"HOT MESS" Starting now homeless crackdown in Austin Texas

miamited

Ted
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No good - it is what is called a loaded question - not meant to find an <honest, true> answer apparently.

Hi YSJ,

I'm sorry you see it that way, but it is an honest question that I'm seeking for an answer from you. You've made several posts claiming that I don't understand what God has said to us about the poor and the helpless and hopeless. Most of them claiming that you understand that God handles each of us according to our faith. While I agree that there are certain issues where God does handle believers and unbelievers differently, I'm asking about Jesus' command to us about treating others as we would want to be treated.

This isn't about how God deals with us but whether or not Jesus actually meant that we human believers were to strive to treat 'others' as we would want to be treated. Because your answers seemed rather ambiguous regarding the subject, I'm asking you directly: Do you think that Jesus' command to believers to treat others as we would want to be treated is meant to mean that we are to treat everyone the same in this regard, or, as your answers seem to infer, there is a different way that we should treat non-believers as far as treating them as we want to be treated?

However, if you're unable to answer such a direct question for fear that you think I'm seeking some ulterior motive, then that's ok.

God bless,
In Christ, ted
 
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Silverback

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As also proven in Calif.
letting the homeless do their thing in public places is making our State dirty and dangerous.
And their encampments in canyons and back country are like living in another world.
A world straight from hell.

MB

It's that way everywhere, and I'm not sure there is a real solution, at least one that's affordable. I have a lot of empathy for the homeless, being destitute like that changes a person, and usually not for the better.

What will not help them is another enormous government program on poverty, I think the answers lie somewhere else.
 
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Silverback

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Hi endeavourer,

Yes, and my fellowship sometimes takes someone who is homeless as a special cause. However, the issue of homelessness isn't going to be handled by a few fellowships offering a meal service once a week or taking an interest in one or two homeless people. That's the point that I'm trying to make with you. You seem to have this idea that homelessness can be handled in the way that your fellowship has been handling it, but the reality seems to be that as a real solution to solve the total problem, what you're doing isn't really meeting that need.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that your work is worthless. It's like the story of the boy and the starfish. Some of your posts seem to infer that you think the solution to the problem is fairly simplistic and I haven't ever found that it is. I too, have spent a good deal of time ministering to the homeless and my experience, mainly in Miami-Dade county FL, is that it's a big, big problem in the larger cities. There hasn't ever been found a one size fits all remedy for the problem.

Yes, there are some who are homeless who will just take and take. What do you do for them? Do we line them up in some empty field and shoot them and bury them in a large hole? Do we just ignore them and let them continue to sleep in store front doorways and under bridges? So, let's all agree that there are some people who take advantage of social services, but we have to be careful that we don't allow our jaded understanding of such people to cause us to stop offering help altogether.

God bless,
In Christ, ted

The shooting issue...don't laugh, I'm sure it's been discussed in certain Government circles.
 
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Mountainmanbob

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However, the issue of homelessness isn't going to be handled by a few fellowships offering a meal service once a week or taking an interest in one or two homeless people.





That's the point that I'm trying to make with you. You seem to have this idea that homelessness can be handled in the way that your fellowship has been handling it, but the reality seems to be that as a real solution to solve the total problem, what you're doing isn't really meeting that need.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that your work is worthless. It's like the story of the boy and the starfish. Some of your posts seem to infer that you think the solution to the problem is fairly simplistic and I haven't ever found that it is. I too, have spent a good deal of time ministering to the homeless and my experience, mainly in Miami-Dade county FL, is that it's a big, big problem in the larger cities. There hasn't ever been found a one size fits all remedy for the problem.

Yes, there are some who are homeless who will just take and take. What do you do for them? Do we line them up in some empty field and shoot them and bury them in a large hole? Do we just ignore them and let them continue to sleep in store front doorways and under bridges? So, let's all agree that there are some people who take advantage of social services, but we have to be careful that we don't allow our jaded understanding of such people to cause us to stop offering help altogether.

God bless,
In Christ, ted
Good points Ted
and very true.

Now that it has gotten to be the
"hot mess that it is"

It's going to take a Massive Effort
government
churches
groups of volunteers
and then much one on one

MASSIVE EFFORT

M-Bob
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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Most of them claiming that you understand that God handles each of us according to our faith.
?? quote me.... I think (or it appears) , but I don't remember for sure, that you are mixing up someone else's posts with mine.
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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However, if you're unable to answer such a direct question for fear that you think I'm seeking some ulterior motive, then that's ok.
That's not it at all. The question is ... skewed, as if assuming the premise you present is true but ignoring the rest of Scripture when Yahuweh and Yahushua (Jesus) directly say what to do (NOT by feelings, emotions, or what we would "like" someone to do , but DO what Jesus Says to do, when He makes it clear, of course. ) .... The social gospel says to treat everyone (and/or their feelings) well. The social gospel is a false gospel, opposed to Jesus.
 
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Silverback

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No it is not.
Finland solved that problem. (not necessarily in a Godly way, but they have no homeless problem at all, from the internet reports)

The socialist paradise you mention like every other country on earth has to deal with homeless problems, it's how you do the statistics, and define things. All nations have areas of squalor where the poor live in shacks, tents, junk cars, and on the street...to believe anything else is naive.
 
