None of These Diseases: I am the Lord who heals you.

yeshuaslavejeff said:

COOL! GREAT! WONDERFUL!
Did the Messiah bear our sins (as written)?
Of course!
What else ?

Click to expand...

Sorrows and infirmity. Does this mean we never get sick? Or never endure sorrows? No, it means he doesn't let us bear them alone.

renniks said:

I have already entered into spiritual life. I don't know what you mean how about letting others enter death with me?

Click to expand...

You stated that everyone will die....I believe what you mean is that you will die. I think it wise to allow others to answer the following question for themselves:

"And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"

RaymondG said:

You stated that everyone will die....I believe what you mean is that you will die. I think it wise to allow others to answer the following question for themselves:

"And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"

Click to expand...

So we all get to decide whether we die? " It is appointed unto man once to die..."

renniks said:

So we all get to decide whether we die? " It is appointed unto man once to die..."

Click to expand...

Do you make and exception for enouch an Lazarus?

RaymondG said:

Do you make and exception for enouch an Lazarus?

Click to expand...

Lazarus died once. We don't know if he died again. It's off topic anyway. What do you mean that people can choose whether the die?

renniks said:

Lazarus died once. We don't know if he died again.

Click to expand...

I agree. Since Lazarus can be resurrected by Christ, never to die again, why cant we?

renniks said:

It's off topic anyway. What do you mean that people can choose whether the die?

Click to expand...

Not sure where the confusion lie. What part of the question confuses you?:

"And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"

RaymondG said:

I agree. Since Lazarus can be resurrected by Christ, never to die again, why cant we?


Not sure where the confusion lie. What part of the question confuses you?:

"And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"

Click to expand...

Are you talking about physical death? I understand what Jesus said to mean we will never experience hell, that is, separation from God. We can choose not to go to hell, but we can't choose whether we die physically.

RaymondG said:

You stated that everyone will die....I believe what you mean is that you will die.

Click to expand...

Everyone dies, and will die, physically - unless the Lord were to return while we are still alive.

It sounds as if you are implying that if a person has enough faith they will not die physically. Everyone who has ever been born has died, including all the OT saints and Jesus himself. (Yes, I know he came to die, and also know that he is alive today; but he died.)
When he said "he who believes in me will never die", he was not talking about physical death. If he had been, then it would be clear that he has not kept that promise. Abraham, Moses, David, Isaiah, Peter, Andrew etc are alive - but not physically. they make up what we call the communion of saints, and I think are part of the cloud of witnesses that is talked of in Hebrew 12:1.

Strong in Him said:

Everyone dies, and will die, physically - unless the Lord were to return while we are still alive.

It sounds as if you are implying that if a person has enough faith they will not die physically. Everyone who has ever been born has died, including all the OT saints and Jesus himself. (Yes, I know he came to die, and also know that he is alive today; but he died.)
When he said "he who believes in me will never die", he was not talking about physical death. If he had been, then it would be clear that he has not kept that promise. Abraham, Moses, David, Isaiah, Peter, Andrew etc are alive - but not physically. they make up what we call the communion of saints, and I think are part of the cloud of witnesses that is talked of in Hebrew 12:1.

Click to expand...

I have no issues with you dying, if you so choose. Would you mind if I choose life instead? Would you mind is I answer "Yay Lord" when He says to me: "And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?""

renniks said:

Are you talking about physical death? I understand what Jesus said to mean we will never experience hell, that is, separation from God. We can choose not to go to hell, but we can't choose whether we die physically.

Click to expand...

If I told you that you will never die, what does it sound like Im talking about?

If I have all power, why try and limit it to what your mind believes can be possible?

RaymondG said:

If I told you that you will never die, what does it sound like Im talking about?

If I have all power, why try and limit it to what your mind believes can be possible?

Click to expand...

How about we actually read the passage?

17 On his arrival, Jesus found that Lazarus had already been in the tomb for four days. 18 Now Bethany was less than two miles from Jerusalem, 19 and many Jews had come to Martha and Mary to comfort them in the loss of their brother. 20 When Martha heard that Jesus was coming, she went out to meet him, but Mary stayed at home.

21 “Lord,” Martha said to Jesus, “if you had been here, my brother would not have died. 22 But I know that even now God will give you whatever you ask.”

