Genesis 1 is to be taken literaly - it is the only logical option

klutedavid · Oct 15, 2019

BobRyan said:
reading the actual posts in the thread may help you out a bit there.

This thread is defined by the OP and not by the posts contained therein.

Your OP outlines a literal interpretation of Genesis chapter one and a fundamentalist interpretation to boot.

Whereas the theory of evolution involves the change in the characteristics of species over time, in adapting to the environment.

Evolution has nothing to do with a literal, fundamentalist reading of Genesis.

Steve Falkenberg, professor of religious psychology at Eastern Kentucky University, observed:

"I've never met anyone who actually believes the Bible is literally true. I know a bunch of people who say they believe the Bible is literally true but nobody is actually a literalist. Taken literally, the Bible says the earth is flat, it has pillars, and will not be moved (Ps 93:1, Ps 96:10, 1 Sam 2:8, Job 9:6). It says that great sea monsters are set to guard the edge of the sea (Job 41, Ps 104:26). ..."[25]
(wikipedia.biblical.literalism)

Do you believe that the earth is supported by pillars? If not, then you do not hold to a literal interpretation of Genesis and certainly not a fundamentalist, literal interpretation of Genesis.

BobRyan · Oct 15, 2019

Anguspure said:
As is indicated in the Bible as a future state, the Creator supplies the light necessary with His presence during the time of creation and until the Sun is brought into play.

I am of the opinion that although from the Creators perspective the Earth was created in 6 days, that the perspective of long ages and design progression and development from the perspective of an observer within the system are accurate.

Could God in your opinion tell the difference between 6 days and 4 billion years? If so then when God says "six days you shall labor...for in six days the LORD made" Ex 20:11 would he be aware that humans do not labor for 4 billion years and then rest? Would he also be aware that the language He is using in his own spoken statement in Ex 20:11 was conveying the idea that He did something in six days the same as people work six days -- the same unit of time? Would he be aware of that?

If you say you did something in an hour but in fact it took you 20 years would you be "overstating your case"??

• The first of the Biblical days lasted 24 hours, viewed from the "beginning of time perspective." But the duration from our perspective was 8 billion years.

If there was "evening and morning" for each of those days then plants would have how many100's of millions of years of darkness in your view? How fast do you think the earth was rotating at that time? Same as today?

So the period for which the Earth needed the Creators light is probably a billion years or so, not 1 Solar day (a time frame which didn't exist until the planet was in orbit around the Sun anyway).

The earth would have needed "some light" besides the sun for three rotations of planet earth -- the day night sequence 3 times.

BobRyan · Oct 15, 2019

klutedavid said:
This thread is defined by the OP and not by the posts contained therein.
...

Steve Falkenberg, professor of religious psychology at Eastern Kentucky University, observed:

"I've never met anyone who actually believes the Bible is literally true. .

Wow just think - you met people here who think the Bible is true and Steve has never met one. I think that puts you one-up on Steve's experience.

Thanks for sharing that.

gideon123 · Oct 15, 2019

There is no reason for this topic to lead to accusations about faith (or lack of faith). Obviously there are a wide variety of Christians with differing opinions about Genesis 1. This does not mean that their faith is wrong.

I disagree with a literal interpretation. But i believe that those who have a literal interpretation have strong faith in God.

FInally, there are too many people here talking about the "text". What text? Please show me the original text, dictated by God and given to Adam.

Show me that text.

Dont show me anything in English ... that is a copy of a copy of a copy. Adam did not speak English.

Dont show me anything in ancient Hebrew. That is also a copy of a copy of a copy. Adam did not speak Hebrew, and neither did Noah.

Show me the original text, written in the language that Adam or Noah actually spoke. If you have that text on a clay tablet, then you can talk about what the words mean and what interpretation is valid.

Blessings!

klutedavid · Oct 15, 2019

BobRyan said:
Wow just think - you met people here who think the Bible is true and Steve has never met one. I think that puts you one-up on Steve's experience.

