Adam's Sin

Tree of Life said:

What do you think of the question in the OP?

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I can't tell you exactly how it is, but because of Adam's rebellion against God and his siding with Satan, his guilt is shared by all his descendants. This is because Adam lost the Holy Spirit and his body became mortal. He had the sentence of death in him the moment he disobeyed God's express command. Therefore all his descendants received the same mortal bodies, and so they, including us, are all under the sentence of death. In that way, we share Adam's guilt and condemnation.

It is only through Christ paying the price for our guilt and condemnation that we, through faith in Him can be converted and receive eternal life.

Tree of Life said:

Romans 5 probably does say that Adam's guilt is imputed to his offspring. Paul says in Romans 5:12 - ἐφʼ ᾧ πάντες ἥμαρτον. This can be rendered: "Because in him all sinned."

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The argument is whether it can mean "because all sinned" or "in whom all sinned," not "because in him." The Greek means "because all sinned." The mistranslation of "in him all sinned" is historically attributable to Augustine.

Tree of Life said:

Is the guilt of Adam's sin imputed to his offspring (us)? Why or why not?

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The entire curse of sin was passed to his offspring because he decided to have children after he fell, and his genetics and spiritual nature began to decay and/or die. In other words, he lost his title as a son of God, and by default gained the title of son of man - from "little god" to carnal entity - passing that maximum of carnality to us.

Us having the curse of sin is a consequence of Adam and Eve procreating after they fell. When the Most High God told them to be fruitful and multiply, He didn't mean for them to have billions of carnal children under the curse of sin.


The guilt of Adam's sin is Adam's alone; many of us carry our own measure of guilt; others feel they have nothing for which to be guilty.

Tree of Life said:

Is the guilt of Adam's sin imputed to his offspring (us)? Why or why not?

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Only in an analogical sense did we sin and fall with Adam. The state known as original sin is described primarily as separation from God, Whom man was made for communion with. As we're born outside of this vital communion, we experience the consequences of Adam's original sin, and may learn, with experience and grace, of our absolute deprivation and need for something more that we that which we find in this brave new world, morally free from God, that Adam obtained for us. We're here to learn what Adam missed-just how much we truly need God.

timtams said:

The argument is whether it can mean "because all sinned" or "in whom all sinned," not "because in him." The Greek means "because all sinned." The mistranslation of "in him all sinned" is historically attributable to Augustine.

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And yet Rom 5:19 associates our own sin directly with his, as resulting from his:
"For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous."

I do not read the Genesis myth as a fall from an original state of perfection into sin and death. The first couple were completely innocent and naive creatures. They were certainly capable of making a mistake but, without knowing good from evil, they lacked even the ability to sin. That ability came only with them eating of the "Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil". To me the story is a "coming of age story". Our mythical first couple graduated from animal status into to fully self aware human beings capable of making moral judgements. This is not an Original Sin story but rather an Original Blessing story that should be celebrated. We are not a people fallen from an original state of perfection into sin and death.

Why the expulsion from Eden? In the mythology, I believe it to be symbolic that mankind was no longer a naïve creature living in moral ignorance but had become real men and women living in a real world where there was real good and evil.

What we are is a people that is still evolving and that evolution has profoundly affected not just our bodies but our psyches as well. The world in which we evolved was a difficult and dagerous one and mere survival was of the highest priority. Selfishness became a part of who we are as a survival mechanism. This selfish instinct is no longer as necessary as in our savage past but it is still powerful. If there is an "Original Sin", this is it. Of course it is not a sin really but an innate part of our nature and it can be overcome.

In the words of John Spong: "Every living thing, plant and animal is programmed to survive. What is true of all these living things is also true of human life. The only difference is that we human beings are self-conscious, while plants and animals are not. If survival is our highest goal, self-centeredness is inevitable and thus this quality becomes a constant part of the human experience. Traditionally, the church has called this "original sin" and has explained it with the myth of the fall. That was simply wrong. Survival is a quality found in life itself. There was no fall. Self-centered, survival driven, self-conscious creatures is simply who we are. There is thus no such thing as "original sin" from which we need to be rescued by a divine invader. So much of traditional Christianity assumes this false premise."

