Should Christians Celebrate Veteran's Day

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SteveIndy

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Should Christians Celebrate Veteran's Day?

il_340x270.1367159137_8xbv.jpg


Am I against veterans, no, I am for veterans, I am a veteran, but more important than veterans is TRUTH?

The picture above is preposterous and offensive. Jesus would never own a gun or participate in violence of any kind. Yet, today, hundreds of thousands of Christians in the military have been convinced that Jesus sanctions the taking of lives through violent acts and that it is a sacred act to kill your enemy in self-defence, capital-punishment, or in war. For the first three hundred years of the Church it is very well known that killing of any kind was forbidden by the Savior. Yet, the next eighteen hundred years show a progressive slide in the opposite direction. Today we are left with the majority of Christians believing that killing is okay and approved by the Lord, unbelievable but prophecied; "evil has become good, and good evil."

To correctly understand this issue we must first ask a question, "how do we acquire our beliefs and worldview?" Nearly everything we believe about life and God is inherited or obtained through personal contact with other people much like a person would catch a cold. Through this contact, humans begin to form and filter their belief systems. For lack of a better term let's just call this involuntary gathering of information "subliminal learning," it is the building of a database of ideas that we presuppose to be true about life. A normal growing human person will hold most things to be true or false based on three things, experience, observation, and the environment. Humans, build this knowledge-base on sensory data which they can see, hear, smell, or feel and on secondary familiar information that is shared through parents, siblings, family, country of origin, peers, school, or Church. Our assessment of things like truth, justice, right, wrong, moral, immoral, etc., are not sensory like taste, feel, sight, or hearing, but are rather information acquired or learned like our language and its regional dialect. This can be easily observed in people of different cultures having certain worldviews which are cultural, local, or territorial. All of this is to say that our worldview or presuppositions are accumulated and learned through contact with the world around us and are not necessarily based on absolute facts or truth. Christians, like almost everyone, when presented with a conflicting idea, will very often discard truth for a cherished or popular opinion and force truth to conform to our presuppositions.

Def.: pre·sup·po·si·tion, an unquestioning assumption about the world, sometimes called a worldview, or an unconscious response relating to a statement whose truth you take for granted in a conversation.

So, what does this have to do with Veterans Day?

Christian military men and veterans have drawn false conclusions based on popular notions and presuppose that God is pro-military and pro-war. Once this fact is admitted, It is easy to recognize that a false monolithic worldview plays a huge part in how and what Christians generally believe about the world, even their Christian world. Christian soldiers claim to be "born again" of a spiritual seed and that they are no longer of the world of flesh and blood but of the Spirit; we are "in the world but not of the world." Through new-birth Christians are made aware of a new second nature and should realize that they wear this body of flesh and blood, with its old corrupt nature, as a remnant of a past life, a vestigial and dangerous appendage (see Rom. 7). Our fleshly body is now a tool and mechanism to be used to infiltrate the world and perform missions of rescue. We are explicitly warned to not trust this old-man of the flesh, which still desires the world, lest we become comfortable, and betray our Commander, and join in the work of evil. Christians are soldiers of the Cross and must remain faithful to their prime directive to seek and to save the lost, even at the cost of their own lives.

Christians have been given a "trust" for the benefit of lost men and swear loyalty to a new Commander in Chief, who underwrites and guarantees that trust. They are cautioned of the dangers of taking their eyes off Christ's narrow path, lest they suffer with the enemy, his same fate. But, a tragedy has occurred. Christians in the military have allowed the flesh and the world to override and reinterpret their Commander's orders. They have listened to the voice of human "reason," which has its source in faulty data which they presupposed to be true; human reason is a blind and confused guide. The Christian soldier has been tricked into listening to the voice of the enemy, a voice from the dark side, and now ignorantly serves the adversary and deny that sacred trust.

