gender dysphoria and the plight of parents

redleghunter · Dec 3, 2019

Sparagmos said:
I don’t see that happening at all. I have transgender friends, I’ve never heard of doctors rushing people into transitioning. Doctors don’t even suggest it.

Should doctors be willing to inject 8 year old children with hormones if one or both parents demand them to do so?

Brightmoon · Dec 3, 2019

redleghunter said:
Should doctors be willing to inject 8 year old children with hormones if one or both parents demand them to do so?

I don’t know and neither do you as neither of us are medical doctors. We both can express opinions but they’d be based on ignorance

Brightmoon · Dec 3, 2019

redleghunter said:
There are disorders where people want their perfectly healthy legs amputated. Should a parent indulge in such a request from an adolescent or advise the teen that maybe just maybe they will change their minds later and that then they are adults they can do what they wish with their legs?

Body integrity dysphoria - Wikipedia

Someone with this disorder usually has some brain damage. Being gay or being one of the other alphabet soup people is a rare but natural occurrence. Not a mental illness. The distress caused by being mistreated causes most mental problems in gays and other alphabet soup people

redleghunter said:
Not true. It is quite observable.

That’s not always true. I live in nyc and gay and alphabet soup people are free to live their lives here. Unless you ask or they tell you you’d never know if they were stereotypical gender conforming or not.

redleghunter · Dec 3, 2019

Brightmoon said:
I don’t know and neither do you as neither of us are medical doctors. We both can express opinions but they’d be based on ignorance

It is your opinion the doctor should decide? What about the kid who does not even know adolescence yet? Mommie tells Jimmy he is Jane and a girl, so he listens to Mommie. Jimmy/Jane at age 16 bursts into anger at Mommie for changing him from what he was supposed to be. He runs away from home.

redleghunter · Dec 3, 2019

Brightmoon said:
That’s not always true. I live in nyc and gay and alphabet soup people are free to live their lives here. Unless you ask or they tell you you’d never know if they were stereotypical gender conforming or not.

We are not speaking of 'conformity' but what is biological fact.

MournfulWatcher · Dec 3, 2019

MournfulWatcher · Dec 3, 2019

PloverWing said:
You are correct, though, that the exact definition of "sex" in the law is one of the important legal issues being debated.

Sports is a difficult question, because it is very much about one's body shape. And the locker room question is one that should be handled with sensitivity to all involved.

But this particular court case involved a transgender woman who was fired from her job when she informed her employer of her transgender status and her intent to begin dressing as a woman at work. That firing would be illegal under New Jersey state law, but it's not illegal under federal law. Or maybe it is, depending on what "sex" means, hence the arguments before the Supreme Court.

If most people really do want transgender people to be protected from discrimination in the workplace, then Congress could address this by explicitly adding "gender identity or expression" to the list of forms of discrimination prohibited by federal law.

I don't understand why we have to change the meaning of "sex" to protect trans people. Why can't it fall under the protection for people with mental illnesses and disabilities?

This entire idea that we need to accept gender identity as a protection is disingenuous. No one agrees on what gender identity entails. I simply see no science to support an unlimited amount of genders (which is the logical conclusion of having a spectrum of genders, and also contradictory to the idea of trans people even being a real thing, because transgenderism implies that there are only two genders in which someone can transition, while an infinite amount of genders ultimately means that maleness or femaleness isn't actually real.) You also have to decide how you're going to enforce gender identity into law; people have been sued for using the wrong pronoun. That obviously conflicts with freedom of speech, which is another example of trans rights trumping everyone else's.

Sports shouldn't even BE a difficult question. "Body shape" puts it too simply. Men and women are very different biologically. Transwomen competing in every single women's sports event are blowing away the competition. In contact sports, women have been severely injured by them in ways they wouldn't have been injured by an actual woman. And now there's talk of transwomen competing in the Olympics.

Recently a transgirl in a high school fought to be able to use the lady's locker room and they sided with him over a real girl who had been fighting against. I saw a video where she was on the brink of tears saying she didn't want to have to get naked in front of him (because she's a swimmer and sometimes they have to be naked in front of other girls in the locker room.)

I feel like people keep saying this same thing about the conflict between women and transgenders and liberals keep ignoring it. I'm sick of it.

Brightmoon · Dec 3, 2019

KarateCowboy said:
This is a religious belief, based on blind faith. It's alt-left religious extremism. You can't say sex is biologiical and gender is a social construct and then turn around and say gender is biologically built into an organ such as your brain

I didn’t say gender was a social construct . Sex specific clothing is a social construct. I said gender happens in the brain 5 months after fertilization. Some people have a mismatch between their sex and their gender. Biological and medical science is just starting to recognize this and is trying to make these people comfortable with their bodies.
Even in other species that normally have male and female this isn’t always true. In turtles the temperature of the nest the eggs are in can determine the sex. In some fish and other bilaterians, they can change sex depending on whether there are any of the opposite sex around or depending on how old the organism is. Humans show some of same the plasticity and science is starting to recognize that instead of encouraging abuse of these people. Sex determination is not cut and dried the way you think it is.

