Is This a Joke? WashPost Writer Claims Republicans Have a Problem Accepting Election Results

Albion

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Yeah I dont let R's off the hook for their pointless impeachment. But Clinton really handed them the excuse on a plate. He should have known better. (And thats besides the ethics of the sexual relation with a subordinate intern.)
Yeh. I suppose we might think of an act of PERJURY as having handed them something. :doh:
 
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The IbanezerScrooge

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Bill Clinton did actually commit the exact crime for which General Flynn was sentenced to jail for.

Jus sayin ...

... or perhaps you feel that General Flynn should not have been sentenced?

The difference being Flynn was found guilty and Bill Clinton was not. Fairly important distinction.

Also, I feel like everyone needs to reacquaint themselves with what impeachment actually is, how it works, what a "guilty" verdict means and that Bill Clinton was not impeached for getting a consensual hummer in the Oval Office, something that most males, especially conservative ones, would give him a high-five for, but for lying to a grand jury and obstruction of justice. Same with Nixon. He wasn't impeached for having anything to do with the actual crime of the break-in at Watergate. He was threatened with impeachment for the cover-up involving obstruction, witness tempering, lying, etc.

If one of the articles of impeachment for Trump is abuse of power related specifically to the Ukraine call it will be the first time that a president has been impeached directly for something in office in addition to all the blatant obstruction he's engaged in since Mueller.
 
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durangodawood

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Yeh. I guess we well might think of PERJURY as having handed them something. :doh:
If perjury rose to an impeachment level offense, Trump woulda been out of there long ago for suborning perjury among his associates, especially given the stakes: collaboration with foreign interests in fooling with a US election.
 
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durangodawood

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The comment was about Clinton, not Trump. You talked as though you did not know the issue involved in the Clinton impeachment.
I mentioned perjury because it was the impeachment rationale with Clinton. But there was a sort of national groan during the Clinton impeachment because it wasnt widely thought to rise to an impeachment level offense, at least not given the subject of his perjury.
 
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Albion

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I mentioned perjury because it was the impeachment rationale with Clinton. But there was a sort of national groan during the Clinton impeachment because it wasnt widely thought to rise to an impeachment level offense, at least not given the subject of his perjury.
The defenders of Clinton would have groaned at any charge, don't you think? The minute impeachment was contemplated, every Cabinet member and party pol came forth with the same line--"let him do his job, this is all about a private matter," etc.
 
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durangodawood

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The defenders of Clinton would have groaned at any charge, don't you think? The minute impeachment was contemplated, every Cabinet member and party pol came forth with the same line--"let him do his job, this is all about a private matter," etc.
Well there was also the sense that the Starr investigation of Whitewater morphed into a fishing expedition when it expanded to Paula Jones etc, and the pres was caught in an embarrassment trap.

Yes Clinton did a crime, but it was largely seen as a sordid little personal affair, and not as gamble with our very democracy - which are the current stakes, if the claims against Trump are true.
 
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Albion

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Well there was also the sense that the Starr investigation of Whitewater morphed into a fishing expedition when it expanded to Paula Jones etc, and the pres was caught in an embarrassment trap.

Yes Clinton did a crime, but it was largely seen as a sordid little personal affair, and not as gamble with our very democracy - which are the current stakes, if the claims against Trump are true.

But if we accept all of that...

it is impossible NOT to see the current impeachment proceedings as anything but a farce.

At least, with Clinton, there WAS a crime and he paid for it quite apart from how the impeachment proceedings went. And you said it 'morphed.' Now today we have no 'morphing' because the accusers set the president up with phony charges in the first place and then have changed them at least a half dozen times while looking for anything that might stick.
 
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durangodawood

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But if we accept all of that...

it is impossible NOT to see the current impeachment proceedings as anything but a farce.

At least, with Clinton, there WAS a crime and he paid for it quite apart from how the impeachment proceedings went. And you said it 'morphed.' Now today we have no 'morphing' because the accusers set the president up with phony charges in the first place and then have changed them at least a half dozen times while looking for anything that might stick.
No actually I see the charges against the current president as extremely serious, and so far pretty well corroborated.

Will be interesting to see if they hold up to scrutiny in the trial, if it comes to that. But we'll have to use our own judgement, of course, as the outcome is forgone even before the trial.
 
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Albion

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No actually I see the charges against the current president as extremely serious, and so far pretty well corroborated.
Wow. Considering that neither of those is true, I'm surprised to read such a calmly-worded affirmation of not one but both of them.
 
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ToddNotTodd

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The defenders of Clinton would have groaned at any charge, don't you think?

Nope. Not amongst the people I was talking to at the time.

The minute impeachment was contemplated, every Cabinet member and party pol came forth with the same line--"let him do his job, this is all about a private matter," etc.
Because lying about committing adultery didn’t seem like an impeachable offense, since it wasn’t an abuse of power.
 
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durangodawood

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Wow. Considering that neither of those is true, I'm surprised to read such a calmly-worded affirmation of not one but both of them.
Yeah, the topic can generate a lot of heat, understandably. But youre playing with your own health if you have a freak out every time you touch it.
 
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ToddNotTodd

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Wow. Considering that neither of those is true, I'm surprised to read such a calmly-worded affirmation of not one but both of them.
You're not the arbiter as to whether someone's definitions of "serious" and "pretty well" are "true" or not. It's illogical. You don't want to be illogical, do you?
 
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durangodawood

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But IT was a crime. In the Trump case, they have tried and tried and have none.
"Impeachable offenses" dont track entirely with criminal behavior. Thats as the founders intended it. Non-criminal abuses of power at the expense of the republic were considered impeachable, while minor crimes were generally not.
 
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ToddNotTodd

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No one needs an arbiter in the case of those two.
Unless you can point to objective definitions of “extremely serious" charges and "pretty well corroborated" charges, then you're trying to tell someone that they're objectively wrong in their subjective opinions.

Which is illogical.

You don't want to be illogical, do you? People won't take you seriously if you're illogical...
 
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