Christ has shown us a better way to navigate this deadly minefield behind enemy lines. He has written it all down for us and exemplified it by His life, His Apostle's lives, and the lives of His faithful disciples for two-thousand years. Yet, we go to the world and enlist in its security forces like those faithless Israelites who wanted to be led by a king. This was not a rejection of the prophets it was a rejection of God and His ways. When the Israelites were told of the cost in resources and family they still demanded something they could see, as opposed to faith, in the unseen God.

Do Christian Soldiers and Veterans Desire Truth?

Christians celebrating Veteran's Day is only a symptom of something much, much deeper. "Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter."

With so many Christians joining the military I wonder if "truth" is really that important to these men and women? If truth has not led them, then what? Is it the power of pride, patriotic preaching, peers, and popular sentiment that motivate them? Or, is it as simple as base animal cravings for violence and action? Whatever the reason it most certainly is of this world and not of Christ. We must learn that God accepts nothing of the old life! There is only one thing God wants of us, and that is our unconditional surrender to Him; we are His captives. When we are born again, and surrender completes its humiliating business, the Holy Spirit begins to transform His new creation, and there will come a time when there is nothing remaining of the old life. Our old patriotic and gloomy outlook disappears, as does our old attitude toward ways-and-means, and “all things are of God” (2 Corinthians 5:18). How are we going to get a life that has no lust for accolades and honor, no self-interest, and is not sensitive to the suggestions of others? How will we have the type of love that “is kind…is not provoked, and thinks no evil”? (1 Corinthians 13:4-5). The only way is by allowing nothing of the old life to remain, and by having only simple, perfect trust in Christ, our only Commander in Chief.

Freedom Has A Price

Christians should understand very well what their freedom will cost. The men and women who have traveled the Trail of Blood pioneered by those early saints who refused to kill for any reason have now passed the baton to this generation. Those saints understood the price that had to be paid and willingly grasped that baton. Will this generation lay down their worldly weapons long enough to Biblically consider the true cost of freedom and take up the call to "Come and Die"?

This truth needs to be rediscovered and passed-on to future generations - and Veterans Day is a great place to start.

"Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends." - John 15:13

This may seem like a harsh indictment against Christians on the Right or on the Left. When Christians join the world in its celebration of evil by laying praises and admiration on those we send to do our dirty work, to secure for us a safe place to play video games, watch T.V., and gorge ourselves on the residue of a lost civilization, we share in that evil and it becomes ours, we own it.

We are no less guilty than those we send,

or the ones whose lives we go there to end.
 

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ajcarey

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Judicial action against evil and military action in defending one's nation and defending wherever one has jurisdiction are right, proper, and good. Jesus Himself used violence when He cleansed the Temple (His Father's House where He had jurisdiction) of corrupt practices and those who were doing them. The Apostles baptized a Roman centurion (Acts ch 10) and jailor (Philippians chapter 16) without making them step down from their positions which potentially required use of force to faithfully be in. The Apostle Paul enlisted the help of the Roman army to protect him from a plot against his life in Acts chapter 23. God commanded Israel's Judges and other leaders to punish evil with the sword throughout Israel's history (look at 1 Samuel chapter 15- Samuel was right to slay Agag with the sword when Saul wouldn't).

Pacifism is not a Christian doctrine and to follow Christ properly we must not practice it nor promote it. True Biblical non-resistance which is taught from Genesis to Revelation is to refuse to avenge yourself apart from acting in the line of one's duty in accordance with one's rank and jurisdiction. David knew well that it was right for him to kill Goliath in defending his nation from alien invaders; and wrong for him to avenge himself with own hand against Saul and Nabal.

If Christians should not celebrate Veterans Day, then the only honest and consistent thing to do would be to not be in the military at all nor to commend the military ever at all (i.e. be anti-solider and anti-veteran). It is expected of those who sign up that they will take up arms and fight to defend their nation. But this is something that can be compatible with Christianity- and this would only be wrong when and if orders were given to act outside of the righteous principles seen in Scripture.
 
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Rescued One

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Should Christians Celebrate Veteran's Day?

View attachment 265743

Should Christians be grateful for freedom of religion and women being treated with respect?

Do we believe in anarchy? I appreciate policemen who risk their own lives to save others.

