When was hell created?

nolidad

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You speak well of the magnitude of what Jesus did......then you say it will only benefit a few.....and for the majority.....it would be as though nothing happened at all.... Think about that.
Then you say all Adam did was eat a fruit.....and that was enough to doom all humanity without their knowledge or consent.

If one were to believe Jesus has all power and His work was great......wouldnt your assertion give them a little pause....since it was not able to trump the effect of one who ate a fruit?
Was Adams disobedience more powerful than Jesus' obedience? even unto the death of the cross?


Adam brought in the age of hell.....the notion that we much all suffer this fake because of his action.
Jesus introduce us to the kingdom of heaven....and the notion that through Him.....we can enter this kingdom here and now.

Whose report are we to believe.? which idea is more important for us to focus on and believe? Which has more power?

YOu are wrong about Adam bringing in Hell.

Matthew 25:41
Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

RaymondG you need to understand that it doesn't matter a whit what we think or whether we believe something is fair or not, or right or not or just or not! All that matters is what God said! He gets to make the rules, as He is God!

Romans 9:19-22 King James Version (KJV)
19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?

20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?

22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:


The simple fact is if God let every person born go through that test- we would probably all fail! God is infinite- we are not. We have but a prion of information and we dare judge God?
 
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nolidad

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If one were to believe Jesus has all power and His work was great......wouldnt your assertion give them a little pause....since it was not able to trump the effect of one who ate a fruit?
Was Adams disobedience more powerful than Jesus' obedience? even unto the death of the cross?

God warned Adam of the consequences of disobedience- and he went ahead anyway and disobeyed! God was not boligated to save anyone!~ But His love caused HIm to offer man redemption!
 
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RaymondG

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If one just pooh-poohs away hell, they also diminish the cross and heaven! For the one who spoke of heaven and the cross also declared the reality of the lake of fire and hell/grave/hades. If He lied on one- why should we believe him on the rest? Personal feelings?
Maybe it isnt a case of the Master being wrong.....But our interpretation of His words being wrong. Are you one to believe that your interpretations are inerrant, and if they are proven false than it must be the speaker who is false, and not the interpreter?

How about it.....Do you need to hate thirst and hunger before you appreciate food and water? Do you need to believe that you can be homeless before you become grateful for roofs over your head? Much you focus on becoming deathly ill before enjoying and seeking the bliss of good health?
 
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RaymondG

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God warned Adam of the consequences of disobedience- and he went ahead anyway and disobeyed! God was not boligated to save anyone!~ But His love caused HIm to offer man redemption!
Thanks for your opinions......I find no fault in anything you believe. If you wish to argue man's wisdom, you must find another.
 
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nolidad

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Maybe it isnt a case of the Master being wrong.....But our interpretation of His words being wrong. Are you one to believe that your interpretations are inerrant, and if they are proven false than it must be the speaker who is false, and not the interpreter?

How about it.....Do you need to hate thirst and hunger before you appreciate food and water? Do you need to believe that you can be homeless before you become grateful for roofs over your head? Much you focus on becoming deathly ill before enjoying and seeking the bliss of good health?

Well if you think my understanding is wrong- I am open to be corrected if it is a better scriptual argument! Jesus did not speak in mystical codes so that only the adept are avble to understand. He spoke in plain language (except when he was hiding th ekingdom after Israel committed the unpardonable sin)

His talk of the cross, is clear, of heaven is clear, of salvation is clear. If you think His talk of the lake of fire is grossly misunderstood- then show why.
 
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RaymondG

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Well if you think my understanding is wrong- I am open to be corrected if it is a better scriptual argument! Jesus did not speak in mystical codes so that only the adept are avble to understand. He spoke in plain language (except when he was hiding th ekingdom after Israel committed the unpardonable sin)

His talk of the cross, is clear, of heaven is clear, of salvation is clear. If you think His talk of the lake of fire is grossly misunderstood- then show why.
You understand now, what you are able to understand now. When you are ready to understand more, you will. Only God knows what each of us is able to bear....
We must first give up the idea that we can gain wisdom through our own study before we can receive revelation from God.

I find no fault in any you say or believe.
 
