Body + Breath = Living Soul?

Matthew 10:28 Do not be afraid of those who kill ... - Bible Hub

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Don't be afraid of people. They can kill you, but they cannot harm your soul. Instead, you should fear God who can destroy both your body and your soul in hell.
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Christ is Lord said:

Also, if the breath or life goes back to God what does that actually mean? Can it interact with God in heaven?

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See the difference between spirit and soul in God's Word (not anywhere else,btw) . It is a vast, vast difference.

These are really good questions. It has been my understanding that the idea of disembodied souls is more a Greek philosophical conception than a Christian one. But that can be argued.

I have always wondered what it means to say that spiritual beings don't have bodies. If we mean they don't have physical bodies, that makes sense. But if something is not "embodied" in some way, then it is not located anywhere. So, for instance, a spirit that is not in some way located must be ubiquitous. But, of course, ubiquity is a characteristic that belongs solely to God, so that can't be right. That being the case, spiritual beings must have some kind of "body." I would assume it is a spiritual body. As Jesus said about the resurrection, we will be like the angels. And as Paul said, we will have spiritual bodies. Just some thoughts, but not sure how coherent they are.

Christ is Lord said:

I grew up in a tradition that taught the following equation: Body + God's Breath of Life = Man Became a Living Soul. It goes on further by saying if you take away God's Breath, man is no longer a leaving soul and the breath goes back to God in heaven and the body returns the dust and man is "asleep" until the resurrection. However, recently I've been thinking that there are some holes in that logic, because if 'body' is in the equation where would that put things that God made that don't have a 'body' i.e (the supernatural realm, angels, demons, etc). If you need a body to be considered a living soul/spirit then things from the supernatural realm would be dead by that logic.

Angels for example, don't have a 'body', they are spirits and are disembodied by nature, however, they can occupy a physical nature if need be. Also, if the breath or life goes back to God what does that actually mean? Can it interact with God in heaven? This is another reason why I still can't see how the some would say the Bible teaches soul sleep. Can a soul die?

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It's a peculiar view, that's for sure--nothing that could be considered standard thinking among any of the usual Christian denominations.

Christ is Lord said:

I grew up in a tradition that taught the following equation: Body + God's Breath of Life = Man Became a Living Soul. It goes on further by saying if you take away God's Breath, man is no longer a leaving soul and the breath goes back to God in heaven and the body returns the dust and man is "asleep" until the resurrection. However, recently I've been thinking that there are some holes in that logic, because if 'body' is in the equation where would that put things that God made that don't have a 'body' i.e (the supernatural realm, angels, demons, etc). If you need a body to be considered a living soul/spirit then things from the supernatural realm would be dead by that logic.

Angels for example, don't have a 'body', they are spirits and are disembodied by nature, however, they can occupy a physical nature if need be. Also, if the breath or life goes back to God what does that actually mean? Can it interact with God in heaven? This is another reason why I still can't see how the some would say the Bible teaches soul sleep. Can a soul die?

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Regarding angels ... they are a different type of created being. They don't die. Evidenced of why satan and the fallen angels will have to be destroyed by God in the very end.
Angels can be seen or not seen. Angels have supernatural abilities that mankind does not have, including the fallen angels.

Angels do have physical bodies.

Ezekiel 1:1-28 gives a physical description of angels as four-winged creatures. In Ezekiel 10:20, we are told these angels are called cherubim.

When angels are seen in Scripture and appearing on earth, they usually appear (not always) in the form of human beings ... so they have the supernatural ability to change their physical appearance.

Hebrews 13:2
Do not neglect to show hospitality to strangers, for thereby some have entertained angels unawares.

Angels do not die.

Luke 20

34Jesus answered, “The sons of this age marry and are given in marriage. 35But those who are considered worthy to share in the age to come and in the resurrection from the dead will neither marry nor be given in marriage. 36In fact, they can no longer die, because they are like the angels. And since they are sons of the resurrection, they are sons of God.

Yes ... a soul can die ... a soul is a person ... "Body + God's Breath of Life = Man Became a Living Soul" (a person) ... this is correct.

