do you believe ufos are demons flying?

Jipsah

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You've given us nothing but seemingly uniformed personal opinions.
As opposed to the wealth of hard demonstrable evidence everyone else is setting forth here, right? <Laugh> OK, FWIW, I've seen at least 3 flying things that I couldn't identify. That appears to make my opinion at least as credible as yours. But I'll stand by my logic, which tells me that fantastic phenomena are usually the product of an active imagination paired with sketchy observation.

Why would we care what you're "betting" if you don't know what you're talking about?
And I'd be forced to ask you the same thing. Why believe in your flying saucers? Because you say so? Not good enough.

Do you have any experience, knowledge or expertise in this subject area?
Unless you've identified those hitherto unidentified flying things, I'll submit that my knowledge and expertise in that realm is a good as yours.

It apparently doesn't trouble you that precisely no one today who is knowledgeable about the phenomenon agrees with you.
Really? A few hours ago you opined that no one at all believed what I do, but I've demonstrated that to be false. I expect that this latest contention of yours equally as presumptuous. Unless you're using the reverse logic, so that if you have to be a Believer before you can be considered to have the proper experience, knowledge or expertise. I expect that that is the case. "If you don't agree with me then you don't know." Sorry, not good enough.

"All mundane objects"? "Simply explained"? I don't think so. More significantly, those with the vast depth of knowledge of J. Allen Hynek, Jacques Vallee and Jerome Clark don't think so.
I'm less than astonished to hear that. And you're all entitled to your opinions. But there's serious dearth of hard data there, isn't there? If we're still depending on "evidence" that's most commonly expressed as "I think they're space men/demons...", then I don't consider any of you an authority.

The puzzle to me is why people say things such as this when they clearly aren't knowledgeable about what is a complex, multi-faceted phenomenon and their uninformed opinions are completely at odds with the opinions of those who are far better informed and more qualified. What's the point?
Again, I'll say the same for you. What arcane knowledge do you possess that anyone else doesn't? You saw UFOs, and that's nice. I have, as well. On three separate occasions. I'm satisfied that there was a workaday explanation for all three. Do I know what that explanation is? No, else they wouldn't be UFOs, would they? But when I see something that (my favorite) "defies the laws of physics", I assume that my observation was faulty, knowing the laws of Physics to be the laws of God. The True Believer "knows" that it was the spacemen/demons are exempt from those laws, and therefore his observation can't (and must not be) faulted. Completely different perspective.

In any case, you're saying in effect that I must accept your views of the nature of UFOs on authority. I deny the authority.

What you are doing is pretty much exactly what atheists do with believers: "I may not know anything about Christianity, but I do know it's all nonsense and only credulous dummies believe it."
First I deny the comparison as nonsense. Apart from that, belief in God and the supernatural must be based of faith. I have faith that God exists, and that Christianity is true. But if you're asking me to accept that flying saucers, driven by non-human beings, exist, then telling me to have faith isn't just inadequate, it's ridiculous. They're there or they ain't. If I'm to believe that they're there it's gonna take more than telling me that everyone but me believes it, especially when I'm about 99.23875% sure that isn't true.

BTW, I think you misunderstand Occam's Razor. The point of Occam's Razor is that explanations should not be made unnecessarily complicated. All things being equal, the least-complicated explanation is to be preferred - but isn't inevitably correct.
You're trying to teach your grandmother to ingest raw eggs here, mate. If I hadn't known what it meant I wouldn't have used it. You lot are offering a bizzaro, supernatural, extraterrestrial "answer" to a question, and I'm arguing for a simple one. You have no evidence for your beliefs, so I'm content with Sir William's principle being appropriate here. If the first argument someone puts forth looks like it was designed by Jules Verne working in conjunction with Rube Goldberg, then they're gonna have to support with something better than an argument by authority if they expect me to buy in.

You're not addressing the evidence at all - more like putting your head in the sand.
The "evidence" of grainy pictures of God knows what, people's whose accounts begin with "I woke up and..."? Or people who say "I don't know what it was, but nothing made by man can do that", who should have left off with "was". Of people who "know" that anything they see in the air that they can't immediately recognize is a demon. That kind of "evidence"? That's evidence? Am I to believe in the Loch Ness Monster or the Cottingley Fairies as well? Sorry, I'll pass.

There is nothing inherently simpler about your pseudo-explanation ("all mundane objects," which is clearly incorrect anyway) than demons, aliens or any of the other speculation that has been offered.
Oh, I don't know about that. Seems to me that a UFO turning out to be an airplane or Venus or a staple in the picture (a famous "UFO" picture, forsooth). or just a fraud is a lot simpler than demons or spacemen. Unless demons and spacemen are a lot commoner where you are than here.

"Demons" would be quite a simple and straightforward explanation that actually fits much of the evidence quite nicely and is entirely consistent with Christian theology.
So that may actually be what's wrong with my car! And the mechanics keep insisting that it's the transmission...