Not the sin itself, but the effects of that sin upon the human race.

redleghunter said:

Why did St Augustine reason why babies needed to be baptized?

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Because of the effects of Original Sin.

chilehed said:

Because of the effects of Original Sin.

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And that would be?

Tree of Life said:

Is the guilt of Adam's sin imputed to his offspring (us)? Why or why not?

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"When Adam had lived 130 years, he fathered a son in his own likeness, after his image, and named him Seth (Genesis 5:3)." All of us are born in the image and likeness of Adam. We are spiritually dead to God and in need of His life. That life is only available through the resurrection of Jesus Christ. What has been "imputed" to us is our need to be born again of the Spirit of God.

Tree of Life said:

Is the guilt of Adam's sin imputed to his offspring (us)? Why or why not?

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No. But Adam and Eve died spiritually. All his descendants are born dead also. People do not sin and then become sinners. The nature we inherit is sinful, so sin is the outworking of that nature.

Tree of Life said:

Is the guilt of Adam's sin imputed to his offspring (us)? Why or why not?

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Yes, because we were members of the covenant between him and God.

The righteousness of Christ is imputed to all believers, because we are members of the covenant between him and God.

You cannot have the one without the other.

Tree of Life said:

Is the guilt of Adam's sin imputed to his offspring (us)? Why or why not?

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Hello, is the guilt of our own sin Not Adam's.
Why? Because Adam did not committed my sin but me.

redleghunter said:

And that would be?

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Off topic. In any case, if you want to know what Augustine thought, I suggest reading his works.

Tree of Life said:

Is the guilt of Adam's sin imputed to his offspring (us)? Why or why not?

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No. Because one man's sin or righteousness cannot be imputed to another man except in the case of Christ. See Ezekial 18. We all become guilty of our own sin, the same way Adam did and we can all become free of sin the same way he did. That is what Romans 5 is saying (if you can get it).

redleghunter said:

Yes but according to Augustine there was a specific reason a cute little innocent baby who has never sinned required baptism. I posed this question to another poster.

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1) a cute little innocent baby who has never sinned

A:There is no such thing according to God's Word the Bible:

2) a cute little innocent baby who has never sinned required baptism.

A: God's Word which is the truth says:

Neogaia777 said:

Choose life, and life in Christ, with Christ, etc...

God Bless!

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Did we have to choose death and death with Adam? Or did it just happen.....similar to the question in the OP.

If our situation with Adam is so different than our situation with Christ...... why do some use the direct comparisons in Roman 5 to explain that all sinned in Adam.......when our believed on the results of both Adams, are contradictory?

twin.spin said:

1) a cute little innocent baby who has never sinned

A:There is no such thing according to God's Word the Bible:

Genesis 6:5
Ecclesiastes 7:20
Psalm 14:2-4
Matthew 15:19
John 3:6
John 6:63
Psalm 51:5
Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me.​

2) a cute little innocent baby who has never sinned required baptism.

A: God's Word which is the truth says:

1) Jesus' commanded to make disciples of all nations (Matthew 28:19) ... babies are part of "all"

2)Baptism is something God does to us:

• Baptism: washes your sins away (Acts 22:16)
• Baptism: forgiveness of sins (Acts 2:38)
• Baptism: "The promise (forgiveness of sins) is for -
  • "your children (Acts 2:39)
  • "and for all who are far off—for all whom the Lord our God will call.”(Acts 2:39)

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Thank you! I used that language for a reason.

Tree of Life said:

Is the guilt of Adam's sin imputed to his offspring (us)? Why or why not?

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God never told anyone that they suffered from the guilt of Adam. He never told a person they had Adams sin imputed to them.

eleos1954 said:

We have a sin nature ... we inherited from Adam & Eve ... that is it is more natural for us to sin than not too .... each of us are guilty for the sin we each commit and that includes Adam & Eve.

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Sin nature is not in the Bible.