Brightmoon · Dec 3, 2019

MournfulWatcher said:
I don't understand why we have to change the meaning of "sex" to protect trans people. Why can't it fall under the protection for people with mental illnesses and disabilities?

This entire idea that we need to accept gender identity as a protection is disingenuous. No one agrees on what gender identity entails. I simply see no science to support an unlimited amount of genders (which is the logical conclusion of having a spectrum of genders, and also contradictory to the idea of trans people even being a real thing, because transgenderism implies that there are only two genders in which someone can transition, while an infinite amount of genders ultimately means that maleness or femaleness isn't actually real.) You also have to decide how you're going to enforce gender identity into law; people have been sued for using the wrong pronoun. That obviously conflicts with freedom of speech, which is another example of trans rights trumping everyone else's.

Sports shouldn't even BE a difficult question. "Body shape" puts it too simply. Men and women are very different biologically. Transwomen competing in every single women's sports event are blowing away the competition. In contact sports, women have been severely injured by them in ways they wouldn't have been injured by an actual woman. And now there's talk of transwomen competing in the Olympics.

Recently a transgirl in a high school fought to be able to use the lady's locker room and they sided with him over a real girl who had been fighting against. I saw a video where she was on the brink of tears saying she didn't want to have to get naked in front of him (because she's a swimmer and sometimes they have to be naked in front of other girls in the locker room.)

I feel like people keep saying this same thing about the conflict between women and transgenders and liberals keep ignoring it. I'm sick of it.

Really ? Why didn’t she just change in the bathroom . I did that for middle school because my mom used to buy me this humiliating underwear . Much ado about nothing . NYC has unisex single bathrooms in public spaces like libraries .

MournfulWatcher · Dec 3, 2019

Brightmoon said:
Really ? Why didn’t she just change in the bathroom . I did that for middle school because my mom used to buy me this humiliating underwear . Much ado about nothing . NYC has unisex single bathrooms in public spaces like libraries .

Women deserve to feel comfortable in their own spaces as much as trans people. No amount of your belittling will change that. Perhaps you're a victim of internalized mysogyny...

But thanks for confirming my last statement in my original post. Liberals never want to actually address these issues.

archer75 · Dec 3, 2019

It just seems to me that there is something really wrong here when the new orthodoxy doesn't even permit statement of pretty obvious facts. You can't refer to transwomen as biological males. There's a serious push to have that be hate speech. Is that nutso or what?

Sparagmos · Dec 3, 2019

redleghunter said:
Should doctors be willing to inject 8 year old children with hormones if one or both parents demand them to do so?

Absolutely not - doctors do not believe that hormone therapy should be considered until after puberty, since puberty “cures” gender dysphoria in many cases. I don’t even think that is legal. Doctors are treating the patient, not the preferences of parents. However, doctors have used hormones to delay puberty in cases where it starts way too early. My transgender friends were required by their doctors to go through a very long process before starting hormone therapy. Doctors generally don’t let people rush into it.

Sparagmos · Dec 3, 2019

MournfulWatcher said:
Women deserve to feel comfortable in their own spaces as much as trans people. No amount of your belittling will change that. Perhaps you're a victim of internalized mysogyny...

But thanks for confirming my last statement in my original post. Liberals never want to actually address these issues.

Being SAFE trumps being comfortable. A transgender person puts themself in danger by using the restroom that fits their birth gender rather than the restroom that fits their presentation. Are you saying you’d be comfortable with a man in the women’s restroom? Because you can’t generally tell that a transgender man is biologically female. So people are going to freak out if he goes in the women’s restroom.

MournfulWatcher · Dec 3, 2019

Sparagmos said:
Being SAFE trumps being comfortable. A transgender person puts themself in danger by using the restroom that fits their birth gender rather than the restroom that fits their presentation. Are you saying you’d be comfortable with a man in the women’s restroom? Because you can’t generally tell that a transgender man is biologically female. So people are going to freak out if he goes in the women’s restroom.

Women deserve to be safe in their areas. Transwomen have sexually assaulted/harassed/raped women in restrooms, prisons, and homeless shelters. You're asking women to put themselves and their daughters at risk. Most transwomen won't do this, just like most regular men wouldn't do this, but it's still something that happens and so women have their own space to protect them from such things.

If a transwoman really looks like a woman, then no one will notice. But that's not really the point I meant to make. My point is it should not be legislated that businesses, schools, colleges, prisons, and homeless shelters are required to place these transwomen in the same places that are reserved for biological women.

Honestly this could be solved if there were more family/unisex restrooms, but many transgender people don't want that because they want to be treated as the opposite gender in every aspect. That was the case with the trans high schooler I mentioned. The school gave him a private bathroom to use but it wasn't good enough for him.

Sparagmos · Dec 3, 2019

MournfulWatcher said:
Transwomen have sexually assaulted/harassed/raped women in restrooms, prisons, and homeless shelters.