Did Greg Olsen give someone permission to put a weapon in his painting?
 
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renniks

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Should Christians Celebrate Veteran's Day?

View attachment 265743

Am I against veterans, no, I am for veterans, I am a veteran, but more important than veterans is TRUTH?

The picture above is preposterous and offensive. Jesus would never own a gun or participate in violence of any kind. Yet, today, hundreds of thousands of Christians in the military have been convinced that Jesus sanctions the taking of lives through violent acts and that it is a sacred act to kill your enemy in self-defence, capital-punishment, or in war. For the first three hundred years of the Church it is very well known that killing of any kind was forbidden by the Savior. Yet, the next eighteen hundred years show a progressive slide in the opposite direction. Today we are left with the majority of Christians believing that killing is okay and approved by the Lord, unbelievable but prophecied; "evil has become good, and good evil."

To correctly understand this issue we must first ask a question, "how do we acquire our beliefs and worldview?" Nearly everything we believe about life and God is inherited or obtained through personal contact with other people much like a person would catch a cold. Through this contact, humans begin to form and filter their belief systems. For lack of a better term let's just call this involuntary gathering of information "subliminal learning," it is the building of a database of ideas that we presuppose to be true about life. A normal growing human person will hold most things to be true or false based on three things, experience, observation, and the environment. Humans, build this knowledge-base on sensory data which they can see, hear, smell, or feel and on secondary familiar information that is shared through parents, siblings, family, country of origin, peers, school, or Church. Our assessment of things like truth, justice, right, wrong, moral, immoral, etc., are not sensory like taste, feel, sight, or hearing, but are rather information acquired or learned like our language and its regional dialect. This can be easily observed in people of different cultures having certain worldviews which are cultural, local, or territorial. All of this is to say that our worldview or presuppositions are accumulated and learned through contact with the world around us and are not necessarily based on absolute facts or truth. Christians, like almost everyone, when presented with a conflicting idea, will very often discard truth for a cherished or popular opinion and force truth to conform to our presuppositions.

Def.: pre·sup·po·si·tion, an unquestioning assumption about the world, sometimes called a worldview, or an unconscious response relating to a statement whose truth you take for granted in a conversation.

So, what does this have to do with Veterans Day?

Christian military men and veterans have drawn false conclusions based on popular notions and presuppose that God is pro-military and pro-war. Once this fact is admitted, It is easy to recognize that a false monolithic worldview plays a huge part in how and what Christians generally believe about the world, even their Christian world. Christian soldiers claim to be "born again" of a spiritual seed and that they are no longer of the world of flesh and blood but of the Spirit; we are "in the world but not of the world." Through new-birth Christians are made aware of a new second nature and should realize that they wear this body of flesh and blood, with its old corrupt nature, as a remnant of a past life, a vestigial and dangerous appendage (see Rom. 7). Our fleshly body is now a tool and mechanism to be used to infiltrate the world and perform missions of rescue. We are explicitly warned to not trust this old-man of the flesh, which still desires the world, lest we become comfortable, and betray our Commander, and join in the work of evil. Christians are soldiers of the Cross and must remain faithful to their prime directive to seek and to save the lost, even at the cost of their own lives.

Christians have been given a "trust" for the benefit of lost men and swear loyalty to a new Commander in Chief, who underwrites and guarantees that trust. They are cautioned of the dangers of taking their eyes off Christ's narrow path, lest they suffer with the enemy, his same fate. But, a tragedy has occurred. Christians in the military have allowed the flesh and the world to override and reinterpret their Commander's orders. They have listened to the voice of human "reason," which has its source in faulty data which they presupposed to be true; human reason is a blind and confused guide. The Christian soldier has been tricked into listening to the voice of the enemy, a voice from the dark side, and now ignorantly serves the adversary and deny that sacred trust.

Christ has shown us a better way to navigate this deadly minefield behind enemy lines. He has written it all down for us and exemplified it by His life, His Apostle's lives, and the lives of His faithful disciples for two-thousand years. Yet, we go to the world and enlist in its security forces like those faithless Israelites who wanted to be led by a king. This was not a rejection of the prophets it was a rejection of God and His ways. When the Israelites were told of the cost in resources and family they still demanded something they could see, as opposed to faith, in the unseen God.