Sorry mate, no flying saucers, driven by either spacemen or demons. Then again, I'm from Missouri (OK, Tennessee, but it's just across the river) and I'm willing to be shown. But you have to have something to show. Evidence has to be evidence, not "everybody knows" or "you have to have faith".
 
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coffee4u

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People seem to keep saying that if we believe in Christ we ought also to believe in flying saucers driven by either spacemen or demons. As well to say that if we believe in Christ we should also believe in kelpies, elves, Barsoomians, banshees, and what have you. That's silly.

All I am saying is if we believe in demons that we should not rule out the possibility that they may appear as extraterrestrials. I highly doubt they are driving anything.

kelpies? What are those? I only know them as an Australian dog.
Barsoomians, also don't know.

Who's to say these things were not demons? If angels can appear as people, why can't demons appear as things?
Hebrews 13:2
Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some have unwittingly entertained angels.
 
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Jamdoc

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I think every sighting so far has been a hoax or a flight of fancy or seeing some natural phenomenon or the ever popular "secret government aircraft" just think what people would have thought seeing the B-2 Spirit (the "Stealth Bomber") when they first saw it with it's uncharacteristic shape? Is there a possibility of space aliens visiting earth? Does scripture specifically rule it out? If not, never limit the possibilities of God's power to create things we couldn't even imagine.
 
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timewerx

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Miracles happen. UFO s? Never seen or experienced one .. why should I believe it in?

You haven't seen Jesus either, nor experience Him in way that make sense and consistent with scientific methods.

Miracles can also be explained with Quantum Mechanics and miracles are not exclusive to Christianity.

So why did you choose to believe that Jesus exists?

Is it because you care for your own salvation or is it because you care for the truth?
 
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coffee4u

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Demons are spirits.
So therefore you would not be able to see
them flying if they were to fly.

If that were true (not being able to see them) then how could we entertain angels?
Hebrews 13:2
Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some have unwittingly entertained angels.
 
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ooQQoo

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If that were true (not being able to see them) then how could we entertain angels?
Hebrews 13:2
Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some have unwittingly entertained angels.
I am not going to entertain you.
 
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dms1972

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Man deceives. Why would demons need to?

As a matter of fact it is only now that the military is admitting to ufo's and has patented anti-gravity technology. Could full exposure be coming soon as they prepare the world for what it has already suspected for ages.


Avro Canada VZ-9 Avrocar - Wikipedia

I havent seen one of these do any more than hover a couple of feet off the ground though.
 
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Bible Highlighter

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There is a whole book out on the correlation of owls and alien phenomenon. There is also a tie to owls and the Rephaim.

Interesting. I believe you, and I believe it can help some who are looking for that. I probably would not seek to get a book like this personally because I do not want to focus on the alien phenomenon too much. I would rather focus more on those things which are good, and lovely (Philippians 4:8). Also, while I believe we should on rare occasion warn against the alien deception, I do not believe it is the major deception that the Bible talks about. I believe the major deception that we are to fight against is the one that still continues even in Christianity today. It is the false belief espoused in Matthew 3:9, and John 8:39.

Anyways, good day to you in the Lord;
And may you please be well.
 
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renniks

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You haven't seen Jesus either, nor experience Him in way that make sense and consistent with scientific methods.

Miracles can also be explained with Quantum Mechanics and miracles are not exclusive to Christianity.

So why did you choose to believe that Jesus exists?

Is it because you care for your own salvation or is it because you care for the truth?
First, you have no idea how I've experienced him.
As for the existence of God, nature itself answers that question for me.
Yes I believe in Christ by faith, but also because of compelling evidence.
I have found no compelling evidence for UFOs.
 
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Ken Lee

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The technology happening today can affect anyone adversely, influencing moods, pulsing words, and making sickness. In the air, emanating from satellites, tower antennas, etc . . .
The devil is actively using such media, and unless Christians stand up against this persecution, more bad things will happen.
It's not a coincidence many criminals in jail said they heard voices telling them to do the act.

Persecuted But Not Forsaken book at Amazon (Marshall Lee)
 
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timewerx

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First, you have no idea how I've experienced him.
As for the existence of God, nature itself answers that question for me.
Yes I believe in Christ by faith, but also because of compelling evidence.
I have found no compelling evidence for UFOs.

I agree with you and believe what you're saying about God.

But your argument is no more compelling than believers of UFOs give.

You got to have a reason why you choose to believe one thing and reject another whose nature of existence is equally verifiable (or equally unverifiable for that matter).

Is it based on feelings (feel good or bad about something), or utmost desire to live eternally?
 
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renniks

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You got to have a reason why you choose to believe one thing and reject another whose nature of existence is equally verifiable (or equally unverifiable for that matter).
First no one has convinced me that UFOs are equally verifiable. I've experience God in many ways. I have zero experience with UFOs.
 
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