Searching for the right church

Carl Emerson · Oct 8, 2019

A Gerbil said:
One of the churches I attended told me I hadn't been imbued with the Holy Spirit because I didn't speak in tongues. However when I heard people at the church 'speaking in tongues' it just sounded like gibberish, and not genuine languages, apparently that's to so demons can't interpret what is being said?!

Rather Bizarre...

The Holy Spirit is the third person of the trinity and the first sign of His being resident in you is His peace which passes all understanding.

All the best for your quest to find the right fellowship.

GingerBeer · Oct 8, 2019

A Gerbil said:
Methodist, Church of Scotland, Anglican, Quakers, three independent churches*, Russian Orthodox, Baptist, Unitarian, The Salvation Army, Gospel Church and even the Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses

It is said by some that the elephant in the room is missed and in your list it looks like you're missing the largest single christian church. Why did you not visit a Catholic church?

NeedyFollower · Oct 8, 2019

A Gerbil said:
I got baptised over three years ago in a church which was adequate, but I stopped attending for personal reasons. I have investigated, and in some cases visited, numerous churches since then - Methodist, Church of Scotland, Anglican, Quakers, three independent churches*, Russian Orthodox, Baptist, Unitarian, The Salvation Army, Gospel Church and even the Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses - yet I have not found a single one in which I felt wholly comfortable.

It may be that I am overly fussy, and it's certainly true that in every single congregation I met some lovely, genuine people and often enjoyed the services. I am sure people reading this forum belong to some of those churches, so I will not single any of them out for particular criticism. It amazes me just how diverse the Christian faith is!

I have felt my faith wax and wane over the last two years, and even even chatted with a Jew (online) and a few Muslims, as well as attending a Buddhist temple, however I am utterly convinced that Jesus is the Son of God and that He was God in human form. It struck me, incidentally, how incredibly similar Islam and Judaism are, and it was suggested to me by followers of the other two Abrahamic religions that Christians are polytheistic (because of the Trinity) and guilty of idolatry.

What was it I didn't like about the churches I attended?

- Many were overtly political. I believe that politics has no place in church at all. Whilst society is becoming ever more fractured along political lines - especially here in Scotland where there is the question of independence, EU membership, government austerity, etc - I don't want to hear this in church when I go to worship. Of course help the needy, have food banks, but I don't believe a sermon should ever be used to promote one's political views.

- One of the churches was genuinely polytheistic it would seem, and one no longer seems to be a Christian faith. So that I do not offend anybody, I will not elaborate upon this but will suggest that if you research all of the churches I have mentioned you will see this for yourself.

- One of the churches preached the 'Prosperity Gospel' and requested money at every opportunity, claiming that to reap a (financial) harvest one first needs to sow.

- Some of the churches have dispensed with Christian teachings in order to conform to modern standards.

- Some I just felt didn't appeal to my style of worship - sometimes it was too loud and modern, sometimes it was very antiquated with medieval chanting, incense or a bit bizarre.

There are literally thousands of denominations, so there must be one for me. My beliefs are actually very simple:

1) I believe in God the Father who was personified on this earth as Jesus Christ, His Son. I cannot say I am one hundred percent convinced of the third being, the Holy Spirit, and therefore I am genuinely unsure whether I am Binitarian or Tinitarian. That may exclude me from a number of churches - though I am prepared to be convinced.

2) I believe the Bible is the inspired word of God but that much of it is metaphorical, though obviously much of it is literal.

3) I believe in the teachings of Christ abrogates any conflicting teachings from the Old Testament - which I'd argue should be the case with anybody who calls themselves a Christian.

4) I believe that Jesus Christ sacrificed Himself to atone for the sins of man, and that we are all sinners.

5) I believe that ultimately God is merciful, as shown by the fact He was willing to sacrifice His son (and in effect Himself) for us.

6) I believe that God does not want Christians to pursue money, status and power. I believe that God demonstrated that the ego is the cause of much sin, and that we are to be humble and to serve Him and one another. For example, Jesus was born in a stable, the 'son' of a carpenter, washed His disciples' feet - including Judas' - and suffered an agonising and humiliating death.

Like all people I am flawed and still learning. However I cannot just accept what I am told. Mathew 7:7.

To anybody still reading, thank you and may God bless you!

I believe faith is a journey and the comfortable and familiar can be a snare to growth . You remember the scripture which says without faith it is impossible to please God for you must believe that He is and He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him . So keep seeking . Of course the Holy Spirit is the spirit of truth so continue to do truth though it may be like Abrahams journey ...God told him to go but did not show him ahead of time . I look forward to seeing you on that day when we shall all be one .

