Flat earth question

Lulav · Oct 25, 2019

I've seen some videos about one of the ways to prove the flat earth Theory was to study Flight routes. Some seemed to be pretty convincing.

I was reminded of it recently when looking on a Google map.

It showed that a flight from Philadelphia PA to Miami Beach, Florida would take 2 hours and 40 minutes. Sounds good since the drive would take somewhere between 17 and 18 1/2 hours. I've driven it myself so I know that's accurate. It's between 1,201 and 1,294 miles depending on route taken.

But from Philadelphia to Branson MO. it is 17 hours to drive, but 10 hours 20 minutes to fly.

How is it that the driving time is similar (17-18 1/2 hours) but the Fly time is almost 5X more for Missouri than Florida?

This may be one of the problems but it also brings up many more questions.

Please watch this short vid

If you can't be bothered to watch it then don't be bothered to comment.

Thanks!

hellothere · Oct 25, 2019

Lulav said:
I've seen some videos about one of the ways to prove the flat earth Theory was to study Flight routes. Some seemed to be pretty convincing.

I was reminded of it recently when looking on a Google map.

It showed that a flight from Philadelphia PA to Miami Beach, Florida would take 2 hours and 40 minutes. Sounds good since the drive would take somewhere between 17 and 18 1/2 hours. I've driven it myself so I know that's accurate. It's between 1,201 and 1,294 miles depending on route taken.

But from Philadelphia to Branson MO. it is 17 hours to drive, but 10 hours 20 minutes to fly.

How is it that the driving time is similar (17-18 1/2 hours) but the Fly time is almost 5X more for Missouri than Florida?

This may be one of the problems but it also brings up many more questions.

Please watch this short vid

If you can't be bothered to watch it then don't be bothered to comment.

Thanks!

I appreciate this guy's effort, but I don't see this as a convincing argument. The earth is only represented on a square map because all maps are like that. It's easier to measure and plot points. It may not be a perfect representation, but it's still a rather accurate representation of all the different bodies of land and water on earth. If you want to prove the earth is flat, then either go into space and take a picture of it that proves all the pictures we have were fabricated by the government, or travel to the edge of the earth and see either a cliff into nothingness or the giant impenetrable wall of ice.

SeventyOne · Oct 26, 2019

Lulav said:
I've seen some videos about one of the ways to prove the flat earth Theory was to study Flight routes. Some seemed to be pretty convincing.

I was reminded of it recently when looking on a Google map.

It showed that a flight from Philadelphia PA to Miami Beach, Florida would take 2 hours and 40 minutes. Sounds good since the drive would take somewhere between 17 and 18 1/2 hours. I've driven it myself so I know that's accurate. It's between 1,201 and 1,294 miles depending on route taken.

But from Philadelphia to Branson MO. it is 17 hours to drive, but 10 hours 20 minutes to fly.

How is it that the driving time is similar (17-18 1/2 hours) but the Fly time is almost 5X more for Missouri than Florida?

This may be one of the problems but it also brings up many more questions.

Please watch this short vid

If you can't be bothered to watch it then don't be bothered to comment.

Thanks!

Interesting video. The gist of it seems to be that there is no proper 2D representation of a globe available, which doesn't really pertain to a flat earth. That said, flat-earthers generally use what is called the AE (Azimuthal Equidistant) map as the best guess to represent the true nature of the earth, knowing it also has inherent issues itself, being derived from a globe projection. But just like the video states, neither side has an accurate map.

That said, a rather comprehensive response to flights as they pertain to a flat-earth perspective was done by Jeranism on the Globebusters show (which I highly recommend) about a year ago now. Here's a link to someone who excerpted just that portion of the show into it's own segment. It's a bit long, but like I said, it's rather comprehensive.

Jonaitis · Oct 26, 2019

I've watched this video before, and I find it interesting. The Mercator may have many flaws, but it is the best map projection we have today, and the best we have for navigation. If one looks at this map projection, one will immediately think that Greenland is huge and larger than the continent of Africa. India is disproportionate too. (I think he discussed this in the video). If you compare the continent of Africa with Asia, the former is either the same size or larger than the latter, but it doesn't on the Mercator projection.