23 Jesus said to her, “Your brother will rise again.”

24 Martha answered, “I know he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.”

25 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. The one who believes in me will live, even though they die; 26 and whoever lives by believing in me will never die. Do you believe this?”

27 “Yes, Lord,” she replied, “I believe that you are the Messiah, the Son of God, who is to come into the world.”

What was the point Jesus was making? Lazarus was stone cold dead. Did Lazarus not believe in Jesus? We have every reason to think old Laz was a true believer, and yet he died, physically, that is. So, what does Jesus actually say?, "even though they die, they will live." Obviously, he's not saying someone will live forever in their current physical body if they believe, or why would he say they will live even if they die?
Yes, it's both in a sense, because we will be resurrected with new bodies. But the point is that we will live forever in heaven and the new earth, if we believe in him, instead experiencing eternal death.

RaymondG said:

I have no issues with you dying, if you so choose. Would you mind if I choose life instead?

Click to expand...

I have eternal life, the life that Jesus came to bring, John 10:10; so my spirit will live forever.
My body will die one day, as will yours; if you're claiming you will still physically be around in 500 years time, I don't believe you. The body is temporary. As I said, everyone who has ever been born, has died - otherwise the world would have become massively overpopulated years ago.

If our human bodies did not die Scripture would not talk about death, the need to come to Jesus before we die, Luke 12:20, and the fact that we will all have resurrection bodies, 1 Corinthians 15:36, 1 Corinthians 15:50. If their is no physical death there will be no resurrection, and the parts of the NT which talk about being raised after death, are lies.

RaymondG said:

If I told you that you will never die, what does it sound like Im talking about?

Click to expand...

Spiritual death - which we all acknowledge and agree with.
You appear to be saying that you, alone, will be able to choose not to die physically.

renniks said:

25 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. The one who believes in me will live, even though they die; 26 and whoever lives by believing in me will never die. Do you believe this?”

Click to expand...

Thanks for quoting this. If you look carefully, you can see that it seems to be contrasting those who have died, with those who are living. If you die, you will be raised......AND if you are alive and believe....you never have to die.

Are you willing to follow me pass death?

renniks said:

What was the point Jesus was making? Lazarus was stone cold dead. Did Lazarus not believe in Jesus? We have every reason to think old Laz was a true believer, and yet he died, physically, that is. So, what does Jesus actually say?, "even though they die, they will live."

Click to expand...

A dead man cannot believe......which is why Im encouraging you not to go that route. If you live and believe.....you will never die. If I were talking about one death.....I would have said "Not die"

e.g. Will you come with me to the store today? I will not come. Will you come with me tomorrow or the next day , or the day after that?.....I will never come...so no need in mentioning MULTIPLE days.

renniks said:

Obviously, he's not saying someone will live forever in their current physical body if they believe, or why would he say they will live even if they die?

Click to expand...

Thing are only obvious to the carnal mind.....which cannot understand the things of the spirit. It is better to ask God for wisdom than to accept the first thing the mind brings to us. else seeing we will not see and hearing we will not hear....and be converted.

If you choose to die, there will still be hope for you......For he is a savior to all men.....but especially to those that believe.

"For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe."

I ask you again....

"And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"

Strong in Him said:

Spiritual death - which we all acknowledge and agree with.
You appear to be saying that you, alone, will be able to choose not to die physically.

Click to expand...

Ah yes, the "name it and claim it" theology. My grandparents bought into it and gave all their worldly goods to a radio preacher and then got old, sick, and died. I had an aunt and uncle who were active in a denomination which promised miraculous healing to all who truly believe. They believed truly and then got old, sick, and died. There two immutable certainties in this world - death and taxes.

Strong in Him said:

I have eternal life, the life that Jesus came to bring, John 10:10; so my spirit will live forever.

Click to expand...

Do you know this? Have you walked in eternity? Have you taken possession of your soul? Have you received your new name? Or are you content with dying and waiting to see? After death, there is no ability to repent.....So why no receive the promise before dying.....after which, you will never die again.....?

Strong in Him said:

My body will die one day, as will yours; if you're claiming you will still physically be around in 500 years time, I don't believe you. The body is temporary. As I said, everyone who has ever been born, has died - otherwise the world would have become massively overpopulated years ago.

Click to expand...