PROPHECYKID · Oct 8, 2019

A Gerbil said:
I got baptised over three years ago in a church which was adequate, but I stopped attending for personal reasons. I have investigated, and in some cases visited, numerous churches since then - Methodist, Church of Scotland, Anglican, Quakers, three independent churches*, Russian Orthodox, Baptist, Unitarian, The Salvation Army, Gospel Church and even the Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses - yet I have not found a single one in which I felt wholly comfortable.

It may be that I am overly fussy, and it's certainly true that in every single congregation I met some lovely, genuine people and often enjoyed the services. I am sure people reading this forum belong to some of those churches, so I will not single any of them out for particular criticism. It amazes me just how diverse the Christian faith is!

I have felt my faith wax and wane over the last two years, and even even chatted with a Jew (online) and a few Muslims, as well as attending a Buddhist temple, however I am utterly convinced that Jesus is the Son of God and that He was God in human form. It struck me, incidentally, how incredibly similar Islam and Judaism are, and it was suggested to me by followers of the other two Abrahamic religions that Christians are polytheistic (because of the Trinity) and guilty of idolatry.

What was it I didn't like about the churches I attended?

- Many were overtly political. I believe that politics has no place in church at all. Whilst society is becoming ever more fractured along political lines - especially here in Scotland where there is the question of independence, EU membership, government austerity, etc - I don't want to hear this in church when I go to worship. Of course help the needy, have food banks, but I don't believe a sermon should ever be used to promote one's political views.

- One of the churches was genuinely polytheistic it would seem, and one no longer seems to be a Christian faith. So that I do not offend anybody, I will not elaborate upon this but will suggest that if you research all of the churches I have mentioned you will see this for yourself.

- One of the churches preached the 'Prosperity Gospel' and requested money at every opportunity, claiming that to reap a (financial) harvest one first needs to sow.

- Some of the churches have dispensed with Christian teachings in order to conform to modern standards.

- Some I just felt didn't appeal to my style of worship - sometimes it was too loud and modern, sometimes it was very antiquated with medieval chanting, incense or a bit bizarre.

There are literally thousands of denominations, so there must be one for me. My beliefs are actually very simple:

1) I believe in God the Father who was personified on this earth as Jesus Christ, His Son. I cannot say I am one hundred percent convinced of the third being, the Holy Spirit, and therefore I am genuinely unsure whether I am Binitarian or Tinitarian. That may exclude me from a number of churches - though I am prepared to be convinced.

2) I believe the Bible is the inspired word of God but that much of it is metaphorical, though obviously much of it is literal.

3) I believe in the teachings of Christ abrogates any conflicting teachings from the Old Testament - which I'd argue should be the case with anybody who calls themselves a Christian.

4) I believe that Jesus Christ sacrificed Himself to atone for the sins of man, and that we are all sinners.

5) I believe that ultimately God is merciful, as shown by the fact He was willing to sacrifice His son (and in effect Himself) for us.

6) I believe that God does not want Christians to pursue money, status and power. I believe that God demonstrated that the ego is the cause of much sin, and that we are to be humble and to serve Him and one another. For example, Jesus was born in a stable, the 'son' of a carpenter, washed His disciples' feet - including Judas' - and suffered an agonising and humiliating death.

Like all people I am flawed and still learning. However I cannot just accept what I am told. Mathew 7:7.

To anybody still reading, thank you and may God bless you!

Since you are looking into churches you should visit a local Seventh Day Adventist Church one day or maybe just check out a service online or a sermon from one of the prominent pastors like David Asscherick, Doug Bachelor, Steven Bohr or Walter Veith.

A Gerbil · Oct 8, 2019

Carl Emerson said:
Rather Bizarre...

The Holy Spirit is the third person of the trinity and the first sign of His being resident in you is His peace which passes all understanding.

All the best for your quest to find the right fellowship.

Thank you for your replies today. God bless you.

GingerBeer said:
It is said by some that the elephant in the room is missed and in your list it looks like you're missing the largest single christian church. Why did you not visit a Catholic church?

I replied to somebody else concerning this earlier in this thread:

'I am ashamed to admit that some of that is down to the sectarian nature of the city in which I live and my protestant background. However, I obviously would not let anything stand in the way of me joining 'the true church', were I to accept that is the case.

I suppose my problem with the Catholic church stem partly from historic acts done in its name - e.g. the treatment of the Cathars, and partly due to the fact that I believe it is unnecessary to have a mediator between myself and God, therefore there is no need for confession. Despite having friends in the Orange Order, I don't particularly dislike the Catholic Church however.'

I stand by that. However thank you for taking the trouble to read my post and for replying, it is greatly appreciated. God bless you.