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The Righterzpen

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Why do you think the angel in Revelation 5 looked -under the earth-to try to
find someone to open the sealed book with seven seals?
in heaven - under the earth - and other locations

First off; let's take a close look at the first few verses of Revelation 5, because the passage does not actually say that this angel is "looking" under the earth.

Verse 1:
Let's start with the first verse of Revelation 5. We have a figure sitting on a throne with a scroll in His hand. This is a pictorial description of God the Father. This scroll is written on the front and back and is sealed with 7 seals.

Now what is this scroll? We know when it's opened; all these things happen. Now if we go back and look through the Bible at what types of documents were sealed by people of authority; we see they all carry legal implications. A bill of divorcement. A decree from a king that people should do A, B or C. Prophets are sealed. People are sealed. Books are stated by prophets to be sealed because: "I can't interpret it for you, I don't understand what that means, because it is sealed."

So, who opens the seals so that the legal document can be read, understood and enacted upon? Later on in Revelation; obviously we have this "lamb that was slain" that opens the seals.

Verse 2:
Now here's where it gets interesting. We have an "angel" that is "strong". "Angel" in the Scripture is also translated "messenger". That messenger can be a human messenger, a Divine messenger, an other than human entity bringing a message, a false messenger / prophet, a demonic entity or even Satan himself.

This "angel" is said to be "strong". That word "strong" is primarily used in the context of combat. This is an accusative / combative "angel". This "angel" "proclaims" (declares / preaches) in a "voice" (tone) "loud" (of the greatest "band with"). "Who is worthy (weighted - as in to balance out a scale) to open (read with correct interpretation) the scroll and to break (loose, unleash) the seals?"

Now keep in mind this "scroll" the Father is holding is a legal document. Who by this law, has countered the weight of it; that He is able to cause to come to pass all that is written in this book; (also enabling men now possessed by the Holy Ghost to understand it)? This "scroll" is the Law and all it encompasses both in written Scripture, as well as what is naturally revealed to man in the creation.

This brings us back to the question of what did the atonement actually accomplish? We know the lamb that breaks the seals is Christ. The atonement that paid for sin and fulfilled the law is actually what makes the law active upon men; either to redeem them (through atonement) or to condemn them for their disobedience.

Now the book of Job is filled with some interesting verses about "seals".
The stars are "sealed".
My transgressions are "sealed" up on a bag.
Instruction is "sealed" upon the ears of man.
God "seals" up the hand of every man that all men may know His work.
The earth is turned to clay "as a seal" in the day that the wicked are shaken out of it.
Leviathan's scales are his pride "shut up together with a close seal".

Leviathan is Satan.
This "angel" in Revelation 5:2 is Satan.

Verse 3:
Note the "angel" is not actually looking for someone "in", "on" or "under" the earth to open the seal. He's declaring the question: "Who is weighted in this balance? to correctly interpret and set in motion what's written in this book?"

And "no one" (nothing) was able "in" (from out of) heaven, "upon" (in regards to / against / on the basis of) the "earth" (the arena we live in that operates in space and time with the intent to prepare us for eternity) nor "under" (that which is subject to authority) the earth. This Greek word "under" is most commonly used to describe enemies "under" Christ's feet.

Now what does this mean?

Nothing coming out of heaven (both created and including God Himself in His eternal form) could open the seals, because what the book contains is relevant to the the creation, not the creator. This is the distinct reason for the incarnation. This is why the 2nd person of the Godhead became a human being. Because the scroll pertained to the creation; God could not open it unless He became part of the creation.

Nothing in the earth could open the seals because none of the created realm possessed the wisdom and power of the Divine in order to make known and cause to come to pass what is written in the scroll.

Nothing under the earth could open the seals because even as being subject to law; no created entity on account of their temporal nature, could attain to the balance God had set. This is reason #2 for the necessity of the incarnation.

Stitching the verses together:
Now let's jump back a minute to what the atonement actually accomplished. As stated earlier: The atonement that paid for sin and fulfilled the law is actually what makes the law active upon men; either to redeem them (through atonement) or to condemn them for their disobedience.

If God had never created a redemption plan; the only outcome possible for any thing He'd create, would have been its indiscriminate destruction, based on its inherent corruptibility. (That would have been the waste of a good creation.)

