punishment. show me a clear unreinterpreted verse that shows your opnion and I would believe it!

The Righterzpen said:

So rejoice when God choses you to burn.... because what a mercy to burn off your dross!

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Looks like you misspelled chooses.

Saint Steven said:

Looks like you misspelled chooses.

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Does it really matter if its spelled right?

Or is it rather that this issue of wrath being eternal is like unto the atheist arguing with the theist over the existence of God. It doesn't matter if your right; it only matters if I'm right!

Yet, as pointed out to a previous poster - if you really could have your dross burned off; there's no need for the Redeemer, because apparently you believe you can atone for your own sin.

So, is that what you're "agreeing" with?

The Righterzpen said:

Does it really matter if its spelled right?

Or is it rather that this issue of wrath being eternal is like unto the atheist arguing with the theist over the existence of God. It doesn't matter if your right; it only matters if I'm right!

Yet, as pointed out to a previous poster - if you really could have your dross burned off; there's no need for the Redeemer, because apparently you believe you can atone for your own sin.

So, is that what you're "agreeing" with?

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Your assumptions and biases are evident. Can you apply some critical thinking here?

The dross burning is the WORK of the Redeemer. Therefore the Redeemer is ABSOLUTELY needed.

On the issue of who is right and whether it matters, let's turn the tables, as it were.
I would rather be a Universalist and be wrong than a Damnationist and be right.

If you are wrong, you are falsely accusing God of the most tyrannical and horrible crimes imaginable. Claiming that he would burn alive his own creation, children made in his own image, and keep them in that state of torment for all eternity with no hope of escape.

Not to mention the effect on the gospel itself which Damnationism essentially says that Jesus has come to save you from himself. Because if you refuse to believe in him, you will burn. As if the gospel message is to save people from the Savior. Hello?

Saint Steven said:

Your assumptions and biases are evident. Can you apply some critical thinking here?

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Can you apply some contextually correct Scripture? Your problem is that you don't like the idea of God's wrath being just and God being sovereign to determine what He wants to do. You don't think anyone deserves wrath and therefore everyone has to be saved because that's palatable to how you want to see God.

Saint Steven said:

The dross burning is the WORK of the Redeemer. Therefore the Redeemer is ABSOLUTELY needed.

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Why was Jesus crucified? If the point of the cross was to deal with the wrath of God; and if you can be purged of your dross in the lake of fire, to be delivered in the end; what was the point of the cross? What was the point of the incarnation? If there is any way out of hell other than the blood of Christ than the blood of Christ is pointless. If you are capable of being purged yourself; you don't need a redeemer. That's the bottom line of where your doctrine here leads.

Saint Steven said:

On the issue of who is right and whether it matters, let's turn the tables, as it were.
I would rather be a Universalist and be wrong than a Damnationist and be right.

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LOL - do you realize the implication of what your saying? If as a universalist; you're wrong. You would end up in the Lake of Fire and never get out! Do you realize that? And that is because you are denying the work of Christ who you allege has bought you by His blood. You are saying that atonement is not necessary.

Saint Steven said:

If you are wrong, you are falsely accusing God of the most tyrannical and horrible crimes imaginable. Claiming that he would burn alive his own creation, children made in his own image, and keep them in that state of torment for all eternity with no hope of escape.

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Let's look a little more critically at your belief here though. As far as I'm aware; you are not denying that people suffer God's wrath. You just are claiming that suffering isn't eternal. Now even if that wrath was not eternal; the wrath of God is still the wrath of God. It's still the same wrath; and how is that wrath not being eternal still not "tyrannical" and "criminal" in your mind? If you believe God's wrath is just; then you have no argument over it being "tyrannical" or "criminal" regardless of how long it lasts. You are falsely accusing God of being unjust is what you are actually doing.

Now; what's the unpardonable sin?

According to Scripture; the unpardonable sin is to witness God in the flesh performing miracles, know it is God in the flesh, (this is your Messiah Jewish leadership) and to say Jesus performed these miracles by the power of Satan.