NeedyFollower said:
I believe faith is a journey and the comfortable and familiar can be a snare to growth . You remember the scripture which says without faith it is impossible to please God for you must believe that He is and He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him . So keep seeking . Of course the Holy Spirit is the spirit of truth so continue to do truth though it may be like Abrahams journey ...God told him to go but did not show him ahead of time . I look forward to seeing you on that day when we shall all be one .

Absolutely. I will seek Him and I'm confident He will answer me. God bless.

PROPHECYKID said:
Since you are looking into churches you should visit a local Seventh Day Adventist Church one day or maybe just check out a service online or a sermon from one of the prominent pastors like David Asscherick, Doug Bachelor, Steven Bohr or Walter Veith.

You are the second person to mention the Seventh Day Adventists in this thread. I have been reading about them today, and have even posted a thread relating to their diet.

dqhall · Oct 8, 2019

A Gerbil said:
You are the second person to mention the Seventh Day Adventists in this thread. I have been reading about them today, and have even posted a thread relating to their diet.

It is possible to learn a healthy vegan or vegetarian diet without attending Seventh Day Adventist Sabbath services. There are numerous books and articles about plant based diets. An SDA community in Loma Linda, CA has more centenarians than anywhere else in the USA. I left an SDA congregation after it seemed like they wanted to study Daniel and Revelation most of the time. That was over 30 yrs ago.

GingerBeer · Oct 8, 2019

A Gerbil said:
I believe it is unnecessary to have a mediator between myself and God

Who is this mediator?

Aussie Pete · Oct 8, 2019

A Gerbil said:
I got baptised over three years ago in a church which was adequate, but I stopped attending for personal reasons. I have investigated, and in some cases visited, numerous churches since then - Methodist, Church of Scotland, Anglican, Quakers, three independent churches*, Russian Orthodox, Baptist, Unitarian, The Salvation Army, Gospel Church and even the Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses - yet I have not found a single one in which I felt wholly comfortable.

It may be that I am overly fussy, and it's certainly true that in every single congregation I met some lovely, genuine people and often enjoyed the services. I am sure people reading this forum belong to some of those churches, so I will not single any of them out for particular criticism. It amazes me just how diverse the Christian faith is!

I have felt my faith wax and wane over the last two years, and even even chatted with a Jew (online) and a few Muslims, as well as attending a Buddhist temple, however I am utterly convinced that Jesus is the Son of God and that He was God in human form. It struck me, incidentally, how incredibly similar Islam and Judaism are, and it was suggested to me by followers of the other two Abrahamic religions that Christians are polytheistic (because of the Trinity) and guilty of idolatry.

What was it I didn't like about the churches I attended?

- Many were overtly political. I believe that politics has no place in church at all. Whilst society is becoming ever more fractured along political lines - especially here in Scotland where there is the question of independence, EU membership, government austerity, etc - I don't want to hear this in church when I go to worship. Of course help the needy, have food banks, but I don't believe a sermon should ever be used to promote one's political views.

- One of the churches was genuinely polytheistic it would seem, and one no longer seems to be a Christian faith. So that I do not offend anybody, I will not elaborate upon this but will suggest that if you research all of the churches I have mentioned you will see this for yourself.

- One of the churches preached the 'Prosperity Gospel' and requested money at every opportunity, claiming that to reap a (financial) harvest one first needs to sow.

- Some of the churches have dispensed with Christian teachings in order to conform to modern standards.

- Some I just felt didn't appeal to my style of worship - sometimes it was too loud and modern, sometimes it was very antiquated with medieval chanting, incense or a bit bizarre.

There are literally thousands of denominations, so there must be one for me. My beliefs are actually very simple:

1) I believe in God the Father who was personified on this earth as Jesus Christ, His Son. I cannot say I am one hundred percent convinced of the third being, the Holy Spirit, and therefore I am genuinely unsure whether I am Binitarian or Tinitarian. That may exclude me from a number of churches - though I am prepared to be convinced.

2) I believe the Bible is the inspired word of God but that much of it is metaphorical, though obviously much of it is literal.

3) I believe in the teachings of Christ abrogates any conflicting teachings from the Old Testament - which I'd argue should be the case with anybody who calls themselves a Christian.

4) I believe that Jesus Christ sacrificed Himself to atone for the sins of man, and that we are all sinners.

5) I believe that ultimately God is merciful, as shown by the fact He was willing to sacrifice His son (and in effect Himself) for us.

6) I believe that God does not want Christians to pursue money, status and power. I believe that God demonstrated that the ego is the cause of much sin, and that we are to be humble and to serve Him and one another. For example, Jesus was born in a stable, the 'son' of a carpenter, washed His disciples' feet - including Judas' - and suffered an agonising and humiliating death.