The creation was inherently corruptible because of the temporal nature of it being created. Creation bearing a certain reflection of its Creator, can only be corrupted by the knowledge of good and evil, because it does not bear the attributes of God that prevent God from being corrupted by that knowledge. (Being omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, immortal and having no beginning and no end.) These attributes make God incorruptible; but due to lack of them, incorruptibility does not apply to anything God creates.

Conclusion:
These verses have far broader application than the question of: Where is physical hell? Where is physical hell is actually of no spiritual value to us. It's actually a moot point. It doesn't matter.

As for these other verses you quoted? I'll go over those later.
 
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The Righterzpen

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When Samuel came back from the dead to speak with
Saul - the wicked lady said -gods were ascending out
of the earth.

There are multiple commands in Scripture against necromancy and not attempting to contact the dead. Had this woman actually gotten Samuel? That's a good question; because the soul one is attempting to contact is not who (or what) actually shows up. If the divide between the living and the dead is actually "opened" what is communicating with the seeker is demonic.

Now was this a special case that God actually allowed Samual to be sent? I suppose that is a possibility looking at the accuracy of the message that was given to Saul. The other possibility is that this woman was granted a vision and the messenger of that vision was Samuel. Samuel though as being someone who was atoned for; would have been in a different position judicially speaking than unredeemed souls in hell.

So here enters another factor in this puzzle of "contacting the dead"; Harry Houdini.

Now what does Harry Houdini have to do with Saul and this medium? Harry Houdini was a "spiritualist" and wanted so badly to contact his deceased mother. Being a magician though; Harry knew all the tricks. After interacting with several mediums; Harry posed a challenge to all mediums out there. He would have a séance with them and if he could not expose them as a fraud; he would give them a substantial amount of money. In the first few months of this challenge; he had lots of takers! After having exposed all that took him up on this though; the respondents dropped off significantly and Harry Houdini basically "won his own bet". After having very publicly done this; Harry Houdini pretty much was the death of the "mainstream" spiritus movement of his time.

Which this brings me to the point of why I brought up Harry Houdini. Is the divide between the natural and spiritual world being allowed by God to be breached today? In the times when the Bible was still being written; people saw visions and angels and what ever. But now that the cannon of Scripture is closed, God is no longer doing that; yet God not being a God of confusion, is He actually still allowing Satan to do that?

My assessment of the situation is that the answer to that question is a qualified "no". The Scripture does talk about "strong delusion that they should believe a lie" and "lying signs and wonders" in the last days. So this seems pretty clear to me that the lying signs and wonders are indeed not true, bonafide and legitimate supernatural events. These people are simply charlatans; just as Houdini aptly demonstrated.

Now this doesn't mean that Satan and demonic forces don't try. I've seen some interesting things caught on video that do not appear to me to be that the video was tampered with. And the people recording the video have no explanation for. These are live video footage of what appears to be partial manifestations of dark forms. In the paranormal investigative community; they are often called "shadow people". And to me; they seem to be some attempt of a demonic entity to manifest itself. And God closing the cannon of Scripture does make sense that an attempt from a demon to circumvent God's authority to "look like a human ghost" would not produce a fully visible manifestation.

So interesting dichotomy this passage about Saul and Samuel produces.

as to the verse about Jacob would go down in the grave -to
his son- as in still mourning and would not be comforted

Jacob going "down" to his grave (sheol) in mourning. Physically burying people "under ground" is a common practice; although ironically not particularly common to that culture. They generally entombed the dead, yet did not technically "bury" them as we do in the western world.

Sheol was considered / is the "holding place" of the dead. (Currently only the unregenerate dead; because once Christ ascended to heaven upon death; He took those He'd atoned for out of "hell" / "Abraham's bosom" and they ascended to the 3rd heaven (Paradise) with Him.

Where hell is physically can not be determined by looking at this material world. Hell can't be materially defined in our current course of time. It's not like we can get in a craft of some sort and "find hell". If we penetrated through the core of this planet; all we'd find is what is materially there; because we as material entities currently don't have access to the spiritual dimension of this universe.

as to when David's child died, because of murder and adultery
done by David

The verse in question is "I shall go unto him, but he shall not return again to me". Taking into consideration that David was a redeemed individual; that child having also been atoned for, David would see him again, but the child (in this life) would not return again unto David.

That is the only interpretation of that verse that makes sense looking at the entirety of Scripture. David did not "go visit this child in hell". That's just not possible.
 