Thanks for sharing that.

Is the earth supported by pillars?

klutedavid · Oct 15, 2019

BobRyan said:
Wow just think - you met people here who think the Bible is true and Steve has never met one. I think that puts you one-up on Steve's experience.

Thanks for sharing that.

It is not about whether you think the Bible is true or not. We are talking about the way that you read and interpret the scripture. You seem somewhat confused in your replies.

Your interpretation of the scripture is based on the premise that every word, every line in the scripture, is true and never in error.

I could ask you, for example, what was the last words that Jesus spoke on the cross before He died. That is, as recorded in the gospels.

Matthew 27:45-46
Now from the sixth hour darkness fell upon all the land until the ninth hour. About the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud voice, saying, “Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” that is, “My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?”

Luke 23:46
Crying out with a loud voice, said, “Father, into Your hands I commit My spirit.” Having said this, He breathed His last.

John 19
Therefore when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, "It is finished!” And He bowed His head and gave up His spirit.

So you tell me exactly and without any error what were the last words that Jesus spoke on the cross?

BobRyan · Oct 15, 2019

gideon123 said:
There is no reason for this topic to lead to accusations about faith (or lack of faith). Obviously there are a wide variety of Christians with differing opinions about Genesis 1. This does not mean that their faith is wrong.

No one "needs" to say "the bible is corrupt and not reliable" or any such thing. Everyone can have their own view of doctrine their own acceptance of the Bible.

another option is this --

klutedavid said:
You may accept that man is infallible when writing the scripture, I don't. ..

I do not accept that premise that the scripture is perfect and without error.

Scripture is inspired but written by men and more to the point. Scripture was written by patriotic Jews with a vested interest in proclaiming their own greatness.
.

BobRyan · Oct 15, 2019

klutedavid said:
It is not about whether you think the Bible is true or not. We are talking about the way that you read

We then go to the experts in Hebrew language and OT studies in all world class universities to see "if" this is a question of "the way you read" or a fact about literature, language and history.

BobRyan said:
Professor James Barr, Regius Professor of Hebrew at the University of Oxford, has written:

‘Probably, so far as I know, there is no professor of Hebrew or Old Testament at any world-class university who does not believe that the writer(s) of Genesis 1–11 intended to convey to their readers the ideas that: (a) creation took place in a series of six days which were the same as the days of 24 hours we now experience (b) the figures contained in the Genesis genealogies provided by simple addition a chronology from the beginning of the world up to later stages in the biblical story (c) Noah’s flood was understood to be world-wide and extinguish all human and animal life except for those in the ark. Or, to put it negatively, the apologetic arguments which suppose the "days" of creation to be long eras of time, the figures of years not to be chronological, and the flood to be a merely local Mesopotamian flood, are not taken seriously by any such professors, as far as I know.’

BobRyan · Oct 15, 2019

klutedavid said:
You seem somewhat confused in your replies.

if I only had a nickle for each time you accuse someone of being confused in each of your posts on this thread.

BobRyan · Oct 15, 2019

klutedavid said:
I could ask you, for example, what was the last words that Jesus spoke on the cross before He died.

I could ask you "how many texts in the Bible say -- this is the last word Jesus spoke on the cross before He died"

I can't do that because it would be rabbit trailing off-topic and I need to keep this thread on topic. I am just saying "I could" ask it.

BobRyan · Oct 15, 2019

gideon123 said:
FInally, there are too many people here talking about the "text". What text? Please show me the original text, dictated by God and given to Adam.

Show me that text.

Dont show me anything in English

A great many Christians on this board believe scripture on the subject of the death , burial and resurrection of Christ, His ascension into heaven , the promise of the 2nd coming, etc but none of them have "the manuscript autographs" that you seem to insist on. Is it your claim that unless one has the autographs the Bible is not to be trusted??