Blaspheming the Holy Spirit is actually a ridiculous sin; because it is certainly not one committed out of ignorance! These men who said this to, as well as about Jesus; knew He was the Messiah and they knew that meant He was God incarnate!

So if I'm wrong and people's dross can be burned off in the Lake of Fire, that they ultimately be redeemed on the other side of that experience; then whether I believe in eternal wrath or not is immaterial, because I too will be "burned off of my dross". Yet if I'm right; you are in the Lake of Fire for all eternity! Your doctrine here makes what any of us believe about God immaterial.

Saint Steven said:

Not to mention the effect on the gospel itself which Damnationism essentially says that Jesus has come to save you from himself. Because if you refuse to believe in him, you will burn. As if the gospel message is to save people from the Savior. Hello?

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LOL - you neglect to mention the reason people are under God's wrath to begin with. God's wrath abides on men because of their sin; not because God is arbitrarily angry and unfair.

Shrewd Manager said:

The fact that the Greek word for 'punishment' is always kolasis (correction) never timoreisis (retribution) should give you a good hint.

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Let's see if you're right about the Greek words by comparing Strong's numbers:

No, you are not right! The English word "punishment"; is not always the Greek word "kolasis". "timoria" is also translated once as "punishment"!

Strong's #2851 (kolasis) Translated "punishment" is only used in two places (Matthew 25:46, 1 John 4:18). In Matthew its translated "punishment", in 1 John its translated "torment". Matthew 25:46 says "everlasting punishment".

Before we look at the word "everlasting" let's look at the word "torment" and see if "correction" fits?

1 John 4:18
18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

Now does this word substitution make sense?

18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath correction. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

Well..... that really makes no sense because if God chastises those He loves; why would fear not have "correction"?

So does the word "kolasis" really mean "correction"? That does not appear to be the case. It means "torment" or "punishment". And here is why we use Scripture to interpret Scripture. When the concordance tells you "kolasis" means "correction" that definition is not accurate to the Scriptural usage of this word. Now how this word may have otherwise been used in the secular Greek of the day is immaterial to how it's used in the Scripture. The Scripture tells us this because it tells us to compare it to itself.

Now; other Greek words for "punishment".

Strong's #2009. This word is only used once and it's in 2 Corinthians 2:6. This word lends itself more to "correction" as to "to turn someone to the right path" than does "kolasis" (#2851) The context of this word is that apparently someone had made a statement to the authorities that caused a bunch of people to be jailed. And Paul is stating that the weight of this on that man's conscience has "corrected" him (changed his course of action; he won't do that again).

Strong's #5098. Ahhh.... here's the other word you quoted "timoria" which is only used in one place (Hebrews 10:29) and translated "punishment". (Of which too; the word "retribution" would fit, because it's "of one authorized to administer recompense".)

Hebrews 10:
28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy (#3628) under two or three witnesses:

#3628 - used a total of 5 times. Translated as: "mercy" (KJV), "compassion" (NIV).

29 Of how much sorer punishment, (#5098) suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance (#1557) belongeth unto me, I will recompense, (#467) saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge (#2919) His people.

#1557 - used total of 9 times. Translated as: "avenge" (3x KJV), "vengeance" (4X KJV), "avenge" (1x KJV), "punishment" (1X KJV) The NAS uses the word "justice" in one place and "avenge" in the other 8 places. The interlinear uses the word "vengeance" in all places.

#467 - used a total of 7 times. Translated as: "recompense" (4x KJV), "repay" (1X KJV), "again" (2X KJV - Romans 11:25, 1 Thessalonians 3:9)

Romans 11:25:
34 For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?

35 Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again?

36 For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.

1 Thessalonians 3:
8 For now we live, if ye stand fast in the Lord.

9 For what thanks can we render to God again (repayment) for you, for all the joy wherewith we joy for your sakes before our God;

10 Night and day praying exceedingly that we might see your face, and might perfect that which is lacking in your faith?

(As is aptly demonstrated; multiple Greek words are used in context of "punishment", "vengeance" and "judge". This doesn't even address the Hebrew words translated as "punishment".)

