LDS Is Jesus White?

mmksparbud said:

God's ways are so much simpler and fairer!

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What could be more fair than what Paul said that those who were valient on the earth for the cause of Jesus Christ and bringing much fruit into the kingdom of God, vs those who were lazy and indolent toward Jesus Christ and the building up of his kingdom.

Is it not fair for God to reward the valiant with more glorious resurrected bodies, and reward the lazy with lesser resurrected bodies? Of course it is. That is one of the ways that God's word is manifested when it says that God judges all according to their works.

Pretty simple too.

He is the way said:

Yes there is a Hell, the rich man went there. Perhaps his five brothers did also.

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It is a parable that pointed to the fact that "even" if the dead were raised, they still would not believe, for Jesus had raised the real Lazarus and the Pharisee did not believe and Jesus never spoke to them without using a parable. And if you go back a few verses it says the Pharisees were listening. But, yes, there is a hell, with actual fire that burns the wicked down to ashes.

Peter1000 said:

What could be more fair than what Paul said that those who were valient on the earth for the cause of Jesus Christ and bringing much fruit into the kingdom of God, vs those who were lazy and indolent toward Jesus Christ and the building up of his kingdom.

Is it not fair for God to reward the valiant with more glorious resurrected bodies, and reward the lazy with lesser resurrected bodies? Of course it is. That is one of the ways that God's word is manifested when it says that God judges all according to their works.

Pretty simple too.

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God grants to every one that is saved eternal life in His presence. That is His promise. How He decides to reward those who have won 10000's over those how have won 1 is up to Him and it not stated. God did not say He judges according to how many others we brought in but according to our hearts and how much we love Him and our fellow man and have followed the leading of the Holy Spirit. Not everyone is called to be a Billy Graham, some are called to be a simple farmer, eking out a living and seeing few others but they love the Lord and do as He says. He is not impressed with those who have merely gone out and preached to thousands and had many baptisms and had never even been called to do so but were doing it for power and money. For some of the TV evangelists, it is merely a high paying job with lots of fringe benefits.
Rev 22:3 And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:
Rev 22:4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.

There will be no one who can not see their God and Savior. There are only the saved and the lost---simple and fair.

Peter1000 said:

Simpler and what you think is fairer does not necessarily mean "truth".

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What the bible says it truth and it does not say anything about somepeople being in different parts where they can not see Him.

Rev 22:3 And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:
Rev 22:4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.

Saved or lost--nothing else.

It was to show that after the rich man died he went to Hell because he did not help Lazarus:

(New Testament | Luke 16:20 - 23)

20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

(New Testament | Luke 14:11 - 14)

11 For whosoever exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.
12 ¶ Then said he also to him that bade him, When thou makest a dinner or a supper, call not thy friends, nor thy brethren, neither thy kinsmen, nor thy rich neighbours; lest they also bid thee again, and a recompence be made thee.
13 But when thou makest a feast, call the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind:
14 And thou shalt be blessed; for they cannot recompense thee: for thou shalt be recompensed at the resurrection of the just.

Hell is a place of torment in the spirit world and is also known as spirit prison. Paradise is also in the spirit world and is a place where the spirit persons of the just go until the resurrection. I know that the spirit person continues to live in the spirit world when the body dies.

He is the way said:

It was to show that after the rich man died he went to Hell because he did not help Lazarus:

(New Testament | Luke 16:20 - 23)

20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

(New Testament | Luke 14:11 - 14)

11 For whosoever exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.
12 ¶ Then said he also to him that bade him, When thou makest a dinner or a supper, call not thy friends, nor thy brethren, neither thy kinsmen, nor thy rich neighbours; lest they also bid thee again, and a recompence be made thee.
13 But when thou makest a feast, call the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind:
14 And thou shalt be blessed; for they cannot recompense thee: for thou shalt be recompensed at the resurrection of the just.

Hell is a place of torment in the spirit world and is also known as spirit prison. Paradise is also in the spirit world and is a place where the spirit persons of the just go until the resurrection. I know that the spirit person continues to live in the spirit world when the body dies.

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Your entitled to you own believe, Jesus explains what He meant with it.

Luk 16:29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
Luk 16:30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
Luk 16:31

And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. ​

And He said it precisely because He had indeed risen a Lazarus from the dead and still the Pharisees did not believe!

Peter1000 said:

It seems that the word incarnation means
in·car·na·tion:
noun

1. 1.
   a person who embodies in the flesh a deity, spirit, or abstract quality

This definition is not any different than what we preach. Jesus was a spirit being before he was incarnated, which included his "mind/will/intelligence". His incarnation was that his spirit being was embodied in his flesh and bone human being.