Neostarwcc · Oct 15, 2019

When I first read the OP I was like "Well duh, every Christian believes in a literal seven day creation" then I read the first few pages of replies.

I'm like really? How can you call yourself a Christian and call the bible the inerrant word of God (and several of them do because they're Protestants) and yet still not believe in the literal seven day creation of God? The apostles never commented on it but I'm 99.9% sure that they believed in the Genesis account so why shouldn't you?

GodLovesCats · Oct 15, 2019

fwGod said:
But.. astronomical observations over the years show that our solar system moves in a circular path which makes up the galaxy.

Further, all galaxies observed are disc shaped. None depict a spiral shape.

Wrong. Galaxies come in different shapes. There are different types of galaxies too. They were discovered by astronomers by hte way. Some galaxies are binary, which means the planets revolve around two main stars like our Sol.

klutedavid · Oct 15, 2019

BobRyan said:
I could ask you "how many texts in the Bible say -- this is the last word Jesus spoke on the cross before He died"

I can't do that because it would be rabbit trailing off-topic and I need to keep this thread on topic. I am just saying "I could" ask it.

The whole thread is a rabbit trail.

There were multiple accounts of these last words of Jesus and the scripture is inerrant.

So Bob, which account do you select as the correct account of the last words of Jesus?

The problem remains for any student of the scripture, regardless of whether they wan't to just ignore or answer questions on the scripture.

klutedavid · Oct 15, 2019

ChristianForCats said:
Wrong. Galaxies come in different shapes. There are different types of galaxies too. They were discovered by astronomers by hte way. Some galaxies are binary, which means the planets revolve around two main stars like our Sol.

The current count on Galaxies is around 2 trillion, that is, a million times a million Galaxies.

When God creates He certainly does it on a massive scale, so vast that we cannot really even comprehend the Cosmos.

fwGod · Oct 15, 2019

ChristianForCats said:
Wrong. Galaxies come in different shapes. There are different types of galaxies too. They were discovered by astronomers by hte way. Some galaxies revolve around two stars, unlike Sol being the only sun that 8 planets share in the Milky Way.

I would think that astronomers would discover galaxies. I haven't done an in-depth study on all the galaxies. My minor viewing was based on the charts that usually showed up in the search which showed most to be disc-shaped. The majority is what I referred to.
Any greater detail I leave to a thread that is actually about astronomy and galaxies. Since this isn't, I hardly think that it's the place to be so quick to say "you are wrong".

SkyWriting · Oct 15, 2019

BobRyan said:
Sadly for that - we already know what a 7 day week is and that takes almost no science at all.

There was no sun at the beginning of the week.
God was not standing on the earth in the sun for morning and sleeping in the evening.
God does not experience time or even science at all.

BobRyan · Oct 15, 2019

SkyWriting said:
There was no sun at the beginning of the week.

Agreed. No sun until day 4.

God does not experience time or even science at all.

Some people claim to know more about God than He does.

But the question is "can God accurately communicate"?

The Bible says He can.

BobRyan · Oct 15, 2019

ChristianForCats said:
Some galaxies are binary, which means the planets revolve around two main stars like our Sol.

??

galaxies don't revolve around planets or stars. Apparently that goes double for binary galaxies

(Not sure why that topic is on this thread - but I find it interesting)

GodLovesCats · Oct 15, 2019

I never said tbey do Bob. Not sure how your misread my post.

Anyway, if "The Creation" took only 6 days, there would be only one planet. How do you explain the other 7 planets, dwarf planet, comets, and hundreds of meteors, asteroids, and moons existing if all things that God made were created in 5 days? It is obvious the Bible was not intended to teach us what God made in the infinite time before He created a wet planet for all kinds of species to live on. So there is no way God, despite His power to make things at any rate He wanted, actually did start and complete the creation in 6 days.

Genesis 1 is to be taken literaly - it is the only logical option

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