Matthew 10

Berean Study Bible
Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Instead, fear the One who can destroy both soul (person) and body (physical) in hell.

There are 2 resurrections from the grave, 1st of the saved who go to be with the Lord to heaven for 1,000 years ... after that the 2nd resurrection those of the lost and are destroyed by fire, along with the earth. After total destruction, then God makes everything new.

The Lord is the energy source for life ... for both the saved and unsaved (and animals) ... his breath ... when one dies is that energy source and the energy source returns to him.

Ecclesiastes 3:19
New International Version
Surely the fate of human beings is like that of the animals; the same fate awaits them both: As one dies, so dies the other. All have the same breath; humans have no advantage over animals. Everything is meaningless.

There are "records" of everyone's life being kept in heaven described as the "book of life". When one is saved their name goes into that book ... and if one dies earthly death and has not been blotted out ... removed from that book ... then they will be in the 1st resurrection that happens when Jesus returns.

Jesus made it clear we will have REAL physical bodies.

1 John 3:2
New International Version
Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is.

Luke 24 (Jesus appearing to the disciples AFTER His resurrection

38“Why are you troubled,” Jesus asked, “and why do doubts arise in your hearts? 39Look at My hands and My feet. It is I Myself. Touch Me and see— for a spirit does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have.”

Maybe ... this might be somewhat relatable ... ;o)

Like a computer hard drive .... information is stored there and is accessed when energy is provided to the computer. If the hard drive is removed ... the information is still on the hard drive (dormant - asleep, so to speak) ... it hasn't disappeared ... it just needs it's energy source to access the information that is waiting there to be accessed. All of the "hard drives" have a terrible virus on them (sin).

So, when the resurrections occur the Lord reconnects the "hard drives" (provides energy) ... The saved ... when their hard drive was removed (died earthly death) the ultimate anti-virus protection was placed on it (blood of Christ) and their "hard drive" was totally wiped clean. When they are resurrected their "information" (no longer tainted by the virus) is transferred to a "new hard drive" (given a new body) that goes to heaven and will remain 100% clean for eternity ... as there are not any viruses in heaven.

The lost are raised up and their "hard drive" (energy source) is reconnected however ... they don't have any anti-viral protection (blood of Christ) whatsoever ... and they are resurrected with the viruses (sin) still on their "hard drive" and do not have any way to get rid of it or repair it ... they do not have access to the anti-virus protection (blood of Christ), therefore will be destroyed (because their "hard drive" can not be fixed/repaired) thereby will be destroyed and will cease to exist for eternity.

Christ is Lord said:

...where would that put things that God made that don't have a 'body' i.e (the supernatural realm, angels, demons, etc). If you need a body to be considered a living soul/spirit then things from the supernatural realm would be dead by that logic.

Angels for example, don't have a 'body', ... ... Can a soul die?

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I am not sure is it right interpretation that body is required. And about angels, perhaps they have spiritual body, as in this:

It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body and there is also a spiritual body.
1 Cor. 15:44

Soul can be destroyed:

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Matt. 10:28

Christ is Lord said:

I grew up in a tradition that taught the following equation: Body + God's Breath of Life = Man Became a Living Soul. It goes on further by saying if you take away God's Breath, man is no longer a leaving soul and the breath goes back to God in heaven and the body returns the dust and man is "asleep" until the resurrection. However, recently I've been thinking that there are some holes in that logic, because if 'body' is in the equation where would that put things that God made that don't have a 'body' i.e (the supernatural realm, angels, demons, etc). If you need a body to be considered a living soul/spirit then things from the supernatural realm would be dead by that logic.

Angels for example, don't have a 'body', they are spirits and are disembodied by nature, however, they can occupy a physical nature if need be. Also, if the breath or life goes back to God what does that actually mean? Can it interact with God in heaven? This is another reason why I still can't see how the some would say the Bible teaches soul sleep. Can a soul die?

Click to expand...

To answer your question. How man was made is different from other beings. Specifically according to Genesis 2:7 he formed man out of the dust them breathed into him the breath of life. Angels do not have the same bodies like we do because angels are not souls, angels are spirits. Look at this verse if you thought what I said was a little weird.