Like all people I am flawed and still learning. However I cannot just accept what I am told. Mathew 7:7.

To anybody still reading, thank you and may God bless you!

Welcome to the last days Christian dilemma. What calls itself "church" these days bears only a passing resemblance to the New Testament pattern laid out for us. Denominations are, by definition, carnal. I did not say that, Paul did.

You will find people who are as conflicted as you are. The minimum number to constitute a church is two. I meet daily with another believer that I've known for about 35 years. From time to time, we visit a denominational fellowship, usually Baptist. As you know, it is the people who make the church, not the label.

The missing ingredient in most Christians is "Life". All who are born again have this Life. It is not what we were born with. It is the Life that is the nature of Christ Himself. Most Christians never come to the realisation that Christ actually lives within. He is well able to produce every spiritual fruit that we need, without our help and in spite of all that we are or are not. Seek out people who know Christ as "The Life" and stay close to them. There are some Christians who are unassuming, gentle, wise, unselfish and care for others. I call them the "Shining Ones". Am I one? Yes - not by my own assessment but by what others have said.

When I was a new Christian, I went to every conference and youth camp that I could. I saw that some speakers were different, but I did not know why. I wanted to be like them, and that was my prayer. It took a long time and much tribulation, but one day God opened my eyes. Lord Jesus is my life. He is my everything and my all. It's easy to sing the songs and quote the Bible. Coming to the knowledge of this truth was hard for me. Ask the Lord to show you what I mean. It is the difference between a life of trying to do the best you can (never good enough) and knowing the power of the resurrection as your power.

GingerBeer · Oct 8, 2019

dqhall said:
they wanted to study Daniel and Revelation most of the time

The third word in their name, "Adventist", explains why they study Daniel & Revelation a lot. For them those books present a way to calculate the date for the return of Christ. But "return" is one of those words that means one thing to me and a different thing to Seventh Day Adventists. Their theology has a kind of "return" that is invisible. There's also a "judgement" that is invisible happening in the holy of holies inside a heavenly temple.It too is related to Daniel & Revelation and the calculations derived from numbers mentioned in those books; numbers like 2,300, 1,260, and other numbers too. It is a characteristic of Adventism of every kind to calculate a year and possibly a month and day for the return of Christ.

Vicky gould · Oct 8, 2019

The church has been under spiritual attack for a few millennia. Some of the leaven has gotten and every Christian needs to be in church for the safety in numbers because the attacker is looking for those who are vulnerable. It’s my opinion and it and a dollar will get you a coffee. There is no church out there that isn’t screwy in some ways. You know what is important in your walk and I think you can find a church close to where you are in your walk. The preacher Charles Spurgeon had 700 men from his congregation on their knees praying for him while he preached. How many pastors would be thrilled with 7 praying for him as he preached. How much support does your pastor get through the week.?

bad sermons does he get prayer and the time he needs for the Holy Spirit to anointed his sermon. Of course prayer for the entire church is also needed. There are many things church’s can do known to those who are members. Doctrine for me is essential .
Not to be pessimistic but they have some studies out there that says 50% of people in the pews would leave their church but they are convinced there isn’t anything better out there. It isn’t easy but it can be so worth it. I am praying for the Lord to Shepherd you to where you are meant to be and to show you where and how you are to serve Him by serving where He has led you. God bless

Rescued One · Oct 9, 2019

I was a non-Trinitarian as a Mormon. I went to God for guidance. I told God that I didn't know Who He was, so I prayed to "the True God." God is Triune. You need to study your Bible and believe in the true God. These are some of my notes:

1. Deuteronomy 6: 4 — There is only one God, Jehovah.
2. Isaiah 43 : 10-11— He is the LORD and only Savior.
3. Isaiah 44 : 6 — He is the first and the last.
4. Revelation 1 : 8 — He is the Lord God Almighty, the Alpha and Omega.
5. Revelation 22 : 13, 16 — Jesus is the first and the last, the Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the End.
6. Revelation 1 : 17-18 — The one God who was the first and the last died and rose again!
7. Hebrews 1 : 1, 2, 8 — God the Father calls the Son, "God."
8. Acts 5 : 3-4 --Peter calls the Holy Spirit, "God."
9. John 6 : 27 --Jesus calls the Father, "God."

The Trinity Revealed in the Resurrection

1. Acts 10 : 39-40 — God raised Christ from the dead.
2. 1 Thessalonians 1 : 10 — God the Father raised the Son from the dead.
3. Romans 8 : 11 — God the Spirit raised the Son from the dead.
4. John 2 : 19-22 — God the Son raised Himself from the dead.