No spirit bouncing around a meat casing called Jesus. But an embodiment of Jesus's spirit into his human flesh and bone being. Just like the definition says.

BTW we partake of the Eucharist in our worship services every week, so I guess we are not part of the modern gnostic tradition.

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Mormon bread and water is not the Eucharist.

The term "Eucharist" (thanksgiving) is that by which the rite is referred to[11] by the Didache (late 1st or early 2nd century),[15][16][17][18][19] Ignatius of Antioch (who died between 98 and 117)[18][20] and Justin Martyr (writing between 147 and 167).[16][18][21] Today, "the Eucharist" is the name still used by Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, Roman Catholics, Anglicans, Presbyterians, and Lutherans. Other Protestant or Evangelical denominations rarely use this term, preferring either "Communion", "the Lord's Supper", "Memorial", "Remembrance", or "the Breaking of Bread". Latter-day Saints call it "Sacrament".
Eucharist - Wikipedia

In The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church), the Holy Sacrament of the Lord's Supper,[1] most often simply referred to as the sacrament, is the ordinance in which participants eat bread and drink water in remembrance of the body and blood of Jesus Christ. It is not equivalent to the Eucharist or Holy Communion in the Catholic Church but similar to rituals of Protestant denominations. Normally, the sacrament is provided every Sunday as part of the sacrament meeting in each LDS Church congregation...

In The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church), the Holy Sacrament of the Lord's Supper,[1] most often simply referred to as the sacrament, is the ordinance in which participants eat bread and drink water in remembrance of the body and blood of Jesus Christ. It is not equivalent to the Eucharist or Holy Communion in the Catholic Church but similar to rituals of Protestant denominations. Normally, the sacrament is provided every Sunday as part of the sacrament meeting in each LDS Church congregation....

After the water is passed to the congregation, the water trays are covered with the bread trays for the remainder of the service. Usually, those who have prepared the bread and water prior to the meeting have the responsibility of disposing of them after the meeting. The leftover bread and water are discarded. Latter-day Saints believe the bread and water to be symbols, not the actual body and blood of Christ; therefore, discarding blessed bread and water is not considered sacrilegious.
Sacrament (LDS Church) - Wikipedia

A Christian is promised all spiritual blessings. There is no more than all.

Ephesians 1:3
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

1 Corinthians 15:10
But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

Phoebe Ann said:

Mormon bread and water is not the Eucharist.

The term "Eucharist" (thanksgiving) is that by which the rite is referred to[11] by the Didache (late 1st or early 2nd century),[15][16][17][18][19] Ignatius of Antioch (who died between 98 and 117)[18][20] and Justin Martyr (writing between 147 and 167).[16][18][21] Today, "the Eucharist" is the name still used by Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, Roman Catholics, Anglicans, Presbyterians, and Lutherans. Other Protestant or Evangelical denominations rarely use this term, preferring either "Communion", "the Lord's Supper", "Memorial", "Remembrance", or "the Breaking of Bread". Latter-day Saints call it "Sacrament".
Eucharist - Wikipedia

In The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church), the Holy Sacrament of the Lord's Supper,[1] most often simply referred to as the sacrament, is the ordinance in which participants eat bread and drink water in remembrance of the body and blood of Jesus Christ. It is not equivalent to the Eucharist or Holy Communion in the Catholic Church but similar to rituals of Protestant denominations. Normally, the sacrament is provided every Sunday as part of the sacrament meeting in each LDS Church congregation...

In The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church), the Holy Sacrament of the Lord's Supper,[1] most often simply referred to as the sacrament, is the ordinance in which participants eat bread and drink water in remembrance of the body and blood of Jesus Christ. It is not equivalent to the Eucharist or Holy Communion in the Catholic Church but similar to rituals of Protestant denominations. Normally, the sacrament is provided every Sunday as part of the sacrament meeting in each LDS Church congregation....

After the water is passed to the congregation, the water trays are covered with the bread trays for the remainder of the service. Usually, those who have prepared the bread and water prior to the meeting have the responsibility of disposing of them after the meeting. The leftover bread and water are discarded. Latter-day Saints believe the bread and water to be symbols, not the actual body and blood of Christ; therefore, discarding blessed bread and water is not considered sacrilegious.
Sacrament (LDS Church) - Wikipedia

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The dictionary calls it a sacrament also:

Eucharist
[ yoo-kuh-rist ]
noun
the sacrament of Holy Communion; the sacrifice of the Mass; the Lord's Supper.
the consecrated elements of the Holy Communion, especially the bread.
(lowercase) the giving of thanks; thanksgiving.
Christian Science. spiritual communion with God.

