The Ten Commandments and God's Finger

Bob S

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Some posting here have not comprehended the fact that Paul did write that the 10 commandments, ministry of death written on tables of stone, were transitory, temporary and in the KJV done away. You criticize me for using those verses in 2Cor3: 6-11 telling me all sorts of derogatory things. The real fact is that you will not face up to the fact that the 10 commandments were the words of the Sinai covenant and that covenant no longer exists. It has been replaced by the new covenant, the one that has better promises, the eternal covenant.

2Cor3: NIV
6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant – not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

The greater glory of the new covenant
7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! 10 For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. 11 And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!

2Cor3: KJV
6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.

11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.
 
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Bro. Dave Gardner

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When we get to Heaven we will have a lot of questions.
But some of us won't have to ask whether the law was immutable or if God wrote the law Himself, because we won't have been searching for loopholes and excuses for being disobedient.
 
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Bro. Dave Gardner

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That statement would contradict Ex34:27-28 and what I seem to think.
Simply unbelievable, the arrogance. There is no contradiction. You are assuming "he" means Moses both times and and creating an apparent contradiction in your own mind, thus rendering verse one disposable and "of none effect."
 
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klutedavid

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Regardless of who did the actual writing, the commandments are from God, and the new covenant is not a lawless covenant.
The new covenant contains the words of Christ and most certainly they are not lawlessness.

Matthew 25:41-46
“Then He will also say to those on His left, ‘Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels; for I was hungry, and you gave Me nothing to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me nothing to drink; I was a stranger, and you did not invite Me in; naked, and you did not clothe Me; sick, and in prison, and you did not visit Me.’ Then they themselves also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not take care of You?’ Then He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

If you do not bear the fruit, i.e., love, then you will no doubt burn with the rest of those selfish people.
 
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Bro. Dave Gardner

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Jesus had no earthly father as Jesus was born of a virgin.
He respected Joseph as an earthly father and Mary as His mother, according to the commandment, I can assure you. It doesn't take much sanctified imagination to arrive at that conclusion. To do otherwise would have made Him an unworthy sacrifice for sin. You don't have to agree (and be right), of course.
 
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klutedavid

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He respected Joseph as an earthly father and Mary as His mother, according to the commandment, I can assure you. It doesn't take much sanctified imagination to arrive at that conclusion. To do otherwise would have made Him an unworthy sacrifice for sin. You don't have to agree (and be right), of course.
Jesus told you who His true father was and He repeated this many times. Mary was merely a surrogate mother.

John 3:13
No one has ascended into heaven, but He who descended from heaven, the Son of Man.

John 3:31
He who comes from above is above all, he who is of the earth is from the earth and speaks of the earth.

John 3
He who comes from heaven is above all.

John 6
33 For the bread of God is that which comes down out of heaven, and gives life to the world.

John 6
38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.

John 6
58 This is the bread which came down out of heaven; not as the fathers ate and died; he who eats this bread will live forever.

John 6
62 What then if you see the Son of Man ascending to where He was before?

John 7
29 I know Him, because I am from Him, and He sent Me.

John 8
14 Jesus answered and said to them, “Even if I testify about Myself, My testimony is true, for I know where I came from and where I am going.

John 8
23 And He was saying to them, “You are from below, I am from above; you are of this world, I am not of this world."

John 8
42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and have come from God.

John 8
58 Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am.”

John 13
3 Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into His hands, and that He had come forth from God and was going back to God.

John 16
28 I came forth from the Father and have come into the world; I am leaving the world again and going to the Father.

John 16
30 Now we know that You know all things, and have no need for anyone to question You; by this we believe that You came from God.

John 17:8
For the words which You gave Me I have given to them; and they received them and truly understood that I came forth from You, and they believed that You sent Me.
 
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Bro. Dave Gardner

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Jesus told you who His true father was and He repeated this many times. Mary was merely a surrogate mother.

John 3:13
No one has ascended into heaven, but He who descended from heaven, the Son of Man.

John 3:31
He who comes from above is above all, he who is of the earth is from the earth and speaks of the earth.

John 3
He who comes from heaven is above all.

John 6
33 For the bread of God is that which comes down out of heaven, and gives life to the world.

John 6
38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.

John 6
58 This is the bread which came down out of heaven; not as the fathers ate and died; he who eats this bread will live forever.

John 6
62 What then if you see the Son of Man ascending to where He was before?

John 7
29 I know Him, because I am from Him, and He sent Me.

John 8
14 Jesus answered and said to them, “Even if I testify about Myself, My testimony is true, for I know where I came from and where I am going.

John 8
23 And He was saying to them, “You are from below, I am from above; you are of this world, I am not of this world."

John 8
42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and have come from God.

John 8
58 Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am.”

John 13
3 Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into His hands, and that He had come forth from God and was going back to God.

John 16
28 I came forth from the Father and have come into the world; I am leaving the world again and going to the Father.

John 16
30 Now we know that You know all things, and have no need for anyone to question You; by this we believe that You came from God.

John 17:8
For the words which You gave Me I have given to them; and they received them and truly understood that I came forth from You, and they believed that You sent Me.
Copy-and-paste all you like--Jesus was a good little sinless boy and obeyed and honored His father and mother. There was a reason they were shocked when He disappeared for three days.
Christ was and is a paradox--100% divine; 100% human.
 