The Trinity Revealed in the Creation

1. The Father: Isaiah 64:8.
2. The Son: Colossians 1:15-17.
3. The Holy Spirit: Job 33:4.

The Father is a Person. We can have fellowship with him, 1 John 1:3; he knows, Matthew 6:6-8; he teaches, Matthew 16:17; he loves, John 16:27; he is a witness, John 8:18; he has a will, John 5:30.

The Son is a Person. We can have fellowship with him, 1 John 1:3; he knows, Matthew 11:27; he teaches, John 1:18, Rev. 2:18; he loves, Romans 8:35, Gal. 2:20; he is a witness, John 8:18; he has a will, John 5:30; he can be grieved, John 11:35.

The Holy Spirit is a Person. We can have fellowship with him, Philippians 2:1, II Cor. 13:14; he knows, I Cor. 2:11; he teaches, Luke 12:12, I Cor. 2:13; he loves, Romans 15:30; he is a witness, Acts 20:23, Romans 8:16; he has a will, I Cor. 12:11; he can be grieved, Ephesians 4:30.

The Father sent the Son. The Father and Son sent the Spirit. They are NOT three gods as Mormons claim.

Please decide to read your Bible. Then you can read the statements of faith of different churches and be able to make an educated choice.

Proverbs 3
5 Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
6 In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.

God bless you as you learn His will.

Glorytothefather2245 · Oct 9, 2019

A Gerbil said:
I got baptised over three years ago in a church which was adequate, but I stopped attending for personal reasons. I have investigated, and in some cases visited, numerous churches since then - Methodist, Church of Scotland, Anglican, Quakers, three independent churches*, Russian Orthodox, Baptist, Unitarian, The Salvation Army, Gospel Church and even the Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses - yet I have not found a single one in which I felt wholly comfortable.

It may be that I am overly fussy, and it's certainly true that in every single congregation I met some lovely, genuine people and often enjoyed the services. I am sure people reading this forum belong to some of those churches, so I will not single any of them out for particular criticism. It amazes me just how diverse the Christian faith is!

I have felt my faith wax and wane over the last two years, and even even chatted with a Jew (online) and a few Muslims, as well as attending a Buddhist temple, however I am utterly convinced that Jesus is the Son of God and that He was God in human form. It struck me, incidentally, how incredibly similar Islam and Judaism are, and it was suggested to me by followers of the other two Abrahamic religions that Christians are polytheistic (because of the Trinity) and guilty of idolatry.

What was it I didn't like about the churches I attended?

- Many were overtly political. I believe that politics has no place in church at all. Whilst society is becoming ever more fractured along political lines - especially here in Scotland where there is the question of independence, EU membership, government austerity, etc - I don't want to hear this in church when I go to worship. Of course help the needy, have food banks, but I don't believe a sermon should ever be used to promote one's political views.

- One of the churches was genuinely polytheistic it would seem, and one no longer seems to be a Christian faith. So that I do not offend anybody, I will not elaborate upon this but will suggest that if you research all of the churches I have mentioned you will see this for yourself.

- One of the churches preached the 'Prosperity Gospel' and requested money at every opportunity, claiming that to reap a (financial) harvest one first needs to sow.

- Some of the churches have dispensed with Christian teachings in order to conform to modern standards.

- Some I just felt didn't appeal to my style of worship - sometimes it was too loud and modern, sometimes it was very antiquated with medieval chanting, incense or a bit bizarre.

There are literally thousands of denominations, so there must be one for me. My beliefs are actually very simple:

1) I believe in God the Father who was personified on this earth as Jesus Christ, His Son. I cannot say I am one hundred percent convinced of the third being, the Holy Spirit, and therefore I am genuinely unsure whether I am Binitarian or Tinitarian. That may exclude me from a number of churches - though I am prepared to be convinced.

2) I believe the Bible is the inspired word of God but that much of it is metaphorical, though obviously much of it is literal.

3) I believe in the teachings of Christ abrogates any conflicting teachings from the Old Testament - which I'd argue should be the case with anybody who calls themselves a Christian.

4) I believe that Jesus Christ sacrificed Himself to atone for the sins of man, and that we are all sinners.

5) I believe that ultimately God is merciful, as shown by the fact He was willing to sacrifice His son (and in effect Himself) for us.

6) I believe that God does not want Christians to pursue money, status and power. I believe that God demonstrated that the ego is the cause of much sin, and that we are to be humble and to serve Him and one another. For example, Jesus was born in a stable, the 'son' of a carpenter, washed His disciples' feet - including Judas' - and suffered an agonising and humiliating death.

Like all people I am flawed and still learning. However I cannot just accept what I am told. Mathew 7:7.