From: Definition of eucharist | Dictionary.com

Phoebe Ann said:

A Christian is promised all spiritual blessings. There is no more than all.

Ephesians 1:3
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

1 Corinthians 15:10
But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

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(New Testament | 1 John 3:7 - 10)

7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

I believe he who loves sin hates God, and he who hates sin LOVES God. Let us therefore glorify God and eschew evil.

(New Testament | James 4:4 - 8)

4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.
5 Do ye think that the scripture saith in vain, The spirit that dwelleth in us lusteth to envy?
6 But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.
7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
8 Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded.

He is the way said:

The dictionary calls it a sacrament also:

Eucharist
[ yoo-kuh-rist ]
noun
the sacrament of Holy Communion; the sacrifice of the Mass; the Lord's Supper.
the consecrated elements of the Holy Communion, especially the bread.
(lowercase) the giving of thanks; thanksgiving.
Christian Science. spiritual communion with God.

From: Definition of eucharist | Dictionary.com

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Jesus did not use water, he used unfermented grape juice and I've heard your excuse for not using it beause people refused you grape juice way back when. Well, that was a long time ago---(and it could have been done anyway) there is no such excuse today. It was also unleavened bread---0no yeast was allowed at this time. Basically, it was matzah crackers. It is tp be done according to how Jesus showed it to be done.

mmksparbud said:

You forget, the prophetess of my church had no more than a 3rd grade education and wrote over a 100 books and has some in the Library of Congress.

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The Library of Congress like the Bodolean Library in Oxford, England is a receiving library for the English language. Virtually everything published in English can be found there. Back in the 80s and 90s my sister was in charge of digitizing the Bodolean library --- everything from precious ancient manuscripts right to the present day is digitally preserved and available to scholars.

JackRT said:

The Library of Congress like the Bodolean Library in Oxford, England is a receiving library for the English language. Virtually everything published in English can be found there. Back in the 80s and 90s my sister was in charge of digitizing the Bodolean library --- everything from precious ancient manuscripts right to the present day is digitally preserved and available to scholars.

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Yes, probably even the BOM. I was just reminding them that they do not have the market cornered on uneducated prophets who wrote books.

mmksparbud said:

Jesus did not use water, he used unfermented grape juice and I've heard your excuse for not using it beause people refused you grape juice way back when. Well, that was a long time ago---(and it could have been done anyway) there is no such excuse today. It was also unleavened bread---0no yeast was allowed at this time. Basically, it was matzah crackers. It is tp be done according to how Jesus showed it to be done.

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Yes He used grape juice and unleavened bread and we can still use that for the sacrament:

(Doctrine and Covenants | Section 27:1 - 4)

1 LISTEN to the voice of Jesus Christ, your Lord, your God, and your Redeemer, whose word is quick and powerful.
2 For, behold, I say unto you, that it mattereth not what ye shall eat or what ye shall drink when ye partake of the sacrament, if it so be that ye do it with an eye single to my glory—remembering unto the Father my body which was laid down for you, and my blood which was shed for the remission of your sins.
3 Wherefore, a commandment I give unto you, that you shall not purchase wine neither strong drink of your enemies;
4 Wherefore, you shall partake of none except it is made new among you; yea, in this my Father's kingdom which shall be built up on the earth.

(Doctrine and Covenants | Section 89:4 - 21)

4 Behold, verily, thus saith the Lord unto you: In consequence of evils and designs which do and will exist in the hearts of conspiring men in the last days, I have warned you, and forewarn you, by giving unto you this word of wisdom by revelation—
5 That inasmuch as any man drinketh wine or strong drink among you, behold it is not good, neither meet in the sight of your Father, only in assembling yourselves together to offer up your sacraments before him.
6 And, behold, this should be wine, yea, pure wine of the grape of the vine, of your own make.
7 And, again, strong drinks are not for the belly, but for the washing of your bodies.
8 And again, tobacco is not for the body, neither for the belly, and is not good for man, but is an herb for bruises and all sick cattle, to be used with judgment and skill.
9 And again, hot drinks are not for the body or belly.
10 And again, verily I say unto you, all wholesome herbs God hath ordained for the constitution, nature, and use of man—
11 Every herb in the season thereof, and every fruit in the season thereof; all these to be used with prudence and thanksgiving.
12 Yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used sparingly;
13 And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used, only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine.
14 All grain is ordained for the use of man and of beasts, to be the staff of life, not only for man but for the beasts of the field, and the fowls of heaven, and all wild animals that run or creep on the earth;
15 And these hath God made for the use of man only in times of famine and excess of hunger.
16 All grain is good for the food of man; as also the fruit of the vine; that which yieldeth fruit, whether in the ground or above the ground—
17 Nevertheless, wheat for man, and corn for the ox, and oats for the horse, and rye for the fowls and for swine, and for all beasts of the field, and barley for all useful animals, and for mild drinks, as also other grain.
18 And all saints who remember to keep and do these sayings, walking in obedience to the commandments, shall receive health in their navel and marrow to their bones;
19 And shall find wisdom and great treasures of knowledge, even hidden treasures;
20 And shall run and not be weary, and shall walk and not faint.
21 And I, the Lord, give unto them a promise, that the destroying angel shall pass by them, as the children of Israel, and not slay them. Amen.