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pasifika

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If it's an 'eternal fire', would that possibly suggest it is in fact eternal - without beginning or end?

If that's the case, it must be of the same essence as God Himself, for only God is eternal. And since Jesus is the a to z, and he is God's salvation, it must be the holy saving fire of God, His pre-existent abundant nature of grace and mercy.
Hello, yes good point...in the verse i quoted Matthew 25:41 state that the 'eternal fire' was 'prepared', so obviously someone (God) prepared it for a purpose so it must have a beginning...in the same verse it says that it was prepared for the devil and his angels...and we know that was no devil before God created the heavens and the earth so I don't think there was eternal fire prepared since there was no evil in the beginning...
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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you have shown me the veracity and meaning of put all trust in the Most High God only.
Good - this is Yahuweh's Doing if it is Accomplished.... (still to be seen)
You had better hope the dogma you stand on will save you.
oops. Such a sudden change.. I don't stand on any dogma. Trust Abba Yahuweh. He Alone is Faithful and True. Men are notoriously corrupt, as you noted also in your post, yes.
You did precisely what people accuse all of us of doing - just saying people are wrong, and hoping that will substantiate things.
No. I don't expect 'substantiation' to be so easy. Like others posting in controversial because their topic/ subject/ interest is heresy, they cannot be "convinced" of what is right, unless they turn to trust in the Most HIgh God Only, which they have consistently refused to do so far as we have seen on the forum -
the "substantiation" , as you call it, will be little by little for those seeking the truth, who keep seeking the truth.

So much was in error in the post(s), I could not hope to "substantiate" anything for those is so deep errors - it is way too much out of line with Scripture to try to tackle in one thread. (mostly, perhaps most important, as Jesus lamented even over Jerusalem, is the lack of wanting to know God and the Truth as He Says; or lack of willingness to obey Him and Him Only (Jesus: "I would have gathered you under my wings and <saved><cared for> and nurtured you/your children/ , but ye would not")
Piece by piece, perhaps, Yahuweh Willing....

It would take years to explain that irony to you, because I know how and who you are. That is why I am conceding, and ending our exchanges.
Explain? No need.
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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Adam had the power to affect everyone without their knowledge or consent. And the cross/Christ requires knowledge and consent to affect anyone.....else it would have no affect at all...
RE "without their knowledge or consent" ....


I know about Adam and what he did, as written / revealed by Yahuweh.

Yahuweh has my consent - I believe all He Accomplished in His Plan and Purpose is best for me and for everyone who loves Him and is called according to His Purpose.

Even though many people do not have knowledge of Christ Crucified, nor do most people consent to it,
the affects of Christ Crucified are still eternal for all who are called who receive eternal life in Him -
the many multitudes in church and out of church who do not consent nor believe what happened
in no way diminishes the power of the cross to save according to all God's Word.
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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There are no oops. You already have the truth....so you are supposed to dismiss anything that sounds contrary to it. My words are not for you.
Apparently your words are not good for anyone; that's why others who know the truth keep replying, responding or are hoping to correct the errors or prevent others from being harmed.
 
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RaymondG

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RE "without their knowledge or consent" ....


I know about Adam and what he did, as written / revealed by Yahuweh.

Yahuweh has my consent - I believe all He Accomplished in His Plan and Purpose is best for me and for everyone who loves Him and is called according to His Purpose.

Even though many people do not have knowledge of Christ Crucified, nor do most people consent to it,
the affects of Christ Crucified are still eternal for all who are called who receive eternal life in Him -
the many multitudes in church and out of church who do not consent nor believe what happened
in no way diminishes the power of the cross to save according to all God's Word.
Oops, when, after dancing around with words, one is discovered to be better suited as a student than a teacher.....we always have the famous phrases to fall back on: "The lord knows best" " His ways are higher than ours" "Who are we to question...."

Your interpretations simply do not add up....no matter how holy they may sound.

One cannot say an act that has no effect on you....is more powerful than an act that effects you regardless of what you believe, or any knowledge you have.

It is possible we disagree because we do not serve the same One. And I am ok with you believing that I am the one who serves the wrong one.......For this is what you are supposed to believe.
 