Oh yeah, this thread is about flat earth. Don't believe in it.

d taylor · Oct 26, 2019

on Twitter

coffee4u · Oct 26, 2019

I looked it up, this says the flight takes 2 hours, 31 minutes. Flight Time from Philadelphia, PA to Branson, MO
Not sure where you got 10 hours from, but I think that is wrong.
As for the video, I think this is a good argument for using globes where we can rather than maps when looking at the world as a whole.

trunks2k · Oct 26, 2019

Lulav said:
.

But from Philadelphia to Branson MO. it is 17 hours to drive, but 10 hours 20 minutes to fly.

How is it that the driving time is similar (17-18 1/2 hours) but the Fly time is almost 5X more for Missouri than Florida?

You probably were not looking at a direct, non stop flight.

Lulav · Oct 26, 2019

coffee4u said:
I looked it up, this says the flight takes 2 hours, 31 minutes. Flight Time from Philadelphia, PA to Branson, MO
Not sure where you got 10 hours from, but I think that is wrong.
As for the video, I think this is a good argument for using globes where we can rather than maps when looking at the world as a whole.

Lulav said:
I was reminded of it recently when looking on a Google map.

Lulav · Oct 26, 2019

trunks2k said:
You probably were not looking at a direct, non stop flight.

Yes, I think that is the conclusion. However Flight time shouldn't be combined with down time I should think . As I said in the OP when seeing that it brought to mind what I'd heard about these flight patterns. There are certainly anomalies that can be found in other flights though that don't make sense when viewed on a global map, but when imposed over a flattened map it becomes clear.

Have a look at the flight map on this page, Why are there no straight lines, except in the European area? Also why do most flights shown on there emanating from the US (except for the eastern seaboard) have to go way up and over Greenland? Seems like a lot of time and fuel waste to me.

JackRT · Oct 26, 2019

Lulav said:
But from Philadelphia to Branson MO. it is 17 hours to drive, but 10 hours 20 minutes to fly.

I think there is a typo involved here --- like an extra "0".

trunks2k · Oct 26, 2019

Lulav said:
Yes, I think that is the conclusion. However Flight time shouldn't be combined with down time I should think .

When you are doing searches for flights, people are concerned with how long it's going to take in total to get from point A to point B. They don't care how long they are actually in the air. So the fight time displayed is the total time.

As I said in the OP when seeing that it brought to mind what I'd heard about these flight patterns. There are certainly anomalies that can be found in other flights though that don't make sense when viewed on a global map, but when imposed over a flattened map it becomes clear.

I think you have that backwards (see below)

Have a look at the flight map on this page, Why are there no straight lines, except in the European area? Also why do most flights shown on there emanating from the US (except for the eastern seaboard) have to go way up and over Greenland? Seems like a lot of time and fuel waste to me.

Because the Earth is a globe. Those are "great circle" paths - the shortest paths between two points in a globe. They are "straight"lines on a globe but when projected into a flat map, they look curved.

Also those naps aren't exact courses, but a rough illustration.

Lulav · Oct 26, 2019

JackRT said:
I think there is a typo involved here --- like an extra "0".

I did not make that typo, it is what I got from a google map.

Well isn't that interesting, I can't copy and paste as it is a copyrighted site but I went to look it up to give a link and now Google is saying it's a 4 hour and 20 minute flight.

According to Google flights there is no non-stop to Branson from Philly.

I think I found another distinction, from Branson to Philly it's the 4 hour and 20 minute flight but from Philly to Branson it's the 10 hour 20 minute flight.

Here's a flight for example from Phila to Branson
5:45 PM – 10:04 PM= 4:19 min

5h 19m PHL–SGF == 319 minutes
1 stop ---1h 3m ORD===63 minutes

319-63 = 256 = 4.26 - 4 hours 26 minutes

So even including the layover time it's still 4 hours 20+ minutes and the similar flight to Florida is

Lulav said:
It showed that a flight from Philadelphia PA to Miami Beach, Florida would take 2 hours and 40 minutes.