To anybody still reading, thank you and may God bless you!

The right church is the one that keeps all the commandents of God. It would be the church that worships on Saturdays. God created the earth in 6 days and rested on the 7th. Jesus never changed the Sabbath to Sunday. Jesus said he came not to abolish the law but to fulfill it so the old laws are still in place. The Sabbath was changed to Sunday by man not God. Read your bible please it is important in these last days.

tturt · Oct 9, 2019

Think we should attend where God wants us. He lets us know.

A Gerbil · Oct 9, 2019

dqhall said:
It is possible to learn a healthy vegan or vegetarian diet without attending Seventh Day Adventist Sabbath services. There are numerous books and articles about plant based diets. An SDA community in Loma Linda, CA has more centenarians than anywhere else in the USA. I left an SDA congregation after it seemed like they wanted to study Daniel and Revelation most of the time. That was over 30 yrs ago.

Yes, absolutely - my earthly father, a sworn atheist, is a vegan. However vegetarian, and especially vegan, diets have only become fashionable recently. The fact that the SDA communities have been promoting them for so long implies that they are doing something right. Thanks for your reply.

GingerBeer said:
Who is this mediator?

The priest: The Priest: Mediator Between God and Man

Aussie Pete said:
Welcome to the last days Christian dilemma. What calls itself "church" these days bears only a passing resemblance to the New Testament pattern laid out for us. Denominations are, by definition, carnal. I did not say that, Paul did.

You will find people who are as conflicted as you are. The minimum number to constitute a church is two. I meet daily with another believer that I've known for about 35 years. From time to time, we visit a denominational fellowship, usually Baptist. As you know, it is the people who make the church, not the label.

The missing ingredient in most Christians is "Life". All who are born again have this Life. It is not what we were born with. It is the Life that is the nature of Christ Himself. Most Christians never come to the realisation that Christ actually lives within. He is well able to produce every spiritual fruit that we need, without our help and in spite of all that we are or are not. Seek out people who know Christ as "The Life" and stay close to them. There are some Christians who are unassuming, gentle, wise, unselfish and care for others. I call them the "Shining Ones". Am I one? Yes - not by my own assessment but by what others have said.

When I was a new Christian, I went to every conference and youth camp that I could. I saw that some speakers were different, but I did not know why. I wanted to be like them, and that was my prayer. It took a long time and much tribulation, but one day God opened my eyes. Lord Jesus is my life. He is my everything and my all. It's easy to sing the songs and quote the Bible. Coming to the knowledge of this truth was hard for me. Ask the Lord to show you what I mean. It is the difference between a life of trying to do the best you can (never good enough) and knowing the power of the resurrection as your power.

Thank you, that's very interesting. The Kingdom of God is within us, after all. I very much believe that.

Vicky gould said:
The church has been under spiritual attack for a few millennia. Some of the leaven has gotten and every Christian needs to be in church for the safety in numbers because the attacker is looking for those who are vulnerable. It’s my opinion and it and a dollar will get you a coffee. There is no church out there that isn’t screwy in some ways. You know what is important in your walk and I think you can find a church close to where you are in your walk. The preacher Charles Spurgeon had 700 men from his congregation on their knees praying for him while he preached. How many pastors would be thrilled with 7 praying for him as he preached. How much support does your pastor get through the week.?

bad sermons does he get prayer and the time he needs for the Holy Spirit to anointed his sermon. Of course prayer for the entire church is also needed. There are many things church’s can do known to those who are members. Doctrine for me is essential .
Not to be pessimistic but they have some studies out there that says 50% of people in the pews would leave their church but they are convinced there isn’t anything better out there. It isn’t easy but it can be so worth it. I am praying for the Lord to Shepherd you to where you are meant to be and to show you where and how you are to serve Him by serving where He has led you. God bless

God bless you, and thank you for your reply.

Phoebe Ann said:
I was a non-Trinitarian as a Mormon. I went to God for guidance. I told God that I didn't know Who He was, so I prayed to "the True God." God is Triune. You need to study your Bible and believe in the true God. These are some of my notes:

1. Deuteronomy 6: 4 — There is only one God, Jehovah.
2. Isaiah 43 : 10-11— He is the LORD and only Savior.
3. Isaiah 44 : 6 — He is the first and the last.
4. Revelation 1 : 8 — He is the Lord God Almighty, the Alpha and Omega.
5. Revelation 22 : 13, 16 — Jesus is the first and the last, the Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the End.
6. Revelation 1 : 17-18 — The one God who was the first and the last died and rose again!
7. Hebrews 1 : 1, 2, 8 — God the Father calls the Son, "God."
8. Acts 5 : 3-4 --Peter calls the Holy Spirit, "God."
9. John 6 : 27 --Jesus calls the Father, "God."