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The Righterzpen

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You speak well of the magnitude of what Jesus did......then you say it will only benefit a few.....and for the majority.....it would be as though nothing happened at all.... Think about that.

Matthew 7:
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Yeah, well as it appears that for the majority, it is as if nothing happened!

The atonement means a lot to me because I know I'm in the minority. There is absolutely no reason why God should redeem me. Why I should understand this stuff and other people don't?

I don't understand that. I believe it; but I don't understand it!

Then you say all Adam did was eat a fruit.....and that was enough to doom all humanity without their knowledge or consent.

Do you believe you would have taken a different course of action if you had traded places with Adam? Do you believe you were holier or more perfect than Adam?

If one were to believe Jesus has all power and His work was great......wouldnt your assertion give them a little pause....since it was not able to trump the effect of one who ate a fruit?

Reality of the matter is that Adam ate the fruit and look at the consequence. If God had created an incorruptible world; (and maybe in some other dimension He has) your argument would be a moot point, because there'd be no need for atonement.

Yet, that is not the reality we are dealing with here; is it?

Was Adams disobedience more powerful than Jesus' obedience? even unto the death of the cross?

Not sure what your point is here, seeing how again, obviously we are not living in a reality where Adam didn't disobey. Atonement opened the door for sinners to be redeemed from the just wrath of God. Is that more powerful to those who are redeemed than to leave all humanity to our rightful and deserved destruction? (That's a rhetorical question.)

Adam brought in the age of hell.....the notion that we much all suffer this fake because of his action.
Jesus introduce us to the kingdom of heaven....and the notion that through Him.....we can enter this kingdom here and now.

Do you really believe you are above Adam that you would not have made such a choice? And if that's the case; then why would you need to enter the kingdom through Christ?

The the Jew (those who think they have enough righteousness to obtain salvation themselves) preaching the cross is a stumbling block. To the Greek (those who believe all this life is all there is; so "Eat drink and be merry for tomorrow we die." it is foolishness.

Whose report are we to believe.? which idea is more important for us to focus on and believe? Which has more power?

Adam's transgression or Christ's atonement? Since both are true; your consideration of both would be prudent.

Maybe it isnt a case of the Master being wrong.....But our interpretation of His words being wrong. Are you one to believe that your interpretations are inerrant, and if they are proven false than it must be the speaker who is false, and not the interpreter?

Was this intended to be addressed to me? I have not said anything that contradicts Scripture.

How about it.....Do you need to hate thirst and hunger before you appreciate food and water? Do you need to believe that you can be homeless before you become grateful for roofs over your head? Much you focus on becoming deathly ill before enjoying and seeking the bliss of good health?

How can one adequately desire atonement if they don't believe they've sinned? Are you under full conviction that you are worthy of God's wrath?

Thanks for your opinions......I find no fault in anything you believe. If you wish to argue man's wisdom, you must find another.

??? If you find no fault in (whom ever it is you are addressing this to) believes; how is it that they would be arguing men's wisdom? "Let God be true and every man a liar." If there is nothing theologically faulty; how is that "men's wisdom"?

You understand now, what you are able to understand now. When you are ready to understand more, you will. Only God knows what each of us is able to bear....
We must first give up the idea that we can gain wisdom through our own study before we can receive revelation from God.

We receive revelation through studying. "Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God". Ultimately the "Word of God" who brings that hearing is Christ Himself.

Now no one will gain wisdom from simply applying their own interpretation to the Scripture. The Scripture actually tells us how to study it. "Line upon line, precept upon precept". "Comparing Scripture with Scripture". The Bereans were more noble than those in Thessolinica because they searched the Scriptures to see if these things were so.

Today, we have a huge advantage over any generation prior. What used to take decades and even lifetimes for previous generations to compile in concordances and dictionaries; we can access with a decent computer program in less than 5 minutes. We have no reason to not know the Scripture better than we do.

I find no fault in any you say or believe.

If you find no fault with one's theology, than why be offended?
 
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Kaon

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Good - this is Yahuweh's Doing if it is Accomplished.... (still to be seen)

oops. Such a sudden change.. I don't stand on any dogma. Trust Abba Yahuweh. He Alone is Faithful and True. Men are notoriously corrupt, as you noted also in your post, yes.