JackRT · Oct 26, 2019

My daughter recently flew from Toronto to Hong Kong in 12 hours.

Lulav · Oct 26, 2019

trunks2k said:
When you are doing searches for flights, people are concerned with how long it's going to take in total to get from point A to point B. They don't care how long they are actually in the air. So the fight time displayed is the total time.

Yes, I understand it's the total time. And I would have to contend you point about them not caring how long they are in flight, what comes to mind first would be people with Aerophobia.

But I get your point.

trunks2k said:
I think you have that backwards (see below)

Don't think so, I've seen these maps and they are as I said. Certain people have done experiments on this.

trunks2k said:
Because the Earth is a globe. Those are "great circle" paths - the shortest paths between two points in a globe. They are "straight"lines on a globe but when projected into a flat map, they look curved.

So how do you explain that the ones coming from the US were curved all the way up to Greenland but those in Europe were straight lines for the most part?

trunks2k said:
Also those naps aren't exact courses, but a rough illustration.

Well that map was a program to plot your personal flights.

I've also hear that in certain flights the contact is lost until just before touch down.

This is a RL time map of all commercial planes in the air at this moment, interesting to look at.

JackRT · Oct 26, 2019

My daughter's flight from Toronto to Hong Kong was almost straight north and down over Siberia, Mongolia and China. This is called a "great circle route" which is the shortest distance between two points on the globular earth.

Lulav · Oct 26, 2019

JackRT said:
My daughter's flight from Toronto to Hong Kong was almost straight north and down over Siberia, Mongolia and China. This is called a "great circle route" which is the shortest distance between two points on the globular earth.

Did you track her flight?

JackRT · Oct 26, 2019

Lulav said:
Did you track her flight?

Yes I did.

Shrewd Manager · Oct 26, 2019

Lulav said:
I've seen some videos about one of the ways to prove the flat earth Theory was to study Flight routes. Some seemed to be pretty convincing.

I was reminded of it recently when looking on a Google map.

It showed that a flight from Philadelphia PA to Miami Beach, Florida would take 2 hours and 40 minutes. Sounds good since the drive would take somewhere between 17 and 18 1/2 hours. I've driven it myself so I know that's accurate. It's between 1,201 and 1,294 miles depending on route taken.

But from Philadelphia to Branson MO. it is 17 hours to drive, but 10 hours 20 minutes to fly.

How is it that the driving time is similar (17-18 1/2 hours) but the Fly time is almost 5X more for Missouri than Florida?

This may be one of the problems but it also brings up many more questions.

Please watch this short vid

If you can't be bothered to watch it then don't be bothered to comment.

Thanks!

Just on the false premise of the vid, original maps (as in surveys and nautical charts) are all done on planar assumptions. So Captain Cook returns from his Pacific adventures and deposits his charts with Admiralty. The boffins in the basement are then tasked with the job of 'circling the square' and projecting those 2D maps onto a 3D ball.

So the world is mapped flat in pieces like a jigsaw puzzle. No allowance is made for curvature by any of the original mapmakers. It's then distorted onto a ball, and to add insult it's distorted a second time to represent it flat again!

It's like Alice in Wonderland.

A_Thinker · Oct 27, 2019

Lulav said:
Don't think so, I've seen these maps and they are as I said. Certain people have done experiments on this.

Certain people ???

Lulav said:
So how do you explain that the ones coming from the US were curved all the way up to Greenland but those in Europe were straight lines for the most part?

Longer flights appear to "curve" more on a flat map. Also, flights are mapped to avoid long stretches over ocean (in case one has to seek somewhere to land in an emergency) ...

Rick Otto · Nov 10, 2019

d taylor said:
on Twitter

Excellent stuff, d

Thanks for sharing.

Flat earth question

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