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Busryde

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I've not read this entire thread, but I've lived in Austin for close to 30 years. We have always had homeless, but what has been happening since last summer when the city began to allow camping is something new and different. There are many aspects to this problem, mental health, economic, addiction, etc. Trust me, this issue has been dominating TV, radio, and social media for months.

However, there is one aspect that is really scary that is not being discussed. Google "ID2020 City of Austin" and read the press releases that the City of Austin has been granted money from the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation with the ID2020 Alliance. Read carefully and you'll realize they are talking about microchipping the homeless in order to provide a "digital identity" so they can access social services. In one CoA document the stated goal is not just to provide a "digital id" to the homeless, but to at least 10% of citizens living below the poverty line. These are dark times.
 
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com7fy8

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Do you think that Jesus' command to believers to treat others as we would want to be treated is meant to mean that we are to treat everyone the same in this regard, or, as your answers seem to infer, there is a different way that we should treat non-believers as far as treating them as we want to be treated?
Yes, treat others the way you would want to be treated, and do what you can to help them.

I think we can get to know certain people so we know more about how to help them.

But I have seen an alcoholic on the sidewalk with her stuff, and she got a ride, in her case to her apartment, then she was motivated to do what she needed to do. People prayed for her, were there for her, but she did what needed to be done practically. And now she is working in a needy persons' connections and supply place.

A guy from out of town came by a street preacher, asked where he could get a shower, was told about a shelter, got the shower, and was working the next day, if I remember right.

A guy was ready for suicide, but someone met him and talked with him, then brought him to his church. Now he is ministering in love hospitality, keeps track of ones not doing well with marriage and church relating. They talk with him, when they show up.

Another guy walked interstate, going to churches, dumpster diving for food and shelter materials. People told him he should have the best of everything; he knew God and loving as God's family is the best of everything. But he needed to stay and grow with a group; he cooperated with his family, and now has stayed in the same place for years.

A couple of the above are not examples of homeless success stories, but we have others in need, not quite on the street.

What really is needed is to find out how to love. And ones might need to stay with a church where they can learn how to love and be patient and forgiving. And with this can come other things working out.
 
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Mountainmanbob

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what has been happening since last summer when the city began to allow camping is something new and different.


There are many aspects to this problem, mental health, economic, addiction, etc. Trust me, this issue has been dominating TV, radio, and social media for months.

However, there is one aspect that is really scary that is not being discussed. Google "ID2020 City of Austin" and read the press releases that the City of Austin has been granted money from the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation with the ID2020 Alliance. Read carefully and you'll realize they are talking about microchipping the homeless in order to provide a "digital identity" so they can access social services. In one CoA document the stated goal is not just to provide a "digital id" to the homeless, but to at least 10% of citizens living below the poverty line. These are dark times.

When given permission to camp anywhere they wish they will set up in front of businesses pooping and urinating wherever they want and bother the customers panhandling and set up on people's front lawns in time if you let them.

Got a "Hot Mess" here with our own people and yet we don't tighten our borders so criminals from down south can ease into our country.

TWO BIG ISSUES HERE.
M-Bob
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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The socialist paradise you mention like every other country on earth has to deal with homeless problems, it's how you do the statistics, and define things. All nations have areas of squalor where the poor live in shacks, tents, junk cars, and on the street...to believe anything else is naive.
I did not mention ANY SOCIAL PARADISE.

Here's how Finland solved its homelessness problem | World ...
Here's how Finland solved its homelessness problem
Finland found a simple solution to its homelessness problem: giving people a place to stay.

Finland has found the answer to homelessness. It couldn't be ...
Finland has found the answer to homelessness. It couldn’t be simpler | Harry Quilter-Pinner
Apr 12, 2018Harry Quilter-Pinner. The tragedy is that it's entirely within our power to do something about it: homelessness is not a choice made by the individual, it is a reality forced by government policy. As homelessness has rocketed in the UK - up 134% since 2010 - it has fallen by 35% in Finland over a similar period of time.

'It's a miracle': Helsinki's radical solution to homelessness ...
'It’s a miracle': Helsinki's radical solution to homelessness
Jun 3, 2019Finland has not entirely solved homelessness. Nationwide, about 5,500 people are still officially classified as homeless. The overwhelming majority - more than 70% - are living temporarily ...
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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Finland has their problems
we got ours -- thank you.
What (seems) to have worked for them
may not work for us?
Actually, probably won't.
M-Bob
NOTHING will "work" for us. (the U.S.). Not until Jesus Returns.
Finland's Solution IS BEING TESTED in many countries, and in several cities in the U>S>A.....
NOT a Godly Solution, however....
it is summing up the population/ the power/ the control/ in the beast system.... and is widely accepted by many "Christians"....
 