This is propoganda. It’s a practically nonexistent problem. But violence against Transwomen is a huge problem. Yo7 still haven’t explained how to deal with trans men in the women’s room. Are you saying women will be ok and feel safe with someone who looks like a man in the women’s room? And how do you protect trans women from being attacked in the men’s room?

MournfulWatcher · Dec 4, 2019

Sparagmos said:
This is propoganda. It’s a practically nonexistent problem. But violence against Transwomen is a huge problem. Yo7 still haven’t explained how to deal with trans men in the women’s room. Are you saying women will be ok and feel safe with someone who looks like a man in the women’s room? And how do you protect trans women from being attacked in the men’s room?

I did say. They should have access to single stall family/unisex bathrooms.

The problem isn't nonexistent. There was literally a whole court case recently where a transwoman wanted to legally force a woman who ran a waxing service for women to wax his privates.
There may be few cases but you also have to remember that there also much fewer transwomen than there are biological men.

Here's a few examples: a transwoman raped and sexually assaulted multiple women in prison after being placed with the female inmates as well as having formerly molested children. Transgender prisoner who sexually assaulted inmates jailed for life

A transwoman sexually assaulted 4 women when placed with females in prison Transgender prisoner put in a female jail 'assaulted four women' | Daily Mail Online

Transwoman who sexually assaulted a ten year old in the bathroom as well as take photos of girls in bathroom stalls: Transgender woman, 18, sexually assaulted girl, 10, in Morrisons toilet | Metro News

Another transwoman who raped a 10 year old in a bathroom (fair warning, this one is hard to read) https://nypost.com/2017/10/20/transgender-woman-convicted-of-sexually-assaulting-girl/

And a man who claimed he was transgender so he could go into women's shelters and rape them: Man Claimed to Be Transgender so He Could Assault Women at Homeless Shelter | Restoring Liberty

Like I said, this is a minority of transwomen, like it's a minority of men who rape. And I know sexual violence against transgenders is a big problem. You could probably give me as many articles or more of transwomen being sexually abused.

But here's the deal: you still have to contend with the fact that women and children are put at risk when businesses, prisons, shelters, schools, etc are legally forced to allow biological men to be placed with women, since that's how most of the women and children ended up victimized in the examples I gave.

KarateCowboy · Dec 4, 2019

Brightmoon said:
I didn’t say gender was a social construct . Sex specific clothing is a social construct. I said gender happens in the brain 5 months after fertilization. Some people have a mismatch between their sex and their gender. Biological and medical science is just starting to recognize this and is trying to make these people comfortable with their bodies.
Even in other species that normally have male and female this isn’t always true. In turtles the temperature of the nest the eggs are in can determine the sex. In some fish and other bilaterians, they can change sex depending on whether there are any of the opposite sex around or depending on how old the organism is. Humans show some of same the plasticity and science is starting to recognize that instead of encouraging abuse of these people. Sex determination is not cut and dried the way you think it is.

Gender is a synonym for sex. The term was literally coined as such. You're pushing a myth, and what you wrote is not internally consistent or factually correct.

Please stop it with the super ignorant biological comparisons to cold blooded reptiles and gilled animals. When you can stay under water indefinitely without drowning then I'll consider the dumb comparisons

JacksBratt · Dec 4, 2019

Brightmoon said:
Well parents who listen don’t tend to have kids who run away from home.

Parents that give their kids everything they want end up with spoiled, entitled, snowflake adults that think that the world revolves around them... they live in the basement till their in their 30's and expect room service.

archer75 · Dec 4, 2019

As to the question of trans women using men's bathrooms and how shocking that would be...a lot of women don't know this, but it's fairly regular (few times a year for me) to walk into a men's bathroom (being a man) and find a woman in there.

First, you have a heart attack.
Then, she says "oh, it's OK, this is your bathroom."
Then you stand there stunned or leave until she leaves.

Semper-Fi · Dec 4, 2019

Brightmoon said:
Well parents who listen don’t tend to have kids who run away from home.

You have this the wrong way. Children
are to honor and listen to there parents.

Kids without proper parents as role models
today, are having a lot of mental issues.
Like girls without fathers are know to cut
themselves, boys also need a father figure.

Gods word says Discipline Promptly. Today
they say children should not be disciplined,
but rewarded, or give-in to what they want.
Proverbs 19:18 Proverbs 13:24

Today children 8 years old are taught to
explore there gender options in school,
against there parents wishes.

The break-down of the God ordained family
structure is being attacked today. [Parents]
rights are being taken away more and more.

1This know also, that in the last days perilous
times shall come. For men shall be lovers of
their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud,

blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful,
unholy,Without natural affection, trucebreakers,
false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of
those that are good,

4Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures
more than lovers of God; Having a form of godliness,
but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

gender dysphoria and the plight of parents

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Apes and humans are all in family Hominidae.

Thank You Jesus!

Thank You Jesus!

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In the beginning was the Word.

Apes and humans are all in family Hominidae.

Apes and humans are all in family Hominidae.

In the beginning was the Word.

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