The Trinity Revealed in the Resurrection

1. Acts 10 : 39-40 — God raised Christ from the dead.
2. 1 Thessalonians 1 : 10 — God the Father raised the Son from the dead.
3. Romans 8 : 11 — God the Spirit raised the Son from the dead.
4. John 2 : 19-22 — God the Son raised Himself from the dead.

The Trinity Revealed in the Creation

1. The Father: Isaiah 64:8.
2. The Son: Colossians 1:15-17.
3. The Holy Spirit: Job 33:4.

The Father is a Person. We can have fellowship with him, 1 John 1:3; he knows, Matthew 6:6-8; he teaches, Matthew 16:17; he loves, John 16:27; he is a witness, John 8:18; he has a will, John 5:30.

The Son is a Person. We can have fellowship with him, 1 John 1:3; he knows, Matthew 11:27; he teaches, John 1:18, Rev. 2:18; he loves, Romans 8:35, Gal. 2:20; he is a witness, John 8:18; he has a will, John 5:30; he can be grieved, John 11:35.

The Holy Spirit is a Person. We can have fellowship with him, Philippians 2:1, II Cor. 13:14; he knows, I Cor. 2:11; he teaches, Luke 12:12, I Cor. 2:13; he loves, Romans 15:30; he is a witness, Acts 20:23, Romans 8:16; he has a will, I Cor. 12:11; he can be grieved, Ephesians 4:30.

The Father sent the Son. The Father and Son sent the Spirit. They are NOT three gods as Mormons claim.

Please decide to read your Bible. Then you can read the statements of faith of different churches and be able to make an educated choice.

Proverbs 3
5 Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
6 In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.

View attachment 264632
God bless you as you learn His will.

Thank you so much for this. I will save it to my computer and study it. God bless.

Glorytothefather2245 said:
The right church is the one that keeps all the commandents of God. It would be the church that worships on Saturdays. God created the earth in 6 days and rested on the 7th. Jesus never changed the Sabbath to Sunday. Jesus said he came not to abolish the law but to fulfill it so the old laws are still in place. The Sabbath was changed to Sunday by man not God. Read your bible please it is important in these last days.

Yes, I'm looking into the Seventh Day Adventists. Thanks for your reply.

GingerBeer · Oct 9, 2019

A Gerbil said:
The priest: The Priest: Mediator Between God and Man

SSPX is a schismatic break away from the Catholic Church. Their theology differs from Catholic teaching. I am sure that one of the points of difference may be SSPX's idea of priests as mediators.

Tolworth John · Oct 9, 2019

A Gerbil said:
I got baptised over three years ago in a church which was adequate, but I stopped attending for personal reasons. I have investigated, and in some cases visited, numerous churches since then - Methodist, Church of Scotland, Anglican, Quakers, three independent churches*, Russian Orthodox, Baptist, Unitarian, The Salvation Army, Gospel Church and even the Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses - yet I have not found a single one in which I felt wholly comfortable.

It may be that I am overly fussy, and it's certainly true that in every single congregation I met some lovely, genuine people and often enjoyed the services. I am sure people reading this forum belong to some of those churches, so I will not single any of them out for particular criticism. It amazes me just how diverse the Christian faith is!

I have felt my faith wax and wane over the last two years, and even even chatted with a Jew (online) and a few Muslims, as well as attending a Buddhist temple, however I am utterly convinced that Jesus is the Son of God and that He was God in human form. It struck me, incidentally, how incredibly similar Islam and Judaism are, and it was suggested to me by followers of the other two Abrahamic religions that Christians are polytheistic (because of the Trinity) and guilty of idolatry.

What was it I didn't like about the churches I attended?

- Many were overtly political. I believe that politics has no place in church at all. Whilst society is becoming ever more fractured along political lines - especially here in Scotland where there is the question of independence, EU membership, government austerity, etc - I don't want to hear this in church when I go to worship. Of course help the needy, have food banks, but I don't believe a sermon should ever be used to promote one's political views.

- One of the churches was genuinely polytheistic it would seem, and one no longer seems to be a Christian faith. So that I do not offend anybody, I will not elaborate upon this but will suggest that if you research all of the churches I have mentioned you will see this for yourself.

- One of the churches preached the 'Prosperity Gospel' and requested money at every opportunity, claiming that to reap a (financial) harvest one first needs to sow.

- Some of the churches have dispensed with Christian teachings in order to conform to modern standards.

- Some I just felt didn't appeal to my style of worship - sometimes it was too loud and modern, sometimes it was very antiquated with medieval chanting, incense or a bit bizarre.

