Michael the Arch Angel = Jesus??? Again. Sorry!!!

yeshuaslavejeff said:

Any angel that Yahuweh appoints as prince over a geographic area.

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Dan 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
Dan_9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

Dan_12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

Act_3:15 And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.
Act_5:31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
Rev_1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,



Mat_9:34 But the Pharisees said, He casteth out devils through the prince of the devils.
Mat_12:24 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.
Joh_12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
Joh_14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.
Joh_16:11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.
Eph_2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

Michael the Archangel---is a title, one of many that Jesus has. Archangel is the chief of the angels---there is only One who leads all the angels, for He created them.

mmksparbud said:

Michael the Archangel---is a title, one of many that Jesus has. Archangel is the chief of the angels---there is only One who leads all the angels, for He created them.

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No.
Jesus is the eternal Word, present from the beginning, through whom all things were created.
Jesus did not create himself. Angels are created beings; he was not created.
Jesus is God the Son, who shared his Father's glory before creation, John 17:5.

Jesus and the archangel Michael being one and the same, is a JW's teaching.

mmksparbud said:

Michael the Archangel---is a title, one of many that Jesus has. Archangel is the chief of the angels---there is only One who leads all the angels, for He created them.

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He created Michael the Archangel to be the chief of the angels. (probably)


Just noted this good accurate post: by @Strong in Him
"Jesus and the archangel Michael being one and the same, is a JW's teaching. "
and that sounds right. If it is a jw's teaching , or another's, in any case, it is false.

mmksparbud said:

​

There are many, many earthly princes throughout the bible. Even David was called a prince and so many rulers were called a prince---there are only 2 Princes that are called the Princes over the world, over the lost and over the saved. ​

Dan 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
Dan_9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

Dan_12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

Act_3:15 And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.
Act_5:31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
Rev_1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,



Mat_9:34 But the Pharisees said, He casteth out devils through the prince of the devils.
Mat_12:24 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.
Joh_12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
Joh_14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.
Joh_16:11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.
Eph_2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

Michael the Archangel---is a title, one of many that Jesus has. Archangel is the chief of the angels---there is only One who leads all the angels, for He created them.

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Hello, if you say Michael is one of many title that Jesus has, so who is the other prince with (Michael ) that mention in Daniel 10:13...But the prince of the Persian kingdom resisted me twenty one days. Then Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me....

According to this verse there is more than one prince apart from Michael. ...

Strong in Him said:

No.
Jesus is the eternal Word, present from the beginning, through whom all things were created.
Jesus did not create himself. Angels are created beings; he was not created.
Jesus is God the Son, who shared his Father's glory before creation, John 17:5.

Jesus and the archangel Michael being one and the same, is a JW's teaching.

Click to expand...

And nobody said that Jesus is a created being, He is not---He is God, was from the beginning with God Eternal and everlasting and the creator of all things---including the angels over which He is the leader of them. That is all archangel means, the chief, ruler of the angels. It is a title. I know the JW's do not teach that Jesus was God from eternity with the Father nor that He created everything. They are not the only ones that believe Michael is Jesus, other denominations do, for the simple fact that it is biblical and just one of Jesus' titles.

Jesus is the “seed” mentioned at Genesis 3:15 who would ultimately fulfill the first prophecy of the bible by crushing the serpents and his seed. It is fitting the he should be the one to do this as the newly installed king.

Jesus talked about the roles he and his angels would do in the future. (Matthew 24:31; 25:31)-Compare 2 Thessalonians 1:7. This concludes that Michael is none other than Jesus Christ.

In Jude 9, reference is made to “Michael the archangel.” Michael means: “Who is like God?” And, since the title “archangel” means “chief of the angels,” they must be one in the same. Therefore, who ever this Michael is must be concerned about God’s sovereignty by proving that no one is comparable to Him.

Revelations 12:7-9 informs us of a battle in heaven between Michael and the serpent (Devil/Satan) including his angels.

pasifika said:

Hello, if you say Michael is one of many title that Jesus has, so who is the other prince with (Michael ) that mention in Daniel 10:13...But the prince of the Persian kingdom resisted me twenty one days. Then Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me....

According to this verse there is more than one prince apart from Michael. ...

Click to expand...

But Michael is the only one called The Archangel. For He is the chief, the ruler of the angels. There are classes of angels. covering cherubs, seraphim, those with 2 wings, those with 6. Gabriel himself would be a chief prince among the angels, a covering cherub is the highest---Lucifer was once one. But only one Archangel from eternity---Michael, and He alone can be called Michael---"one who is like God," for He is God with the Father.

yeshuaslavejeff said:

He created Michael the Archangel to be the chief of the angels. (probably)


Just noted this good accurate post: by @Strong in Him
"Jesus and the archangel Michael being one and the same, is a JW's teaching. "
and that sounds right. If it is a jw's teaching , or another's, in any case, it is false.

Click to expand...

Daniel 12:1 ...'And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.'


First, this verse denotes that judgment has come to an end, probation has closed and Jesus is soon to return. Now who is conducting the great judgment in heaven? God the Father, with Jesus Christ as our Mediator right? So how could judgment come to an end when a "mere" angel stands up? Doesn't this make more sense if it is Jesus Christ that stands up to signal the end of judgment? Also, in the above verse it says that Michael is the "Great Prince" who stands for God's children. Who is it that "stands up" (intercedes) for us? Jesus Christ! Only Jesus will decide when He is finished as our High Priest in the heavenly sanctuary. He will say "It is done"--decision making time is over. Everyone has made their final choice and Jesus alone can stand up and declare time is up.