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klutedavid

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He respected Joseph as an earthly father and Mary as His mother, according to the commandment, I can assure you. It doesn't take much sanctified imagination to arrive at that conclusion. To do otherwise would have made Him an unworthy sacrifice for sin. You don't have to agree (and be right), of course.
Can you interpret the following passage?

Matthew 25:41-46
“Then He will also say to those on His left, ‘Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels; for I was hungry, and you gave Me nothing to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me nothing to drink; I was a stranger, and you did not invite Me in; naked, and you did not clothe Me; sick, and in prison, and you did not visit Me.’ Then they themselves also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not take care of You?’ Then He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”
 
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Bob S

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There is absolutely no way mortal man can comprehend the character of God even through the Son who is God and dwelt among man. Mortal man has not even come up with words that can describe our eternal God. Some on the forum would write anything to try to harass others.

Those who tell us the ten commandments represent the character of God are not thinking beyond what they have heard from others.
 
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sparow

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Do you know that it was Moses that chiseled the words of the covenant on the stone tablets that rested in the Ark of the Covenant? Moses spent forty days hammering on those stones. Those who tell us the ten were written by God's finger are telling us a misnomer. The set of commandments that Moses dropped and broke into pieces were written by God's finger. I wonder why God had Moses write the second set? Were they perfect like the first set would have been?

Ex34:27 The Lord said to Moses: Write these words; in accordance with these words I have made a covenant with you and with Israel. 28 He was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And he wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.[/QUOTE

Exodus 31:18 (NKJV)
18 And when He had made an end of speaking with him on Mount Sinai, He gave Moses two tablets of the Testimony, tablets of stone, written with the finger of God.

Exodus 34:27 (NKJV)
27 Then the LORD said to Moses, "Write these words, for according to the tenor of these words I have made a covenant with you and with Israel."


Why anyone would think Exodus 34:27-28, refers to ten or that it would take 40 days and 40 nights to do it surprises me. There is a lot more to the covenant than the Ten Commandments, like the kingdom of God and it's King; Moses wrote a book of the covenant, that may have taken 40 days and forty nights.
 
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fwGod

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How many were in the OT and how many are in the NT? I always hear there are 613 the OT and 1050 in the NT...
There is only one commandment mentioned in Rom.13 says
8 "Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law."

There is only one commandment in the OT. Love, which flows in two directions.

Neh.1:5
Then I prayed this prayer: “Lord, God of heaven, you are the great and powerful God. You are the God who keeps his agreement of love with people who love you and obey your commands.

The 613 are God's way of saying "Let me count the ways of loving your neighbor."

Jesus said that there are two. Love God. And love your neighbor as yourself. The whole of the law and prophets hang on those two commandments.
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Jesus said that there are two. Love God. And love your neighbor as yourself. The whole of the law and prophets hang on those two commandments.

Both of those commandments are in the Torah...in Deuteronomy and in Leviticus...so basically Yeshua was teaching Torah in the NT... :)
Shalom
 
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fwGod

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Both of those commandments are in the Torah...in Deuteronomy and in Leviticus...so basically Yeshua was teaching Torah in the NT... :)
Shalom
Indeed He was, since all in the days of His ministry were required to live by the Old Testament (though not yet spoken of as that) because the Church age had not begun yet, and the NT had not been written yet.
 
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Bro. Dave Gardner

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Some posting here have not comprehended the fact that Paul did write that the 10 commandments, ministry of death written on tables of stone, were transitory, temporary and in the KJV done away. You criticize me for using those verses in 2Cor3: 6-11 telling me all sorts of derogatory things. The real fact is that you will not face up to the fact that the 10 commandments were the words of the Sinai covenant and that covenant no longer exists. It has been replaced by the new covenant, the one that has better promises, the eternal covenant.
It's not that "we" ("Some posting here"--since we seem to have begun embracing vagueries) don't "comprehend" your quotes and claims. "We" simply don't agree with your interpetation that a few favored passages trump the testimony of the Bible as a whole. It's not harassment; it's not derogatory criticism; it's simply the proverbial heat in the (debate/discussion) kitchen.

In my opinion, posts that consist of spam-like quoting of Scripture along with unfounded accusations of harrassment and passive-aggressive addresses to nameless discussion opponents just look like attempts to derail a thread.

I made it clear some time ago that I intended to counter these aggressive anti-ten commandments influences. They were unheard of in my childhood amongst Christians, and I reject them outright. Their fruit is apparent in society today.
 
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Bob S

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Both of those commandments are in the Torah...in Deuteronomy and in Leviticus...so basically Yeshua was teaching Torah in the NT... :)
Shalom
And why wouldn't He? The new covenant was yet to be ratified. There is no law in all of the Sinai covenant that come close to the one Jesus taught us
Jn 15:9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. 10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love. 11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full. 12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. 13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. 14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
 
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And why wouldn't He? The new covenant was yet to be ratified. There is no law in all of the Sinai covenant that come close to the one Jesus taught us
Jn 15:9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. 10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love. 11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full. 12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you. 13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. 14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

So you think His commandments were different than His Father's??? A house divided can not stand...
 
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