There are literally thousands of denominations, so there must be one for me. My beliefs are actually very simple:

1) I believe in God the Father who was personified on this earth as Jesus Christ, His Son. I cannot say I am one hundred percent convinced of the third being, the Holy Spirit, and therefore I am genuinely unsure whether I am Binitarian or Tinitarian. That may exclude me from a number of churches - though I am prepared to be convinced.

2) I believe the Bible is the inspired word of God but that much of it is metaphorical, though obviously much of it is literal.

3) I believe in the teachings of Christ abrogates any conflicting teachings from the Old Testament - which I'd argue should be the case with anybody who calls themselves a Christian.

4) I believe that Jesus Christ sacrificed Himself to atone for the sins of man, and that we are all sinners.

5) I believe that ultimately God is merciful, as shown by the fact He was willing to sacrifice His son (and in effect Himself) for us.

6) I believe that God does not want Christians to pursue money, status and power. I believe that God demonstrated that the ego is the cause of much sin, and that we are to be humble and to serve Him and one another. For example, Jesus was born in a stable, the 'son' of a carpenter, washed His disciples' feet - including Judas' - and suffered an agonising and humiliating death.

Like all people I am flawed and still learning. However I cannot just accept what I am told. Mathew 7:7.

To anybody still reading, thank you and may God bless you!

May I suggest you try the christianityexplored web site, put in your town and you will get a list of 'evangelical' churches.
As always check out there web sites, test the online sermons, statement of belief etc.

If a church preaches and is seeking to practise the gospel, but has a few niggles I would say, moan at the pastor but continue to attend.
You and I are not perfect, neither are those making up the church.

A Gerbil · Oct 9, 2019

GingerBeer said:
SSPX is a schismatic break away from the Catholic Church. Their theology differs from Catholic teaching. I am sure that one of the points of difference may be SSPX's idea of priests as mediators.

Well why does one need to confess one's sins to a priest? Why can one not simply pray to God in order to be forgiven of one's sins? Where is purgatory mentioned in the Bible? How can the one true church justify the Abigensian Crusades, inquisitions and torture it inflicted?

Tolworth John said:
May I suggest you try the christianityexplored web site, put in your town and you will get a list of 'evangelical' churches.
As always check out there web sites, test the online sermons, statement of belief etc.

If a church preaches and is seeking to practise the gospel, but has a few niggles I would say, moan at the pastor but continue to attend.
You and I are not perfect, neither are those making up the church.

Thank you. There are a few listed which are close to me. One I have already attended, and actually considered returning to. I had no problem with their statement of belief, and I thought the pastor was a thoroughly decent guy who clearly works hard for the community. I must sound awful, but I prefer more traditional worship, there's something more fitting and dignified about singing hymns as opposed to the contemporary band and the hand waving and fist pumping...

GingerBeer · Oct 9, 2019

A Gerbil said:
Well why does one need to confess one's sins to a priest?

Confession to the elders (priests) is mentioned in Matthew and in the letter of James.

“If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. Truly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in heaven. For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I among them.”
Matthew 18:15-20

Is anyone among you suffering? Let him pray. Is anyone cheerful? Let him sing praise. Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord. And the prayer of faith will save the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven. Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working. Elijah was a man with a nature like ours, and he prayed fervently that it might not rain, and for three years and six months it did not rain on the earth. Then he prayed again, and heaven gave rain, and the earth bore its fruit. My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.
James 5:13-20

GingerBeer · Oct 9, 2019

A Gerbil said:
Why can one not simply pray to God in order to be forgiven of one's sins?

One does pray to God, and one also asks for wisdom and advice from the elders (priests).

I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
Matthew 16:19

“The one who hears you hears me, and the one who rejects you rejects me, and the one who rejects me rejects him who sent me.”
Luke 10:16

GingerBeer · Oct 9, 2019

A Gerbil said:
Where is purgatory mentioned in the Bible?

There is no purgatory in the scriptures but there is both a promise of seeing God made to the pure in heart and a warning that one's earthly works will be judged and what is not precious will be burned and the one who works perishable works will be saved but as if he had passed through fire. The idea is of transition from Earthly impurity to heavenly perfection. It could be an instant transition or maybe one that seems to take time. But the scriptures do speak of the transition.

Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God.
Matthew 5:8

For we are God's fellow workers. You are God's field, God's building. According to the grace of God given to me, like a skilled master builder I laid a foundation, and someone else is building upon it. Let each one take care how he builds upon it. For no one can lay a foundation other than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if anyone builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw— each one's work will become manifest, for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed by fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done. If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. If anyone's work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire.
1 Corinthians 3:9-15

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