the literal interpretation of scripture

David Kent · Nov 4, 2019

thomas15 said:
Try again David Kent. I think you can do better than this.

I'm not surpprised at Bible writer liking that. Just proves I am correct.

David Kent · Nov 4, 2019

thomas15 said:
Try again David Kent. I think you can do better than this.

Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeks IS* determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

IS* Many comentators in the past 100 years or so have said the word translated "are" in the KJV is singular in the original, thus signifying its unity.

thomas15 · Nov 4, 2019

David Kent said:
Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeks IS* determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

Keep going my brother there is more there just waiting for your discovery.

Biblewriter · Nov 7, 2019

David Kent said:
I'm not surpprised at Bible writer liking that. Just proves I am correct.

I did not intentionally "like" it, and have deleted that rating.

David Kent · Nov 7, 2019

Biblewriter said:
I did not intentionally "like" it, and have deleted that rating.

I see. I do that sometimes.

nolidad · Nov 8, 2019

David Kent said:
Trouble is, those who claim to have a literal interpretation don't.

They say that 70 weeks doesn't mean 70 weeks, but 69 weeks.

When scripture says 1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God. They say no it doesn't, it means he is coming secretly and quietly,

When Scripture says 1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven. They say no he is not he is retuning to heaven.

Well maybe some do, I can't answer for every single literalist. But all the authors I know realize it is 70 weeks or 490 years. We accept that after 483 years the clock stopped and we are awaiting the last 7 yearts, which has been called amongst other names:

The Day of the Lord
The Day of the Wrath of the Lamb'
The Tribulation
The great tribulation
Daniels 70th week
The time of Jacobs Trouble
Day of Woe
Day of Sorrow
amongst others.

YOu cannot get the 490 years to run continuously unless you really twist history andScripture to make thyem fit ones preconceived ideas.

David Kent · Nov 8, 2019

nolidad said:
We accept that after 483 years the clock stopped and we are awaiting the last 7 yearts,

Totally unscriptural and no biblical evidence for it.

Biblewriter · Nov 9, 2019

David Kent said:
Totally unscriptural and no biblical evidence for it.

Actually, there is clear Biblical evidence for that conclusion.

nolidad · Nov 9, 2019

David Kent said:
Totally unscriptural and no biblical evidence for it.

Says you and other preterists here, but the attempted proofs to defend the 490 years are continuous would make even the Jehovah Witnesses blush with shame over how you have to twist Scripture to fit your concepts of fulfillment.

If it was coninuous I woulds gladly accept it- but the events that must take place in the 70th week cannot have taken place despite the fanciful imaginations of many here!

But feel free to show me why you think so and we will see if you can do a better job than all the others who have tried here. I am willing to repent if one shows me a biblical and not philosophical argument!

David Kent · Nov 9, 2019

Biblewriter said:
Actually, there is clear Biblical evidence for that conclusion.

I would like to see it.

David Kent · Nov 9, 2019

nolidad said:
Says you and other preterists here, but the attempted proofs to defend the 490 years are continuous would make even the Jehovah Witnesses blush with shame over how you have to twist Scripture to fit your concepts of fulfillment.

If it was coninuous I woulds gladly accept it- but the events that must take place in the 70th week cannot have taken place despite the fanciful imaginations of many here!

But feel free to show me why you think so and we will see if you can do a better job than all the others who have tried here. I am willing to repent if one shows me a biblical and not philosophical argument!

Firstly I am not a preterist. I consider preterists almost as wrong as futurists.
The 483 years can only have ended at the baptism of Jesus, when John the Baptist presented him as the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. At the same time a voice from heaven said this is my beloved son, shortly followed by Jesus announcing "The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are g, To preach the acceptable year of the Lord."
To set the captives free must mean Jesus was announcing the jubilee.

Now a question for you. What events do you say have not happened that will take place during the70th week?

nolidad · Nov 10, 2019

David Kent said:
Firstly I am not a preterist. I consider preterists almost as wrong as futurists.
The 483 years can only have ended at the baptism of Jesus, when John the Baptist presented him as the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. At the same time a voice from heaven said this is my beloved son, shortly followed by Jesus announcing "The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are g, To preach the acceptable year of the Lord."
To set the captives free must mean Jesus was announcing the jubilee.

Now a question for you. What events do you say have not happened that will take place during the70th week?