Do Christian Soldiers and Veterans Desire Truth?

Christians celebrating Veteran's Day is only a symptom of something much, much deeper. "Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter."

With so many Christians joining the military I wonder if "truth" is really that important to these men and women? If truth has not led them, then what? Is it the power of pride, patriotic preaching, peers, and popular sentiment that motivate them? Or, is it as simple as base animal cravings for violence and action? Whatever the reason it most certainly is of this world and not of Christ. We must learn that God accepts nothing of the old life! There is only one thing God wants of us, and that is our unconditional surrender to Him; we are His captives. When we are born again, and surrender completes its humiliating business, the Holy Spirit begins to transform His new creation, and there will come a time when there is nothing remaining of the old life. Our old patriotic and gloomy outlook disappears, as does our old attitude toward ways-and-means, and “all things are of God” (2 Corinthians 5:18). How are we going to get a life that has no lust for accolades and honor, no self-interest, and is not sensitive to the suggestions of others? How will we have the type of love that “is kind…is not provoked, and thinks no evil”? (1 Corinthians 13:4-5). The only way is by allowing nothing of the old life to remain, and by having only simple, perfect trust in Christ, our only Commander in Chief.

Freedom Has A Price

Christians should understand very well what their freedom will cost. The men and women who have traveled the Trail of Blood pioneered by those early saints who refused to kill for any reason have now passed the baton to this generation. Those saints understood the price that had to be paid and willingly grasped that baton. Will this generation lay down their worldly weapons long enough to Biblically consider the true cost of freedom and take up the call to "Come and Die"?

This truth needs to be rediscovered and passed-on to future generations - and Veterans Day is a great place to start.

"Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends." - John 15:13

This may seem like a harsh indictment against Christians on the Right or on the Left. When Christians join the world in its celebration of evil by laying praises and admiration on those we send to do our dirty work, to secure for us a safe place to play video games, watch T.V., and gorge ourselves on the residue of a lost civilization, we share in that evil and it becomes ours, we own it.

We are no less guilty than those we send,

or the ones whose lives we go there to end.
Good grief, you are a veteran and yet are against Christians in the military? I think Jesus would be fine with spending time target shooting with me. God sure didn't seem to mind sending people to war in the OT. But people tend to forget that Jesus was God then too...
 
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ViaCrucis

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Christians ought to honor those who have suffered, to that end the honoring of veterans is a good thing. What Christians ought not to is glorify war and violence. There are reasons why the holy fathers forbade Christian participation in the military, because our obligation to Christ and our fellow man does not permit us to a false allegiance to temporal rulers in which we must love our countrymen and despise our country's enemies. The Church exists apart from national borders and apart from the rulers and powers of this fallen age.

Christ our God has taught us to love our enemies, to turn the other cheek, and to repay no one evil for evil. The holy apostle writes that if our enemy is hungry and thirst to feed and give him drink, to live in peace with all insofar as it is up to us. This is precisely the context for which St. Paul writes in Romans 13.

Love of country is not wrong, but idolatry is forbidden. Love of country ought to move us toward the pursuit of justice and goodwill; when the use of one's country is used to kill, steal, and destroy the Christian ought to have no part in it.

We have no King but Jesus.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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GOD Shines Forth!

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David knew well that it was right for him to kill Goliath in defending his nation from alien invaders; and wrong for him to avenge himself with own hand against Saul and Nabal.

Excellent point.
 
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SteveIndy

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Should Christians be grateful for freedom of religion and women being treated with respect?

Do we believe in anarchy? I appreciate policemen who risk their own lives to save others.

Your answer is impulsive. Christians should give answers from the New Testament.
 
