Animals

Heavenhome · Oct 25, 2019

Oh Daniel I am sorry that you cannot see past your own opinion.
I don't know how you jump from us being animal lovers to us being animal worshippers.
You have been given scripture but just ignore it.

You are treading a very fine line by equating us animal lovers as being accusers and likening us with Satan.
There is no point in having any further conversation, goodbye.

GodLovesCats · Oct 25, 2019

I knew it Daniel. I was certain you would intentionally twist animal love verses to mean the opposite. The Bible has MANY verses about God loving animals. If you know Genesis 1, you know God loved all animals. Show me absolute proof the Bible says God does not love all of His creatures - those that fly, swim, and move along the ground; wild and domestic; livestock and pets. Genesis 1 is absolute proof He loves them and so is the Noah's Ark story. Did you even look at any of the posts about Balaam and his donkey?

GodLovesCats · Oct 25, 2019

I will stop asking you this question when you answer it. There is no way out except raising the white flag.

Daniel C · Oct 25, 2019

ChristianForCats said:
Show me absolute proof the Bible says God does not love all of His creatures - those that fly, swim, and move along the ground

I've already shown you that God put ''dread'' in all creatures so they are ''delivered'' to us:

Genesis 9
And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.
2 And the fear of you and the dread of you shall be upon every beast of the earth, and upon every fowl of the air, upon all that moveth upon the earth, and upon all the fishes of the sea; into your hand are they delivered.

If you do not accept this as Gods intention for animals then I will accept but not agree with your view.

Now I answered your question as best I can,show me ''absolute proof'' where God does say he loves animals or nature?

GodLovesCats · Oct 25, 2019

Genesis 1

20And God said, “Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the vault of the sky.” 21So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living thing with which the water teems and that moves about in it, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22God blessed them and said, “Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth.” 23And there was evening, and there was morning—the fifth day.

24And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground, and the wild animals, each according to its kind.” And it was so. 25God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

GodLovesCats · Oct 25, 2019

Genesis 7

1 The Lord then said to Noah, “Go into the ark, you and your whole family, because I have found you righteous in this generation. 2 Take with you seven pairs of every kind of clean animal, a male and its mate, and one pair of every kind of unclean animal, a male and its mate, 3 and also seven pairs of every kind of bird, male and female, to keep their various kinds alive throughout the earth.

If God did not love animals He would not have told Noah to put any of them on the ark. Now to see God told Noah He wants all animal species to be kept alive, how is it possible to believe He did not love them?

Daniel C · Oct 25, 2019

ChristianForCats said:
Genesis 1

20And God said, “Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the vault of the sky.” 21So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living thing with which the water teems and that moves about in it, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22God blessed them and said, “Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth.” 23And there was evening, and there was morning—the fifth day.

24And God said, “Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground, and the wild animals, each according to its kind.” And it was so. 25God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

ChristianForCats said:
Genesis 7

1 The Lord then said to Noah, “Go into the ark, you and your whole family, because I have found you righteous in this generation. 2 Take with you seven pairs of every kind of clean animal, a male and its mate, and one pair of every kind of unclean animal, a male and its mate, 3 and also seven pairs of every kind of bird, male and female, to keep their various kinds alive throughout the earth.

If God did not love animals He would not have told Noah to put any of them on the ark. Now to see God told Noah He wants all animal species to be kept alive, how is it possible to believe He did not love them?

I do not accept that these posts demonstrate God loves animals. He preserved them,doesn't mean he loves them. They are here for our sustenance if nothing else.

And you can't make a claim and expect me to disprove it,you need to substantiate your own theory or else it is just that-theory.

I have shown God causing dread in all animals so mankind will be able to subdue them. I can also prove my own claim that God loves those created in his own image:

John 3:16 (Jesus said)
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

In my view you failed to show how God loves animals and nature.

GodLovesCats · Oct 25, 2019

Do you seriously believe God would only create animals to hate them? In Genesis 1, God created animals, told them to multiply, and saw that they were all good. He BLESSED them. And he made man vegetarian, specifically telling Adam and Eve all of the PLANTS and only plants) are for food. DID YOU READ GENESIS 1 after I posted it? If you did, you would know it is 100% absolute proof God loves all kinds of animals, so I am sure you did not.

renniks · Oct 25, 2019

Daniel C said:
*Baptist Forum - Rules Apply*

So I was wondering what the general viewpoint towards animals was.

God commanded us to rule over nature:

Genesis 1
28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

God is the creator and owner of all things and he's telling us (Mankind) to subdue the earth. He is not asking,he is demanding we subdue and subdue means to take control over,so we are the authority over the earth/nature/animals now God has given us the authority. If we are the authority we get to choose what happens with the animals and nature as God gave us that right. Animals are not co-equal with humans they are inferior and should be treated with that status,not cruelty but human needs/rights come before animal needs/rights.

God told us we are to take control over the earth/nature and are we doing it? Well looking at the way people exalt nature to the same level as human beings I would say no. Animals are property,not family members,not co-equal with men women or children-Property.

I understand the heathens worshiping animals because they don't know God and have no love for their fellow man but I also think i've seen some professing Christians doing this as well. I'm not sure how they can harmonize being a christian and animal worship.