Most of the Olivet Discourse (apart from the Luke portion concerning Jerusalem which happened 66-70 AD)

The rise and rule of the "antichrist"
The abomination of desolation standing in the holy place (corresponding to Paul in Thess.)
The angels going throughout the world, the "false prophet".
The salvation of the entire nation of Israel ans spoken in Jeremiah 31 and Daniel

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined

27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

A) Israel has not finished THE transgression
B) they have not made an end of sins
C) Everlasting righteousness has not been brought in yet
D) Israel has not anointed the most holy!
E) While Rome has destroyed Jerusalem and the Sanctuary- the prince (antrichrist) has not amde a 7 year covenant with the many yet!
F) There has been no ceasing of the sacrificial system after 1/2 of a 7 year covenant. Nor for teh overspreading of abominations!

There are many more.

David Kent · Nov 10, 2019

nolidad said:
Most of the Olivet Discourse (apart from the Luke portion concerning Jerusalem which happened 66-70 AD)

The rise and rule of the "antichrist"
The abomination of desolation standing in the holy place (corresponding to Paul in Thess.)
The angels going throughout the world, the "false prophet".
The salvation of the entire nation of Israel ans spoken in Jeremiah 31 and Daniel

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined

27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

A) Israel has not finished THE transgression
B) they have not made an end of sins
C) Everlasting righteousness has not been brought in yet
D) Israel has not anointed the most holy!
E) While Rome has destroyed Jerusalem and the Sanctuary- the prince (antrichrist) has not amde a 7 year covenant with the many yet!
F) There has been no ceasing of the sacrificial system after 1/2 of a 7 year covenant. Nor for teh overspreading of abominations!

There are many more.

And the many more are?

Refering to your points:
A)see below (1)
B) sin was dealt with
C) Righteousness was brought in
D) Christ was annointed at his baptism by the Holy Spirit
E) Not one the 6 points which were completed in the 70 weeks.
F) Likewise The covenant was confirmed by Christ. Romans 15:8

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to (1)finish the transgression,(2) and to make an end of sins, (3) and to make reconciliation for iniquity, (4) and to bring in everlasting righteousness, (5) and to seal up the vision and prophesy, (6) and to anoint the most Holy.

(1) The trasgression was finished or comldeted when they crucified Christ,
(2) Jesus dealt with sins at the cross,#
(3) Jesus made reconcilliation for iniquity by his death.
(4) Jesus brought in everlasting righteousness by hid death for those whom he died, he imputed his reightgeousness.
(5) "The law and the prophets were till John" Jesus fulfilled the law.
(6) Jesus was anointed at his baptism. Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,

nolidad · Nov 11, 2019

David Kent said:
And the many more are?

Refering to your points:
A)see below (1)
B) sin was dealt with
C) Righteousness was brought in
D) Christ was annointed at his baptism by the Holy Spirit
E) Not one the 6 points which were completed in the 70 weeks.
F) Likewise The covenant was confirmed by Christ. Romans 15:8

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to (1)finish the transgression,(2) and to make an end of sins, (3) and to make reconciliation for iniquity, (4) and to bring in everlasting righteousness, (5) and to seal up the vision and prophesy, (6) and to anoint the most Holy.

(1) The trasgression was finished or comldeted when they crucified Christ,
(2) Jesus dealt with sins at the cross,#
(3) Jesus made reconcilliation for iniquity by his death.
(4) Jesus brought in everlasting righteousness by hid death for those whom he died, he imputed his reightgeousness.
(5) "The law and the prophets were till John" Jesus fulfilled the law.
(6) Jesus was anointed at his baptism. Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,

point 1- no the transgression hasn't finished as their is still unbelief in Jews.
B- sin was dealt with.
C everlasting righteousness has not been brought in- as there is still unrighteousness in Israel! (Remember the 70 weeks is for Jerusalem and Jews)
D Baptism is not an anointing. Jesus has not been anointed as king yet. He is still only in His office of HIgh Priest!
E. Well here we agree not all points are completed so the 70 weeks is not up!
F. As Romans 15:8 is the aorist active infinitive preceded by the modifier verb "to" it is reflected as future. the blood of Jesus is the seal of the covenant- but that doesn't mean the covenant is in full force yet as nearly all covenants had parts that went into effect over time!

2. sin has not ended as sin is still being committed.
3. Jesus does not make reconciliation. His death enabled reconciliation to be possible. Mankind is the party that must make reconsiliation!
4. Everlasting righteousness in this context is not th estate of a saved soul- but the state of the kingdom.
5. Well there are still many who have not received everlasting righteousness. And this 70 weeks are for Jews. there are Jews yet to recvieve everlasting righteousness.
6. The law ended at the cross, but vision and prophesy haven't- look up what seal meant here.
7. Yes Jesus was anointed to preach the gospel. But he was not anointed in what matters most- as King! God anointed Jesus to preach, but Israel shall anoint Jesus as king as they should have done on Palm Sunday!