Peter1000 said:

What could be more fair than what Paul said that those who were valient on the earth for the cause of Jesus Christ and bringing much fruit into the kingdom of God, vs those who were lazy and indolent toward Jesus Christ and the building up of his kingdom.

Is it not fair for God to reward the valiant with more glorious resurrected bodies, and reward the lazy with lesser resurrected bodies? Of course it is. That is one of the ways that God's word is manifested when it says that God judges all according to their works.

Pretty simple too.

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Your objection to God's mercy is noted and was addressed in Matthew 20:1-16 in the parable of the vineyard. The workers who were hired at the end of the day were paid the same as those who were hired at the beginning of the day. Different levels of effort, same reward. It's God who gets to decide what's fair, not you. There are no more or lesser glorious resurrected bodies.

He is the way said:

Yes He used grape juice and unleavened bread and we can still use that for the sacrament:

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In biblical times wine was normally fermented to the maximum of about 16%. At that concentration the alcohol actually kills the yeast. Biblically this was called strong drink. However the wine was usually cut with water to bring down the alcohol content to 5% to 8%. Grape juice would only be available a few weeks a year during and just following harvest season. Beyond that time the wild yeasts would already be turning the juice into wine. Distillation of alcohol was not known until about the twelfth century. In the first century among the common people the consumption of weak beer was actually more common than wine which was often reserved for special occasions like weddings.

JackRT said:

In biblical times wine was normally fermented to the maximum of about 16%. At that concentration the alcohol actually kills the yeast. Biblically this was called strong drink. However the wine was usually cut with water to bring down the alcohol content to 5% to 8%. Grape juice would only be available a few weeks a year during and just following harvest season. Beyond that time the wild yeasts would already be turning the juice into wine. Distillation of alcohol was not known until about the twelfth century. In the first century among the common people the consumption of weak beer was actually more common than wine which was often reserved for special occasions like weddings.

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In Ancient times, people had different ways of preserving grape juice; they were very knowledgeable in preserving and preventing it from fermenting. Vineyards in the Old Testament days were very important to the people. Watchman protected them and their owners were exempt from military service during harvest time. Actually, fermented wine was a lot more difficult to make and preserve than the grape juice. The process of fermentation was only possible if conditions were just right. The fermentation process required a moderate temperature to be maintained in the presence of air; this released the yeast in the albumen and it multiplied and combined with other yeast germs in the air which ate the glucose in the juice turning it into ethyl alcohol. Through this process the grape juice has been chemically altered.

After boiling the juice down into a sweet sticky syrup it was called dibs or honey, and then it could no longer ferment naturally. Jacob sent this to Joseph in Egypt Gen. 43:11, and it was exported to the Phoenicians Eze. 27:17. They stored fresh juice in the chambers of God’s house. This is the wine God allowed his people to drink; it was for the priests, minister’s porters and singers. The word for wine is Heb. tîyrôwsh, tee-roshe’ meaning fresh juice.

The ancients practiced the following ways of preserving grape juice.

1. They would filter the juice through strainers and remove the protein (albumen); this would leave no yeast for fermentation.
2. Putting fresh juice in jars and sealing it with pitch, placing the jars in cool pools of water, and keeping the temperature at a certain degree so the yeast would not multiply.
3. Placing fresh juice in jars and burning sulfur dioxide over the jars.
4. Dried raisins, (boiled for juice).
5. Boiling fresh juice down into a syrup called dibs; later they would dilute it with water and drink it as a beverage.

