JohnAshton
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Sola scriptura or ECF-like traditions of man? Christ in Mark 7
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Amen, revelation from God is how men have come to know His word since creation. There’s no reason to assume that has changed. The scriptures demanded that the adulterous woman be stoned to death and yet Jesus showed mercy on her. Had the Pharisees stoned the woman they would’ve been justified according to the scriptures but God still had more to reveal to His word. The Jews believed they already had God’s full word and didn’t expect a New Testament or a new covenant. So there’s no way of knowing that the scriptures we have now actually contain all that God plans for us to know since they were written.
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Daniel Marsh
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The ECF were taught by the Apostles, thus you are comparing rocks to good fruit.
2 Thessalonians 2:15
Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.
2 Thessalonians 2:15
Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.
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"they studied the scriptures daily to SEE IF those things spoken to them by Paul - were SO" Acts 17:11
I prefer the Bible.
Mark 7
5 The Pharisees and the scribes *asked Him, “Why do Your disciples not walk according to the tradition of the elders, but eat their bread with impure hands?” 6 And He said to them, “Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:
‘This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far away from Me.
7 ‘But in vain do they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’
8 Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”
9 He was also saying to them, “You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who speaks evil of father or mother, is to be put to death’; 11 but you say, ‘If a man says to his father or his mother, whatever I have that would help you is Corban (that is to say, given to God),’ 12 you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or his mother; 13 thus invalidating the word of God by your tradition which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.”
Your optimism... "noted"
I prefer the Bible.
Mark 7
5 The Pharisees and the scribes *asked Him, “Why do Your disciples not walk according to the tradition of the elders, but eat their bread with impure hands?” 6 And He said to them, “Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:
‘This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far away from Me.
7 ‘But in vain do they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’
8 Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”
9 He was also saying to them, “You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who speaks evil of father or mother, is to be put to death’; 11 but you say, ‘If a man says to his father or his mother, whatever I have that would help you is Corban (that is to say, given to God),’ 12 you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or his mother; 13 thus invalidating the word of God by your tradition which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.”
'
Your optimism... "noted"
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Not according to the magisterium of the one true nation church started by God at Sinai -- at the time of Mark 7 when God confronted them.
According to them it was "holy tradition" ,,, "sacred tradition"
So then Christ hammered that tradition "sola scriptura" to show them their error.
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"they studied the scriptures daily to SEE IF those things spoken to them by Paul - were SO" Acts 17:11
I prefer the Bible.
Mark 7
5 The Pharisees and the scribes *asked Him, “Why do Your disciples not walk according to the tradition of the elders, but eat their bread with impure hands?” 6 And He said to them, “Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:
‘This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far away from Me.
7 ‘But in vain do they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’
8 Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”
9 He was also saying to them, “You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who speaks evil of father or mother, is to be put to death’; 11 but you say, ‘If a man says to his father or his mother, whatever I have that would help you is Corban (that is to say, given to God),’ 12 you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or his mother; 13 thus invalidating the word of God by your tradition which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.”
Your optimism noted.
This is for the objective unbiased readers - it is not my way of saying you don't have free will or that you cannot ignore whatever you wish to ignore.
Just that the unbiased objective readers are going to notice the very details you insist - do not exist.
I prefer the Bible.
Mark 7
5 The Pharisees and the scribes *asked Him, “Why do Your disciples not walk according to the tradition of the elders, but eat their bread with impure hands?” 6 And He said to them, “Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:
‘This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far away from Me.
7 ‘But in vain do they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’
8 Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”
9 He was also saying to them, “You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who speaks evil of father or mother, is to be put to death’; 11 but you say, ‘If a man says to his father or his mother, whatever I have that would help you is Corban (that is to say, given to God),’ 12 you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or his mother; 13 thus invalidating the word of God by your tradition which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.”
Your optimism noted.
This is for the objective unbiased readers - it is not my way of saying you don't have free will or that you cannot ignore whatever you wish to ignore.
Just that the unbiased objective readers are going to notice the very details you insist - do not exist.
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BryanJohnMaloney
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Where is Sola Scriptura explicitly mandated in Scripture? Likewise, where, in Scripture alone, is the definitive list of what is to be in Scripture?
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your optimism is noted.
But in real life we can all see the text.
"they studied the scriptures daily to SEE IF those things spoken to them by Paul - were SO" Acts 17:11
I prefer the Bible.
Its called "seeing the details"
Mark 7
5 The Pharisees and the scribes *asked Him, “Why do Your disciples not walk according to the tradition of the elders, but eat their bread with impure hands?” 6 And He said to them, “Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:
‘This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far away from Me.
7 ‘But in vain do they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’
8 Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.”
9 He was also saying to them, “You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who speaks evil of father or mother, is to be put to death’; 11 but you say, ‘If a man says to his father or his mother, whatever I have that would help you is Corban (that is to say, given to God),’ 12 you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or his mother; 13 thus invalidating the word of God by your tradition which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.”
The text alone - refutes the case that your preference would select so you make no effort at all to show that your preference survives the text. Which is of course, fine with me. I don't think you have any other choice given your preference in this case.
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Major1
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That is a good opinion but it is not what the Word of God says to us.
1 Corinthians 1:8-10...……..
"Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears."
Completeness has to be the Written Word of God as in the original Greek the word is "Teleion", which indicates PERFECTNESS/COMPLETNESS.
It would be helpful to remember that the Apostles were commission by God in the flesh and it was them and only them who were taught by Christ who completed the Scriptures.
What the Jews expected is simply not in view. What God wanted done was done by those (Apostles) who He commissioned.
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Major1
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Correct!
Christ established HIS church of born again believers.
Where the rub or contention came in is that originally the Catholic church alleged that the common person cannot understand the Word of God. There needs to be, therefore, a “clergy” to instruct the “layperson” in terms of what he is to believe and practice.
This concept likewise is void of justification.
Paul instructed the Christians in Ephesus in 5:17 to...…..
“be not foolish, but understand what the will of the Lord is”.
The apostle told those saints that by reading his words they could understand those matters pertaining to Christ in Ephesians 3:3-4.
It is an undeniable historical fact that as the Roman ecclesiastical system evolved, the time came when Catholic clerics surrendered the idea that the doctrine and practice of the Roman Church could be defended by the Scriptures. Hence, by default, the notion arose that “the Bible does not contain the whole of God’s revelation, and that a body of traditional doctrine existed in the Church equally deserving of veneration” (Salmon 1959, 28).
This is precisely why the method of Sola Scriptura came about.
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That scripture is inconclusive to support the idea that all prophecy and revelation will cease brother. Your making a huge assumption here. We cannot presume to know God’s intention concerning His revelations based on this passage of scripture. I believe you are adding into it more than it’s actually saying.
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BryanJohnMaloney
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Where in this "Word of God" are the exact contents of this "Word of God" stated? Book, chapter, and verses, please.
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Major1
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It really is not that hard.
2 Timothy 3:16
"All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness".
Deut. 4:2...……...
2 Do not add to what I command you and do not subtract from it, but keep the commands of the Lord your God that I give you."
Prov. 30:5-6...……….
5 “Every word of God is flawless;
he is a shield to those who take refuge in him.
6 Do not add to his words,
or he will rebuke you and prove you a liar."
Because there are many books that claim to be divinely given, a casual or gullible attitude toward them can result in confusion and eventually destruction. The Bible is complete, completely trustworthy and sufficient to completely answer anything we need to know for eternal salvation or practical wisdom concerning our relationships, morality, character of conduct and much more.
Read more: The Content of God's Word is Complete
Read more: The Content of God's Word is Complete
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