David Kent · Nov 11, 2019

The 483 years ended when jesus was baptised and the 70th week began. This began a Jubilee. In the midst of the week he was cut off. In the midst of a literal week as well as a prophetic week. During that week Jesus confirmed the new covenant with the Jews. At the end of that week Cornelius and his family were baptised and the gospel was no longer only for the Jews, but was opened up to the gentiles. Jesus was crucified after the 69th week and in the 70th week.

David Kent · Nov 11, 2019

nolidad said:
point 1- no the transgression hasn't finished as their is still unbelief in Jews.
B- sin was dealt with.
C everlasting righteousness has not been brought in- as there is still unrighteousness in Israel! (Remember the 70 weeks is for Jerusalem and Jews)
D Baptism is not an anointing. Jesus has not been anointed as king yet. He is still only in His office of HIgh Priest!
E. Well here we agree not all points are completed so the 70 weeks is not up!
F. As Romans 15:8 is the aorist active infinitive preceded by the modifier verb "to" it is reflected as future. the blood of Jesus is the seal of the covenant- but that doesn't mean the covenant is in full force yet as nearly all covenants had parts that went into effect over time!

2. sin has not ended as sin is still being committed.
3. Jesus does not make reconciliation. His death enabled reconciliation to be possible. Mankind is the party that must make reconsiliation!
4. Everlasting righteousness in this context is not the estate of a saved soul- but the state of the kingdom.
5. Well there are still many who have not received everlasting righteousness. And this 70 weeks are for Jews. there are Jews yet to recvieve everlasting righteousness.
6. The law ended at the cross, but vision and prophesy haven't- look up what seal meant here.
7. Yes Jesus was anointed to preach the gospel. But he was not anointed in what matters most- as King! God anointed Jesus to preach, but Israel shall anoint Jesus as king as they should have done on Palm Sunday!

1. Transgression was completed when the Jews filled up the measure of thier fathers who killed the prophets Matthew 23:29-32
2 Sin was dealt with at Calvary when Jesus took our sins in himself and gave us his righteousness See Hebrews 2:17
3. Your reply is faulty 2 Corinthians 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; See also verses 19 & 20 and Hebrews 2:17

David Kent · Nov 11, 2019

Sorry that posted before I had finished

nolidad said:
4. Everlasting righteousness in this context is not th estate of a saved soul- but the state of the kingdom.
5. Well there are still many who have not received everlasting righteousness. And this 70 weeks are for Jews. there are Jews yet to recvieve everlasting righteousness.
6. The law ended at the cross, but vision and prophesy haven't- look up what seal meant here.
7. Yes Jesus was anointed to preach the gospel. But he was not anointed in what matters most- as King! God anointed Jesus to preach, but Israel shall anoint Jesus as king as they should have done on Palm Sunday!

4. Prove it from scripture
5. The Jews who trusted Jesus did.
6 The law and the prophets were till John. John was the last and greatest of the Old Testament prophets. After John was put in prison Jesus began preaching the kingdom of God and the Gospel. Mark 1:14 & 15.
7. Jesus, the most holy was annointed. He said so. What else do you want.

David Kent · Nov 11, 2019

It is a futurist falsehood that Jesus offered himself as king. He came as king and his followers accepted him, unbelievers didn't and never will. When the Jews tried to make him king he refused. That was not why he came. He came for Calvary.

nolidad · Nov 12, 2019

David Kent said:
1. Transgression was completed when the Jews filled up the measure of thier fathers who killed the prophets Matthew 23:29-32
2 Sin was dealt with at Calvary when Jesus took our sins in himself and gave us his righteousness See Hebrews 2:17
3. Your reply is faulty 2 Corinthians 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; See also verses 19 & 20 and Hebrews 2:17

You need to look up Danile again! it is THE transgression not one.

Yes God ended His war with man through Jesus- but we have to reconcile by exercising faith!

2 Corinthians 5:18
And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
2 Corinthians 5:20
Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

Should have read two more verses! We have to ask for reconciliation for reconciliation to take place! And once again Let us look as to whom the Daniel prophecy is directed to:

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city,

nolidad · Nov 12, 2019

David Kent said:
Sorry that posted before I had finished

4. Prove it from scripture
5. The Jews who trusted Jesus did.
6 The law and the prophets were till John. John was the last and greatest of the Old Testament prophets. After John was put in prison Jesus began preaching the kingdom of God and the Gospel. Mark 1:14 & 15.
7. Jesus, the most holy was annointed. He said so. What else do you want.

So you do not believe that Paul prophesied and John was prophesying when He wrote the book of Revelation?

Once JOhn the Baptist died- there was no more prophecy? Is that what you are trying to say?

the literal interpretation of scripture

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