In New Testament times, wines were imported into Judaea from all over the Mediterranean world. The rich had cellars in their houses to store the wine. They stored wine in narrow jars with pointed ends called amphorae; the pointed ends were buried in the earth and under water to preserve the wine. Wine was stored in pottery jars and kept in underground cisterns, caves, and dugout chambers. These jars existed for the dead sea scrolls were found in pottery clay jars. Some of their pottery jars were big enough to hold up to 30 gallons, such as the ones used at the wedding feast. Fermented wine was stored, because it was poured out daily as burnt offerings in the temple Mal. 3:10.
CHAPTER THREE: Ancient ways of preserving grape juice. – hiscandleministry

He is the way said:

The dictionary calls it a sacrament also:

Eucharist
[ yoo-kuh-rist ]
noun
the sacrament of Holy Communion; the sacrifice of the Mass; the Lord's Supper.
the consecrated elements of the Holy Communion, especially the bread.
(lowercase) the giving of thanks; thanksgiving.
Christian Science. spiritual communion with God.

From: Definition of eucharist | Dictionary.com

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It's one of the Holy Sacraments. There's more than just one. Though the number depends on who you ask, ranging from only two, to an unnumbered amount. Presbyterians recognize only two, Lutherans recognize two or three (depending on whether Absolution is to be regarded as a Sacrament or not), Roman Catholics and some Anglicans recognize seven, while the Eastern Orthodox have no hard limit on the number of Sacraments, but there are at least the same seven which Roman Catholics number.

The term "sacrament" comes from the Latin sacramentum, the sacramentum was, originally, the oath a soldier swore in fealty to Caesar and the Empire. Early Latin-speaking Christians chose this word to translate the Greek mysteria (singular mysterion). These were "Holy Mysteries", that is things which conveyed divine reality which could only be known by revelation. That the Eucharist is the body and blood of Christ could not be known except that the Lord explicitly takes bread and wine and says, "This is My body" and "This is My blood".

St. Augustine gives his definition of a Sacrament as Accedat verbum ad elementum, et fit sacramentum, "Hereto the word with the element, and it is a sacrament"; where God has joined His word with a material element, such as water, or bread and wine, it is a Sacrament, a Holy Mystery. Without either of these it isn't a Sacrament. Baptism, without the word, is no longer Baptism, it's just getting wet; and yet without the element it isn't Baptism either, though the word is itself "living and active" which is why the preaching of the word is still efficacious (Romans 10:17).

So it is correct that the Eucharist is one of Christ's Holy and Precious Sacraments. For He instituted it for our benefit, that here in the meager gifts of bread and wine is, somehow, also Jesus Christ, His flesh and blood, broken and shed for us. And thus we do not eat mere bread and wine, but here we receive Christ Himself, present in and under these meager gifts. That's what makes it a Sacrament.

-CryptoLutheran

ViaCrucis said:

It's one of the Holy Sacraments. There's more than just one. Though the number depends on who you ask, ranging from only two, to an unnumbered amount. Presbyterians recognize only two, Lutherans recognize two or three (depending on whether Absolution is to be regarded as a Sacrament or not), Roman Catholics and some Anglicans recognize seven, while the Eastern Orthodox have no hard limit on the number of Sacraments, but there are at least the same seven which Roman Catholics number.

The term "sacrament" comes from the Latin sacramentum, the sacramentum was, originally, the oath a soldier swore in fealty to Caesar and the Empire. Early Latin-speaking Christians chose this word to translate the Greek mysteria (singular mysterion). These were "Holy Mysteries", that is things which conveyed divine reality which could only be known by revelation. That the Eucharist is the body and blood of Christ could not be known except that the Lord explicitly takes bread and wine and says, "This is My body" and "This is My blood".

St. Augustine gives his definition of a Sacrament as Accedat verbum ad elementum, et fit sacramentum, "Hereto the word with the element, and it is a sacrament"; where God has joined His word with a material element, such as water, or bread and wine, it is a Sacrament, a Holy Mystery. Without either of these it isn't a Sacrament. Baptism, without the word, is no longer Baptism, it's just getting wet; and yet without the element it isn't Baptism either, though the word is itself "living and active" which is why the preaching of the word is still efficacious (Romans 10:17).

So it is correct that the Eucharist is one of Christ's Holy and Precious Sacraments. For He instituted it for our benefit, that here in the meager gifts of bread and wine is, somehow, also Jesus Christ, His flesh and blood, broken and shed for us. And thus we do not eat mere bread and wine, but here we receive Christ Himself, present in and under these meager gifts. That's what makes it a Sacrament.

-CryptoLutheran

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Interesting.

devin553344 said:

Sorry I realized his face shown as the sun so I removed the pic

Can't seem to get it to link in the post again, says error when I tried to show it here for some reason Must be some internet restriction on the pic. Let me see, just had to reference the link and not upload:

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So you have to have his "hair" and "head" "white as wool", "white as snow". That is of course if you are trying to follow the description found in Revelation. Try again I think. Lol.