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hedrick

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Being on this site has opened my eyes. The staggering numbers dealing with serious disorders blows my mind. I’ve been on the Internet over two decades. That wasn’t the norm. Something’s changed.
I'm 70. I've seen a number of political changes. This issue changes name from time to time. Once it was the "war on poverty." Then the concern changed to homelessness. I don't think it's a new problem at all. The importance of specific components changes. Income inequality is definitely an increasing problem. People now have to work multiple jobs to make ends meet. Drug problems have left some people helpless. But the sorts of problems involved have been there forever. They just show up in different forms.

And no one solution applies. Governments and churches can each do things that the other can't do. Both are needed, in my view.
 
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Mountainmanbob

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People now have to work multiple jobs to make ends meet.


Drug problems have left some people helpless. But the sorts of problems involved have been there forever. They just show up in different forms.

And no one solution applies. Governments and churches can each do things that the other can't do. Both are needed, in my view.
We hear that all the time
but, where are they?
I know next to none working more than one job.
Do you yourself actually know any?
If so how many?
I bet at the best -- very, very few?
Not enough to make the news.
But, they will throw the story in there anyway.
M-Bob
 
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miamited

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?? quote me.... I think (or it appears) , but I don't remember for sure, that you are mixing up someone else's posts with mine.

HI YSJ,

Do you see somewhere where I quoted you? Just saying that what you seem to be saying is... Is not quoting. You do understand what 'quote' actually means, right?

This is what I'm talking about. So many of your posts just seem to be rather disjointed ideas that are cobbled together with string and push pins. Now, you seem to be accusing me of 'quoting' you when there's absolutely no evidence that I have.

God bless,
In Christ, ted
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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?? quote me.... I think (or it appears) , but I don't remember for sure, that you are mixing up someone else's posts with mine.
HI YSJ,

Do you see somewhere where I quoted you? Just saying that what you seem to be saying is... Is not quoting. You do understand what 'quote' actually means, right?

This is what I'm talking about. So many of your posts just seem to be rather disjointed ideas that are cobbled together with string and push pins. Now, you seem to be accusing me of 'quoting' you when there's absolutely no evidence that I have.

God bless,
In Christ, ted
See my post above ? ?? quote me - means quote me: show where I said what you posted I said, i.e. what you posted that you THINK I meant or said. Instead of posting what you think I said, quote me.
This will not clear up the long time thinking (if based on apparent pre-conceived doctrines or ideas) , but it might help, at least to clarify what you are talking about that is real, and not what you think I think.

So many posts must be or appear "disjointed .." etc, because of the rules of the internet we are posting under. Direct declaration of some things is forbidden.
 
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Silverback

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Austin Braces As Texas Officials Plan Crackdown On Homeless Encampments - The Appeal

In recent months, large encampments underneath overpasses and outside the Austin Resource Center for the Homeless, the city’s main downtown shelter, have become a flash point. Resident complaints and a from earlier this month—depicting a violent confrontation between a motorist and an allegedly aggressive panhandler—have sparked a backlash against the City Council’s decision to revise the ordinances. A newly formed PAC, Our Town Austin, has mentioned homelessness issues in its effort to recallthe mayor and some councilmembers. And Abbott has criticized the encampments as overcorrecting on homelessness at the expense of “public safety and common sense.”

&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
Seems like rather than worrying about all of the ones coming into the United States illegally we should start to take care of our own homeless population which has proven to be --
"one hot mess".

I've worked with the homeless for many years.
Taking on this issue is going to take a lot of resources.
M-Bob


Within reason, the homeless deserve our empathy. That being said, some do things that are unnecessary, and people don't like it.

I love in the Tampa area, most wooded areas for instance behind a strip mall, or along train tracks in the suburbs have homeless living there. initially, most do a pretty good job of staying out of site, just coming out to panhandle, and to try to get something to eat. At this point, provided they are not to close to a school bus stop, they are left alone, and that's fine.

However, it seems that once they start building campfires, slinging their trash around, and performing their waste functions without "Digging" a hole, and covering it up, is when things start to get more difficult for them, it starts to smell, their trash starts blowing around, they become more aggressive when panhandling, and sooner, or, later law enforcement gets involved. The COPS confiscate the few belongings, and they are either run off, or arrested for trespassing.

If they would skip the campfire, keep a neat and clean campsite, and "Dig" a hole, they would have fewer problems.

Additionally, you can keep yourself clean in field conditions, it just takes some effort, and it's not rocket science.

Empathy, or, not, most people will not tolerate these things near their businesses, or homes.
 
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com7fy8

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However, it seems that once they start building campfires, slinging their trash around, and performing their waste functions without "Digging" a hole, and covering it up, is when things start to get more difficult for them, it starts to smell, their trash starts blowing around, they become more aggressive when panhandling, and sooner, or, later law enforcement gets involved.
Ones who do this possibly lived like this when they did have jobs and a place to stay; and so, may be, this is why now they are living like this where they are. What someone does with a little can be an indication of what someone will do with much.

Hasn't this happened with certain lottery winners? They spent themselves broke with a little, then with a lot.

Here in Massachusetts we have Lyme's disease and eastern equine encephalitis which might do some social work to get outdoors people in somewhere. I am curious how outdoors people get by, in Florida with fire ants and I would say maybe more mosquitoes than we have here.
 
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