Rev_16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
Rev_21:6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
Rev 21:7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

Rev 22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

Michael the archangel means, "the greatest messenger, who is like God".



Jos 5:13 And it came to pass, when Joshua was by Jericho, that he lifted up his eyes and looked, and, behold, there stood a man over against him with his sword drawn in his hand: and Joshua went unto him, and said unto him, Art thou for us, or for our adversaries?
Jos 5:14 And he said, Nay; but as captain of the host of the LORD am I now come. And Joshua fell on his face to the earth, and did worship, and said unto him, What saith my lord unto his servant?
Jos 5:15 And the captain of the LORD'S host said unto Joshua, Loose thy shoe from off thy foot; for the place whereon thou standest is holy. And Joshua did so.

Joshua fell on His face and worshipped the captain of the host of the Lord!!! This is Michael the archangel, the captain of the Host---no man can worship an angel, no angel makes anything holy---The Father and the Son can make anything Holy by their presences---no created being can!



Revelation 12:7 ...'And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels.'


who is the war in Heaven between? Is it between Satan and an angel? No, the war is between Satan and Christ Jesus. And notice that it says in the above verse in Revelation that Michael and HIS angels fought against the dragon (Satan) with "his" angels. So we have Satan with his angels fighting against who? Jesus Christ and His angels! God's angels don't belong to another angel. They belong to our Lord and Saviour, Jesus Christ. Remember who the "CAPTAIN OF THE HOST" is from Joshua 5 above? It is someone who turns the place where He stands into HOLY GROUND. It is Christ Jesus!

Chapter 12

1 And at that time, Michael shall stand up fn1, the great ruler who stands for the sons of your people fn2. And there shall be a time of distress, such as has not been from the being of a nation until that time. And at that time, your people shall be delivered, everyone that shall be found written in the Book fn3. (Ps 9:5)

2 Michael the arch cherub is a special cherub
that protects Israel.

mmksparbud said:

And nobody said that Jesus is a created being, He is not---He is God, was from the beginning with God Eternal and everlasting and the creator of all things---including the angels over which He is the leader of them.

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He's not the leader of the angels; he's God the Son, Saviour, Lord, King and redeemer of mankind.

mmksparbud said:

They are not the only ones that believe Michael is Jesus, other denominations do, for the simple fact that it is biblical and just one of Jesus' titles.

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Michael, the angel, was given the human name Jesus??
Of course he was!

It was God the eternal Word who became flesh, not an angel.

tsk tsk

mmksparbud said:

Michael the archangel means, "the greatest messenger, who is like God".

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Jesus is not a messenger, someone LIKE God; he IS God.
God himself took on flesh, became like us, walked in our shoes. This is how Jesus can mediate between God and man - he was both. This is why we can know that God hears our prayers - Jesus, who knows and has experienced, what it means to be human, is praying for us. We can be reassured that God understands all our troubles; he's been there.

Michael is the chief of the angels. Angels are created beings; they were created by God the Father through Jesus. Jesus is superior to the angels, Hebrews 1:4. Angels are messengers and serve God. Jesus IS God.
Hebrews 1:4-9.

yeshuaslavejeff said:

tsk tsk

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??

So many words, ... yet the truth is and remains so simple and true.

Strong in Him said:

Michael, the angel, was given the human name Jesus??
Of course he was!

It was God the eternal Word who became flesh, not an angel.

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In this, are you agreeing that Jesus is not an angel, Jesus is not Michael ? If so, good.

icedragon101 said:

I know this subject keeps coming up over and over again, but I have a new question on Daniel 10. in 2011 I thought this doctrine had been debunked when I attended an Evangelical Church and the preached on this subject. As he was preaching I thought I saw the proof that Michael was NOT Jesus, but now I think I may have drawn a hasty conclusion. In the vision Daniel see what most believe a vision of the pre-incarnate Christ. Then he falls un-conscious and when he wakes up he is told by an un-named being that Michael had to be called to help, because he was resisted by the Prince of Persia, that is why it took so long to come to Daniel. The problem is that when Daniel falls asleep and then wakes up is the speaker the Pre-incarnate Christ or is some other being. If it is PIC then it is proof Michael is not Christ. If it is some one else then Christ could still be Michael. Does anyone know if the language indicates that it is one way or the other?

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Who is the man identified below?

Daniel 10:5-6
I lifted my eyes and looked, and behold, there was a certain man dressed in linen, whose waist was girded with a belt of pure gold of Uphaz. His body also was like beryl, his face had the appearance of lightning, his eyes were like flaming torches, his arms and feet like the gleam of polished bronze, and the sound of his words like the sound of a tumult.

It's incredible how far from Christian truth some of these Protestant churches end up, once they sever ties to the original and true Christian Church. The original Christian Church, the one Church Jesus Christ founded, which He said was to remain one, to which He promised the fullness of God's truth until the end of time, has consistently taught for 2,000 years that God consists of three individual divine Persons - the Father, the Son (Jesus Christ), and the Holy Spirit. Angels are created beings. God is not.

John 1, Hebrews 1, and many other passages show that Jesus is not an angel.