No. I don't expect 'substantiation' to be so easy. Like others posting in controversial because their topic/ subject/ interest is heresy, they cannot be "convinced" of what is right, unless they turn to trust in the Most HIgh God Only, which they have consistently refused to do so far as we have seen on the forum -
the "substantiation" , as you call it, will be little by little for those seeking the truth, who keep seeking the truth.

So much was in error in the post(s), I could not hope to "substantiate" anything for those is so deep errors - it is way too much out of line with Scripture to try to tackle in one thread. (mostly, perhaps most important, as Jesus lamented even over Jerusalem, is the lack of wanting to know God and the Truth as He Says; or lack of willingness to obey Him and Him Only (Jesus: "I would have gathered you under my wings and <saved><cared for> and nurtured you/your children/ , but ye would not")
Piece by piece, perhaps, Yahuweh Willing....


Explain? No need.

Ok.
 
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GenemZ

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If we have enough knowledge and understanding as to why hell was created in the first place? Then, you will know when it was created.

Angels fell first.

In order to appeal their case Satan desired to present evidence in court to vindicate their choice.

God set up the guidelines.

The following guidelines can be deducted from Scripture:
Those who rebelled had to submit to the Lord's supreme court standards.


A. They must remain invisible when influencing men.

B. They must ask permission before embarking upon doing what they want to do.

We see the "asking for permission" in the case of Satan going after Job. And, with the demons cast out of Legion who were craving to enter a herd of pigs. Both times they could not do what they wanted to do without first getting permission from the Lord.

Apparently, at the fall of Lucifer and his angels some of the fallen angels were unthinking brutes and barbarians by nature. These were unwilling to follow the mandates. They are the typical mindless,violent, mob rioting types. Therefore, they could not be a part of the appeal case as mandated by God on earth.

So, for them God created the Abyss. Its located in the place we now call Hell (or Hades). Its under the earth.

The Abyss is not to be confused with the Chains of Darkness we read about. That location is used to lock up the angels who later rebelled just before Noah's flood. These angels rebelled against God. These ones left their positions of authority and forcefully took human women to have sex with. And, procreated, producing hybrid offspring to be destroyed in Noah's flood. These angels are now in their own special prison different from the knuckle dragging demons to be found in the Abyss.



grace and peace...
 
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The Righterzpen

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I see you've written a lot, so let's deal first with this part. David was not referring
to the time of the resurrection, or that would mean that his son did return.
the son can't return - David would go to him
They would both then await the time when Jesus Christ redeemed the souls
out of the righteous part of hell.

As for Samuel, what I find interesting is that it didn't surprise Saul as to what
was seen -came up out of -ascended out of the earth.
There is another verse in the OT as to speaking out of the ground -like a familiar
spirit.

I'm only trying to prove that hell is inside of the earth. The bottomless pit is opened
after the star is on the earth.
The abyss was where the devils didn't want to be cast when Jesus Christ was here.
They were wondering if He was going to torment them early?
/before the time
torment us
Another time, Jesus Christ was asked by a devil if He had come to destroy us.
To me, this shows destroy and torment are the same thing. All the devils
should know that they will be tormented, so none of them will just be destroyed
right away.

The devils didn't ask if they were going to carried away far out into the universe, nor
did it seem odd that Samuel referred to have been caused to be brought up.

evil angels - in darkness - awaiting the day of judgment
were cast down -to hell

Samuel said that he was - brought up.

The bottomless pit is in the location of earth and smoke arises when it is opened.

If the rich man was in some far off galaxy in torment, then why would he
think that Lazarus could so easily return to warn his five brothers to repent, so
they didn't end up there? I'm not sure if he wanted Lazarus to go back inside of
his body that had sores, or just his soul return to warn his brothers to repent.

if one went to them -from the dead
though one rose from the dead


This is odd if it was an actual resurrection as to the body that was being required
for this return, as when Lazarus arose -many believed. With the resurrection of
Lazarus -the friend of Jesus Christ, a stone had to be moved first so he could
get out of the tomb.

Jacob, when still thinking Joseph had been eaten by an animal, spoke of mourning
and going to his son.

Revelation 20 shows that death and hell delivered -up -the dead which were in
them.

Why do you think the angel in Revelation 5 looked under the earth for someone
to open the sealed book?

Did you even read what I wrote? You are simply repeating much of what you already said.
 
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