1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
1Co 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

1Co 15:48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
1Co 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

Now you can read more verses but what I am getting from these verses is that the equation between the earthly which is man, and the heavenly which would be the angels right now, is not the same. Jesus Christ when he was resurrected had a different kind of body which would be a spiritual body and all heavenly beings would have this body.

1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
1Co 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,

We are flesh and blood. Our bodies will be changed in order to enter heaven and we shall bare the image of the heavenly.

The OP has the advantage that the idea is stated in Gen 2:7. But one brief reference isn't a whole anthropology. In the OT life after death isn't really a significant topic, so it's unlikely that the author was thinking of that. He was thinking of our bodily life. When we stop breathing (more or less - modern medicine complicates that) we're dead. But that doesn't prevent us from living in a different form.

Christ is Lord said:

I grew up in a tradition that taught the following equation: Body + God's Breath of Life = Man Became a Living Soul. It goes on further by saying if you take away God's Breath, man is no longer a leaving soul and the breath goes back to God in heaven and the body returns the dust and man is "asleep" until the resurrection.

Click to expand...

agreed.

1 Thess 4
13 But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. 15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord.

Christ is Lord said:

However, recently I've been thinking that there are some holes in that logic, because if 'body' is in the equation where would that put things that God made that don't have a 'body' i.e (the supernatural realm, angels, demons, etc).

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They have bodies according to Rev 4 and Ezek 1. No text in scripture says angels don't have bodies ... that is more greek mythology saying it.

As for "usual denominations" that view is also held by the one that Christianity Today says in the fastest growing and also the 5th largest Christian denomination in the world.

1213 said:

I am not sure is it right interpretation that body is required. And about angels, perhaps they have spiritual body, as in this:

It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body and there is also a spiritual body.
1 Cor. 15:44

Soul can be destroyed:

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Matt. 10:28

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Good point especially for those of us who believe in a bodily resurrection.

1 Thess. 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.


When you have all 3 parts you are a person when you are missing 1 or more you are not a person

icedragon101 said:

that sounds good and nice, but since this a forum where we use scripture,

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Why does everyone have to use the Bible to prove things when the Bible was not meant for that purpose? Not everyone uses the Bible the way you do

Do as the Father Sovereign Creator Almighty Says.

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charsan said:

Why does everyone have to use the Bible to prove things when the Bible was not meant for that purpose? Not everyone uses the Bible the way you do

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Traditionally, tradition is used far far far more than the Bible for anything. Few people prove things via Scripture any more, or ever?

Christ is Lord said:

I grew up in a tradition that taught the following equation: Body + God's Breath of Life = Man Became a Living Soul. It goes on further by saying if you take away God's Breath, man is no longer a leaving soul and the breath goes back to God in heaven and the body returns the dust and man is "asleep" until the resurrection. However, recently I've been thinking that there are some holes in that logic

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False tradition, for exampe: >

Christ is Lord said:

Angels for example, don't have a 'body', they are
spirits and are disembodied by nature,

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(Perhaps nothing created is ever floating around, per se, 'disembodied' )
For angels et al some spiritual body is likely or written.

Truth: (coherent enough) >

public hermit said:

That being the case, spiritual beings must have some kind of "body." I would assume it is a spiritual body. As Jesus said about the resurrection, we will be like the angels. And as Paul said, we will have spiritual bodies. Just some thoughts, but not sure how coherent they are.

Click to expand...

yeshuaslavejeff said:

Traditionally, tradition is used far far far more than the Bible for anything. Few people prove things via Scripture any more, or ever?

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For me it is not just the Bible or something else. For me it is the Bible, The Church Fathers, and what the Church holds. I do not just use the Bible alone because it was never intended for that use, the idea that the Bible should be used alone is an idea that came from man and not an idea or directive found in Scripture.

The problem is not in what you use, but in accepting those things , teachings or practices, that are contrary to the Bible.

yeshuaslavejeff said:

The problem is not in what you use, but in accepting those things , teachings or practices, that are contrary to the Bible.

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Who gets to decide that.