Pope meets with Jesuit criticized by conservatives for gay outreach

Michie

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This is why I agree with what was mentioned in another post that intended ambiguity allows for plausible denial.

You would never hear of a member of the Courage Apostolate being invited to a sit down with the Pontiff.
Great point!
 
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chevyontheriver

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So Fr. James Martin LGBTSJ says the pope supports him, apparently against such meanies as archbishop Chaput. Who are we to doubt this is true? Will the Vatican issue a correction on how we are supposed to understand his visit with the pope? I'm doubting that. So the conclusion is, sadly, that the pope does approve of what Fr. Martin does.

Joe Biden says the pope approves of him flaunting code of canon law 915 and 916. Who are we to doubt that is also true.

We used to joke about 'Is the pope Catholic?' but that was back in the day that the expected answer was 'of course'.
 
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Stabat Mater dolorosa

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We used to joke about 'Is the pope Catholic?' but that was back in the day that the expected answer was 'of course'.

Don't forget the insult that ones more catholic than the pope :preach:
 
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concretecamper

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Pope meets with Jesuit criticized by conservatives for gay outreach

The title is so misleading. The Catholic Church has been reaching out to sinners of all types for 1,000s of years to bring many people to Christ. I would argue conservatives do more for those with gay tenancies than any liberal would ever do.
 
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Michie

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Pope meets with Jesuit criticized by conservatives for gay outreach

The title is so misleading. The Catholic Church has been reaching out to sinners of all types for 1,000s of years to bring many people to Christ. I would argue conservatives do more for those with gay tenancies than any liberal would ever do.
The title is not misleading. Fr. James Martin is misleading.
 
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eastcoast_bsc

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The title is not misleading. Fr. James Martin is misleading.



I would agree with the both of you. Yes Father Martin is misleading but the title is unclear. What does “outreach” mean, does it mean the Pope acted in love and-promoted the group Courage? Or does it indicate the Pope supports the LGBT agenda which Father Martin vigorously supports?
 
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chevyontheriver

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Pope meets with Jesuit criticized by conservatives for gay outreach

The title is so misleading. The Catholic Church has been reaching out to sinners of all types for 1,000s of years to bring many people to Christ. I would argue conservatives do more for those with gay tenancies than any liberal would ever do.
Aside from any liberal/conservative dynamic, the ones who call sin as sin actually can help in the reformation of a sinner while those who refuse to call a sin a sin hinder the salvation of a sinner. We do no favors when we don't call a sin a sin. We hate the sinner when we love the sin.
 
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chevyontheriver

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I would agree with the both of you. Yes Father Martin is misleading but the title is unclear. What does “outreach” mean, does it mean the Pope acted in love and-promoted the group Courage? Or does it indicate the Pope supports the LGBT agenda which Father Martin vigorously supports?
Would that they all promoted Courage. I have not heard that Fr. Martin does that. Pope Francis can clarify his position if he wants to.
 
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eastcoast_bsc

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Interesting that Pope Francis says he felt used by Fr. Martin.

Can’t he muzzle him?

He seems to have no problem muzzling others. He can surely call him back to Rome and leak to the media that he counseled him.

An aside shouldn't the Pope be a little more savvy then to allow a known gay activist to use him?
Something is not right here.
 
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Michie

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He seems to have no problem muzzling others. He can surely call him back to Rome and leak to the media that he counseled him.

An aside shouldn't the Pope be a little more savvy then to allow a known gay activist to use him?
Something is not right here.
There is a definite communication problem. You can’t complain about the media yet be unwilling to clarify or take a stance as the head of the church.
 
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eastcoast_bsc

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There is a definite communication problem. You can’t complain about the media yet be unwilling to clarify or take a stance as the head of the church.

Yes and the Pope does understand the media because he plays them all the time. He should have understood the optics of a private meeting with Martin. Everything martin does there is an agenda involved.
 
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chevyontheriver

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Interesting that Pope Francis says he felt used by Fr. Martin.

Can’t he muzzle him?
Pope Francis can't be so dumb as to think a private meeting with Martin wouldn't be taken as an endorsement. So it was an endorsement.

But maybe pope Francis has figured out he's gone too far and he needs to backtrack a bit. He could start by ending Martin's position as a consultant to the Vatican's Secretariat for Communications. Actions speak louder than some little private complaint that Martin took advantage of him.

I think it's a smoke screen. I think he is still a fr. James Martin LGBTQSJ supporter. Somebody convince me I'm wrong.
 
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chevyontheriver

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Pope Francis can't be so dumb as to think a private meeting with Martin wouldn't be taken as an endorsement. So it was an endorsement.

But maybe pope Francis has figured out he's gone too far and he needs to backtrack a bit. He could start by ending Martin's position as a consultant to the Vatican's Secretariat for Communications. Actions speak louder than some little private complaint that Martin took advantage of him.

I think it's a smoke screen. I think he is still a fr. James Martin LGBTQSJ supporter. Somebody convince me I'm wrong.
Nobody has tried yet to convince me I'm wrong. I would be happy in this instance to actually be wrong. Anybody?

I am left to think pope Francis is a Peronist at heart.
 
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Gnarwhal

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Interesting that Pope Francis says he felt used by Fr. Martin.

Can’t he muzzle him?

It just seems like more of Francis' Peronist tactics, speaking out of both sides of his mouth.
 
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