I've already agreed with you....that you will die. I do not wish to sway you from your beliefs and desires. Is it ok if myself and @renniks walk into heaven now and not follow you through the path of death.....and instead take the path of life?

Strong in Him said:

If our human bodies did not die Scripture would not talk about death, the need to come to Jesus before we die, Luke 12:20, and the fact that we will all have resurrection bodies, 1 Corinthians 15:36, 1 Corinthians 15:50. If their is no physical death there will be no resurrection, and the parts of the NT which talk about being raised after death, are lies.

Click to expand...

There is physical death and many who must experience it......but there is a path to life that few find....for it is not popular.

Strong in Him said:

Spiritual death - which we all acknowledge and agree with.
You appear to be saying that you, alone, will be able to choose not to die physically.

Click to expand...

You agree with it because it is something you feel you cannot prove. Yet death you see every day.

You see and believe. Yet blessed are they who, without seeing...believe.

And see, the path to death have multitudes..... Yet, I will not be along.... for i believe @renniks is close to accepting life....

RaymondG said:

You agree with it because it is something you feel you cannot prove. Yet death you see every day.

You see and believe. Yet blessed are they who, without seeing...believe.

And see, the path to death have multitudes..... Yet, I will not be along.... for i believe @renniks is close to accepting life....

Click to expand...

I already told you I have already accepted the life that God offers many years ago. I still don't know what you're getting at, and since you seem to have no inclination to state it plainly, I guess we are done here.

RaymondG said:

Do you know this?

Click to expand...

Yes, because the Lord Jesus Christ, my Saviour, has told me so in God's word.

RaymondG said:

Have you walked in eternity?

Click to expand...

Eternity does not start at some point in the future.
Eternal life starts now. I am God's child now and have the Spirit now, who is a deposit guaranteeing my inheritance, 2 Corinthians 1:22, 2 Corinthians 5:5. I have life - and this life that I have IN Christ Jesus will last for eternity.

RaymondG said:

After death, there is no ability to repent.....

Click to expand...

I know.
But as Jesus is my Saviour, took my sins and I am IN him, I will not need to repent.

RaymondG said:

.So why no receive the promise before dying.....

Click to expand...

So you admit that there is physical death then? Good - that is all we are saying.

RaymondG said:

I've already agreed with you....that you will die. I do not wish to sway you from your beliefs and desires. Is it ok if myself and @renniks walk into heaven now and not follow you through the path of death.....and instead take the path of life?

Click to expand...

I have eternal life NOW.
I am living in fellowship with the Lord, part of the vine, John 15:4-5, God's child, Romans 8:16-17.
That won't change when my earthly, temporal body dies - which it will one day; as will yours. You seem to be saying that this doesn't happen to some people, yet you haven't provided Scriptural evidence, never mind proof, that Abraham, Moses, the prophets, the disciples etc etc are alive somewhere in the world today. They are not. They died; the Bible says so - or don't you believe the word of God?

RaymondG said:

There is physical death and many who must experience it....

Click to expand...

EVERYONE experiences physical death - it came into the world the same time as sin and sickness.
If you ARE trying to say that the Apostles are alive physically somewhere; where's your evidence?

RaymondG said:

but there is a path to life that few find....for it is not popular.

Click to expand...

No, the path to eternal life is not easy.
Eternal life does not mean eternal physical life, however.

RaymondG said:

You agree with it because it is something you feel you cannot prove.

Click to expand...

Spiritual death = separation from God; being dead in our sins.
People who have eternal death are those who never repented while they were alive and, as you yourself have said, there is no repentance after death.
I don't need to prove that - it's what Scripture says.

RaymondG said:

And see, the path to death have multitudes..... Yet, I will not be along....

Click to expand...

If you are saying that your body will never die - that if CF is still around in 500+ years time, you will still be on here, I don't believe you.
Before the flood the Lord said that man was mortal, and his years would be numbered at 120, Genesis 6:3. Later, the Psalmist said that our years would be "70, or 80 if we have the strength", Psalms 90:10. So God himself says that man is mortal and will live on earth for a limited number of years.
The reason Jesus, and others, preached repentance now was that no one knew when they were going to die and it would be too late to accept God after death.
Your body will die one day, too. I am sure you have eternal life, as I do; but your flesh and blood body will die - like everyone else.