Sorry dude, this aspect of your argument falls apart here!

Shrewd Manager said:

Correction has a goal - to correct, correct?

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Except the definition "correction" is not what is intended in these passages. That definition makes no sense in the context of those two verses.

Shrewd Manager said:

So the adjective translated in this context as 'eternal' ie aionion, could only then mean 'ages of' (as it can mean in context eg 'this present evil age' - Gal 1:4) or maybe 'corrected eternally' (ie fixed once and for all).

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Now let's take a look at the word "everlasting" here in Matthew 25:46. Since you quote the term "ages of". That's Strong's #166.

The word is only in context(ed) of "age" as it relates to God. God being "ageless". I.E. having no end. That's why this word is translated "eternal". This is a derivative of another word "age" (temporal age) which this word means "ageless". This word is used 71 times and is always translated "eternal", "everlasting", "eternity" or "forever".

This is not the same word "age" used in other places. Like "the destruction of Jerusalem will come at the end of the age". That's a different Greek word. (Strong's #165). That word is often translated "world". The "end of the world"; which is often understood (sometimes misunderstood) as the destruction of the cosmos. I.E. the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD. Jesus was not talking about the destruction of the cosmos with the ending of that "age". He was speaking of the "end of the age" of Judaism there. Post that verse (in Matthew 24) He speaks of the "heaven and earth will pass away" (I.E. destruction of the cosmos.)

Shrewd Manager said:

So the problem is not that we're reinterpreting scripture, it's rather that you're leaning on mistranslations and faulty assumptions.

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Is that really the case? As I have just aptly demonstrated to you (using the Scripture) that you have misinterpreted / mistranslated the Scripture.

Shrewd Manager said:

These point to nasty carnal results, which can't be true to the Spirit.

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As to reference to your mistakes / misapplications and mistranslations; I would agree with your statement here!

Shrewd Manager said:

The fact that the Greek word for 'punishment' is always kolasis (correction) never timoreisis (retribution) should give you a good hint. Correction has a goal - to correct, correct? So the adjective translated in this context as 'eternal' ie aionion, could only then mean 'ages of' (as it can mean in context eg 'this present evil age' - Gal 1:4) or maybe 'corrected eternally' (ie fixed once and for all).

So the problem is not that we're reinterpreting scripture, it's rather that you're leaning on mistranslations and faulty assumptions. These point to nasty carnal results, which can't be true to the Spirit.

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Mat 25:46

And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

κόλασις
Transliteration
kolasis
Pronunciation
ko'-lä-sēs κολάζω (G2849)
Greek Inflections of κόλασις κόλασιν — 2x
Dictionary Aids
Vine's Expository Dictionary: vii. τιμωρία, κόλασις.

KJV Translation Count — Total: 2x
The KJV translates Strong's G2851 in the following manner: punishment (1x), torment (1x).
Outline of Biblical Usage [?]

1. correction, punishment, penalty
   

The Bible and greek show you wrong.

Also what ever that correction (which is a negative not a positive or corrective thing) is eternal so there is no getting out of it!

Saint Steven said:

Your assumptions and biases are evident. Can you apply some critical thinking here?

The dross burning is the WORK of the Redeemer. Therefore the Redeemer is ABSOLUTELY needed.

On the issue of who is right and whether it matters, let's turn the tables, as it were.
I would rather be a Universalist and be wrong than a Damnationist and be right.

If you are wrong, you are falsely accusing God of the most tyrannical and horrible crimes imaginable. Claiming that he would burn alive his own creation, children made in his own image, and keep them in that state of torment for all eternity with no hope of escape.

Not to mention the effect on the gospel itself which Damnationism essentially says that Jesus has come to save you from himself. Because if you refuse to believe in him, you will burn. As if the gospel message is to save people from the Savior. Hello?

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No the gospel message is to save people from the eternal consequence of their sin! Hello have you read Gods Word?????

And you should be a biblicist not worry about universalism and damnationist. The Bible says the lost are lost for all ages!