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SteveIndy

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Judicial action against evil and military action in defending one's nation and defending wherever one has jurisdiction are right, proper, and good. Jesus Himself used violence when He cleansed the Temple (His Father's House where He had jurisdiction) of corrupt practices and those who were doing them. The Apostles baptized a Roman centurion (Acts ch 10) and jailor (Philippians chapter 16) without making them step down from their positions which potentially required use of force to faithfully be in. The Apostle Paul enlisted the help of the Roman army to protect him from a plot against his life in Acts chapter 23. God commanded Israel's Judges and other leaders to punish evil with the sword throughout Israel's history (look at 1 Samuel chapter 15- Samuel was right to slay Agag with the sword when Saul wouldn't).

Pacifism is not a Christian doctrine and to follow Christ properly we must not practice it nor promote it. True Biblical non-resistance which is taught from Genesis to Revelation is to refuse to avenge yourself apart from acting in the line of one's duty in accordance with one's rank and jurisdiction. David knew well that it was right for him to kill Goliath in defending his nation from alien invaders; and wrong for him to avenge himself with own hand against Saul and Nabal.

If Christians should not celebrate Veterans Day, then the only honest and consistent thing to do would be to not be in the military at all nor to commend the military ever at all (i.e. be anti-solider and anti-veteran). It is expected of those who sign up that they will take up arms and fight to defend their nation. But this is something that can be compatible with Christianity- and this would only be wrong when and if orders were given to act outside of the righteous principles seen in Scripture.

Judicial action is not Christian and belongs to the world. What the world does is not the business of the Christian who is a citizen of another country. Christians are not directed anywhere to serve the world in its misguided efforts to tame the evil deeds of men, but we are rather told to separate ourselves from the world and that is the example we see from Christ’s followers.

Jesus’ use of the cord of rushes to drive evil from the Temple is the LONE example that people use to prove that Jesus endorses violence of all kinds. It does not say that Jesus used that “whip” to inflict injury on any man, but only to drive them and their animals out of the Temple area. You may want to take notice that Jesus did not organize a squad of fighters to rescue John the Baptist when He could have easily; He allowed him to be killed. Jesus’ anger at the abuse of the Temple for monetary and worldly purposes was the anger of a righteous Person at the gross blindness of people who should know better, very much like Christians today.

Your use of the Centurion and jailer prove nothing at all. The fact that we do not know what they did leaves us only to “assume” certain things. It would be more valid to assume that they followed the example of Jesus and the Apostles of a consistently, separated, non-resistant, and peaceful lifestyle. When we assume that these men continued in their violent ways we assume too much.

Paul’s asking for help from the Roman soldiers was not a selfish act to save his life as you assume, it was so that he could secure an audience to preach the Gospel in Rome and to complete his mission.

Your use of the Old Testament is not admissible as evidence because it has been overwritten by the New Testament. The Book of Hebrews makes it very plain and clear in numerous places that the O.T. is no longer a document that can be used to prove the actions of the Church. If you try and use the O.T. to plead your case before the Great Judge you will be thrown out of court. A last will and Testament is only valid after the testator has died and can be re-written many times as long as he is still alive. Once the testator dies then the document is sealed and cannot be changed as Hebrews makes clear. Christ did exactly that when He, as the Testator, re-wrote the New last Will and Testament, (see Matthew 5,6,7). Please confine your understanding to the New Testament.

You are correct that pacifism is not a Christian doctrine, but non-resistance to evil is a Christian doctrine; Jesus said, “Resist not an evil person” and exemplified that doctrine in His own life and His Apostles understood that example and obeyed it.

It is okay to commend the veteran for his bravery although it is misguided. From the world’s view, it is honorable to kill your enemy, but not from the lofty view of Heaven whose rules and laws we are to obey even though we now live in a foreign country; we must not become traitors to our Homeland.

I am not anti-veteran or anti-soldier as you suggest, these men are part of those I have come to plead with to see the truth of The Good News. I am no more against them than I am against everything in the kingdom of this world. Christians have a new Commander in Chief who they must obey even if it cost them their lives in this world. It is NEVER right to take another human life EVER.

You cannot be a Christian and serve two masters, you must make a choice!
 
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