I think domesticated Dogs are probably the best example of animals being worshiped. Although Dogs in society attack and kill people,bark and cause nuisances for their neighbors,leave dog foul on the floor western society still makes excuses for these. I think dogs in general are a nuisance but get away with these things because animal worship. God did not tell us to exalt nature but to subdue it.

Thoughts?

I agree overall. I do like my dogs but they are just animals, not to be treated like humans. I hunt, trap, fish and love animals for what they are, part of nature God gave us to manage and enjoy.

GodLovesCats · Oct 25, 2019

Giving your dogs food, water, shelter, exercise, and toys to play with and grooming them is not the same as treating them like humans? I am not talking about putting clothes on them or anything like that.

Daniel C · Oct 25, 2019

renniks said:
I agree overall. I do like my dogs but they are just animals, not to be treated like humans. I hunt, trap, fish and love animals for what they are, part of nature God gave us to manage and enjoy.

renniks i'm glad to hear from you in this thread,because I was about to post this in despair:

''Where are all the Bible believing Christians that can see God intends to have a special loving relationship with the one created in his own image and that the other things are just secondary?

Are there any on this forum or am I the only one?''

You are more theologically balanced than what I first (mistakenly) gave you credit for in my mind and this view on life you have in relation to God,mankind and nature proves that.

God bless you.

GodLovesCats · Oct 25, 2019

Daniel, let me know when you figure out God does not make creatures in the world just to hate them. No part of Genesis says He hated His own creations or that He is a hateful God. If you read chapters instead of cherry-pick verses, you'll see what I mean.

GodLovesCats · Oct 25, 2019

Also explain to me why you claim just being an animal lover means worshipping animals and hating other people.

GodLovesCats · Oct 25, 2019

I am dead serious about this. All you can do is answer my questions.

renniks · Oct 25, 2019

ChristianForCats said:
I am not overriding God. Does any verse in the Bible refer to shepherds as sheep owners? I doubt it.

We are Shepard's and we own our sheep. The same was true then. Do you think shepherds keep sheep just for fun? No they have to be able to make a profit or they can't afford to be shepherds. Which means they sold sheep for slaughter, and in those days probably sacrifices, and they sold the wool. If you can buy and sell some thing, surely you own it.

renniks · Oct 25, 2019

ChristianForCats said:
This is not true. Only humans need a savior because only humans ate fruit from the Tree of Knowledge. If a cat had eaten it, cats would know what sin is and need Jesus. Animals capable of thinking also have the ability to love and do love. They do have souls. The only thing missing is an ability to know and love God. I cannot understand why you doubt all animals with brains and hearts are able to love anything, including humans, or have their own thoughts and personalities that make them special.

Please show me biblically where it says animals have souls? Animals act on instinct. They do not reason in the same way we do.

renniks · Oct 25, 2019

ChristianForCats said:
Mankind needs a savior because man sinned. No other kind of animal sinned, so only people go to hell.

If animals don't go to hell, what do you think happens to them when they die? It would be go to heaven, of course, because they did not sin.

They go into the dirt. there's absolutely no biblical evidence that animals have souls.

renniks · Oct 25, 2019

ChristianForCats said:
If God did not love animals He would not have created them and said, "Let them be fruitful and multiply." He would not have liked everything he made after creating all of the animals. Don't you know He loved all of the things He created? Anyone who read Genesis 1 can see that very clearly.

The point is that he does not love them in the same manner he loves humans... Can you imagine a god who would demand the sacrifice of humans? And yet the God of the Bible demanded the sacrifice of animals. When the Israelites sacrificed their children God reprimanded them severely. When I say I love my dog, it does not mean the same thing as I love my wife or my kid. If the dog was threatening the life of a child I would put a bullet in his head without a second thought. The problem is people equate animals with humans. There's nothing wrong with having affection for an animal, but to treat it like it has human rights is wrong.

GodLovesCats · Oct 25, 2019

The same God sacrificed His own Son, who is fully human.

Why don't you think caring for a dog is treating it like it has human rights? We have the same rights too - food, water, shelter, etc.

See the earlier posts about Balaam's donkey. When Balaam beat his donkey on the head, the angel said a very bad thing to him. Why? Becasuse it is a sin to absue any animal.

Daniel C · Oct 25, 2019

renniks said:
The point is that he does not love them in the same manner he loves humans... Can you imagine a god who would demand the sacrifice of humans? And yet the God of the Bible demanded the sacrifice of animals. When the Israelites sacrificed their children God reprimanded them severely. When I say I love my dog, it does not mean the same thing as I love my wife or my kid. If the dog was threatening the life of a child I would put a bullet in his head without a second thought. The problem is people equate animals with humans. There's nothing wrong with having affection for an animal, but to treat it like it has human rights is wrong.

I agree and that's the correct order of importance.

The problem with a lot of these animal advocates is all they have is their pet animals,they are cut off from the rest of society and all they think about is their pets. so it twists their vision of Gods plan for mankind. It also creates a disconnect between them and the rest of the human family.

Some of the most dysfunctional people I have ever met are individuals that have extreme affinity for animals without a balance for people and of course the creator.

Your OP is a good model for the relationship man and beast should have:

"I do like my dogs but they are just animals, not to be treated like humans. I hunt, trap, fish and love animals for what they are, part of nature God gave us to manage and enjoy."

Animals

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